Why aren't truckers in the driver's seat?

Discussion in 'Experienced Truckers' Advice' started by jptrick, Nov 3, 2012.

  1. 900,000-tons-of-steel

    900,000-tons-of-steel Road Train Member

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    The majority of companies pay a salary commensurate with experience, not based on merit. I agree with the gist of what you set forth but it isn't the way it works with the majority of companies.
     
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  3. tl385

    tl385 Light Load Member

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    Amen, G/MAN.
     
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  4. jgremlin

    jgremlin Heavy Load Member

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    There are have been several responses in this thread so far which have some merit. But I think this one has the most merit as far as this topic goes.

    Our biggest problem is us. We are our own worst enemy. And I think the quick training periods and low cost of entry are the biggest contributors to that. This is because those two factors more or less ensure that this industry will never have a shortage of individuals who are lacking in education, intelligence and/or self esteem. Now before anyone jumps all over me for calling truckers stupid, let me clarify that I am NOT knocking anyone. I'm just calling it as it is.

    The facts are what they are. And the fact is all of us know full well not to touch a bottle with yellow liquid sitting on the ground near a fuel pump. We've all seen them. We all know what they are. We all know where they came from and how they got there. You don't need to look any further than that to know that our industry is filled with individuals who lack the common decency and self respect necessary to go use a toilet or at the very least, put your pee bottles in the trash so no one else has to deal with them.

    Those people? They are among us and they are plentiful. And they aren't writing well reasoned letters to their congressmen. They aren't supporting any lobby groups that want to further our cause. And they most certainly aren't refusing to work for bottom feeders who pray on the ignorant.

    I was raised by a small business owner and I think that infected me with a small business owners perspective on labor relations. Which is to say I'm generally anti-union because I tend to see things through the business owners eyes. But in the case of trucking, I'm not sure I see a better solution than a union. The job does not require anything above a slightly below average level of intellect. And the relative ease of entry means we will always have plenty of below average individuals among our ranks. Again, I'm not knocking those folks, I'm glad they're here, god bless 'em all. But the facts are what they are. And in this case, I think a union is the best hope for bringing about better conditions and treatment across the industry because we cannot leave it up ourselves to do it on our own.

    Which is to say there is no way we will ever see better conditions treatment across the entire industry because there is no way we will ever see a union gain that much acceptance and power within our industry. The days of union dominated trucking are over and they aren't coming back. The best advice I could give anyone in this industry is to be vigilant and aggressive in your retirement planning and do your best to seek out tolerable conditions and treatment for as long as possible. Because someday, 2012 is going to be the good old days and we're all going to look back at how well we were treated back then and wish we were still treated so well.
     
  5. DealBreaker

    DealBreaker Light Load Member

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    I disagree blame belongs with the carriers. People get paid and treated right, a funny thing happens they stay ...
    We are on the cusp of a great unknown, they have raised med standards to near idiotic levels going as far as measuring necks.
    Where all of these regulatory paths seemingly headed towards a crossroads of some sort.
    Insurance companies dictating corporate policy. Profit dictating corporate morality and various agenda laden entity's attempting to subvert the will of millions.
    You can show all the respect in the world, The next day get thrown under the bus by the very one's you were loyal 2.
    This forum is proof positive most all companies now are ####. Picking one is like spinning a roulette wheel.
    For those of you that are underpaid you can all test this out on monday.
    Walk into your dispatch office. Tell your supervisor you have a new found respect for them and As such you must be now be paid a respectable wage for the sacrifice you and your family endure .

    Let us now how that works out for you .
    What will you do if they say no?

    I hope the shortage grows to near epidemic levels then and maybe then common sense will overtake all parties involved.
    Have a nice day:biggrin_25525:
     
  6. G/MAN

    G/MAN Road Train Member

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    We have the better educated drivers in this industry than when I first came into the business. The problem isn't education, as far as formal education is concerned. There are too many who simply don't care about themselves or the business. That is obvious by the trash and urine bottles left all over parking lots and the wet toilet seats that I see in truck stops from drivers who are too lazy to lift the seat or use a urinal.

    Many carriers do treat drivers well. I have had drivers working for me who were treated well, chose their own runs and pretty much did what they wanted and they were well compensated. Their pay was always there when it was supposed to be and yet I still had some who trashed my equipment, embezzled money, sold my fuel and one even abandoned a truck. It isn't always the carrier who is the problem. All a union would do is protect these types of individuals from being terminated or prosecuted. A good worker who is conscientious doesn't need a union. A good worker will always be in demand. A good worker will always be well compensated.

    If you are one of those who detest this business, then find something else to do that is more to your liking. Most carriers do a good job of getting drivers home when needed, however, due to the nature of this business it is not always possible. Carriers cannot afford to send all their drivers home with an empty truck. If you want to pay for the fuel and costs of driving home, then perhaps that is what you should do. I have usually been able to get home when needed. I have missed one Christmas and I can't blame another company since it was my company. I deadheaded from Eagle Pass, TX to Tennessee last year to be home on Christmas. Every business has it's drawbacks. I usually manage to be home at least on Thanksgiving and Christmas, but things can and do happen. You should understand this about the business. Whether you are an otr trucker, salesman or business executive, there will be times when you will not manage to be home when you would like.

    Other than the EOBR's and speed limiters, carriers have not been responsible for all the added regulations. You can thank the unions for some of them as well as certain special interest groups, such as MADD, etc., for many of the useless regulations. The majority of carriers want fewer not more regulations. When an industry becomes too regulated they leave the country. When workers make unrealistic demands on their employer, they move or shut the doors. The only thing unions do is shake down uneducated drivers who don't want to be held accountable and who want to be paid more for doing less. Well, it will be difficult to move the trucking industry out of the country, but carriers can bring in drivers from outside the country if that is what it takes to move the freight.

    There are some drivers who think that they can do a better job of running their company than the owners. I have had a few who thought that they could do a better job of running my business than me. Funny thing is that most of them lost their trucks (if they ever owned one) or didn't have the discipline to save enough money even for a down payment on a truck. They could not manage themselves or their one truck, but knew how I should run my business. If you want to make more money you have a few choices. You can improve your value to the company by doing your job better than most others. Don't complain when the company wants you to take a load to NYC. You get paid no matter where you go, who why should you care? You could save your money, buy a truck and lease to a carrier. You could save your money, buy a truck and trailer and get your own authority.

    Stop complaining and start planning. Fortunately, I don't see unions being a strong force in the otr trucking. Union membership is down, even in the LTL segment. I can't believe how many whine about wanting the union to come in and save them. Most people are paid exactly what they are worth in this industry. As I previously stated, there are ways in which you can earn more money, but it will take a commitment from you and a lot of discipline.
     
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  7. EZX1100

    EZX1100 Road Train Member

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    Gman, you may run a very decent company, and you seem like a pretty decent guy


    but that post was full of "stuff", because "most"? no ALL of these mega-carriers treat drivers like dog poop

    its just that men are so beat down these days, they just accept it

    you have been on this forum a long time, seems that you just choose to disbelieve all of these "bad company" posts

    i agree with you regarding SOME drivers and piss bottles and toilet seats and a host of other hygienic things, but that has nothing to do with truck drivers, that is just the way these animals were raised (same thing happens in offices)
     
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  8. jgremlin

    jgremlin Heavy Load Member

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    Always you say? I guess I must have worked for a few companies that didn't get the memo on that. :rolleyes:


    Was I whining? I don't believe I was. I don't generally support unions. But it cannot be denied that there are examples in history in certain industries where the labor force was horribly mistreated and conditions didn't improve until they formed a union. I am not at all claiming that the same is true for all unions today. It isn't. But unions have done good things for certain groups of workers in the past. And I also said in my post that while going union is the only possible solution I can imagine for improving conditions industry wide, it will NEVER happen. So was if I was whining I'd hate to hear what its like when a baby needs a bottle in your world.
     
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  9. EZX1100

    EZX1100 Road Train Member

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    Unions as organizing tools for the working man are a necessity in today's corporate dominated world

    it was unions that helped the working man during the robber baron years in the early 20th century

    now, did unions get fat, lazy, greedy, and bought out? yes they did, that was the goal of the union-busting politicians and oligarchy

    however, no one can deny unions, as a general idea is a good thing, the name of our country is UNITED states

    we have a military that is not 1.5million individuals, but it works as a union

    the ATA is a union for the mega carriers

    why is it truck drivers think they can fare better alone than together? some of the comments we make are mind-boggling
     
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  10. DrtyDiesel

    DrtyDiesel Road Train Member

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    My dads in a union at the Georgia pacific he works at, he's been in it for almost 28 years now. He said they used to actually do good things, but the new people running it don't really do anything at all. Work conditions have greatly improved as well as pay, but he told me certain things that need to change just haven't.

    I believe in unions but I personally wouldn't want to be in one for this industry.


    On a side note, our mechanics at one of the shops are thinking of forming a union. I just told him good luck with that

    Ethan
     
  11. 900,000-tons-of-steel

    900,000-tons-of-steel Road Train Member

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    In response to GMAN's latest ...

    You are an obvious deviation from the norm, run a good company and appear to be a fair and decent human being but (and I mean NO disrespect whatsoever) it appears it's been quite some time since you had to deal with the politics of driving over the road for a company other than your own and the trials and tribulations of the industry from a driver's perspective working for a run-of-the-mill company. While it appears you run a good company and treat your employees fairly, it is not the norm in the industry, not even close. To wit:

    - "A good worker will always be well compensated."

    There are thousands of drivers with plenty of integrity across the country who give their all to a company only to have that company turn their backs on them when the chips are down. This situation is played out every day across the country. The majority of carriers care only about moving freight from point A to B and the driver is a faceless number to the company, a replaceable and expendable commodity. An accurate sentence would be: "A good worker can sometimes be compensated justly IF the driver is with a fair and reputable company." Good drivers in this industry are far from being "always" well compensated. Most are overworked and underpaid.

    - "All a union would do is protect these types of individuals from being terminated or prosecuted."

    Unions have pros and cons but what you assert about ALL a union would do is untrue. A union can and does offers protection from unfair treatment rampant in the industry and can and does give a voice and protection to the trucker who has little recourse against unfair practices and wages in the industry. Problems such as CDL holders who spent $5k for a "school" only to sit at home and not find a job, illegal or immoral truck leases forced on drivers with the intent to fail so the company can maximize profits from the failure of the driver, abuse of DAC reports, drivers intentionally being paid a substandard wage to intentionally create turnover and much more. This isn't about whether one is pro or anti-union but the fact that drivers should have the CHOICE as to whether to join a union or not. Companies and carriers and certain organizations who fight unions tooth and nail want things to remain the same whereas truckers rights and recourse are limited and drivers are under their thumbs whereas they have complete control and drivers have little. Being the most "conscientious" driver in the world means little to most carriers as driver's personal feelings and concerns are all but irrelevant to most companies.

    - "Most carriers do a good job of getting drivers home when needed."

    Driver surveys (http://www.blogtalkradio.com/trucke...rucking--current-opportunities-and-discussion) and multiple trucker organizations' rank lack of home time AND lack of appreciation among the most common complaints by drivers leaving the industry and contributing to the high turnover. (http://truckinginfo.com/hdt/archives/2008/01/046a0801.asp).

    - "Most people are paid exactly what they are worth in this industry"

    I respectfully and highly disagree. When many drivers' total hours are calculated for the week it often comes out to $10 an hour or less for many and you maintain this is what they are worth for moving hundreds of thousands of dollars, sometimes millions of dollars, worth of freight, safely, on time and in good shape. Drivers are often making what they made 20 years ago and many are making even less.

    Such is not "whining" nor "complaining" but simply identifying what is taking place throughout the industry. The cream always rises to the top and I am satisfied with my position and company and know where I am going but had to weed through myriad bottom feeding companies who prey on new drivers and treat even seasoned drivers as nothing more than a replaceable and expendable commodity. Sadly, this is the norm in this industry and I feel for my fellow drivers who are stuck in an undesirable position who often have little choice but to remain there for fear of a company unfairly tarnishing their record should they decide to leave and go elsewhere. Lastly, the majority of drivers are not paid by merit as you suggest but by tenure and experience.
     
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