Don't Buy International!

Discussion in 'International Forum' started by HulseyEnvironmental, Sep 28, 2012.

  1. HulseyEnvironmental

    HulseyEnvironmental Bobtail Member

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    Sep 28, 2012
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    Dont Buy International!

    Here at Hulsey we have a fleet of trucks that we use for hauling. One of the trucks we purchased to be the flagship of that fleet was a brand new International Workstar 2011. Out of all the Trucks in the fleet we own, some of those trucks being older. The flagship spends more time in the shop than quite literally all the other trucks put together. Bottom Line, The Workstar is a Lemon. We have experienced nothing but reluctance from International when it comes to honoring the warranty. In fact owning this truck by our estimates has cost us the initial investment over 100 k and probably Twice that in downtime. Companies out there with trucking fleets will know what I mean when I say that A Brand new Tractor Trailer Truck needs to be able to operate to pay for itself, every hour one of these things sits idle is costing the company big money. We would very much like to continue to do business with international trucking, but unless they can stand behind their products I can say as of a certainty we will never buy from them again. At this point I advise all
    buyers to avoid International Trucks. They may not all be lemons like the WorkStar, but Do You Really want to spend over 100k with a company that won't stand by their products?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 28, 2012
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  3. Dutch

    Dutch Light Load Member

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    You can also you can try calling 1-800-44-TRUCK (87825) to see if you can get in touch with a CSE. What problems have you been having?
     
  4. Hooda

    Hooda Light Load Member

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    What kind of hauling are you doing with the truck and what engine/driveline is in it? I know that's irrelevant to the statement, but I drove new Ford dumps back in the 90's before ford STUPIDLY exited the heavy truck segment, complete with superior support. The company I was with went Sterling for a while until he had trouble with warranty issues and quality and made the LEAP to Mack (which contributed to their demise-If you're having trpuble paying for Sterlings, how you gonna pay for Macks?)but Mack gave him the RED CARPET for every little issue. Now that I'm getting back into the biz as an OTR driver, I'll be looking for an employer that doesn't even look at International, but I'd drive a Mack or a Volvo any day of the week.

     
  5. Calspring

    Calspring Light Load Member

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    I don't have any experience with International but I would venture to say that whoever made the purchasing decision didn't do much research. It is written all over the internet the problems people have had with the Navistar engines. The trucks seem to be built well the engine is just a dog with fleas. International has said they are coming out with a new engine in 2013 (i believe it is based off of a cummins) because they were not able to meet the epa requirements with their EGR technology. There has been quite an improvement in the quality of engines that use DEF and this will hopefully turn things around for international.

    For myself, it didn't take long to no longer consider international when I bought my trucks as I could see the issues that people were having although I was initially interested because I would like to avoid the hastle of DEF fills (it is only available at a few truck stops in bulk in western Canada, you usually have to hit a lube shop to get it or pay through the nose for the jugs)
     
  6. Hooda

    Hooda Light Load Member

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    Rockville, Minnesota
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    I guess my ONLY issue with International that really gets me is I like cool looking trucks, and there's no getting around the Lonestar as being out and out COOL. I'd be happy to drive one, but awfully PO'd if that pretty truck spent an inordinate amount of time in a service bay
     
  7. chalupa

    chalupa Road Train Member

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    Binder spent like 104 million in warranty claims at last report. Some of their products stay in the shop so much they have a curtain so you can't see it. The CEO retired ( Forcefuly ) from the co.and the board the other day.

    Binder is in deep doodo right now and it's going to be awhile before they see daylight. They are bleeding money bad and this explains alot. They tried to thumb their nose at the competition and the EPA and got burned for it.

    Looks to me like you need to choose. You can stay with the truck and try to work it out or you can clean it up and sell / trade it. Depends on how bad it is, only you know that. Hows your documentation? Got a record of every repair, tow, visit, phone call? You could try lemon law or BBB arbitration but both are time consuming. Have you called the zone rep? Got to call dealer and him before you go any higher and give them both a chance to adress concerns.


    You might inquire of your CPA the optimum time to dump ( take the loss ) also .

    Tough call, raw deal....
    Good luck,.
    JMO
     
  8. freightlinerman

    freightlinerman Road Train Member

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    Could you be more specific an tell us WHY the trucks are in the shop? This post is very vague.
     
  9. Heavyd

    Heavyd Road Train Member

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    I love these rants. Nothing like coming on here and ######## and complaining about how much down time your trucks have. If you find yourself going to the same dealer over and over and the truck really doesn't get fixed, maybe it is the dealer, not the truck! Dealers are just as different as the trucks are. Find a different dealer. Do a search, you will find lots of people that hate Petes, or Volvos, or Macks or whatever. Yes, Internationals and MF suck, but the rants belong at the playground.
     
    EZ Money Thanks this.
  10. Mind-Master

    Mind-Master Bobtail Member

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    I work for a municipal goverment and I just got a brand new Interational WorkStar 7400 SBA truck. Engine is the infamous MAXXFORCE 9 Advanced EGR. I have a lot of issues with this truck from high operating temperatures, strange exhaust fumes and exhaust smell, water leaking into the cab trough the visor, A/C and Fan clutch just don't work and it is not comfortabble being on this cab all day with no A/C and an engine that generates to much heat and trows it thowards the firewall. My feet feel the heat as the DPF infrastructure is undrr the cab's floor. I like how it performs but there are issues that keep coming time aftrr time. My Maxxforce 9 is mated to an ALLISON 3500 RDS and I think there is a comunication problem between engine and transmission. Got it to the dealer yesterday for service and the people at the dealer just back-off on honoring the warranties for electrical malfinction. They first make sure to blame me for all the issues. Truck has only 480 operational hours and 3,498 miles. Dealer staff told me I should have done an ENGINE OIL and OIL FILTER change at 275 operational hours or 7,000 miles and I think that is to soon for an engine that has not "broken-in" or "loosen-up" allready. Got on my Smart Phone and search for the MAXXFORCE serviceability intervals and it states that ENGINE OIL and OIL FILTER should be done at 550 operational hours or 15,000 miles. Who should I trust? My NAVISTAR dealer or the very own Navistar Company? Dealer charges $780 for a basic mantainance service wich is Engine Oil and Oil Filter change or replacement, Transmission Oil and Transmission Oil filters replacement, Fuel filter replacement and compmete lube-up and grease services. Transmission does not needs any mantainance service yet as the ALLISON AUTOMATIC has a diagnosis or prognosis feature and the monitor on the selector tells me OIL-OK. OIL MONITOR 96%. FILTER MONITOR-OK. TRANSMISSION HEALTH-OK. Diagnostic 1 P2146. So, Who should I trust? Dealer rep. or my ALLISON'S self diagnosis and prognosis feature? Our main company just bought 7 MACK Granite trucks and they have MACK MP-7 with ALLISON automatics and they out-ran me in fuel economy and power. They get up to 5.7 MPG while I just get 2.7 MPG. And the exhaust stack on the MACK trucks are clean on the inside part, while the exhaust stack on my WORKSTAR is corroded and dirty.
     
  11. Mind-Master

    Mind-Master Bobtail Member

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    Intrrnational is loosing customers big time and now box truck drivers are moving to HINO Trucks. I drove a 2013 HINO 338 with ALLISON AUTOMATIC with Shift Management Technology nd it rides very very good, besides they have one of the best warranty coverage in the industry.

    I will choose MACK for our next vocational and otr trucks and HINO for our next class 6 / 7 municipal trucks, both are performing well and free of issues on the emissions stuff.
     
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