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Trucks [ Eighteen Wheelers ] Roll On Big Mama. Forum/Discussion about Eighteen Wheeler Trucks. What truck do you like or dislike? Is your favorite truck a Mack, Peterbilt, Kenworth, Marmon, Volvo or Freightliner? Which diesel engine do you prefer; Detroit Diesel, Cummins, or...

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  ^ Top   #181  
Old 07.28.2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepless nights View Post
Has anybody ever taken off the smart wastegate /fuel filter housing on a MBN. I can see that there is some kind of solinoid in the back of it and I'am wondering if I could controll the wastegate by powering up that solinoid?
The waste gate is ecm controlled. It probably needs a minimum amount of manifold pressure to have the mechanical force to open but under those conditions the solenoid should open if you supply it with enough voltage. ECM solenoids usually need high voltage and can be dangerous to mess with. Not to mention your ecm will probably throw a code.
I know when we do a turbo conversion on those an ECM reprogramming is needed

That resister isn't doing much resisting...when we did those our resistance was much higher. We never tried ambient air. Try more resistance if you want to continue using those and see what you get.
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  ^ Top   #182  
Old 07.28.2008
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Correct me if I'm wrong but with this new Ecm that I bought from PP that has a 6NZ program. It shouldn't regonize that I have a smart wastegate. I know that it dosen't derate with the higher psi on the boost.

Last edited by sleepless nights; 07.28.2008 at 05.50 PM.
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  ^ Top   #183  
Old 07.28.2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freddy View Post
The waste gate is ecm controlled. It probably needs a minimum amount of manifold pressure to have the mechanical force to open but under those conditions the solenoid should open if you supply it with enough voltage. ECM solenoids usually need high voltage and can be dangerous to mess with. Not to mention your ecm will probably throw a code.
I know when we do a turbo conversion on those an ECM reprogramming is needed

That resister isn't doing much resisting...when we did those our resistance was much higher. We never tried ambient air. Try more resistance if you want to continue using those and see what you get.
The resistor I was using were .18 for the fuel which gave me a fuel temp of 156F and the air was .218 0hms I don't know what it made the air temp read. I was told if the resistance is to high with the fuel temp it will derate if it gets to 208 F so I was told to give its some room to move if I got extra resistance in the wire's due to heat. It deffinately gave it more power especially on the bottom end and when it was cooler outside, but it was adding to my exhaust temp problems and I hadn't noticed much improvement if any with the fuel economy so I took them off. Also I have a PP box so if I want to give it a little more juice I can just turn the knob. Thats why I never put the boost sensor on because as you know that the box takes care of that.

Last edited by sleepless nights; 07.28.2008 at 06.02 PM.
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  ^ Top   #184  
Old 07.28.2008
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The filter housing valve needs to un hooked with a 6NZ ecm and un plugged form the harness, it is fighting the 6NZ ecm and cutting back boost, even though the 6NZ ecm doesent recognize it its still working its magic.

Reason why it runs so hot exhaust temps is because PP puts some hotter FLS codes in it, by any chance do you know what trim codes they put in it? 6NZ injectors wont bump fuel millage, they are essentially the same. You need more air in the motor now, I bet the center divider in the turbine housing is cracked on the turbo as well. I would buy a non wastegated turbo like a MI turbo stage 3 or PP turbo. The MBN has a very weak cam the lift on the intake and exhaust valve is alot smaller than a 6NZ, thats hwy the MBN doesent like to pull hard up top. If i were you guys i would go for the 800hp 3406E cam.

A stock 550hp C15 with a plugged wastegate wont blow the turbo, a C16 will. It pushes alot more fuel and exhaust energy to spool the turbo too fast with the blocked wategate putting alot of stress on the shaft. The stock turbos will not hold very long after 35psi, the compressor wheel looses efficiency after that and even though you are boosting more all you are doing is creating more hot air than power do to the turbo being way out of its own efficiency range.

What i would do to a MBN with a 6NZ ecm is, a 2WS or 1LW cam swap 50hp bump in power, 3406B exhaust manifold, non wastegated turbo. This is a very happy engine combo and will run cool on the exhaust and put a smile on your face and money back in your pocket.
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  ^ Top   #185  
Old 07.28.2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 550hpW900L View Post
The filter housing valve needs to un hooked with a 6NZ ecm and un plugged form the harness, it is fighting the 6NZ ecm and cutting back boost, even though the 6NZ ecm doesent recognize it its still working its magic.

Reason why it runs so hot exhaust temps is because PP puts some hotter FLS codes in it, by any chance do you know what trim codes they put in it? 6NZ injectors wont bump fuel millage, they are essentially the same. You need more air in the motor now, I bet the center divider in the turbine housing is cracked on the turbo as well. I would buy a non wastegated turbo like a MI turbo stage 3 or PP turbo. The MBN has a very weak cam the lift on the intake and exhaust valve is alot smaller than a 6NZ, thats hwy the MBN doesent like to pull hard up top. If i were you guys i would go for the 800hp 3406E cam.

A stock 550hp C15 with a plugged wastegate wont blow the turbo, a C16 will. It pushes alot more fuel and exhaust energy to spool the turbo too fast with the blocked wategate putting alot of stress on the shaft. The stock turbos will not hold very long after 35psi, the compressor wheel looses efficiency after that and even though you are boosting more all you are doing is creating more hot air than power do to the turbo being way out of its own efficiency range.

What i would do to a MBN with a 6NZ ecm is, a 2WS or 1LW cam swap 50hp bump in power, 3406B exhaust manifold, non wastegated turbo. This is a very happy engine combo and will run cool on the exhaust and put a smile on your face and money back in your pocket.
So if I understand you correctly even though my turbo is now a stand alone not connected to the steel line that goes to the smart control housing, I still need to disconnect the harness that runs out of that solinoid at the back of the housing?
And I hear you about the turbo putting out lots of boost but not giving that much more power. It dosen't seem to do any better at 40 psi than at 32psi . Fls 18, fts 11, trims I think were 6999
I have recently purchased a used 6nz that has a loose linner or something wrong inside of it won't know untill I get it apart. It had a new exhaust manifold so that is what I just put on the MBN. It was a complete engine so I was going to change the injectors if they would work, don't know what kind of condition they are in. But after reading your post maybe al I have to do is change that cam. That why I bought the engine I knew if I changed enough parts I would get some of that 15% less fuel consumption that a 6NZ was getting over a MBN. I have been looking for a 3406B manifold that is in good shape but supplies are limited around here but I'm sure I will find one soon. I wish I had the option for a different turbo when I had it all apart last week but all there is around here is stock turbo's I was lucky to even get a 6nz turbo most all the dealership stocks now are the one for the twin accerts.
Bye the way thank you for all the information.

Last edited by sleepless nights; 07.28.2008 at 07.28 PM.
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  ^ Top   #186  
Old 07.28.2008
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Try putting in 5232 trim codes, the FLS and FTS is of somewhat stock 550hp motor. Yes the filter base MAY be screwing with the ecm actually, i would unplug it form the harness, like i have on mine for a while now. Get rid of the steel lines, put a barbed nipple fitting in the head and run a hose to the wastegate on turbo. I wouldnt run the hose disconected as the MBN turbos housings are so tiny it may granade. The 6NZ turbos dont differ much from the MBN, also the 6NZ manifold is exactly the same, the ports and design is the same, so you wont gain much there. The main reason why the MBN was rated at 525hp max was the cam, its got less lift and that makes it a good low end motor, but past 1600rpm it seems to run out of breath.

Dont buy turbos from the dealer if you decide to upgrade, either Pittbrgh or Michigan turbo.
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  ^ Top   #187  
Old 07.28.2008
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Originally Posted by sleepless nights View Post
Yes please I would like to know what turbo you have, will it bolt right on or do you have to mod the oil lines or anything. The noise I spoke of with my turbo only did it when I was boosting up around 38psi it didn't make the sound when I kept the boost below 36 psi. The other noise that sounded like a jet engine was there at lower boost pressures though. When you put your latest turbo on did you change the exhaust manifold?
Its a Garrett it bolted on no problem just had to make the exhaust a bit longer as the new turbo has no wastegate making the housing shorter.All oil lines bolted on but the new turbo came with new lines havent used them yet.The jet engine noise you can hear sounds like mine I think its the small manifold,Getting changed very soon to a 3406B.The number is still in the truck I will get it soon.Also I changed the turbo about 2 weeks before I changed the injectors I found it had quite a bit of lag had to run it around 1700rpm but boosted to 35-38psi and EGT of 900-1000*F.
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  ^ Top   #188  
Old 07.28.2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brickman View Post
That C 16 must be a beast to break the turbo shaft.

3406E and various C 15s that I know of have the waste gate vacuum tube completely unhooked, not just pinched and none that I know of so far have broken any thing.
We are a very turbo unfriendly country it broke that hard it blew metal back into both air cleaners right through the aftercooler what a mess.To give you a idea,Today I have done about 400miles in 9 hours,top gear about 20%,I have the brakesaver screwed up to 65psi with the jakes(850hp of retardation)still had to get into the bottom of high range with 4:33 rears.Then up the next hill ALL DAY.The turbo gets a good work out!!
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  ^ Top   #189  
Old 07.28.2008
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This is what im running, its the MI TURBO stage 5 high flow, they claim it will hold 80-100psi of boost. It works great so far pushing over 50psi. Its a Borg Warner, with bored housings to accept bigger wheels, the turbine housing is huge. This turbo is very responsive for such a big beast. Once the gauge gets past 12psi it will peg FAST. Even lugging it at 1300rpm it will build over 50psi.

Only drawback is it pushes so much air that it has some surge to it if you let off the throttle quick at low boost. It will surge at 50psi if you need to back out of it quick do to some idiot cutting you off, but it sounds cool lol, like a sled puller backing out of it...... I know I know its bad blah.... I dont do it on purpouse.
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  ^ Top   #190  
Old 07.28.2008
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Thats one big turbo,How do you get away with only single clamp on the intercooler pipes?My will surge as well whats that doing to the engine?
Is there much difference between the B and C manifolds?
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