Driving down steep grades in icy conditions

Discussion in 'Questions From New Drivers' started by Lepton1, Sep 21, 2017.

  1. Lepton1

    Lepton1 Road Train Member

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    I came across this video, which IMHO is solid gold. Great scenery and great advice.



    First of all, note that this veteran of driving off road (this is a dirt road) USES HIS JAKE BRAKES. I emphasize that point because all new drivers are told to never use Jakes in slick conditions. Good advice IF you don't know how to use them.

    Notice he demonstrates and talks about the importance of using the light or medium Jake setting in conjunction with a constant, light application of the service brakes, about 5 psi. He does go to the high Jake setting for slowing before curves or hitting the slick 10% downgrades.

    He also talks about the danger of going TOO slow on banked curves or longer steep downgrades. On banked turns if you go too slow you slide sideways to the inside of the turn. On long downgrades you can only hold it back so much before you start sliding. Go with the right speed to maintain traction.

    Practice. Learn all the tools and what they can do.
     
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  3. DUNE-T

    DUNE-T Road Train Member

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    I hope I am never gonna need these skills:rolleyes:
     
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  4. 201

    201 Road Train Member

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    My advice, don't. If I broke traction, it was off at the next exit and wait for the salt shaker. Ice was the only thing that I'd "shut 'er down" for. ( Mack R models bust through drifts so nice loaded) Deal with the boss later.
     
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  5. Toomanybikes

    Toomanybikes Road Train Member

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    Just because a guy gets away with a bad idea does not make it a good idea.

    Simple physics - if you have limited traction, distributing braking forces through multiple axles is better then through one or two with the jake. Especially when that one or two is most responsible for stability of the truck and trailer.

    This guy succeeded driving in these conditions despite using the jake, not because of it. He was going slow. And the problem giving this advice is every new truck driver thinks they are an expert shortly getting out of their mentor's truck and ready to use the all so handy jake in all conditions.
     
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  6. AModelCat

    AModelCat Road Train Member

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    If the guys back home never used the jake hauling logs off the mountains they'd spend all day trying to get down from the top. From what I can see, its all about using the tools at your disposal. Chain up, inter-axle locked in and diff locks in and out as needed.
     
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  7. Blackshack46

    Blackshack46 Road Train Member

    Dang good advice. I like these videos, since we only get late november to march to practice with the real stuff anymore. Especially around SE PA.

    These videos though are great at keeping me thinking and remembering what all i need to do.

    If only the forum youtuber could be educational. Lol nah, nvm.
     
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  8. Lepton1

    Lepton1 Road Train Member

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    Amen.

    To which I would add the defining moment of Allen Iverson's career:

    "We're talking about PRACTICE!"

    Once you learn the limitations of traction with the Jake, you learn to play that thing like a piano, changing from High, Medium, to Low or NO Jake as the situation requires.

    Here's the thing. All drivers WILL be faced with a similar scenario if they drive long enough. You might start driving westbound from Denver in t-shirts and shorts weather, approach the Eisenhower Tunnel with NO chains required, but be in a blizzard the last few miles up and down because mountains make their own weather. You will have to be able to deal with that SAFELY.

    One thing the OP video didn't cover, which I think is important, is to cancel the Jakes altogether and LET IT FLY if you feel even low setting is starting to slip. Then get on the service brakes to slow it down to low rpm's, reengage the Jake on low setting and start all over again controlling your descent.
     
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  9. Lepton1

    Lepton1 Road Train Member

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    Absolutely true.

    This is why on the big road you see truckers hauling logs, cattle, or oil field equipment that might be driving a tad faster than you. That's because the challenges they face getting to and from paved roads is often a magnitude of difficulty greater than the simple act of keeping it upright in slick conditions. That's the time to light up a smoke, drink some coffee, say a prayer of thanks for not needing to call a tow truck or bulldozer to haul you out of a snow bank miles from nowhere, and be patient while the big road drivers sort it out.

    By NO means am I the fastest driver on the road in a blizzard. I pay attention to space management. I pay attention to what other drivers need. I slow way down if I am getting passed and might speed way up to expedite a pass. Everything is all about separating myself from drivers that may or may not have skills and mindset to handle the conditions.
     
  10. AModelCat

    AModelCat Road Train Member

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    One thing I am curious about though is how a truck reacts when the jake starts locking up wheel(s).

    No lockers locked in, the duals with the least amount of traction lock up. You still have 6 drive tires turning at road speed so in theory, you should still be going straight, correct?

    Inter axle locked in, the jakes will need to lock up a dual on each axle now. I'd imagine it would be a bit hairier now but you'd still have 4 tires turning at road speed. I could see it getting a bit scarier as tires lock and release as they find and lose traction though.
     
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  11. Lepton1

    Lepton1 Road Train Member

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    No. If you descend an icy grade that is two digits in percentage, you will need to control that descent. Service brakes alone is a bad idea.
     
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