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Biodiesel & Alternative Fuels Forum This is a forum to discuss bio-diesel and other kinds of alternative fuels. We think bio-diesel is the next revolution as Hydrogen costs too much to make and putting food (Ethanol) in your tank is not feasible and will cause food prices to skyrocket. What say you on bio-diesel? Should we start this bio-diesel revolution and kick it into high gear?

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  ^ Top   #11  
Old 05.18.2009
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Originally Posted by stocktonhauler View Post
Actually, it's both a supply-side and demand-side problem. Consumption is rising factorially as the Chinese and Indians come on with their cars, but neither of these countries has much in the way of petro reserves. So, they compete with the US that has outconsumed it's own reserves since the 1970's. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that even as the world's oil producing nations "excess capacity" begins to fade, there will be a price squeeze. This seems to already be happening in a cycle of periodic price spikes and speculation.
The "energy crisis" - which it is - is only a supply-side problem if there is a supply shortage to cure. Granted we could attempt to increase crude production, but it has already been shown to be impossible once the level of any deposit has been reduced to below half - that was the oil crises of the 1970's - when our own reserves dropped below that point. Since it's obvious the Saudi and Russian reserves have declined beyond half, there is precious little we can do to increase supply. None of the finds since the middle of the 1900's can begin to match the Arab Penninsula fields, and the world has been scoured by petroleum engineers since then. The only thing that can be done to allieviate the problem is by affecting demand - and mostly getting us onto an alternative quickly. Petroleum is used through modern industry and the very fabric of our modern society is at stake now... not just our comfy ride down to the C-store.

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Of course, global warming issues appear to be accelerating and already contributing to various social and political problems that ultimately are energy intensive, and burning petroleum is very bad for the environment.
Well beyond the current politically-correct projections. Bad for us. Also why we need to get cracking on moving transportation and society of of all fossil fuels.

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Given the CO2 caps that will be introduced into the market sometime in this decade, those "weeds" (in the form of unplowed prairie ecosystems) will probably be better set aside as consumers of CO2 and producers of oxygen.
Weeds don't require the use of energy to grow them that corn and soybeans do. It can be shown that producing one gallon of ethanol from agricultural products requires more energy in the form of tractor fuel and petroleum-based fertilizers than you get out of the gallon of ethanol when it is burned. The energy budget works the other way around when you use agricultural waste. Replanting forests will do more to take carbon out of the environment than any amount of weed growth.

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Peterbuilt and Eaton are jointly producing a hybrid tractor. Rail trains and rapid transit system use electrical power to move. No, there is certainly opportunity for hybrid production of an SUV. The auto industry just needs to roll up it's sleeves and get to work figuring out the details. All big vehicles waste a lot of energy at cruising speeds, and during braking that can and should be optimized by electronics and battery storage.
Energy used to produce linear motion of a mass is directly proportional to said mass - technological tricks notwithstanding. Want to cut our energy use by half? Cut the weight of all four-wheelers by half. We already have hybrid SUVs... vehicle weight is an albatross already hung around the neck of the consumer. Just need to make it stink like the dead albatross it is.

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Sorry for the comment about the great state of California. We've got plenty of problems of our own out here, but it would be nice if industrial states like Ohio, Michigan, Pennsylvania would stop feeling sorry for themselves and start dreaming of better ways to do things, like these regions did about a hundred years ago. There are a lot of opportunities happening right now...
Regionality has nothing to do with it - that's just an ego thing. If we don't get on top of this thing quickly it will affect Californians as much as it does people from the midwest or China. There is a reason why it is "global warming" not just say "Santa Barbara warming," LOL!

Last edited by ironpony; 05.18.2009 at 06.17 AM.. Reason: getting the quote switches right...
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  ^ Top   #12  
Old 11.30.2009
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WHY does everybody buy into "biofuels take more energy than they produce" Moonshiners ran their cars on alchohol when gas was cheap,And whats with bio diesel: take a good fuel (plant oil) and mix it with DRY methanol (hard to make expensive and dangerous) mix in some lye(also dangerous) and come up with 75 0/0 fuel 25 0/0 waste. Instead of taking some waste heat from the cooling , charge air, or exhaust to warm (thin) the plant oil and burn 100 0/0 of it. Big oil and big industry want to stay big, innovation rarely come from this source but misleading fact seem to flow freely
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Old 12.02.2009
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Unless they get the bio-crud part of bio-diesel going, I've heard that when you take the petrolium used (tractor fuel, fertilizer) to produce the corn (or whatever) used to generate the alcohol feed-stock, then its pretty much a wash as to whether you're getting more energy out than is put in.
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Old 12.03.2009
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not to mention B20 still plugs fuel filter's below 20%..............and i seem to get worse fuel mileage form it


I'll just add this thread to my"run your car engine on water" pile


100% is not an economical, let alone viable fuel source
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Old 12.03.2009
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Ah... yup. That would be part and parcel of the bio-fuel problem. There's not as much energy in a gallon of biodiesel.
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Old 12.06.2009
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Quoting funded funded misinformationist will not solve anything big oil watches the market and keeps fuel at just tolerable prices. people are to comfortable with the way things are to use anything that might be different. Propane for example people hated it or loved it. on paper it was less efficent in actual use quite a bit better. when the media gets back to reporting the truth Bio fuel might have a chance. BUT from now to then we will pay what ever the pump price is complain and do nothing about it.
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  ^ Top   #17  
Old 12.06.2009
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Haven't really noticed a difference with biodiesel I get occasionally in Illinois. My fuel economy goes in the tank with the c.r.a.p. they pump in Texas. Go figure...
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Old 12.09.2009
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My '93 Dodge got worse mileage with B20. I did like the smell! I was getting 17.8 tops commuting to Nashville and back.

Hugo Chavez or BP are the only dealers around here for biodiesel.

BP is Arab oil. Are regular BP diesel I have been getting 22+mpg. On FlyingJ I get 20+.

Pilot regular diesel 17+ And Pilot costs more.
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