pros and cons of a stinger steer vs conventional

I'm sure others will chime in, but to me a LOT of it will depend on your length and overhang laws, here in the states stingers are able to run more deck length than you can get away with on a high mount 5th wheel trailer.

Of course maneuverability is another plus for the stinger, down side is if your power unit goes down, usually just can't stick another truck under it.

That is the main items to me, but like I said, I think your length/overhang laws may be the biggest plus/minus.

 

Hey Albertoz, while I'm thinking of it, how about posting some pics of what you guys build, I am always interested in what other places are doing.

Thanks Stan

 

As Stan said, our length laws and axle weight rules play a big part in the choice, plus a stinger steer usually is more versatile when building complex loads such as mixed cars and light trucks/sport utility vehicles. Typically our height is limited to 13 foot 6 inches on the east coast and 14 foot in the southwestern US. With a stinger the truck can be 75 foot long in most states with 3 foot front over hang and 4 foot to the rear giving you 82 foot total length whereas a conventional (we call them high mount) setup has very different rules depending on the state, for example my home state of Pennsylvania limits high mounts to 65' total length truck and trailer combo, New York will have the same limit plus no overhang if it is a 53 foot trailer but allows overhang on 48 foot trailers.

I also prefer a high mount for easy of loading, there are quick load stinger trailers, but it is still faster for me to load 6 or 7 on my trailer and go, I do short hauls load multiple times a day so the extra 2 or 3 units a stinger hauls is not of great importance to me. There are tare weight concerns as well, my 7 car trailer with a single axle tractor tare weight is 35,000 pounds, a typical 9 car stinger has a tare weight over 40,000, with our gross weight laws every pound makes a difference as does the ability to shift that weight around onto different axle groups to avoid an axle over weight fine.

Please post some pictures of the units you build in Oz, especially interested in the multi trailer road train unit. Thanks.

 

Hey Albert, this is for Cali. BUT, I have found that when it comes to Kingpin/Axle spacing what is legal here will pretty much get you around the rest of the country, if you open this and scroll down you will see the regs for stinger steer trailers.

Basically you are limited to 75' Overall length for truck and trailer, and a stinger is allowed at least 3' of the front (over the cab and a minimum of 4' off the back, some states are as much as 6.5'.

You can not exceed 288" from Centerline of front Axle to Centerline of REAR MOST Axle (NOT wheelbase) on tractors and from stinger Kingpin to CL of rear most axle on trailer can not exceed 34' for one/two axles 36' for triple axle.

BUT you have to be careful on kingpin placement, in order to get to the 75' rule your KP MUST be a minimum of 60" BEHIND the CL of the REAR most axle. This is considered "West Coast Stinger" there is an East Coast stinger that has a slightly different trailer length spacing, but the WC setup is legal everywhere, the EC version is NOT legal in Cali.

One other item, WC states 14' height EC states 13'6" height.

I think I have that right,

Hope this helps?

Stan



http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/traffops/engineering/trucks/trucksize/length.htm



[h=1]Auto, Boat, & Camper Transporters Exemptions[/h]

NOTE: This exemption is for commercial haulers. If you are towing an oversize boat for personal use, you will need to obtain an oversize permit from the Caltrans Permits Office at: www.dot.ca.gov/hq/traffops/permits.​

[HR][/HR]OVERALL LENGTH
Per California Vehicle Code (CVC) Section 35401.3, transporters of motor vehicles, boats, and camper units have length exemptions. Following are selective paraphrases of the CVC, and text copied from the Federal Code of Regulations. It is not guaranteed and may be subject to change.
35401.3. (a) A combination of vehicles designed and used to transport motor vehicles, camper units, or boats, which consists of a motortruck and stinger-steered semitrailer, shall be allowed a length of up to:
(a) 70 feet if the kingpin is at least 3 feet behind the rear drive axle of the motortruck.
(b) 75 feet if all of the following conditions are maintained:

(1) The distance from the steering axle to the rear drive axle of the motortruck does not exceed 24 feet.
(2) The kingpin is at least 5 feet behind the rear drive axle of the motortruck.
(3) The distance from the kingpin to the rear axle of the semitrailer does not exceed:

• 34 feet, or
• 36 feet if on a triple axle semitrailer.

​

OVERHANG
35401.3. (a) and (b) These combinations shall not be subject to subdivision (a) of Section 35411 (which requires that the vehicle plus load cannot exceed 75 feet), but the load upon the rear vehicle of either of these combinations shall not extend more than 6 feet 6 inches beyond the allowable length of the vehicle.
LOAD-CARRYING EXTENSIONS
35402. (b) Extensions up to 18 inches in length on each end of a vehicle or combination of vehicles used exclusively to transport vehicles shall not be included in measuring the length of a vehicle or combination of vehicles when the vehicles are loaded. (This exemption not allowed on STAA vehicles per CVC Section 35401.5(b) -- see discussion below.)
SLIDING FIFTH WHEEL UP TO 2'6" AT 35 MPH OFF FREEWAYS
35402. (e) A truck semitrailer combination may use a sliding fifth wheel to extend the length of the combination by not more than 2 feet 6 inches while traveling 35 miles per hour or less on any highway, except a freeway. The sliding fifth wheel when extended shall not be included in measuring the overall length of the combination of vehicles if:

• the pivot point of the semitrailer connection is more than two feet to the rear of the center of the rearmost axle of the motortruck, or
• if the distance from the pivot point to the center of the rearmost axle of the semitrailer does not exceed 34 feet.

(This exemption not allowed on STAA vehicles per CVC Section 35401.5(b) -- see discussion below.)
[HR][/HR]

AUTO, BOAT, & CAMPER TRANSPORTERS
ON THE STAA NETWORK​

STAA VEHICLES
Per CVC 35401.5.(a), a truck tractor and semitrailer may have unlimited length on the STAA Network (which includes the National Network and Terminal Access routes) if the length of the semitrailer either (1) does not exceed 48 feet, or (2) does not exceed 53 feet and has a KPRA* of 38 feet maximum on a single-axle semitrailer or 40 feet maximum on a two-or-more-axle semitrailer.
*KPRA = kingpin-to-rear-axle distance
AUTO, CAMPER, & BOAT TRANSPORTERS CAN BE STAA VEHICLES
Per CVC 35401.5.(a), for the purposes of this section, a motortruck used in combination with a semitrailer, when that combination of vehicles is engaged solely in the transportation of motor vehicles, camper units, or boats, is considered to be a truck tractor.
AUTO, CAMPER, & BOAT TRANSPORTERS LOSE TWO EXEMPTIONS AS STAA VEHICLES
CVC 35401.5(b) disallows the exemptions of Section 35402 (b) and (e) (see those sections above -- "Load-Carrying Extensions" and "Sliding Fifth Wheel...") on combinations of vehicles operated subject to the exemptions provided by this section (STAA).
[HR][/HR]FEDERAL DEFINITIONS
Code of Federal Regulations, Title 23 - Highways
Sec. 658.5 Definitions
Automobile transporters. Any vehicle combination designed and used specifically for the transport of assembled highway vehicles, including truck camper units.
Boat transporters. Any vehicle combination designed and used specifically to transport assembled boats and boat hulls. Boats may be partially disassembled to facilitate transporting.
Stinger-steered combination. A truck tractor semitrailer wherein the fifth wheel is located on a drop frame located behind and below the rear-most axle of the power unit.
FEDERAL LENGTH REQUIREMENTS
Code of Federal Regulations, Title 23 - Highways Sec. 658.13 Length
(e) Specialized equipment--
(1) Automobile transporters.
(i) Automobile transporters are considered to be specialized equipment. As provided in Sec. 658.5, automobile transporters may carry vehicles on the power unit behind the cab and on an over-cab rack. No State shall impose an overall length limitation of less than 65 feet on traditional automobile transporters (5th wheel located on tractor frame over rear axle(s)), including "low boys,'' or less than 75 feet on stinger-steered automobile transporters. Paragraph (c) requires the States to allow operation of vehicles with the dimensions that were legal in the State on December 1, 1982.
(ii) All length provisions regarding automobile transporters are exclusive of front and rear overhang. Further, no State shall impose a front overhang limitation of less than three (3) feet nor a rearmost overhang limitation of less than four (4) feet.
(iii) Drive-away saddlemount vehicle transporter combinations and driveaway saddlemount with fullmount vehicle transporter combinations are considered to be specialized equipment. No State shall impose an overall length limit of less than 75 feet on such combinations. This provision applies to saddlemount combinations with up to three saddlemounted vehicles. Such combinations may include one fullmount. Saddlemount combinations must also comply with the applicable safety regulations at 49 CFR 393.71.
(2) Boat transporters.
(i) Boat transporters are considered to be specialized equipment. As provided for automobile transporters in Sec. 658.5, boat transporters may carry boats on the power unit so long as the length and width restrictions of the vehicles and load are not exceeded. No State shall impose an overall length limitation of less than 65 feet on traditional boat transporters (fifth wheel located on tractor frame over rear axle(s), including "low boys,'' or less than 75 feet on stinger-steered boat transporters. In addition, no State shall impose an overall length limitation of less than 65 feet on truck-trailer boat transporters. Paragraph (c) of this section requires the States to allow operation of vehicles with the dimensions that were legal in the State on December 1, 1982.
(ii) All length provisions regarding boat transporters are exclusive of front and rear overhang. Further, no State shall impose a front overhang limitation of less than three (3) feet nor a rearmost overhang limitation of less than four (4) feet.

 

Hey Albertoz -

(1) When posting images, go 'advanced' to post the image.

(2) I can't find a link, but a few years ago, when Cottrell designed the NextGen B train, there was discussion about making it a road train for the Canadian and Aussie market. The problem, as I recall, was with the stinger 5th wheels and how much stop and go pressure they would take. I don't think weight was the issue, because the units were well balanced. I'll keep looking for that article.

(3)

 

By the way, welcome to the forum.

Based on some of the road trains I have seen in the outback, overall length shouldn't be an issue ! :smt003