Does driving PC while on 10

Just to be clear, this is what I believe to be true. You have 3 levels, if you will, of off duty. You have off duty as in home time, take the kids to church, go on the beer run, go to the bar, cut the grass, (NOT smoke it lol). You get the picture, remember we use off duty, NOT sleeper (which is also off duty and not PC, another form of off duty. Then you have sleeper birth time, another form of off duty. Must be used when in sleeper and only in sleeper, we don't drive on line two, but its off duty. Remember DOT treats this as in the sleeper and sleeper only. Notice the rules for the 8/2 split, MUST be in sleeper 8 CONTINUANCE hours, did you get that, 8 continuance hours in sleeper not off duty line 1 or PC off duty driving line 5. DOT treats the 3 off duties different.
On a team truck up to 2/3 years ago the team driver that was not driving was not allow to sit up front for the full 10 hours, ask me how I know. The rules changed to allow that person to sit up front, Again DOT is very specific on that, they may sit up front for the first two hours or the last two hours, again must be in sleeper for 8 continuance hours, legally can not come sit up front during the 8 hours in sleeper. So how can one say you can drive off duty PC during your 10 hours off. Yes the rules say if you run out of hours at the shipper/receivers you can go to the closes safe parking place and the hours driving under PC will count as off duty for your 10. There is a post here where a driver got a falsifying logs write up I cant remember if he got a fine or not,logged off duty but stayed in the sleeper. All you that think all off duty is the same might what to reconsider. I know, I know but you have been doing it for years and never got busted, so have a lot of drivers speeding and never been busted, does that make it legal?

Now we have PC off duty. Used to be there was no line 5 we would drive under line 1 and note driving off duty PC. Why did DOT give us line 5 if its the same as line 1?? It is NOT the same, 2 different off duties, which must be logged accordingly. PC is used to get you out of a bind as long as you are not advancing that load. Notice DOT does not allow you to drive PC to get the load there, only to get you to a safe place. I guess you can argue with DOT that the consignee was your safe place,lol. You can use PC to go from hotel to beer run and back, perfectly legal, check FMCSA, this is one of the examples they give. Don' ask me to link it, if I found it so can you. You can not use PC to go get a oil change, maintenance on truck, not allow, must be personal.

 

@Expeditor:

You are so wrong about so many specific HOS regulations, it is embarrassing.

I hope people catch on fast enough to your ignorance that they don't get in trouble because of it...

Please...... just drop it.

 

Please explain were I'm wrong, as a matter of fact I thanked your post. PC sure is off duty driving, but there are 3 versions of off duty. By the way been doing these for 9 years, not a expert, but I do have my own carrier business, for the last 4 years, that requires me to know the law. Had a DOT audit and passed it with flying colors. Tell me about yourself. Do you own a carrier business and know the back office? I can back everything I print, can you? You don't have to agree with my view, I'm just trying to help others out. Tell me where I'm wrong and back it up.

 

This is your interpretation of the rules of pc. You still haven't shown me any written rules by fmscA except for the new rule about off duty driving g when your hours are up at a shipper/receiver.
I guess, in your opinion, that's the only pc driving you can do since that's the only rule you quote.
If I am at a dock getting loaded,I go I and ask if I can Disconnect and leave to get something to eat, i can do this on line 5. When you disconnect and reconnect. Back to trailer you should be on duty.
Seems you just want to argue. Cause you keep on saying the same stuff

 

You must of not read all my post completely. I have said you can go from a hotel to a beer joint and bring back your beer to the hotel room and enjoy it. I have said you can go from home to your terminal, all while on PC, to start your day, You go on duty at your terminal. All legal. You can go from truck stop to restaurant, bar, gogo bar, church, then back to truck stop or stay where you went, you don't have to return to truck stop all on PC. You can go from shipper or consignee to first safe place to park , if you run out of hours, all while on PC. What I said about PC is you can't drive all night then go back on duty as your PC time was your 10 hour break. FMCSA says you're PC time must allow you adequate time to get your mandated rest period. Here read it for yourself. People get so offensive when you point out that what they believed to be true is not. I will link, in the next message, if I can find it where a driver got dinged for logging off duty but was in the sleeper. Driver the rules are the rules, what I interpret them to mean and what you interpret to mean means nothing, what matter is what the LEO is going to think the rules say. I try to go by command sense. Read number 3, my beef is with someone saying they can drive all night and still count that as their 10 hour break.

Examples of Appropriate Uses of a CMV While Off-duty for Personal Conveyance
The following are examples of appropriate uses of a CMV while off-duty for personal conveyance include, but are not limited to:

1. Time spent traveling from a driver’s en route lodging (such as a motel or truck stop) to restaurants and entertainment facilities.
2. Commuting between the driver’s terminal and his or her residence, between trailer-drop lots and the driver’s residence, and between work sites and his or her residence. In these scenarios, the commuting distance combined with the release from work and start to work times must allow the driver enough time to obtain the required restorative rest as to ensure the driver is not fatigued.
3. Time spent traveling to a nearby, reasonable, safe location to obtain required rest after loading or unloading. The time driving under personal conveyance must allow the driver adequate time to obtain the required rest in accordance with minimum off-duty periods under 49 CFR 395.3(a)(1) (property-carrying vehicles) or 395.5(a) (passenger-carrying vehicles) before returning to on-duty driving, and the resting location must be the first such location reasonably available.
4. Moving a CMV at the request of a safety official during the driver’s off-duty time
5. Time spent traveling in a motorcoach without passengers to en route lodging (such as motel or truck stop), or to restaurants and entertainment facilities and back to the lodging. In this scenario, the driver of the motorcoach can claim personal conveyance provided the driver is off-duty. Other off-duty drivers may be on board the vehicle, and are not considered passengers.
6. Time spent transporting personal property while off-duty.
7. Authorized use of a CMV to travel home after working at an offsite location.

 

Absolutely you can go to get something to eat on PC, as long as your company approves. DOT has no problem with that.

 

Read this thread and then come back and tell me that sleeper off duty is the same as being off duty at home. Hint it's not. FMCSA sees 3 different off duties. I have a post that I explain the three. That is way you have line 1, line 2 and now line 5. Why all the hate? if I was telling stories about how 30 years ago I ran the scales and beat up DOT, or telling stories about the US Marshall's I would be a hero. My wife and I run a carrier we have to keep up with the laws, just here trying to help. keep people safe and legal. Why would you want to pay for mistakes when they can be avoided? There is a old saying that goes like this. A smart man learns from his mistakes, I wise man learns from others mistakes. Just saying.

7 Points for not switching to SB after Off Duty

 

No, they do not "see" three off duties. There is only off duty, on duty, sleeper berth and driving.

I can drive a truck between my two farms for 24 hrs, OFF DUTY, and then go on duty with full 14, 11 and 8 hr clocks. All legal. Stupid, maybe, but legal. You can PC or commute for hours before your shift, off duty, all legal. You can PC to Walmart and the zoo in the middle of your 10 hr break, without interrupting your break.

There is only off duty, on duty, sleeper berth and driving. While off duty, you can drive within the legal definitions of PC or Exemptions such as Ag. You can do off duty work (i.e. Ag Exempt work), or just be off duty, it is all the same as far as Johnny Law is concerned.

 

Are you on paper or ELDs? Because, if your carrier has ELDs , and they allow it, you would have line 5. Yes you are right, you can drive that truck till the wheels come off, under PC, If you like, but it doesn't make it legal. FMCSA has not put a mileage limit or a time limit under PC, But JJ Keller, Big Road, and many others caution that because it is implied that it is to get a driver out of a predicament. That is why FMCSA says the closes-es parking or rest area and up to the LEO discretion. I'm just using command sense here.

This form FMCSA
In these scenarios, the commuting distance combined with the release from work and start to work times must allow the driver enough time to obtain the required restorative rest as to ensure the driver is not fatigued.

The time driving under personal conveyance must allow the driver adequate time to obtain the required rest in accordance with minimum off-duty periods under 49 CFR 395.3(a)(1) (property-carrying vehicles) or 395.5(a) (passenger-carrying vehicles) before returning to on-duty driving, and the resting location must be the first such location reasonably available.

Now tell me how you can go to the zoo in the middle of your 10?? Sure you can, but in won't be legal. It says it right there.

 

If you are not govern by the 7/80 rules then accept my apologize, what I have been saying might not apply to you if you run under different rules. But if you are 7/80 then these rules apply. If you think that off duty is off duty, then do this next time you take a 10 hour break log 5 in sleeper and 5 as off duty. Do this until your logs get audited by DOT. If you pass and you can show me logs and a good level 1 inspection I will apologies to you. Just because people do things their whole life one way doesn't mean it right. Many people here will argue off duty is just like sleeper and PC, but it's not. When you drive PC why not log sleeper? ITs off duty is it not? Next time you take 34 hours at home log it as sleeper. I wonder what DOT would say if I log my week vacation all sleeper. Its all off duty, right.