Some truckers oppose letting Mexican trucks on U.S. roads

Don't want to hi jack your conversation but the statement about been able to live a comparable life on 1/10 th of the salary because the cost of living in India is so cheap. Completely wrong.The problem is that there are skilled and qualified people that have continues employment for many years that live in cardboard boxes on the sidewalks in India.This is because they cant afford a house or houses are not available.An apartment or house of an acceptable American standard costs more in India (In most 3rd world countries it is this way) then in most parts of America.

 

And this is why the "they" continue to flock here....."The shining City on the hill" as Reagan so eloquently put it......

 

You may be right, but I haven't heard of programmers in India living in boxes. From every report I've ever heard, people flocked to IT in India because it provided an above average living, even on $6,000 USD a year.

Now $6,000 USD is based on the average an Indian progammer was making about 10 years ago. It's probably closer to $10,000 USD now, but I really don't know. Anyway, $6,000 USD is like $275,000 rupees and $10,000 is arounf $455,000 rupees (you can find conversion calculators online). Most of the IT jobs in India are located in Bangalore, and here are some recent rental values for Bangalore http://content.magicbricks.com/property-rates-in-bangalore

It would seem that programmers on that kind of salary could well afford some kind of apartment there.

 

I can only speak for my time spent in the IT field, which stretched from the early 80's until 2002. I never saw any people from India working in the field until the Internet really took off, and that would've been in the mid 90's. The Internet made it possible to have software development done overseas, which is why you didn't see outsourcing take off until the late 90's. The vast majority of people from India that I did see and work with in the U.S. were here to pick up experience, and then go back to India. Most didn't want to stay in the U.S. As far as IT goes, there's no reason to flock here because they've now go it over there.

 

I've always been under the impression that the H1B was used only to fill jobs where there was a lack of qualified Americans. Got this from wikipedia (yeah, I know about using wikipedia as a source, but not all things on it are wrong):

The H-1B is a non-immigrant visa in the United States under the Immigration and Nationality Act, section 101(a)(15)(H). It allows U.S. employers to temporarily employ foreign workers in specialty occupations. If a foreign worker in H-1B status quits or is dismissed from the sponsoring employer, the worker can apply for a change of status to another non-immigrant status, find another employer (subject to application for adjustment of status and/or change of visa), or must leave the US.

The regulations define a "specialty occupation" as requiring theoretical and practical application of a body of highly specialized knowledge in a field of human endeavor] including, but not limited to, architecture, engineering, mathematics, physical sciences, social sciences, biotechnology, medicine and health, education, law, accounting, business specialties, theology, and the arts, and requiring the attainment of a bachelor's degree or its equivalent as a minimum (with the exception of fashion models, who must be "of distinguished merit and ability".) Likewise, the foreign worker must possess at least a bachelor's degree or its equivalent and state licensure, if required to practice in that field. H-1B work-authorization is strictly limited to employment by the sponsoring employer.

So my question is how could this type of visa be used to bring in foreign drivers? Not to be condescending or insulting, but it doesn't seem driving a truck would be so highly specialized that there would be a lack of qualified U.S. drivers to do any available driving job. How IT and U.S. companies got around it as far as hiring programmers is that they asked for skill sets that were virtually impossible to have. It'd be like asking a mechanic to be master certified in both autos and diesel, and also to be an expert on every make, model, and year produced by Ford, GM, Chrysler, Toyota, etc. over the past 10 years. Then they could claim that there were no "qualified" U.S. programmers and could bring someone in on an H1B visa and pay them a lot less. If the H1Bs complained, they'd lose their sponsorship and be sent back to where they came from, and there was always someone else willing to take their place.

 

You're right on point. H1B visas cannot be used to bring in truckers from Mexico or other points in South America. This is propaganda used by OOIDA to scare the hell out of their members, get others to join and to help them oppose the US upholding their obligations.

You're right. The Department of Labor views us as "unskilled labor" which is an insult in and of itself.

How these companies in the past were able to bring in the Aussies and Kiwis and the Eastern Europeans is anyones guess. I've worked with them. They're ok, at least the ones from down under. The morons for the EU don't speak much English and are rude as hell.

But consider the numbers once again. We have more than 3,000,000 CDL holders in the US. Mexico has, at last count, less than 250,000 Federally licensed truck drivers. (Those that can operate nationwide in Mexico) And with almost 4,000,000 loads crossing the southern border each year, don't you think they're all needed to keep the industry moving down there?

 

I was not specifically talking about programmers living in boxes because I don't know of this specifically.I do know for sure that there are thousands if not millions of skilled productive people living in what would be considered sub human conditions by first world standards.Modern ships and communication have made the world smaller then ever.History has repeated its self over and over.The fortunes of empires rise and fall.The pattern is usually a slow rise in fortunes of all.Then a falling away of the middle class , then collapse. Major corporations care only for profits and nothing else.If legislation allows for them to move then why would they stay where costs are higher or restrictions tighter. If this continues unabated manufacturing will keep migrating out of America.American corporations may still own these concerns but not be located in America (I also think these corporations see them selfs more as world corporations then American as time goes by) .If this is allowed the effect will be felt mostly by the middle class.The very rich own the stock in these corporations so the extra profits from lower input costs are good for them.The poor are already poor.I'm just not convinced that definition of poor in America is the same as what is considered poor in some parts of the world.The middle class is where the loss of manufacturing industries will be felt mostly, if the trend is allowed to continue.A common held belief is that what ever happens is natural progression and should be left to run its course.This is the capitalist way.Survival of the fittest.This sounds fair does it not ? I say if you are happy to play second fiddle and become poorer and poorer then go with this.What got America to the top of manufacturing may not be what is needed to keep it there.Changes are needed in order to force things to go in a direction that is not natural.I don't think America has the ability to ease restrictions or lower input costs enough that manufacturing would flow towards America.It is impossible for you to compete with wages in China , India or any other developing nation. A way needs to be found to entice or if need be force US corporations to keep their manufacturing on US soil.This may sound extreme or unfair but my argument is this. As unfair as this sounds it is also unfair that a truck driver in Africa earns $4 p/h with zero benefits.The world is an unfair place and that is how it is. You can choose to be fair and poor or "unfair" and hang on to what you have got.By force if necessary. The tide wont turn on its own , unnatural intervention is needed.It is later then you think.

Sorry somehow thought I was in the thread about Manufacturing decline in America.Some parallelism though.

 

I say ban outsourcing for a period of 5 years. When the period is over, and a Unites States based company begins to put foreigners to work before US Citizens, levy heavy fines upon them, and knock off the big tax breaks.

Just 5 years is all that would be needed to dig us out of this crap. I know what a lot of you are gonna say, but the problem is too big and the final analysis points to the end of this country.

True most manufacturing jobs have been automated, but why did Ford choose Mexico for its big plants? One word.


GREED.


I wish the medical field would call this what it is. A mental disorder.

I have met people that literally act like a junkie where money is involved. Greed is another word for addiction. The only difference is the drug. Drugs make people do stupid things. Money is the worst drug of all.

Just my observations, your mileage may vary.

 

Under what authority?

 

Ban outsourcing for 5 years...What would Dell do?

What about Cigna?.....

Do Americans have the ability to answer phones, answer questions correctly, and be courteous no matter what...for $10/H?