I have yet to see this claim actually be proven.


Well I think what maybe some people might be getting at is how many unions have specific job descriptions. Like if a worker spots a small oil spill from a bottle...he can't clean it up...has to call his supervisor who calls the supervisor in another building who calls the custodial staff which checks its hour board to see who is at the top of the list and gets the double over time pay...etc.

There was someone on this site that mentioned how they wouldn't feel comfortable changing a light bulb on their truck because that is a mechanics job. And they had someone else fuel the truck up too, as that was also someone elses job.

__________________
"You Americans are so gullible. No, you won’t accept Communism outright. But we will keep feeding you small doses of socialism until you finally wake up and realize you already have communism. We won’t have to fight you; we’ll so weaken your economy that you will fall like over ripe fruit into our hands."
Former Soviet Premier Nikita Kruschev

Some people get it...while others not so quick.
They are the same ones who go thru the self check out at the grocery store and don`t realize the more they do it...the less cashiers the store will hire, but will be the first to complain about the number of people on welfare rolls. Then they will say...well the store needs to make a profit and the cost to the consumer is less, but is it really..when the state they operate in has to raise sales taxes to pay the single mom welfare that wants to work but can`t get a job.

When I owned a truck I did all the repairs and maintenance that I could,..I am not scarred of that kind of work,...HOWEVER,.....I could lose my job if I did any of that work now,....My company doesn't want me to work on the truck,...I am not a certified mechanic I am a truck driver,..That is what I was hired to do,..So that is what I do.....

You just explained perfectly what is wrong with the union mentality.

Keep as many people doing as little as possible. Let's transfer your example to the automakers. Don't use robotics, use 5 guys to weld that car frame, and pay 5 salaries, pay 5 lifetime benefits, and charge the customer for those continuing costs.

Or, install a robotic welder, who doesn't get paid, doesn't have work "slowdowns" and doesn't need insurance benefits for 60 years and adds an expense to the auto only one time. Offer your product at a lower cost due to the lower expenses and sell more cars.

Thank you for proving my point.

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yeah but there is a problem...this argument doesn't hold any water. If you go to a Wal Mart or a big store that has a need for self check outs...half the time its because there aren't enough cashiers anyways. And the people who use the self check outs only have like 10 things in their basket anyways.
Most big name stores, have people trained in on the registers. Wal Mart has cashiers, people who only run the registers. At the same time, their other associates are trained to use the registers as well, if needed. It depends on the department they work in, they might get called, might never get called.
Currently, the self checkouts are slow and tedius and often require assistance anyways. The argument that using them will result in more welfare people is silly. I mean...do you go inside the gas station when you buy gas, just so someone can go through the motion of swiping your credit card?
Technically if you look at your life, there is a TON of things that you do that 'tosses people' out into the welfare lines; that is...if you believe that self check out theory.

So basically when you try to argue that unions are more productive, work harder and deserve more...how does that work, when you don't / can't do what most non-union truck drivers do? Because if changing a light bulb is outside of your abilities as a driver, then you aren't as productive...right? Adding fluids?

I mean...Im not trying to be sarcastic here or anything...but one of the arguments that is brought up is the hard working union guy, The productive union guy, the more efficient union guy. The "because of that, I should make more" union guy. But then at the same time...I think of two broken down trucks on the side of a road. One guy is under their truck, with tools, working on it so they can get on the road. The other guy is on the phone, trying to get someone down there to the truck...waiting...etc.

__________________
"You Americans are so gullible. No, you won’t accept Communism outright. But we will keep feeding you small doses of socialism until you finally wake up and realize you already have communism. We won’t have to fight you; we’ll so weaken your economy that you will fall like over ripe fruit into our hands."
Former Soviet Premier Nikita Kruschev

I never said I don't have the ability to change a light bulb,...The company's policy say I can't,...So unless I want to risk loseing a very good job,..I do my job,.and let the mechanics do theirs,...

I hope that cleared up misconceptions that might have been brought forth by ziggystyles.

Drive safe

Well I guess this is the right place to put my 2Censt in, so here goes. I was a member for 18 years of OCAW and it merged with PACE which merged with USW and before that I was a ICEW member for 10 years so I guess that makes me a union member, my dad was a member of OCAW for 35 years. So born a member and raised a member and if given the chance today I would vote NO on joining. BUT if I work for a union shop I join.The unions today are not my dad's union. Hell THEY are a big business themselves.I read the last contract the USW got for the Chemical worked is which what I used to do, and believe me it sucked. No help for retirees health(union said it was a strike issue) 2 1/2% raise each year ( whats the cost of living going up?) in other words don't put your eggs in that basket. If the company is treating you fine you don't need a union if they aren't a union is not going to help.It just cost you money each month so be very sure you know what you are getting.

No, sorry. Misreading what someone wrote to fit your agenda is dumb.
The quote that you quoted me on, was a reply to a comment / claim that union workers are MORE productive and work HARDER and 'deserve more'. My comment was that I have yet to see that claim proven. You fire back with saying that you work just as hard. The original comment was that they work harder.
I never once said they don't work as hard. Some do.

No, sorry. Misreading what someone wrote to fit your agenda when you don't know anything at all about the person you are replying to, that makes you look dumb. Never mind the fact that I've detailed extensively my union history. But yeah, lets toss that all aside because I havent work with unionized trucking comps.

Anybody with half a bass for a brain knows about work classifications. Instead of you simply doing something, you can't...it has to be passed on to someone else, whose job it is to do it. Even if it saves time, and you can easily do it, no...nuh uh. Better not try...tampering with someone elses job (aka doing something to help out, making things safe...etc) could get you fired.
Look at Wal Mart. Many of its associates are trained in various other departments. I worked in toys, frozen, dairy, deli, produce, registers and helped out in countless others. However if Wal Mart was unionized...Id have to say "sorry, I can't do that because hey look at my work contract buddy. Haha, no way am I going to help you out, fat chance. Get someone else to stock that empty milk display. Those customers can just go to another store for all I care...HooRah!"
of course, that argument is pointless because many people believe Wal mart is the anti-christ.

That does clarify things, but personally I think its a huge waste of resources for a mechanic to do work that would take a driver a few minutes to complete. While Im not saying a driver should swap out an engine or anything...I think basic routine maintenance like light bulbs, adding fluids...etc should be something that a driver can easily do.

__________________
"You Americans are so gullible. No, you won’t accept Communism outright. But we will keep feeding you small doses of socialism until you finally wake up and realize you already have communism. We won’t have to fight you; we’ll so weaken your economy that you will fall like over ripe fruit into our hands."
Former Soviet Premier Nikita Kruschev

In my case it isn't up to me or the contract,....The company made the rules about maintenance,..I work for the company and I follow their rules....Why is it so hard for you to understand?