Prime INC.

You said the following, "

Heres a NEWS flash " Your the type of wanabee trucker thats GOING to have PROBLEMS with any CARRIER you decide to go with ".

So you think I'm gone react favorably to this kinda rude statement. You would be wrong.

As for comprehension, I never took the post, "that you will always be learning", as, one would always be getting training wages. As a matter of fact I stated clearly that everyone knows that learning goes on and on. This a "GIVEN". What is wrong is when a guy is used as a trainee to get cheap "Team Labor". After so many miles it becomes abusive. How long must a guy drive as a trainee before they go out on the road. SNI trains in 4-6 weeks and the guy goes on the road. The starting pay is .39 cpm and they are driving solo, not team. SNI has a good reputation.

Some people are acting like I just started talk'n about Prime just for fun. Or I talk poorly about all outfits for no reason. This would be wrong thinking. Prime is an outfit I looked at and it's questionable. There are those who make it hard to clear up the questions.

SNI is an example of a company I believe is a fair outfit. I have not run into problems understanding what's going on at SNI. Swift has problems but I'm not interested in Swift and I don't talk about them. Few people have problems understanding whats going on there. I could but i don't. Werner is another outfit, people talk about, that could be talk'd about. Again I don't talk about them. May is a good outfit. I don't talk much about them. All of these, I have had little resisitance in regards understanding whats going with these companies.

 

I knew you would show up somewhere else......cryin' about how you were "Attacked"..... Why aren't you enough of a man to admit that you have a problem seeing at night? Like I said on the other forum.....there's no shame in it.....it's just something people need to know.

I bet Mr. FLATBED would want to know you couldn't see at night if you were going to try to drive one of his trucks.

And, since I'm the one that asked the original question......

Here's how it went....
Mannmk7 starts his thread asking if there are any Trainers that like to drive at night. He gets a few responses.....and continues to ask about night driving......triggering my response "Hey, Mannmk7.....Why you sweating the night driving?"

From there it's history.......anyone that's been in this world any length of time knows when a driver(or wannabe) gets defensive about a question....there's something deeper there. Well, his responses keep getting more and more aggressive and defensive.......then he sends me a PM telling me that if I will withdraw all my posts about the subject he will also......AGAIN TRIGGERING MY RADAR......see, people don't want other people to be able to read or see anything that will point out a weakness.

I refused......so, now.....he's over here......trying to justify his actions and strike out at a company that he has and probably never will work for. Why, because he's afraid to answer a simple question honestly. That's it. So, if anyone chooses to read his dribble and take it for fact......remember, there are actually people out here that DO WORK FOR PRIME.....that will give you HONEST answers.

Later, mannmk7......much later.

 

I never " said " ANYTHING I posted a fact and you did not like it.

It was not rude just my opinion ( truth hurts ) , and if you cannot take that on a posting board , wait until your on a loading dock , regardless if your the BEST paid / most Knowlegable on company facts trainee in the world of trucking boy are you in for an EYE OPENING in the MIDDLE of the DAY.

Anyway your about as amusing as rattling a box of rocks , so in the future do not respond to my posts and I will avoid yours in return.

 

Wow! And the mods here crucify me for bein' outspoken?

 

If I may, I'd like to add my 2 cents to this conversation about Prime Inc. I'll present it restaurant style so y'all can pay for it AFTER reading it. If you're not completely satisfied, you're not required to pay.

I worked for a small outfit starting in the mid 1990's that treated their drivers fairly and REALLY supported them. Many of the Independent Contractors who were there were recruited from Prime.

Reason?
Because the dispatcher had driven for Prime as an I/C and knew many of Prime's better drivers, and how they were prone to running as many miles as dispatch could give them. Slouches they weren't.

From the stories they told me, when they FIRST started with Prime, it was THE place to make big bucks --- if a driver were willing and able to keep up the pace. For SOME drivers, the dispatched miles ran them into the ground. In actuality, SOME drivers couldn't handle all the miles available, and they moved on, claiming Prime ran their drivers ragged. Which, was probably true. But SOME drivers thrived on all the miles and asked for more.
Overall, those who wanted ALL the miles they could get were quite satisfied.

Then, at some point, I was told, Prime began to change.
Dispatched miles weren't as many and they noticed their pay stubs didn't match their own records --- which, at first, wasn't often --- but enough to raise a red flag.

Waiting for loads, which had been a rarity in the past, seemed to become more common. They noticed a decline in their earnings, even though they ran as dispatched. Part of the problem was the amount of time they were required to wait for a reload --- which hadn't been a problem in the past. Another part of the problem was payroll paperwork mistakes(?), which, when noticed, often took weeks, or months, to resolve. Meanwhile, as the drivers ran their Big trucks like a business, and required their pay to keep rolling, they found they had to dip into their reserve accounts to accomplish that --- something they never had to do before, and the reason they had those reserve accounts built up in the first place.

It seems that Prime giveith, then Prime taketh away.
And more and more I/C drivers began to smell something rotten.
As I understand, those I/C drivers tried to no avail to correct the problem through communicating their concerns with the front office, and were less than impressed with the responses they received. SOMEthing had changed BIG time.

Back in the day, it seems Prime was THE place for drivers wanting to run hard and make the better pay, to go. Prime drivers, especially the I/C's, had a good reputation for gittin' 'er done.
If they decided to go with another company, it usually wasn't because they weren't satisfied with Prime, more often it was because they wanted to slow down a tad. And after a period of time with another company, many returned to Prime and the opportunity to make bigger bucks.

When other companies saw that a driver had driven for Prime, --- especially if it was for several years, that just about guaranteed that they'd be hired. Prime drivers, for the most part, had a very good reputation within the truckin' industry. That's one reason why the company I was then working for delighted in recruiting dis-satisfied Prime drivers. They made excellent employees with the company because they were reliable. And with the things we hauled, failure was NOT an option. If we didn't arrive on time, the show wouldn't go on.

For quite awhile, Prime's reputation as a good company to drive for continued as the word trickled out about how that company had changed. Drivers and I/C's who were unaware of the changes still flocked to Prime in droves. Those who did wondered why Prime was so highly (over) rated. It wasn't what they expected, because it wasn't what it USED to be.

As more and more seasoned and well seasoned drivers realized that, the reputation of Prime began to wane within them. To keep on truckin', Prime hired more newBees, and/or encouraged their present I/C's to become small fleet owners within Prime, and be responsible for hiring their own drivers to git 'er done.

Now, most seasoned and well seasoned I/C's knew worthy drivers whom they'd met over the years to fill their seats, and committed themselves. Keeping in mind that those drivers they hired were seasoned and knew which way was up, it didn't take them too long for them all to realize they were sold a different package than promised by Prime -- through the small fleet owner --- and made the I/C's look the fool for repeating what Prime had told them.
The I/C's weren't real pleased with that, but they were now committed by a signed contract to keep their small fleet running and servicing Prime's needs. Their driver turnover rate increased at a time when they depended on drivers being experienced, satisfied and remaining for years.
Often referred to as the
Sweet dream gig, ....... running for a small company that is more than fair with their drivers,
But...........................
A small fleet owner with a high turnover rate is not good.
And why it's said that if one wants to make a small fortune in truckin' --- they need to start with a large fortune.

To keep the seats filled after the more savy drivers saw the writing on the wall, the I/C's were forced to hire less seasoned drivers --- and Boy-0-BoY, that's when MORE problems for them began.

I was wittness to what damage a new husband/wife TEAM did to a brand new, O/O spec'd, 450 hp, Super-10 , which, as I recall, is what they said they'd "learned" on, ..... Freightliner Classic, ..... in about two weeks.
Might be a new record.

Did they do a good job?
Y'all tell me,........................
The interior had cigarette, or ?, burns EVERYwhere!
The dash
the desk in the bunk area
the floor ---which was also soaked with something VERY sticky.
The whole interior smelled strongly of musk, as though a whole bottle of concentrate had been dumped all over. After airing out for SEVERAL hours, the smell was still overpowering.
My friend's wife was crying --- although she blamed the tears on an allergy to musk.
YeAH!
And just recently diagnosed.
Ya reckon.

Just about EVERything on the interior was sticky with dirty hand prints and pet hair --- even on the ceiling in the bunk area. It's as though soda or SOMEthing sticky, were sprayed all over the interior area.
Perhaps a celebration?
On the back row, no doubt.
Y'all come, and bring y'all's dogs with ya.
We got a BIG condo --- plentya room for a dozen
guys an' baby-dolls.
BYO and B some for me and the wife.

But I digress, .................................

During that 2 weeks, they managed to run, as a team, about 500 to 600 miles a day. They didn't like driving at night, or while the Big truck was moving, --- so they both slept at night.
And NEVER drove in the rain.
That's dangerous, doncha know!
At this point, I should mention that they were hired around November and running out of Tennessee.
What are the chances they'd encounter any rain?

After staying out OTR a whopping 2 weeks, they requested 2 weeks off duty to "rest up".
But they never returned.
WhY?
Well, while they were home, my friend decided they were the random draw for a random drug test that first week.
Guess what?
YuP!
Positive.
Imagine that.
Now imagine this, ..............................

At the time, I was driving his brand new, 500HP, 18 speed, custom ordered, Freightliner Classic, for him as he had just undergone surgery, and I was helping him keep up the payments. The company I drove for, and the same company he was an I/C for, agreed to that arramngement in support of that driver.
Imagine THAT?

The company gave me time off from a company Big truck so I could do that.
And even held my company Big truck for me upon my return.
Now consider that those running the truckin' part of the company, were ALL former Prime I/C's or O/O's, and were runnin' the show at this company they way, they say, Prime USED to be run.

Anyway ......................................
Many of those I/C's lost their shirts because they still had Big truck truck payments to make on their small fleet Big trucks, now sitting without drivers --- as more and more drivers were hearing what was happening at a formerly good company and were avoiding Prime more and more as the word spread. The better and best drivers avoided Prime as a result.
Those who hadn't heard, or ignored what they didn't WANT to hear, and generally out of touch, heard of the GREAT deal they could receive at PRIME --- touted as being one of the BEST.
And it WAS, at ONE time.
WannaBees didn't know, and they flocked to Prime based on Prime's past reputation.
Prime didn't necessarily plan on that happening, I don't think, but they badly needed the drivers.
As a result in the lesser quality drivers, Prime devised a way of profiting from that, by offering training.
To their credit, I also think extended training periods would be better for MOST newBees. Three months?
YuP!
I have NO problem with that.
Six, or more, months experience with the company before being able to do a lease (another profit increaser for Prime, but not necessarily for Prime drivers) sure sounds better than C.R. England's offering it at orientation -- to complete newBees.

How many times have were heard that a Big truck truck driver is
OVER trained?
What's with the desire to get training over with ASAP?
Have we developed an I know it all and there's NOTHING else that I can possibly learn, ......... attitude?
Have we become SO concerned with making TOP dollar, ASAP, that we're not concerned with learnin'.................. anymore?

If so, just imagine,.............................

who that leaves to fill those empty seats?

If y'all said ANYbody willing --- you're correct.
Willing, and it some cases, UNable.
Pay disputes to the small fleet owners were common --- but now, besides Big truck truck payments, they also had payroll to meet.
They took a risk with their capital invested in Prime, based on Prime's, formerly, good reputation. Which, as they found out, had changed --- and they were now experiencing, first hand.

Prime drivers of about 10 years ago told me then, that, as a company driver, Prime can run a driver ragged and keep them out OTR for months at a time. The paychecks were higher than most starter/training companies, but that's if they were willing and able to run (hard) for the money.
Some were up to the challenge, and said they liked running for Prime.
Some were with family, and didn't like the hard running and/or lack of home time, which is to be anticipated.
Nothing unusual about that within ANY truckin' company.
Just about all those drivers mentioned that incorrect pay stubs were common.
I'm sure THAT wans't anticipated, and isn't all that common or usual within the truckin' industry.
LiveIt-N-LearnIt.

Exactly what and how Prime opperates today, I have no first-hand knowledge, other than what I read here at TTR, and other places. What I'm reading sounds like it could have been written by those I've known who drove for Prime back in the day, --- except that the current posters seem to have had more recent experience.
But it still, basically, sounds the same after all these years.
At this point, I've concluded that not much at Prime has changed much over the years.
Then, there are the various law-suits.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm
Does it seems that Prime only really changes when the courts FORCE them to comply with the laws and rules?
It's not like they're not WILLING to change, ..... at all, .......
it just seems to take a bit of force to git 'em to git 'er done. :smt062:smt021:smt075

Then again, ..... there ARE those who WANT to run like that.
The key to success, I think is, which way they're runnin'.
TO, or away from?
Ya reckon.

 

Ahhahahah. You got that right. I may be stretching it a bit myself. Personally I've been holding back. Some haven't figured it out yet. Or some are new.

 

Please STOP your SCARING my HARD DRIVE

 

Everyone knows when a person or company turns a question around and puts the problem on the driver there's something wrong with the company. In this case, a representative of Prime, Steve, turning the question around by asking the question asker, "Why? Do you have night blindness?", and detracting from the question. This is an over simplistic technique that's been used forever. Rather than simply answering the question! (The original question was, " Are there any trainer's that like night driving.")

You seem to have a real problem with the question yourself.

I never went any further than thanking the posters for there responce. You used any thing you could think of to ask me that 'off the subject, of the cuff', question, "why do you have night blindness". The more you write the more you bury yourself in this heap exposeing yourself for what you are!

You have gone way overboard with your defensiveness to the point of being nasty and rude. My question is born out of the talk on this board, and the DOT, that night driving and fatigue are a big problem in the industry.

I believe there are many trainers that try to use unsuspecting new guys, trainee's, as night drivers. If so this is could be a safety hazard. Drivers have said they don't like night driving. They have also said that driving 4 hours a night is about all they can do.


As for asking Prime drivers questions; Prime drivers benefit from being a sorta of a Prime recruiter. They get paid for each person who comes to Prime and if the get a certain number to come to Prime they get truck payments paid for a year. Employees of Prime also benefit from drivers who go to the company and leave because the probably leave money in the retirement fund not to mention the benefit of the cheap driver they had. Can you believe them? Each person needs to decide for themselves; this is the politically correct thing for me to say. A number of those "plenty of prime drivers ' your are referring to are probably your cronies. Cronyism is alive and well at your "web hang" out! I'm sure you'll continue.

 

Hmmmmmmmm
Are you readin' what'chr writin'?
That sounds confrontational.

Please provide evidence to indicate that's an accurate statement, dare I say "accusation".

Well, ...... I'm not another "business guy", but I am a
baaadd man --------> !!
Does that count?

I find what has been presented to be at least plausible.
And believable.

Following that logic, it would be reasonable to assume that there ARE truckin' companies that DON'T "rip people off".
Would you be willing to listen to a company like that?

I won't disagree with that.

I'm guessin' the experienced drivers who know what they're lookin' for.
And why.

Please define "Benefit" and "Trainee".

If a trainee could match a trainer in knowledge and ability, I might agree.
Driver trainers are PAID more because they KNOW more --- than MOST newBees.

I'm NOT advocating that misuse and/or abuse is acceptable.
I'm not because it's not.
But requiring a longer training period, for EXPERIENCE, isn't abuse.

Baloney can be good.
But I'm not real fond of bitter baloney.

How could you?
Logically.

Define "forever".
For some that could be a day ----
to others it could be a lifetime.

Well, except for the feeble part, I can see FLATBED'S point.

Another case of shooting the messenger,
and ignoring the message?
Hmmmmmmmmmmm

Doesn't sound like a rip-off to me.

I hope all understand what FLATBED is sayin' here.

"Outspoken"?
Hmmmmmmmm
I don't get that impression.
Maybe OVERspoken.
As well they should when communication degrades to a certain level, or seems to be headed in that general direction.

"MaY" be?
Hmmmmmmmm

ReallY?!

Figured WHAT out, ........ yet?
That you're holding back? :smt102

I'm not sure I understand what you mean about some being "new".

EVERYone? (knows)

If a poster posting opinions is considered a **represenative** of Prime, I reckon FLATBED is, but I don't choose to read it that way.
Is it possible that you read a sentence incorrectly?
**Why, do you have night blindness?** would NOT read the same as
"Why do you have night blindness".

So true!
It's goin' on right now, as I type, ............
I think it's called 'communication'.
So simple, even a caveman could, and did,........ it.

DuH!
Obviously there ARE trainers who like driving at night.
I was one of them.
But I let my trainees drive at night anyway.
WhY even ask that question in the first place?

I was one trainer and Big truck truck driver who liked driving at night, ...... in general.
Proof positive that we exist and thrive on the dark.

BTW, did you "simply" answer his question?

YeAH!
Especially if one has night blindness.

And if it's NOT so?
Not all trainers are alike.
And SOME trainees would jump at the chance to LEARN how to drive at night --- and even ENJOY doing it.

And drivers have said that they DO like driving at night.

Well, ...... if that's all they can do, that's all they can do.
What would YOU have them do?
Give up trying to better their ability?

Good question.
Another good question might be, can we believe you?

Food for thought ----
as long as it doesn't become a food FIGHT.

 

ROFL!! Aftershock..... I'm not worthy..... I wish I had your patience! Have fun with this guy.....you should really be able to mess with him......He's got a short fuse. I'm tired of him.

But, I did notice that you too seemed a little curious as to why he got so worked up when asked why it was such a concern to him.