Two axle Jeep with short neck RGN- will it be practical?

Discussion in 'Heavy Haul Trucking Forum' started by ETMF 58 White, Mar 22, 2021.

  1. RGN

    RGN Road Train Member

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    With a 95" swing trailer if I took off the mud flaps on the truck and moved as far forward as possible and still be able to turn it put the KP right over the front drive, the most I ever got on the pusher (40/60) without lifting the front axle was around 8K. @Rontonio is correct as he is wise to the ways of math and such.

    None of the locals here have big HH setups & hire out the moves. Customers howl like a dog crapn barbwire about the mob cost, but they pay the bill.
     
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  3. old iron

    old iron Road Train Member

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    Fontaine calls my 55 ton trailer a 102" swing radius. My tape measure calls it somewheres between 96" and 98" when measuring the closest point a wheel can contact it.

    Jeep is 106" long from king pin to rear axle. The sweet spot for the jeep 5th wheel is 37" behind the jeep king pin. So all I'm gaining in overall length is 37". I have a short 244" tractor for Canada and even with the jeep I'm still shorter than most 4 axle trucks.
    IMG_20210323_102545741.jpg
    This gives me a 10' 1" group hooked to the truck. (52" between the drives and 69" to the jeep axle)
    I can scale a perfect 20-20-20 and have 12 on the steer.
    I haven't weighed it since converting the jeep to air ride but it should weight around 4,700#.
    The 5th wheel height is 5 1/2" taller.
    IMG_20191012_193256234.jpg
    It's all in the geometry with the physical dimensions you have to work with on your truck/trailer. With my truck I could shorten the jeep itself 6 to 8" and still have room to to clear the tractor. That would shorten up the required main trailer neck length another 4 to 6" and would probably work with your trailer. So it's doable. Be less than a 10' tridem grouping but that's what most lift axle trucks are anyway.
    IMG_20190724_201251790.jpg
    If you need to use it every day then hands down a 4 axle truck is the way to go. But like you I need a relatively light truck 95% of the time and a lift axle on a truck built for it would hurt more than help most of the time. IMG_20180808_193519963.jpg
     
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  4. ETMF 58 White

    ETMF 58 White Light Load Member

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    Thanks, I’m pretty impressed with what you’ve got there. Especially your air ride conversion skills. Nuttall Trailers advertises a single axle jeep on truck paper and it says “width 102 inches length 106 inches” so maybe they mean 106” kp to axle. If so, then what I should do is swing by there next time I’m out in Oklahoma and see how it fits on my truck at various slide settings. I think I have a 24” slide pinned Holland. And I looked on the Arkansas permit web page and it has a drawing of a tridem with the caption “97 inches- 204 inches” so I’m assuming that means I could consider the jeep part of a tridem. Therefore, 60K permit. You saying that yours will give you 20-20-20 gives me hope that I could do the same. I’ll verify all of this with the DOT captain here and put together a game plan. Thanks for your help.

    Also what do you mean by “chain the jeep up”? And what does that have to do with turning into a tight job site?

    FWIW, I bought a brand new never used 60” Holland pinned sliding fifth wheel off a new Peterbilt that the owner was making a log truck. I had in mind to build a real HH truck someday but I’ll probably never get around to it. If this single jeep works out, I might try to sell the long slider.
     
  5. old iron

    old iron Road Train Member

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    These short jeeps are a mother to back up. Especially in soft ground where you got one or maybe two shots at it.
    You can easily get in places that you have no hope of ever backing out. Lol
    If your going to go this route I would try and find a Canadian style jeep with rollers on front of the suspension hangers. And lift air bags on the axle. Then mount your long slider on the truck so you can slide the jeep clear up on the lowboy ramps when empty like this. IMG_20171104_120929387.jpg
    I haven't got around to engineering rollers on mine yet. When I do I want it to tuck in really close to the drive axles. That way the main trailer king pin will be pretty close to where it needs to be over the drives so I can leave the #### thing up if I got it with me but don't need it for legal loads.
    Up north they used to run this setup all over. With the new regs they have gone to more tri drive setups.

    Right now if I'm in a tight spot empty, I just lower the neck. Chain the rear frame of the jeep to the neck. Pick the neck up and lift it off the ground. Walla it's a single trailer just 37" longer for 90° backing out of a job site.
    If you need more height just run the jeep up on some blocks first.

    A proper set of rollers that match the lowboy ramps is a really fast easy way to make it a legal when empty setup that's only a foot or more longer than what it would be without the jeep at all.
     

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  6. beastr123

    beastr123 Road Train Member

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    The 2 best ways to lift a single axle jeep for running empty or extra tight maneuvering is to "jump" the jeep or to chain it up. Chaining it up takes running the jeep up on blocks then dumping all your suspension and chaining the jeep to the neck of the trailer. This will eliminate one swivel point and make it more maneuverable.
    Jumping involves sliding your 5th wheel forward so that the jeeps 5th wh÷l center is ahead of the rear axle center and a set of rollers on the jeep run up the pickup rails on your tractor lifting the jeeps axle off the ground. You then stop the jeep sliding sideways on your frame.
    Either way you run with the jeep off the ground when not needed.
    You may notice that sliding the 5th forward is how you jump and your 24" slider is not enough, but that 60"will be.
     
  7. ETMF 58 White

    ETMF 58 White Light Load Member

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    Wow, great help from both of you guys. I’m assuming those rollers you speak of are like double flange rollers to ride up that lowboy ramp and then not be able to move side to side? I have seen lowboy ramps on mechanical RGN trucks, but mine is hydraulic so I don’t have them. I suppose I could build a set. And it sounds like my bargain 60 inch slider may come in handy after all. So instead of selling it I’ll just sell my 1966 powershift 4020 to Old iron; looks like he needs a few more John Deeres around there lol.
     
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  8. old iron

    old iron Road Train Member

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    Ha!
    Going once...
    Going twice...
    Sold!
    The Canadians ride around with a jeep on the frame rails everyday.
    You might have to throw a chain or strap on it just in case a overzealous law man that's never seen this particular setup decides it's unsecured.
    I was thinking about having a large pin mounted between the rollers that slides into a tapered slot in the rear cross member of the truck.
    Kinda like a trail king style lowboy hookup.
    That way it can't move any direction until it's slid back off the truck.
     
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  9. beastr123

    beastr123 Road Train Member

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    Watch from the 2 min mark to the 5 min mark.
    You can just see the rollers ahead of the tire and see it on the end of the pickup rails.
     
  10. booley

    booley Road Train Member

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    There’s an outfit that runs out of Canada that uses a small tag that they connect to the back of the drives. Anyone familiar with this setup. I could never find out anything about these things but it seems like it’s almost like a “pin-on” E2F7531C-F062-4E08-99B3-1741DD0B5A82.png
     
  11. haulhand

    haulhand Road Train Member

    If you only need a four axle sometimes you should just build a pin on axle. If your in Texas talk with Nu-Gen Services they are in Port Allen and build a slick pinon that is like a lowboy flip and will lift. http://nu-genservices.com
     
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