Clock status question. Staging are to dock if 14 is expired?

If you move a vehicle after the 14 has expired while at a terminal or a dock you have violated no HOS rules! If you get something said to you it is because your carrier is doing it. As long as you DO NOT attempt to drive on a public highway you can be on duty for 168 hours a week I guess. You can NOT legally operate a CMV with any of the clocks expired. 11-14-60/70. If you are directed to leave the facility you will have to leave. I have written about this subject several times now. The FMCSA will NEVER officially allow you to operate EVEN in this situation, to do so opens them up to horrid legal liability. There are no rules anywhere that allow PC moves. What the FMCSA has done is allow PC with restrictions through their authority as a regulator. They did this because carriers were screaming bloody murder about drivers being hung up with shippers and receivers. So instead of using their rulemaking authority under the interstate rules to do something about this, they just allow drivers to PC.

If you get caught in this situation (redacted) your company! Move the dang truck to where it is needed. Attempt to see about just staying there for your 10. If you are directed to leave ask the people there about places to park. While not fully legal I once left a place in Charlotte drove about 3 blocks and pulled to the side of the road. As far as accidents go IF you have taken a 10-hour break since the bust you are OK. Just try to manage your time better. One thing to remember is something my dad told me years ago. In almost every situation you as a driver will encounter, you "ain't" the first! There is a solution close by, you just have to find it!

 

You most certainly can use safe haven rule AND you (under latest rules) can also use PC miles to get to a safe haven, even if you are out of hours.

Granted, both options open you up to legal consequences if something goes horribly wrong.

 

Legally the DOT defines "safe haven" in part 397.5 (d) (3) as ---- (3) A safe haven is an area specifically approved in writing by local, State, or Federal governmental authorities for the parking of unattended vehicles containing Division 1.1, 1.2, or 1.3 materials.

I try not to be a "by the book" person. But as I explained in comment #79 using this term in place of a "safe legal" place to park can be confusing.

I'm an old hand that can read between the lines. A new driver might miss this. Then start asking for a "safe haven" and come off looking a bit foolish.

 

While I agree with @Moose1958 for me it's even more simple than that. If you misuse a legal term when talking about the law, all it does is show you have no clue what you are talking about.

 

Just say safe place or safe parking.

 

Actually, I think the FMCSA nailed it in their guidance to 395.8. "reasonable, safe location" <<can't best this! It takes in all the variables!

 

Safe havens are truck stop, open for parking weigh station, terminal, rest area, Etc.
If a new driver doesn't know this, he didn't read the green book.
They aren't given out as paper weights.
Furthermore, it is called safe haven parking rule, which is generally used for hazmat loads.
Law has been changed regarding pc miles, (for several reasons), since drivers not hauling hazmat sometimes ran into issues when using safe haven parking rule.

"Where is safe legal place to park?" and "Where is a safe haven place to park?", are two entirely different questions. And if the driver gets confused between the two he needs to go back to elementary school and learn basic sentence structure.

 

"sigh" @ZVar your up! I am losing my patience with this subject!

 

Guy needed a simple reply. Didn't need someone quoting rules out of the book, or different legal terminology or anything else.
But since you bought it up, I decided to add to it.
If the guy wants the answer, instead of going on a forum, he should have asked either his safety officer or a DOT officer.

 

No thanks. I'm done with wilfully ignorant people. When the definition is given and they still argue the point, well there is no helping them. All one can do at that point is let other posters know the definition, which was done.