Consequences for First HOS Violation

I dont travel Nebraska often but i do Mississippi. Are you talking about the wide concrete and gravel shoulders coming out of rest areas?

 

No. Last time I was in Mississippi (2012) I 20 had some places right up next to the bridge at an exit. Not real big. Might handle 5 or 6 trucks. Not a whole lot of these places. Just saying. I understand and agree drivers should not be parking on ramps etc. However sometimes circumstances puts that option into play.

 

The guidance states:

"The following are examples of appropriate uses of a CMV while off-duty for personal conveyance include, but are not limited to:"

Here, the guidance EXPLICITLY states that the examples are EXAMPLES of allowed use of PC, but there are OTHER acceptable uses of PC.

Yes, there most definitely is a "spirit of the guidance", and the guidance itself explicitly states the examples are illustrative, and NOT exclusive.

 

And yet again we've had LEO's state that the specific examples are the only ones allowed. I agree that 99.99% of the time it will not be a problem. The simple fact remains though it's guidance and the state can and does make it's own policies. At least one state specifically want's it's LEO's to only use the examples give. No leeway.

Knowing that, everyone that keeps stating it's legal is giving bad advice. It's not legal. Period. Doesn't matter how much everyone wants it to be legal, it simply isn't. Will almost everyone get away with it, citing PC? Sure. Will everyone? Well, since we've had LEO's here that claim to have given violations and citations both for incorrect PC obviously not.

Look, all I'm saying it's it's bad advice to say it's legal. It's may or may not be depending on the officer and state policies. Give advice it's likely fine, but don't say it's legal.

 

No, it doesn't work that way. The laws and guidances are what they are. Localities, states and leo's may interpret those laws differently, and write tickets on those interpretations. That doesn't make law, and that's why we have judges and FMCSA review processes.

The only problem is with the DataQ nonsense where there is no due process and states do get to make their own laws.

To state that it is NOT legal is incorrect. It is legal. Drivers may get cited by cops that are overzealous or misinformed or just badge-heavy, but that's not exclusive to the PC issue.

 

Sorry, we are going to have to disagree on this point.

If it was law I'd agree. It's only guidance though. I can't find it now but I had a very nice write up by the American Bar about why they are not the same and why one can be enforced and not the other. In either case if you do a search like this to see just how murky the differences can be.
https://www.google.com/search?q=is+guidance+the+same+as+law

 

You are flat out wrong, period. If local state cops are telling you that horsecrap they are getting bad information. The FMCSA regulates interstate commerce in the states and they specifically state by their guidance these PC rules are ok. Get off that dang kick about laws will you! The entire part 49 CFR are NOT LAWS they are rules set up by federal bureaucrats. It is these same morons that then interpret them. The CVSA whom trains most state officers is also teaching this. @brian991219 is a CVSA member and I USED TO BE. Your wrong now STOP IT!

 

Yes you are Now stop it!

AT and I are having a civil discussion, if you can't be civil go away.

 

I can't tell an adult what to do. However you are really wasting your time here. Some heads are so hard you can't crack them with a jackhammer. I suggest you don't try. I only removed the ignore I have so I could better undetstand your comments.

 

The truth is LEO's lie and are permitted to do so, thus you can not believe them for legal clarifcation on anything.