How are Brokers NOT to blame?

Discussion in 'Freight Broker Forum' started by rch10007, Oct 14, 2022.

  1. rch10007

    rch10007 Medium Load Member

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    Ok. I'm not looking to start a cult here. I'm throwing out options for problems that have been CLEARLY addressed on this forum over and over again. Why does it keep coming up if there's been a solution? I'm just offering one possible solution here and one cause for all the back and forth, tit for tat drama over rates.

    Check out this article: Why Your Relationship May Be Stuck in a Frustrating Tit-for-Tat Pattern

    It's context is not exactly specific to trucking but relationships are all the same...even within this forum.

    Would you agree brokers and carriers have trust issues? Can we ALL agree on that? If so, how do we move forward given that knowledge?
     
    RJM1953 Thanks this.
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  3. Long FLD

    Long FLD Road Train Member

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    On a larger scale, at the contract level, most loads probably are what you’d consider to be a fair rate. Be it a carrier with a contract and fuel surcharge or a broker with a contract to move a certain number of their loads per week at a given rate. Where the “market” comes into play is when supply and demand comes in. The spot market is overflow for the most part.

    Regardless of how people choose to see it, when rates were high anyone, carrier or broker, that was locked into a contract likely lost money to move loads on the spot market. I know what our stuff pays in general and we would’ve for sure lost money if we couldn’t cover our loads ourselves. This year it’s a different story. They could offer the load at the market rate on the boards and it would move.

    Now the spot market is in the position where there’s not as much overflow and a record number of people got their authority and the result is dismal rates because the slice of the pie is smaller.
     
  4. TallJoe

    TallJoe Road Train Member

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    The spot market determines what rates are available on given lanes. It is important to know what your minimum rate is but imposing your optimal rate on lanes you would like to run is impossible. When it happens, it happens coincidently. In other words, lanes pay what they pay and you won't beat it by much, therefore you need to find lanes that would be applicable to your rate, not the other way around.
    For example, I was happy running Chicago-Baltimore, MD markets for over a year when it paid $4000 and then backhauls were in the range of $1800 - 2400.
    After tolls and fuel, I was left with $4000-5000 per week (4-5 days runs).
    If I were to continue those two lanes today, I'd be left with a little above $2500. I can't realistically expect that I'd be able to achieve much more than that but the same results, if not better I can obtain by running shorter but more frequent runs - more regionally. If $2500 after tolls and fuel were my weekly minimum, I'd be looking for lanes that would enable me to achieve that rather than hoping to get more luck with lanes I find most preferable.
     
    bryan21384, MIT and rch10007 Thank this.
  5. rch10007

    rch10007 Medium Load Member

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    Thank you for carrying on the conversation. I've been thinking rate calculation has been the root cause of rates being taken so low. I have taken a low rate before just to get home (like maybe 3 times - since 1995). I totally understand how that happens. That's why I don't judge or hate carriers that do. However, I've never taken the stupid kinds of rates that are on the load boards right now. I find it offensive and wanted to know if other's are offended. If so, will this lead to carriers "sticking" it to the brokers next year? If carriers are looking forward to gouging brokers again, is that cycle healthy? If not, is there anything that "we" professionals in the industry can do to make a change? See where I'm going here?

    I see a problem and I'm asking others in the biz for feedback to have a discussion. Thanks for bringing up contract rates. I will say from the data I have reviewed, contracts rates are way up! This has been great for longevity...for some.

    Also, you bring up new authorities. I am so torn here. There HAS to be some standards implemented here. I want folks to be free to get into a truck, but at the preservation of those that have put in the time (paid their dues) to have a solid, reliable business in place and continue to operate so that folks can eat. Could preservation of owner/operators be linked to national security in your mind? If so, would it behoove the regulators to implement a better strategy that would increase the amount of time it takes to obtain authority? Thereby reducing the surge of new and departing carriers? Thereby reducing the dramatic swing in rates?

    Again, I'm asking for a discussion here. I'm not crying over the rates. But how are we all to blame, and more importantly, is there something we can start doing to help change things down the road...I know nothing we discuss is going to change for me. I'm not asking these questions because I need more work and can't get it...as some seem to think. I take loads when I need to go purchase things for my farm. Guess what, I get paid to go buy stuff and most of the time, the rates I get paid also cover what I buy to haul back. So, I'm not in any trouble of losing my company anytime soon. I own everything out right and do most of my own maintenance. I don't have to take cheap rates because I have a steady stream of income outside of trucking.. More importantly, I don't haul cheap freight because I know it's not good for the next guy.

    That said, I did have to research ALOT to determine what would be an appropriate rate to charge brokers or shippers when they call. I've tried to share this knowledge merely to help the next guy. Maybe even strike up a conversation that brokers could watch to see where carriers are getting their rates from so they can do a better job of relaying our needs to the shippers so when they take on a new client, they are in a better position to know what their client can expect...realistically. That just seems like a win for everyone...to be on the same page. Not everyone will want to do that, but they don't matter to anyone but themselves anyways.
     
  6. LameMule

    LameMule Road Train Member

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    Crack your window, turn up some tunes and give it time for the dust to settle.
     
  7. rch10007

    rch10007 Medium Load Member

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    Great point! Check this out: IF you have a method of calculating your rates, you can then view "average market rate" data and compare whether or not the lane you are researching will be profitable to you BUT more importantly you'll have a reference to know when those lanes may become profitable again.

    For example, I'll attach more data from a chart I provided earlier. It shows the difference between a loadboard average rate and what I need to move in that lane. I DO NOT reduce my rate to go into some "cheap market." However, I do not increase my rates to go into FL either. If a broker or shipper calls me to move a load, chances are I tell them I'm too expensive for them or that they'll be happy to hear what I'll go for. This is my attempt of not screwing the next guy by taking rates willy nilly.

    This data is not up to date, as FSC is calculated here but changes daily, as do my rates. load.jpg


    When you look at the difference between my rate and the market rate, you can see what lanes would be profitable for me to seek loads.
     
    TallJoe Thanks this.
  8. bonder45

    bonder45 Road Train Member

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    I find personally the best way to get yourself the rate you want is to go directly to the customer and take what you want. Anything extra you can’t handle you broker out.

    It’s more work and more money but definitely worth it IF your customer sees you as an asset to make their life easier.
     
  9. Midwest Trucker

    Midwest Trucker Road Train Member

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    Ssssshhhhhh.
     
  10. wichris

    wichris Road Train Member

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    No problem, let them. Most will treat a customer the same as a broker, makes them appreciate a good carrier even more.
     
  11. Midwest Trucker

    Midwest Trucker Road Train Member

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    Are you crazy? lol That is your JOB to gouge brokers. Your content making a fair wage? Dude, go be a company driver. This is grown man stuff not powder puff.

    If you have a customer then be fair and think long term. If your customer is the broker… rip his head off and piss down his ####ing throat. I don’t mean this literally and be professional, but you have to have a mindset of get every last dollar out of this ### hole. When things switch you better believe that’s how he’s going to act.

    Now, I run assets, owner ops, and am a broker… I make sure I make good money on the brokerage but I’m actually not as cut throat in that side because I want s quality carrier to service my customer and try to use the same carriers over and over. But, I respect when carriers lean on me as long as their service is top notch. Sometimes I gotta lean on them but they know there’s freight that they need.

    This content, everything fair crap is why your so confused. Life isn’t like that. Be the best, demand the most, and follow through. I’ve said before that my goal and what I do is run a first class operation across the board from trucks, trailers, drivers, pay, customers, rates, back office, everything. You cannot achieve nor afford to run like that by being content.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2022
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