Is 10 MPG Possible with a Fully Loaded (80K gross) 5 Axle Truck?

Discussion in 'Trucks [ Eighteen Wheelers ]' started by Dice1, Jul 2, 2011.

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  1. Dice1

    Dice1 Road Train Member

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    Please call Craig @ MicroBlue 704-489-2216, he is the owner and a metalurgist. Let him answer your technical questions because I am not qualified to answer that question.

    After he answers your questions, please come back and post what you found out.

    Thank you.
     
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  3. Dice1

    Dice1 Road Train Member

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    Maybe the manufacturers don't know about it and besides they sell fleets basic trucks for as cheap as possible. The upgrade would make their trucks cost more and would be hard to sell until they can see the results themselves.

    I would say when it gets out to more people in the trucking industry, the rear end and tranny manufacturers will offer this option and will be done in house. The wheel bearing manufactures already have this technology and do not offer it to the trucking industry for what reason I don't know.

    In the USA's future I see $5 plus per gallon fuel cost like in Europe and it is not matter of "if" but "when" it will happen permanently that I believe is not to far in the future for the USA. That is why I started paying more attention to my own fuel mileage.
     
  4. king Q

    king Q Road Train Member

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    Yea , I don't think that would help.
    With sugar your will just make all the surfaces sticky and that will increase the friction.
    Better to stick to the Micro Blue.

    On a serious note I must say I was surprised at the gains but the statement all about frictional losses only being about 10% is inaccurate.
    You just have to ask you self what usable HP is lost between the flywheel and the wheels on the ground.This difference is just the loses from the clutch, transmission,UJ's , rear ends ,rear wheel bearings,seals, brake drag and rear tires.
    The rule of thumb is 80% of power at the flywheel gets to the wheels.
    So if you could eliminate the loses completely (nearly all from friction) then from 80% to 100% at the wheels is a 25% increase in usable power.

    What has to be kept in mind is the speed you travel at.
    As speed increases the energy (Fuel) needed to overcome the wind resistance does not increase proportionally.
    It increases depending on the aerodynamics at a faster rate then the speed increase.
    So at racing speeds the energy just to move the air and overcome drag can become so huge that it relegates friction down to a much smaller percentage of the total loses.
    Therefore as a percentage of total energy consumed you can't list anything as a constant when the single biggest factor is a variable.
     
    Scania man Thanks this.
  5. Scania man

    Scania man Road Train Member

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    I don't know why they don't offer it here because of the emphasis on fuel economy here, although one reason I can think of is we only generally use one drive axle so the savings may not be as much, possibly (and I'm guessing) 30% less than you are currenly getting,

    I apologise if I seem like im running you down, I'm not! I'm just having trouble getting my head around your figures, I'm having trouble believing that something so small can make such a difference! (i hope my fears are wrong)I have massive respect for you and the efforts you are doing and how you are reporting back to us! This industry needs guys like you! Forward thinking, hard working intelligent guys like you! Although I'm in Ireland we are fighting the same battle; fuel price! It's the single biggest cost here, and in large companies here that's affecting wages of drivers( which is wrong), for the owner driver like us it's our livelyhood !

    You are so correct, fuel prices are going one way , up! It's a sad fact that here fuel economy is taking precedence over realability , that's why the likes of daf, iveco, Renault and other manufactures survive here, in fact we only have three good truck builders here, scania, Volvo and mercedes, after that everything else is rubbish,
     
  6. Dice1

    Dice1 Road Train Member

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    The rule of thumb????

    An educated quess?

    Where do these numbers come from?

    Estimates?


    Anybody got anything with solid testing to what is the actual friction/drag loss through the drivetrain to the ground?

    Nobody can actually use an example of the motor dyno numbers and then the dyno numbers put on the ground through the drivetrain using the same dyno and motor?

    Then you have the assembly variables of the rear ends, tranny and all bearings in between that human error can make one tighter or loser that can make a difference? In other words, no two rear ends are built alike.

    I heard there is a German Company that uses a roll down test timing from when the power is cut and how long it takes for the wheels to roll down to a stop? I can't find it that article I was reading on this.
     
  7. V8Lenny

    V8Lenny Road Train Member

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    Bearings and other parts polishes themselves when you drive them in. Racing teams use all kinds of special finishing because they have no time to do break-in. And, if your lubrication works, you have no metal to metal contact. Polishing prevents oilfilm breaking and that makes it possible to use lighter oil and tighter tolerances, but that's big buck racing stuff.
     
  8. king Q

    king Q Road Train Member

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    Google flywheel vs wheel Hp.
    There are various articles and even some calculators.
    None claim to be 100%.
    Rule of thumb , yes.
    Your racing friends will know this.
     
  9. Dice1

    Dice1 Road Train Member

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    When NASCAR shows up with the portable chassis dyno at the track, they do the roll down time test like I mentioned, but I have no links or even information on this.

    I searched several sources and even the car guys are guessing what the loss is from 15% to 20% on a Camaro forum to other forums discussing a wide variation in losses in the same type of rear ends tested. Now since the car guys think a small single rear end only loses 15% to 30% then two huge rear ends have to be at a higher rate of loss.

    I can't find where anybody has proven what is except for quessing at it?
     
  10. V8Lenny

    V8Lenny Road Train Member

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    My truck was dynoed at german MAHA dyno with roll down test, it showed 6 % transmission losses at 754 whp. Highest we have seen was something like 12 % from twin screw with hub reduction axles.
     
  11. kajidono

    kajidono Road Train Member

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    Did they remove the engine?
     
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