Cracked head (intake) but 2 different stories from 2 different mechanics !

Discussion in 'Heavy Duty Diesel Truck Mechanics Forum' started by rbrauns, Nov 29, 2019.

  1. rbrauns

    rbrauns Light Load Member

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    So, I just bought a 2008 FL Cascadia with the 14L DDEC 6 EGR engine. The truck was 800 miles away and rust free compared to the local trucks so I paid for a pre-purchase inspection. The dealer also sent me invoices showing that the head gasket and rad were replaced 6 months ago and still have a warranty left. This work was done by Mechanic A. The pre-purchase inspection place told me that everything was OK except for a few minor things. like a leaky brake chamber, a small chip on the brake pads and a burnt marker light on the cab. Nothing else wrong, solid truck.

    So, based on this, I figured that they really checked everything out and I bought the truck. Flew to get it and drove it home. It was worse than I expected, the drive tires do not have 40% tread but are 1 mm above the wear indicators, there is a horrible shimmy like the engine is really out of balance, it pulls badly to the right and I noticed halfway through my trip that the coolant light was flashing so I topped it up. I tried to sleep in the bunk but there was no heat back there, so I drove home instead. I also noticed the smell of coolant when I turned on the heat so I thought maybe heater core. No big deal.

    I've supposed to start flat deck work on the East coast ASAP.

    Today, I brought it to a local mechanic that everyone uses and swears by. This is Mechanic B. He replaced the steady bearing in the middle of the driveshaft and adjusted the ride height and that fixed the awful vibrations.

    The coolant lines to the rear bunk were disconnected and he pressure tested the system. Holds pressure so the heater core is fine. He checked the engine while it was cold and all was good no leaks, coolant is not mixing with oil and oil is not getting into the coolant so he decides to test the engine when hot with a stopper and a blue liquid in a bottle that changes color if the exhaust is leaking. No leaks there but it is bubbling like a fish tank and big bubbles, too. He checked the air compressor for leaks, the valve in the bunk for leaks and all is good.

    He thinks that the head is cracked right around one of the intake valves. $10K to fix because my DDEC 6 engine was only made for 8 months and the only head that is available is a reman from Detroit. A DDEC 5 engine can even get a brand new head so no cracks at all.

    So, I call the dealer that sold me the truck. Sorry, sold "as is" no warranty. Talked to a lawyer. She said I can sue the inspection company because I based my purchase decision on their clean bill of health but not the dealer.

    Aside from the legal issues, Mechanic A said that he stands by his work and that he's done hundreds of head gaskets and never had a problem. He also told me that Detroit Series 60 EGR engines are bubbly to begin with so just open the cap while the engine is hot, release the trapped air and don't worry, you can just keep adding coolant until I start work and fix the head later. Oh, Mechanic B is just trying to sell me a head but if I drive it 800 miles back to his shop, he can set me up way cheaper. Finally, if the head gasket was bad, then coolant will overflow into the expansion tank so put a jar under it and test it. Don't worry, he says, even if air is getting into the cooling system, the rad cap will release the pressure and I can just drive it around like that. Hey, I drove it home 800 miles, didn't I?

    Mechanic B tells me that there should be no air in the system at all and that I will blow a hose and eventually have too much coolant in the engine which will cause the coolant to get into the oil. Don't drive it off his lot, he says.

    So, who is right? Can I drive around with a cracked intake and put in a jug of coolant every 1000 miles until I start making money or should I get the head replaced ASAP?

    A court date won't happen for a year or longer so I need some help.

    God, I love driving truck but can't stand the scummy people that I keep running into.
     
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  3. AModelCat

    AModelCat Road Train Member

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    Did anybody check the air compressor? The air compressor is cooled by engine coolant and is capable of putting air bubbles into the engine cooling system.
     
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  4. Rideandrepair

    Rideandrepair Road Train Member

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    You need to know if the coolant system is getting pressurized.I don’t know how they can diagnose it as an intake valve, I’m not a mechanic, but a leaky head gasket, left unattended will blow, eventually, possibly causing pitting on top of cylinder liner, if it’s not already damaged. Happened to Me, blew head gasket, replaced gasket, then a couple yrs later the cylinder dropped blowing gasket and filling piston with coolant, locking motor up. I guess you’re saying it’s blowing bubbles from the coolant overflow. A sure sign of a problem. A Mechanic with a pressure tester, shouldn’t have to rely on looking for bubbles. They pressure tested your heater core, passed, they can also , using the same pressure tester hooked up in place of radiator cap, put a little pressure in it, to move the needle. Start Truck, run, and see if the pressure gage moves higher. If the coolant is getting pressurized it will continue to build up pressure. If it’s all good, it should stay below 10 lbs. I think mechanic A thinks gasket is fine, just has air pockets in coolant system, Running it with cap off will allow the air to work its way out. Mechanic B says gasket leaking, due to bubbles. You need to have them check it with a pressure gage hooked up, while it’s running. It’s either building excess pressure, or it’s not. If you keep losing A/F it probably is. But could just be getting too hot from a stuck thermostat or plugged radiator, or ? Have to get the pressure test.
     
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  5. Rideandrepair

    Rideandrepair Road Train Member

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    That’s right, isolating the compressor, to rule it out as the cause should also be done. It Kills Me, how quick some Mechanics are to say the heads cracked.
     
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  6. AModelCat

    AModelCat Road Train Member

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    Its rediculous how inept some mechanics are. Unfortunately it makes the rest of us look stupid.
     
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  7. Heavyd

    Heavyd Road Train Member

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    Can you just get your money back?
     
  8. rbrauns

    rbrauns Light Load Member

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    Thanks for the responses. I'm going to have the Freightliner dealer look at it. The local shop did check the air compressor and found nothing wrong. I will see what my options are this coming Monday, Dec 2. Today is Sat, Nov 30.
     
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  9. xsetra

    xsetra Road Train Member

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    Return truck to seller and honor the warranty or request refund.
    Good luck.
     
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  10. CountryBumkin

    CountryBumkin Bobtail Member

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    The "Blue" test liquid used, turns green in the presence of combustion gases, so it didn't turn yellow means there is no compression getting into cooling system. But the mechanic needs to be sure the test liquid works on diesel (some do gas and diesel, some don't). That's usually what happens when a head cracks (of course it depends on where the crack is, but typically they crack from coolant port to combustion chamber) so that's good.
    Air bubbles in the overflow tank are not normal (maybe one or two). But not a steady flow like a fish tank. If the Air Compressor has a leaking head gasket it can pump air into the cooling system. You said the mechanic tested this (or did he?).
    You need to disconnect the coolant lines between engine and air compressor and see if air bubbles stop. You may be able to test by holding the compressors "unloader" valves open so the compressor is not building air - then if the bubbles stop or reduce you can further confirm by disconnecting coolant lines.

    Here's a video on the test
     
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  11. rbrauns

    rbrauns Light Load Member

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    @CountryBumkin, this video is GREAT ! This is exactly what my truck is doing. Has a new head gasket (still under warranty in fact and he installed 2 new liners and shimmed them 30 thou over stock). AFAIK the 2 mechanics only disconnected the air compressor output line. I'm going to take it to a 3rd shop and specifically request that he disconnect the coolant limes to isolate the air compressor. The motor starts right up if the batteries are full so
    I know the compression is good.

    Doesn't overheat, no oil in coolant and visa versa so I'm thinking it is the compressor.

    The only other symptom is super high oil pressure like 100 PSI even at idle when the truck is hot.

    Seller has hinted at taking the truck back but for less than I paid for it.,,,
     
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