New split sleeper berth provision. What's the formula for 14 hour shift?

Discussion in 'Trucking Industry Regulations' started by TallJoe, May 4, 2021.

  1. TallJoe

    TallJoe Road Train Member

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    Let's see the following example, where more than one 'no less than 2 hours' breaks were taken during one shift, in particular day 2 is a subject to discuss:
    FYI: The ELD software is Keep Truckin.

    Day 1:
    upload_2021-5-4_13-4-47.png
    No violations. The 14 hours shift clock, was stopped. Question is which one of the two breaks were applied: the first one (shorter), the 2nd (longer) or both?


    Day 2:

    upload_2021-5-4_12-59-29.png

    14 hour shift violation: according to Keep Truckin it is conditional. If the required sleeper break is taken (7 hours) it will be removed. Keep Truckin ELD allows to drive, despite 'default' violation warning, until past midnight.

    It seems that it stops 14 hour shift clock on for all of those breaks - all of them are no less then two hours - then adds them up and applies towards the end of the original shift :6:45 pm thus allowing to use up driving time until past midnight. Why did it show default violation at 8:55 pm and not 6:45 pm?
    Is this even correct presumption that all of these 'qualifying for split" breaks should stop 14 hour clock?
    Or is a programming error resulting from an inability of programmers to interpret the rules or perhaps not testing all of possible variations? Of course, KT stands by what their program shows.


    Day 3:

    upload_2021-5-4_13-6-44.png

    Required break in the sleeper was taken,

    AND violations on Day 2 removed (post factum). The driving time graph is all green now.

    upload_2021-5-4_13-3-24.png
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
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  3. Snailexpress

    Snailexpress Road Train Member

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    Weird HOS interpretation by Keep Trucking.
    If day started on page 1 at 4:45 after 10 hours break you should be in violation driving after 18:45 because you don't have consecutive 7 or 8 hours break in sleeper to stop 14 hours. Or i have missed something new rules?
     
  4. TallJoe

    TallJoe Road Train Member

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    Per older rules, yes. It should have stopped it but after the most recent changes of HOS (in effect last September), if you take a break of more than 2 hours in the sleeper or off duty, that break stops the 14 hour clock. In this case, instead of one, three breaks were taken of at least 2 hours and the question is, if all of them are supposed to stop the clock or just one of them, and if it is only 1 of them, then which one?
    Keep Truckin, evidently, stops the clock for each one of them, postponing the end of shift (of day 2) until past midnight onto day 3, by more than 7 hours (1st break 2 hours; 2nd break 2 hours, 3rd break 3 hours and 15 minutes).
     
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  5. scoobertdoo

    scoobertdoo Light Load Member

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    I hate when people give birth in the sleeper.
     
  6. TallJoe

    TallJoe Road Train Member

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    When they must then they must. I am sure it happened.
    LOL I fixed it.
     
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  7. scoobertdoo

    scoobertdoo Light Load Member

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    Could you imagine the mess? I bet the smell would be like a corpse in a day or so.
     
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  8. TallJoe

    TallJoe Road Train Member

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    ELDs such as Keep Truckin don't show violations on the logs sent via email or output file to DOT inspectors.
    Once the logs are sent, they see them in Black and White only. They need to make violation discovery by themselves.
    I don't know what they would make out of it, tbh
    Certainly, some would say that the above is compliant, some others would say that it is not compliant but something makes me think that the majority of them would not know the right answer is, either. So maybe it is better to hand over the 'live' log book on the tablet, just in case, so that they can see that ELDs are showing that everything is good.
     
  9. Snailexpress

    Snailexpress Road Train Member

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    Modifies the sleeper berth exception to allow a driver to meet the 10-hour minimum off-duty requirement by spending at least 7 hours of that period in the berth combined with a minimum off-duty period of at least 2 hours spent inside or outside the berth, provided the two periods total at least 10 hours. When used together as specified, neither qualify period counts against the 14-hour driving window.
    It does not specify how many 2 hours SB .
     
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  10. TallJoe

    TallJoe Road Train Member

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    So now, since you can have more than one qualifying period on the same shift, the question remains, if, for the purpose of determining a new 14 hour hour shift threshold, we should take into account only the period that is "utilized" for the 10 hour combination, or all of them.
     
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  11. Snailexpress

    Snailexpress Road Train Member

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    Good question. Everything written by government you need a lawyer to understand.
     
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