According to its new Administrator, the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration is open to hearing suggestions about how it might change the federal Hours of Service (HOS) rules.
In a half-hour interview with Overdrive last week, new FMCSA Administrator Ray Martinez touched on multiple topics of interest to the trucking industry. Unsurprisingly, the question of ELDs came up and Martinez doubled down on the FMCSA’s commitment to the regulation. But he noted that many of the concerns raised about the ELD rule are actually caused by the existing HOS rules.
“I think that’s something we want to talk about,” said Martinez. “What I’ve seen is that people beat around the bush, but why not have the conversation?”
According to Martinez, he is open to hearing from everyone in the industry “whether they are members of the associations or not.”
“I want to hear, because there are really good suggestions that I’ve already heard over the last few weeks,” he continued. “That I want to hear more and see if there’s something that we can do either within the existing regulations or do we look at changing the regs.”
But Martinez stressed that not all feedback is useful.
“In past years, there was a lot of tension and people were not happy. I understand that. Telling us ‘ELDs are terrible’ or ‘hours of service are terrible’ doesn’t help me as a regulator,” he says. “What we’re hoping to hear is good dialogue. Come to the table and say ‘Here’s where we think FMCSA could be helpful.’”
As for what changes could be made, Martinez says that the FMCSA is still in the “aggressive listening stage,” and isn’t yet ready to make any changes to the hours of service rules.
A big problem with ELD’s is the fact that you can sit in a traffic backup
for 2 or 3 hrs, and move 5 miles an hour or less, and the ELD still runs out
your drive time. Whether you’re driving 5 mph or 75 mph, it’s all the same for
moving 2 miles or 200 miles. It doesn’t differentiate…
Everybody has different metabolisms. I’ve never slept more than 6 or 7 hrs
at a time in my life. To force me to sit idle for several hrs when I can’t sleep
is worse for me than not enough sleep. It just takes the wind out of my momentum sails and makes me MORE tired…
My exact same problem, I only need 5-6 hrs of sleep. I can run 6 hrs straight unless for bathroom break. I always get the best loads no matter what company I work for. Bosses like me and can rely on me and I get the load there safely and quickly. Be safe out there bud and keep it sunny side up 10-4
You need think about what your saying. ELDS have nothing to do with you sitting in a traffic backup. What the he’ll does have to do with it except that its to log with paper. Yes ELDS aren’t the best thing but everybody arguing is basically saying we can’t cheat,like this. You say things like your saying Todd p. If you get the right ELD like Road Log VDO there are ways of making these things work great. I actually don’t mind it a whole lot. Sure if get rid of it if I could but I can’t do i,deal with it. I have my own authority and if you know how you use it you won’t hate it as much much.
The way i see it if there are ways for you to make work for you in anyway it wasnt intended to do then your doing nothing but lying and cheating just like and so many others including myself did with paper logs. Which is the main reason behind the whole elog mandate so dont be surprised that someone from fmcsa is reading these comments and makes whatever divice your using illigal just because your statement about how you manipulate it is against the law and in violation of the hour of service. Ive always said the drivers worst enemy is himself and you and your big mouth and others like you prove it more and more with everything you say.
I run paper. Yes i cheat but i also know my limit. I might go 5 hrs and go to bed or 16 hrs.
You need to get one thing straight. Elogs were not brought about for cheating. It’s about control and white collars making money. Mandating elogs for safety is a joke and a PR thing.
Elogs were brought on by lying and cheating? That’s interesting. From what FMCSA says, elogs are brought on by studies within the industry indicating that there are physical factors relating to truck wrecks and traffic fatalities. I’ve been driving for 25 years and an O/O. I’ve NEVER had a study done, no one I know has had a study done and no one I ever talk to has had a study done. Even more interesting, these “studies” were done on drivers from the large companies that….. wait for it…. have been running on electronic logs and/or Qualcomm’s for YEARS. These larger companies are the ones that are the focal points of the accidents and cause the majority of fatalities on the road. FMCSA admitted they do not have any data collected on small trucking companies, so why are the little guys being punished for the actions of the large companies? I’m not alone in this statement, there are many, many drivers that have accumulated 1,2,3 and 4 million miles accident free and I’m among them. You’re telling me that ALL of us that have driven millions of accident free miles on paper logs, sleeping when our bodies tell us to and driving when we are ok to do so have been doing it ALL WRONG, ALL OF THESE YEARS? Who’da thunk it, that the standard in the industry is the professional steering wheel holder of the likes of Swift that hit things and kill people?
WOW!. The Federal Labor Standards Act of 1938 became the basis
of statements like “cheating and lying on your logbooks”.
That act specifically makes a truck driver work in an
“unprotected class” if they so chose to be a truck driver.
FLSA still does today. Truck drivers still work without overtime pay, even locally, always quoted FLSA “we don’t have to pay truckers overtime”,
and anybody driving OTR should realize they are working 24/7 and
168 hours a week OTR.
You are not relieved of responsibility for the load or rig, even on off duty time , until you’re are back at your home terminal, truck is parked you as a driver,are”relieved of duty,”and you have left the premises.
Many successful lawsuits regarding the premise that truck drivers
are”off duty”. Lots of motorists and lawyers made rich by this.
So the ELD counts to the microsecond, even when you are at home or in the truck stop shower. Still on duty as that clock is still counting.
Shippers and receivers and dispatchers and brokers were and still are the main problem with paper or ELD.
Hold you 2 or more hours beyond your load/unload appointment?
And you say you weren’t working while setting there doing the bidding of shippers/receivers/dispatchers/brokers/company truck you are in?
Then run the wheels off you?
Not a problem, THEY are making money treating you as an “indentured servant” or SLAVE.
BIG or small trucking company, not a problem for them as they
are making money treating you as a slave.
Don’t think so?
Let’s use 40 cpm as the model. A low rate these days…40 cpm times 2500 average miles per week. 1000.00 dollars minus 300 to 400 a week deductions including your road expenses for eating.(Tax law just took away pre- tax deductions and Per Diem. SEE CPA if you don’t believe it).
So 600.00 dollars take home. You worked away from home for 168 hours with all time “on the clock” and 600.00 dollars divided by 168
equals 3.57 an hour.
To bring America their everything.
And you prefer to let the government and trucking industry
hobble your life as a trucker ?
Keep you from your family, not make enough to pay the high rents of today?
To tell you when and how long to sleep, when to pee, when to take a break, still keep you working 168 hours a week?
Without proper compensation?
With cameras watching you ?
With numerous digital distractions in the truck(the powers love to wave the flag of safety)?
With the ELD mandate data mining your every move?
With the data being sold to AI(ya know, ROBOT ) developers who will take away the truck drivers job”?
Are you the unwitting fools who sell the trucker to technology?
Who’s Cheating? The government always did and always has.
The government is BIG Business, and Big Business has got a shoe in
the door to rid itself of truckers ,who are overhead to them.
Do you think adding 10 cents a mile to your paycheck is going to
protect your privacy in the cab or at home?
The driver who understood paper logs understood this:
That the government is going to do what they do, and truckers should do the same! Give the government a legal logbook and go do your job.
America depended on us for that.
Not anymore.
Remember that the ELD is watching your and is running 24/7.
WHO WAS and WHO IS CHEATING WHO?
Exactly. They want to be behind the wheel, even in near stand-still traffic, and log as off duty or in the bunk. That’s the complaint, they cannot cheat.
the best way to do this is to just pull off the road and do it .
ELD isn’t the best thing and is not working and needs a lot of improvements. Until it is corrected go back to paper logs .
Comments like this make no sense to me. There is absolutely no difference between paper and electronic logs. Other than the fact you can cheat 1 easier.
VDO Roadlog Solo has worked great for me as an Intermodal O/O. The ability to go “Yard Moves” inside the terminals or “PC” while bareback or bobtail traveling to or from the terminals makes it possible to get my container and still do an out of state or over the hill move from Seattle or Tacoma. Plus it’s idiot proof. Without it I would have to find another occupation.
I’ll assume bareback is a chassis with no container connected to your truck. Be careful, technically you can’t PC while ANYTHING is connected to your truck. They are working that out for O/Os that own their trailers and do not drop and hook.
You guys (Rick) are always arguing multiple points. No one wants to cheat, if HOS are changed to allow for a driver to make a decision to pull over to take a nap &, or avoid a traffic or weather situation there should be and option to stop the clock to avoiding the more stressful and unsafe parts of driving. The current HOS basically forces you to drive through it in order to be productive. THE ONLY MESSAGE SHOULD BE CHANGE HOS AND WE WOULDNT NEED ELD’s. You drivers that continue to say “they aren’t that bad” are defeated airheads that will continue to give in to everything this government will throw at you. Question did any actual truck drivers vote this horse crap mandate into law? I don’t remember seeing it on any ballot, and the uninformed legislators are willing to push any agenda that can yield a profit.
For what it’s worth, I have exactly the OPPOSITE problem: it takes me two+ hours to wind down after 11 hours, cook (and eat) dinner, shower, relax, fall asleep; with the the 10-hour rule, I’m lucky if I get 5-6 hours of sleep before I’m expected to be on the road again (as a ‘company driver’, there is little leeway).
I have little problem with the 11/14- hour rule, except that I never actually get enough sleep, so I ALWAYS drive ‘tired’, as I don’t get to choose WHICH 11 hours I get to drive.
I love my job- just not the FMSCA and DOT Rules forcing me to do so ON THEIR GROUNDS…
Huge driver shortage in the industry, I think I’ll walk away from it, with the millions on who already have. Allow DOT to come up with solutions to correct what they created. PS, 4 million miler.
It’s keep the shiny side up, what is the sunny side?
Your exactly right. We’re all different and one rule doesn’t seem to fit. Personally I can’t sleep eight hours consecutive but I may get tired during they day and need to stop. Both are problems with the ELD. The main problem I have is shippers and recivers don’t seem to care. If we have to sit multiple hours waiting to load and then they argue about paying is a huge problem.
Thumbs up on this comment
Absolutely! I agree with Road Rage and Tommy. One other factor that no one is mentioning at least not that I have read or heard. As we get older we seem to sleep less. I can’t sleep 10 hours in that truck unless I’m sick. I’m good to go with 6 to 8. After that I get frustrated at the waste of time. Time that I could be heading down the road so that I can go home sooner. I get so frustrated thinking about all the people who put in 14, 16,18 hrs. a day and then they drive home just so they can get up four hours later and go do it again. Granted we are in 80,000+ pounds vehicles but the damage done by 1 fatigued civilian driver or drunk driver is just as effective and hurtful to the friends and family of the driver in a commercial vehicle.
This is so true ! They need to help us with this number one problem and fix it and driver would be so much happier out there
Amen Brother. Precisely put.
If you sit in traffic for 3 hours, you are driving. The ELD doesnt change that. If you are on paper logs and log that as other than driving time, you are falsifing logs. that is the whole purpose of the ELD. Yes, it sucks when theres traffic and you have to sit going 5 miles an hour, but that is still drive time.
And the eld is the nature of the beast. If you cant do your job without falseifying your log go do something else this is the way it is now. The only people belly aching are the oldtimers who are sbout to retire anyway. Welcome to the future. By the way of all those people who killed other drivets on the road due to falsifying therr log its them who should take the blame for elogs.
Yeah- I wish. I have little choice: I’ve spent MANY years shuffling product (driving) for Big Corp; my only choices now are: keep driving, spend my ‘retirement years’ at Burger King or become homeless and a burden on society; I have a problem with Options 2 & 3.
I have NEVER KILLED (or even damaged) ANYBODY in an accident (and I have been driving trucks since 1983).
I HAVE NEVER FALSIFIED MY LOGS to make an appointment.
As an ‘old-timer’, I take offense: it ain’t the ‘old-timers’ ignoring the laws and driving like raging lunatics: every accident I’ve seen involving a big rig resulting in injuries/fatalities on the roads I have traveled during the last 10 years are a DIRECT result of ‘Drivers’ under 40 years of age traveling at MUCH higher speeds than conditions would dictate. For no other reason than GREED.
And don’t EVEN get me started on the ‘Drivers’ I see EVERY DAY texting or talking on their phones (without a ‘hands-free’ device)…
I obey the laws and rules (whether I approve or not).
I ‘bellyache’ about the laws because they are unfair- NOT because they hinder my ability to make money. The thickness of my wallet is FAR LESS IMPORTANT than the safety of myself and others (no matter how maniacal they drive).
So far, EVERY complaint I’ve read the last 5 years have been from ‘Drivers’ who place their personal greed over the safety of those on the road.
I’m ‘old-school’: MY success is dependent on how many people make it home at night on the roads I drive. Period.
It’s because of THESE Drivers the ‘rules’ have become (and are becoming) so needlessly complicated…
Rant over…
Hey..kid when you become a man, you will be able to contribute somthing that will help! For now please be careful & curtious to all us silverbacks.We have driven millions of safe miles to advance the economy of the U.S.A. We are trying to make since of and get through this political snafu of tax control
of every mile we move LdorMT and our location. There DATA
Mining is essential to their control of road tax revenue. I don’t think they care that they are BITTING the hand that feeds the country. I hope they can adopt a 16hr day that starts after 8 hours of SB (strategic/anytime) so we can do our jobs correctly! like timing traffic patterns/Sun at your back/in climate weather patterns/ this mixed start time will create a lot of parking due to rotating shifts that’s just for starters
There are a lot more advantages to this system. Gentry Newsom millions of safe miles
Amen Driver!
yep
So what you are saying basically, it is ok for a human being to make 40 to 50 cents per hour in today’s America? Because that is precisely what happens in those 3 hours when you only move 5 miles. And then you have a few hours left to try and make a living wage. That’s if you don’t run into a shipper who eats up the rest of your allowed hours. I don’t know about you, but I became a driver to earn a living, not for pleasure of sitting in a plastic box on wheels all day.
That has nothing to do with eld’s, that’s the laws you were supposed to be following all along. The eld mandate is needed because so many drivers using paper can’t be trusted to obey the law.
the ELD isn’t thw issue its the 14 hr mandate
sounds like we have a bunch of school drivers on here the bottom line is the ELDs would work fine in a perfect world but I for one in the 35 + years of drive found that perfect world .that’s why the paper logs were set up in quarter hr sections and that ELD that you school boys like is on the min. and that don’t work .2cond. elds put the company in full control of your trip you will run and work your 14 or else you don’t have a job but don’t go over or your in trouble there to this job needs to go back in the drivers control not some pin head behind a desk that can’t even get a TRUCK OUT OF THE PARKING LOT .and the 14 hr rule is stupid anybody that thinks these rules are not for the company mite want to get a other job because you an’t smart enough to be out here with the real drivers
It does need to find a way to go back to the quarter hour system The eld system is a good thing if you manage your time and stay out of the truck stop, but what needs to be addressed is sitting and waiting to unload and load and the 14 he rule need to be changed or done away with been out here over 50 years and like one driver has said it’s for the big companies.
Yes. 14 hrs rule is the problem
I don’t see e-logs as the problem. Its a digital representation and interface that mirrors the analog paper book (or is supposed to be). The root cause of most driver’s frustration is how e-logs impact our service hours. With e-logs AND the 14-hr duty day BOTH in effect, this forces drivers to stay on the road during high-congestion times, through periods of post-meal sleepiness, and (since almost everyone is driving the same hours) made parking almost IMPOSSIBLE. Its a classic case of good intentions with piss-poor implementation. There needs to be some uniformity as to:
1) How they connect to the truck:
2) How (and when) duty status’ are changed and recorded
3) Clarification of rules concerning PC and Yard Moves
4) The afore-mentioned flexibility to stop the 14 hour clock.
If there was a way that drivers could STOP that 14-hour clock, especially during high-traffic areas / times, we would not see so much complaining about e-logs. The proposal of the “up to 3 hour / one-time per 24 hour period” window of flexibility would certainly improve most drivers day. It wouldn’t FIX the issues, but it is certainly a step in the right direction.
Notice I have not mentioned shippers and receivers here – thats a WHOLE other battle that needs to be addressed.
Thank you. Drivers on paper logs kill on average 1 person per minute. Elogs Elogs Elogs!!!!
Shogun, that is 525600 people per year. You should think through your made up BS, before spewing it out. It makes you sound ignorant.
He was just joshin’
Oh no Tim! In the time it took you to type that, five more were killed by a driver on Elogs.
Fake news
Studies also prove that people named Short Circuit are impotent Mormons, and that 83% of stats are made up. Or did I just make at up?
you have a DOT body count calculator that spews lies.
Your calculator is broken just like your moral compass.
How do you find your way to the door?
moderators are scared again. I am awaiting moderation.
ELD is not needed, but desired and required by Big Brother, for purposes of revenue and control, the usual purposes and reasons. They usually cite “safety” as the reason for many rules.
another yep
A 2-3 hour traffic back up is a big problem for an ELD. It would be nice if it could be programmed to a mode that’s not driving, a suspend driving mode or something. For up to a certain mph, say 25-30 mph. Have it kick in at 10 mph and go back to drive line at 25-30.
No, but it could be a problem for a driver.
if you are behind the wheel, you are driving. Guys just want to cheat. Nothing will be solved until they fix the HOS AND drivers get paid BY THE HOUR, WITH overtime.
I agree 100%, I never sleep more than 6-7 hours either, I take a nap in the afternoon sometimes, then with the 14 hour clock ticking, it’s a waste, then we all start looking for a parking spot at 3:00 pm!
I agree with you, they need to dispose of the 14 hour clock!!!! I’ve been a OTR trucker since 1977, I quit in 1996 and came back in 2008. Them people in Washington trying to drive a truck from a computer isn’t working in the real world!
Sir when i’m in a traffic jam i put myself in off duty mode as long as i dont hit 20 mph the ELD thinks i’m still off duty.
The new ELD mandate will automatically put you back on the drive line at 5mph. Removing the 14 hour clock would allow drivers to pull into a truck parking area and wait out traffic slowdowns and make more miles.
You’re NOT understanding the Hours of Service Rules. I think maybe you’re using the wrong analogy. you’re claiming that when you’re stuck in traffic the ELD still logs you as driving and that eats up your hours for driving. When you’re using paper logs you have more control as to what to log as driving on ELD you don’t have that control. The problem with this is that we are all human and we all have a different definition to the word “Driving”. just as you have. I disagree with you thinking that just because I’m stuck in traffic moving two miles an hour that I’m NOT driving, because regardless how fast my truck is going by definition I’m still driving. I can go on and on about ELD’s and Paper Logs. The point is that Drivers out there that push the limit and altered their logs for whatever reasons cause accidents where their is a loss of lives ruined it for the rest of us and giving the Government a reason to babysit us. This will always happen in a society where other peoples opinions, believes and logics force change. And as most of us that been around a long time know, When you allow the Government to step in they almost always take things to the extreme and pass laws and regulations that never fix the problem and almost always make matters worse. I agree and disagree on ELD’s. I believe that the problem really starts and ends with compensation (Money). We can never get away with the fact that we all want to make as much money as possible. In this industry The Professional Driver has been a target of exploitation. The Carriers, Shippers and Brokers all want to save money. The buck always stops with the driver. As professional drivers we do a lot of tasks for FREE. This is by definition “Theft of Labor”.
Todd-I agree with you wholeheartedly. My sleep/wake schedule is so whacked it’s a wonder I have any REM left. Every BODY is different. I cannot sleep when I’m SUPPOSED to; I sleep when my body NEEDS to. Plain and simply stated: hours of service need to be able to take physiological differences into consideration. Forcing me to drive when the ELD says to is just an accident waiting to happen.
THIS I agree whole heartly. I am also one that has NEVER needed more than six hours of rest and sleep. Being awake and watching the start clock tends to wear me out mentally. I would rather see the eight off rule reactived and break times through the daily fourteen hour cycle divided into fifteen minutes four different times. In doing the math and understanding that these breaks would be recorded, there would actually be more cardio activity involved through out the day.
Your exactly correct. Back in the day when a “man” could make money with a truck. It wasn’t uncommon in a open rolling road situation to say cover 900 to a 1000 miles before calling it a day. The ELD’s were brought in as a way to have “control” over green horn drivers, that and speed governing their trucks. Add to that the advent of the 72″ sleeper. And poof. You no longer have a truck driver you now have a caged and enslaved bunk monkey. That you can just beep their box when you need them to preform a trick. And face it there were a lot that liked it that way. Look at the thousands of Swift, Knight and Werner Freightliner Condo’s over the years that became basically homeless shelters on wheels. Not to mention the perfect pet sanctuary. Yep the industry went from drivers washing their window’s and checking their oil, tires, airlines and lights at a fuel stop. To some hippo washing out a ferret cage with a poodle on a leash tied to the cab step at the fuel island talking on a blue tooth head set oblivious to the two flat rear trailer tires.
Now that was funny. Appauling but funny.
No, we have these rules because dumba$$es drove over hours, wrecked and killed people. It ain’t control, it’s trying to control people getting killed or injured. I hear dorks say “Ah should be able to run as hard as ah want.” I always as “Run as hard as you want… that’s a euphemism for BREAKING THE LAW or CHEATING, right?
Look no further than our fellow drivers for the cause of these rules.
Well an eld and paper log by law should be doin the same thing in traffic….
If anyone cant sleep more than 5-6 hrs well think about those who do need it..Cant have different rules for thise who can or cant sleep an x amount of hrs..
The same here.
Why doesn’t the gov work on shippers and receivers about all the time we sit there unpaid and suppose to be happy. How many sit at a dock for over 5 hours and have to give them 3 hours before we can start detention. I bet they don’t sit there not making a dime without pay.
Remove the 14 hour window and many problems would be addressed. Drivers could rest when they need to instead of when some bureaucrat told them they have to.
Being forced to fit all our drive time into that little block with only 3 hours of play to work with creates unnecessary stress and cuts into our productivity for no real gain.
That’s understandable BUT has little to do with all drivers gettigetting the opportunity to rest, eat and sleep. Remember your safety and the others around you is what’s important.
There HAS to be some way of addressing traffic issues. I drive team, BUT, we still have issues in and around large metropolitan areas such as LA, Dallas, etc
Use the 16 hour exception. Can be used once per log period.
16 hr rule cant be used if you’re OTR. To meet the qualification for 16 hrs you must start and end your day at the same location the previous 5 days.
I’ve been driving a long time and I believe that the basic CDL driving rules need to be added to the standard Drivers License Test! We are 2 different class of drivers expected to function in harmony But the State kept half the rules from half the drivers!!
Regular drivers NEED to know what safety rules commercial are trying to drive by and why.!!!!!!!
Hello. 8 hours of service, then overtime. Paid by the hour, not the mile. $30/hour
Agreed. Paid by the hour would end driver shortage and might make trucking more of a job to have.
I get paid a base salary or my load/mileage rate, whichever is more. It still gives me the incentive to push for miles, but takes the stress off if I’m caught in a traffic, or I’m storm stayed. My life is a lot less stressful now.
Paid by the hour lol $30 a hour for 40 hours comes out to $1200 a week before taxes and ins.then you gotta deduct a coulple hundred bucks for road exp.so roughly $550 in deductions leaves you taking home $650 or $700 because you can BET at $30 and hour your not going to be seeing alot of overtime more than likely you will be reduced to a 40 hr week job and spend 2 days sitting in a truck stop. I myself have to take home more than 6 or 7 hundred a week just to pay my bills so maybe we can make it $40 bucks and hour lol trust me otr drivers that are non union will never in the near future be paid by the hour.
I get paid by the hour I run 65 to 70 hours a week take home after taxes and 401 k a little over 1400 per week it’s possible I’m not union either
I have always thought all drivers should get paid by the hour, but then there would always be ones who cheat their employer out of money. I don’t see it working for OTR drivers. But it should always be able to work for local drivers and yet so many are still not paid hourly. You’d have to force shippers to pay delay pay and good luck with that.
Imagine the rate of inflation if all drivers we paid decently for the time they put in. It won’t happen because people in general don’t see value in truck drivers until they don’t get something they want.
The electronic logs don’t work right either. I was whining to my buddy with a different company about not being able to get home and my employer would not pay for hotel (I was in day cab) and he said just shut it off and keep driving. Hey, it worked. Nobody said a word to me about driving 2 extra hours.
Actually, a lot of trucking companies that pay by the hour aren’t required to pay overtime. They do have to pay the hours that are worked but they don’t pay time and a half for anything over 40
The fact is most drivers are working closer to 70 hours a week, so throw another 30 hours in there at time and half $45.00 an hour and now you have $2550.00 a week. That is what a trucker working those hours should be making but it will never happen because there is always the I can drive for four days on 2 hours of sleep and stay out for 4 weeks types out here.
Why don’t y’all buy your own truck and pay yourself 100.00 dollars an hour.
You need a good union job. My take home was consistently about $1400 to $1550 per week after tax.
I’m sure you can get a good union job if you are a young white guy, but what about the rest of us?
And you 3 to 4 times more for everything you buy than I do .
Still won’t put good drivers behind the wheel .just people trying to make a living..to be a good trucker you have to love trucking..because the money will never be enough
Amen to that
Agreed. Companies and “experts” say speed is one of the most dangerous factors in driving. Paying a driver by the mile encourages driving faster, often right at the governed speed of the truck. Hourly pay will encourage drivers to slow down to the speed limit and ensure they are paid for all of the work they do from pre-trip to post-trip.
In my past life, working oilfields offshore, it was once common practice to tie bonusing to production. This not only encouraged people to work hard but to cut corners and take chances too. Of course, as overall production rates increased, bonusing thresholds did too, eventually turning corner cutting and chance taking into increased rates of accidents and incidents. Insurance companies then got more closely involved with “process” and through punitive / compensatory premium schemes made it more profitable for companies to operate safely than quickly. Bonusing then shifted to rewarding ZERO LTA periods rather than production rates and companies / workers were able to make as much money as they ever did but without the high rates of LTA’s.
Without labouring the issue unduly, one can see how the connection between mileage and monthly Driver compensation parallels production bonusing and the behaviour it encourages. Currently, risk mitigation in the trucking industry is being attempted using rules, enforcement and fines. Until the industry finds a way to disincentivize pure production, (miles), rule infraction risks associated with mileage gains will remain just a part of the profit game. Crushing enforcement efforts are themselves expensive and will never reduce safety issues like positive incentives will.
Great post Squire
Lol
jude i have drivers now speeding like heck to beet the clock, trying to make up time because you only have 14 hrs to work regardless of how long you set loading- getting empty- traffic – road closed for bad weather ext. I have drivers now that would have sat and let traffic die down in the big citys be for going through them push on right into it because they can’t afford to stop, i have older drivers , driving tired because they used to take naps when they got tired, but now they can’t – there is more accidents now then there was before, if they would do away with the 14hr rule all would be good.
I don’t know what happened to split logging but I loved it. I had a difficult time sleeping more than 5 or 6 hours, but if I started first thing in the morning, I wanted a nap at 2 or 3 pm. Split logging worked best for me. I think it’s stupid that they took it away.
Allow split sleeper period would help too
Not sure where you are getting your info. The split sleeper is still a legal option. The only difference is that one leg has to be 8 hrs in the sleeper to be counted. A lot of companies are telling drivers they cannot split because back office personnel cannot figure it out. Drivers who work a partial day then sit and wait can use the split to work more. With time management, drivers can legally get 2 additional hrs driving by using it. It can get a driver home. Running out of their 70/8 day clock becomes the issue. Drivers using all of their 11 hrs driving in a day cannot use it. It is the driver using 5 or 6 hrs that benefit the most. Learn it, do it right and the eLog will tell you when you can & cannot drive.
If they are paying you anything but hourly pay, it’s because they are getting you to do something for free.
Agreed. I worked for an outfit where the meet driver on one end was hourly and the meet driver on the other was mileage. Guess who got stuck waiting every night? The mileage guy.
That’s some real BS. I started a job where I worked hourly but then they started paying it in “units” and guess what? Yes, pay went down. Too bad if there was traffic or any other issues like waiting for a load. You sat for “free”. Ask any of those a-holes who get paid hourly at the DOT if they want to work for free.
That’s a moronic statement. The vast majority of trucks can’t even get up to the speed limit, so how do you expect them to slow down. I drove from Davenport IA to Utah yesterday (in a car) with the cruise set at the speed limit. I continually had to slow down for slow trucks making bonehead moves, while keeping an eye out for the 85 mph cars that passed me in a steady stream. All. Day. Long. Of course, trucks are the problem, just like a gun is the problem instead of the person that uses it. You guys can blow hot air about elogs vs paper all day, but the real issue is the hours rules. Get rid of the 14 hour crap, get rid of the 30 minute break (nobody drives for days without stopping), and allow sleep time to be split like it was before. That would make a big difference in many areas, most notably in parking availability. More people would be able to be running on the hiway at any given time instead of cowering in fear at some craphole ‘truck stop’….fear of the almighty elog that will electrocute you if you are 1 second past the limits…..
I agree. When Big Brother is involved, nothing works well.
When I’m driving down the road seems to be plenty of trucks not speeding now. One goes 65 and the other 66 while I sit behind fuming.
These new so called drivers want this hourly pay so they can lounge and get a check ..I rather hustle make my money and go home .not park and wait for my money to add up
Start paying by the hour and some of us would lose money because I don’t see any company paying 30$ an hour.
Most LTL linehaul jobs pay over $30 an hour. The industry does need to change to an hourly based system.
I agree. When being paid by the mile, the incentive will always be to run as hard and as fast as you can to make more money. Pay us by the hour if you value safety. $60 per hour o/o’s
You’ve lost your mind if you think an o/op can or would run for $60 per hour!! With costs today, close to a hundred per hour is more appropriate.
I don’t know if $60 an hour would be enough for an owner operator by the time you deduct fuel, insurance, payments on truck and trailer, maintenance, breakdowns and every other nitpicking expense that comes up along the way. I don’t own a truck, but I do have alot of friends in the business and the expenses they incur at times is ridiculous!
Oh, and taxes!! How did I forget taxes…..
I would compare the hourly rate for an Owner Operator trucker to that of any owner operator of heavy equipment,dozer,crane, or earth moving equipment.Then I want to see what happens when they arrive to start work and you tell them they have to wait for about 8 hours because your not ready.
Then the clock starts ticking..if they say go home.. 2 hour minimum.. stsnd by.. 4 hour minimum..ill stand around all day long when imgetting paid..
Love it Randy. I’d like to be there to witness that.
I’m an owner op hauling crude oil. It requires $100/hr to the truck to be profitable. If I run into a snag while working and it lowers me down to $94/hr, it has a dramatic effect on cash flow and it makes a difference of replacing that worn out tire you’ve been trying replace for a while.
$100/hr ONLY includes the time running the truck. Doesn’t include the paperwork or maintenance you do before and after running. Which is an additional 10-15 hrs or so a week for free. With ELDs clocking you by the SECOND, that affects the difference of being able to haul the last load for the day(short hauling) or not. Which means less pay. and for an owner op, that means having to do what it takes to keep food on the table. Whether that’s performing all your own maintenance on your truck to avoid labor costs, or sadly having to run harder to get that last load and back to the yard before you go into violation by a couple minutes.
Other than feeling like a robot now, I don’t really mind the ELDs as an owner op as it does have some nice features like tracking mileage and it filling in the blanks for you. Downfall is I’m now starting to see drivers drive faster, load heavier, and pass more frequently because no company gave raises to become robotic drivers when the ELD came out. Driving truck has now became risk over reward instead of taking it a little easier and being a couple minutes in Violation.
Just my .02 cents.
that’s what it should by the hour for everyone and time and a half and get paid for all hours logged on 3 and 4 lines
I agree completely!! Stop paying by the mile and start paying by the hour!!
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!! Billy Bob’s, I mean o/o’s, freak at that, but the rest of us will benefit.
It would be a lot easier if some kind of way we could stop I will 14 hours why are you sitting in traffic at the shipper all the receiver if you set more than 2 hours then your 14 hour clock should be able to stop then restart 24 hours is 24 hours regardless if you’re moving are sleeping
“Aggressive listening stage”?
We’ve been quite clear about the HOS and how it can be improved. You start by doing away with the 10hr rule and 14hr duty clocks for people who own less than 10 trucks and/or self dispatch. It’s that simple.
Then, you take these unconstitutional, data collecting invasions of privacy called ELDs, and shove them right back up their totalitarian backsides. Regulation and enforcement without representation, isn’t democracy; it’s dictatorship (and the antithesis of a free market society).
These people are mobsters, and they have hijacked the backbone of this nation’s infrastructure, in order to eliminate competition and artificially spike the cost of freight (which will come out of the pockets of the general public).
The only conversation we need to have, is how to defund these parasites.
Tough but true
Agreed
Again, you just want to cheat. The HOS, while not perfect, are better for almost everyone, except teams. I don’t give a crap about owner/operators who think they should get to drive crazy hours and do unsafe stuff.
Idiots doing unsafe things that make MY profession look bad hack me off. After 33 years of this, it get’s old. Pay right, as in BY THE HOUR and follow the rules.
Make shippers start paying the driver $35. an hour DIRECT TO THE DRIVER, RIGHT THEN, after 2 hours wait and $45 an hour after 4 or 5.
Yes, I’m sure that I don’t know what I’m talking about, but I do. They didn’t just go “We gotta go after them successful Knights o’ the Road.” It was dummies falling asleep and killing folks or speeding, etc. You turds that like to tailgate 10′ off some fourwheeler — you’re just as responsible.
You should go before Congress and tell them exactly that. They will most likely get pissedboff but they need to hear the truth, and so does American society. You are absolutely 100% correct with your post. I thank you!
All the trucks should be equipped with satellite that can be tracked then just do the math on distance and travel time and come up with a sliding hrs adjustment. 8hrs off is plenty…………..I like 10 lol. But team.
No, it isn’t “plenty” we had that back in the day and it SUCKED. 10 is good. I don’t actually want to live in this thing.
Hello
Thank you for allowing me a chance to join in on my thoughts I had several conversation with officers , and my drivers one says no if your off duty that doesn’t count against your 14 hours of service and my driver telling me it does ? I think we have finally figured out that it does this to me is insane if a driver drives does a 30 min pretrip then drives 4.5 hours to get unloaded then has to wait 3 hours to get reloaded and goes off duty they then lock there truck up goes fishing , shopping , visit family ect comes back for there appointment time gets reloaded takes them a hour to finish loading then drives 6 hours to come back because of traffic one should be able to see there’s a problem here if your off duty and not responsible for your truck and go do personal things then truly this should not count against your 14 hours or at least allow a driver 24 hours to finish there 14 hours a day driving on duty time ,then of course have to take a 10 hour break before getting back in truck. The stress this causes driver and owners is to much to be added to both, its hard enough with all the other things we have to deal with on a daily basis . My drivers and myself want to be lawful and safe but we also want to be able to do a days work we have customers we have had for years my drivers leave really early in a day and get home early but because of this it has put so mush stress on it all, Saftety is the goal for everyone taking it from one area and replacing in another is not solving anything
Thanks
James Johnson
Mr. Johnson, They are correct, when you start your 14hr on duty status it stays running even if you log off duty. The only way to get your time back is with an 8 hour consecutive sleeper berth but that will not give you the full time back unless you go another 2 hours for a complete break.
So, let me make sure I understand this correctly…
You want your drivers to be up for 24 hours on a 10 hour rest break? Pretty sure that idea will get nowhere. That is completely unsafe. The point of 14 on 10 off is to keep drivers from being fatigued by being up for so long. Why would you want your drivers to be up 20 hours and get behind the wheel and drive 4 hours? How is that a solution? Have you tried being up that long? I have. Your judgment is off, reflexes are slow, and you feel like hell. A 14 hour time frame to work is just fine. Why make it more? Other professions don’t do that. Charge your shippers and consignees for the delays.
exactly
I’m already thinking about the 100 degree days laying in a truck for 10hrs..sweating cuz you C ant idle. Everybody C ant afford APU…then you want me to drive well rested when I couldn’t sleep
Let us stop our clock if we need to sleep, if we get tired need to sleep 2 hours or what ever we have to , so we can be safe. Stop the mandatory. 30 minute break. That was to please the public. Not to help truck drivers. I like the electronic logs, keeps track of all our hours for us. Makes it easier.
Jay, this makes perfect sense to me. If it’s 3 PM and I’m headed from Indiana to Wisconsin, who in the heck wants to drive through Chicago during that time when you could stop, nap, then shower in Indiana, then drive through Chicago a few hours later? I always liked split logging. Why on earth would they not allow you to stop your clock if you were resting? Giving up on split-logging was stupid. It wouldn’t fix traffic issues but with GPS now, you might know ahead of time where the traffic tie-ups were.
No one should have to work a 14 hour day without a break. No one working a 12 hour day should be denied a break. The ELD was put in place to help regulate the hours a driver drives; to help drivers be safe on the road. To stop dispatchers/companies from pushing tired drivers into driving longer or be fired.
I don’t want to work a longer day but in reality this is trucking. I believe by adding 2 more hours on the day will help with loading and unloading times but leave the 11 hour rule in place for driving also at the same time be able to split the hours in the sleeping berth the old way. Any combination of 10 hours off. 8/2 is a killer it forces people to drive when their tired. Try it some time take a 8 hour break and sleep maybe 2 of those hours but hey it’s legal but you feel like crap. I’m old school it’s all ridiculous but we need to make money and do it safely
There are many issues with these ELD’s Yep being stuck in Atlanta, DC, NY, Chicago, LA during rush hour will eat up your time. Even if you stop for 2 hours while traffic is backed up your clock of 14 hours of on duty is still running. Being able to stop from 7am to 9 am and 4pm to 6 pm as a break NOT counted in your 14 hours will go a long way to cut down on traffic AND help drivers. Before ELD’s I would stop before traffic started an go again after an make it up on the back end of my logbook. I got my miles in, I wasn’t in stop and go traffic as much an I was less of a risk of an accident getting a nap. They stress Driver fatigue but these ELD’s are a big causing factor of the problem. If I was tired I pulled into a rest area an rested for an hour or two. I slept in the sleeper got a good nap an was ready to drive alert again. When the ELD’s started you can’t do that without losing hours so all you could do was pull in walk around kick the tires an get back in an go. 30 minutes later your fighting sleep again. People are human not machines that start and stop when you push a button. Telling drivers how long you can drive is like telling Congress to do some work, it doesn’t work. Having the 30 minute break rule is like a tease. 20 minutes to get to sleep an 10 minute nap sure your good to go.
Our biggest problem is waiting to get loaded. Some shippers just don’t care about time. I would like to see the 14 hour clock stop for 2 hours if your in the sleeper or off duty. This would help some. I always find myself needing that extra two hours to get unloaded and finding a safe place to park.
Make shippers start paying the driver $35. an hour DIRECT TO THE DRIVER, RIGHT THEN, after 2 hours wait and $45 an hour after 4 or 5.
LOLOLOL And the drivers who are late for appointments should be paying the shipper/receiver $35 – $45 for each hour, RIGHT THEN.
Maybe a flat rate for 12-24hr delays…or drivers would go broke.
It would help if the ones that keep making laws regarding trucking/truckers knew about what they were making laws about, and actually had many years in a seat behind the wheel instead of just behind a desk..its kind if like having a otr trucker making laws regarding the use of electronic eavesdropping devices in government buildings…i myself never sleep over 4-5 hours at a time..being forced to sit the remaining 5-6, for no reason, is absurd..we do not work a 9 to 5 job here..
Hi to every one.
The best solution is 11 hours in 24 hours so always have enough time to finish the work and make your money.
Okay Ray Martinez I’m ready to have that one on one with you, not to complain about the changes but to have that conversation and help you better understand what’s going on out here.
Hi i think if you just did away with the 14 hour clock and had a 24 hour then do your 10 hour brake that would solve a lot of headache.
Definitely old school the way we use to do it but as the industry changes so do the rules unfortunately, but I do agree with you
I agree the 14 hour clock is the problem. I can do a 7 hour break but if it’s not 8 or 10 hours then it does not stop the clock.
Really.? Think about that. On the day your employer forces you to work twenty four hours you’ll regret that suggestion.
And the 10 hour break would need to be split…6 and 4…5 and 5…8 and 2…etc…its crazy to be forced to spend 10 hours straight in the sleeper! Bastards that make these dumb rules!
I saw it as a perfect system George K. Why ruin a good thing except so many politicians want to make it look like they are doing something to someone that the general public dislikes. No respect. Bring back split-logging.
I think rules and regulations need to be applied but I also feel that ELD’s are a problem in this industry simply because we as drivers run into constant delays while in route to our destination with loads that are already considered hot or pick ups that have been scheduled on such a tight time to meet, while being stuck in traffic our time continues to run out and when finally arriving at destination, we have very limited time to get loaded/unloaded and most customers do not allow overnight parking we are forced to run into violation to find a safe place to park not knowing if we are going to get a knock on the door to move our trucks, so yes ELD’s are problem not a solution to our HOS
the 14 hr clock has to go.i am pushed hard to do the same rte regardless of delays whether it be weather or shipper/reciever holdup.i can’t stop and wait for severe weather to pass for i may not make my appt at the reciever.when im off duty ( SB,Meal Break,etc it Should NOT count against the 14 hr clock. again this 14 hr clock which currently starts at the going On Duty needs to stop once i go Off then resume once i go back On.this 14 hr rule has made my trips much more stressful and unsafe as im being pushed with minimal leadway.
45 + is a good milage and they all are right no one can sleep 10 hrs and feel rested number one I tose and turn the whole time and work on the truck cleaning you do better driving and most people get tired after 8 hrs but don’t need 10 to revive from it ,its a waist of 10 hrs. after fighting to go to sleep ,my 19 hrs are up ,I start driving and ready to go to bed 4 hrs later.plus no one says how the eld constitutes a rest area stop. a fuel stop and just plain sitting on the side of road ,or waiting in line for fueling. too many ifs in there. what happens if I am sitting in a dock for 4 hrs to load or unload..
yes and dispatchers don’t care if you are out of hrs ,that load has to be loaded before 3:00 or it has to be there by 8 in morn and than you sit there on duty waiting for them to unload you ,they need to start more on the companys than the drivers.
Nobody gives a crap about the drivers. You can’t get it there and you will probably lose that load and the money that comes with it. I ran out of hours because they made me babysit a broken trailer and then they wrote me up for not stopping sooner when I insisted on a hotel room (day cab) when they wanted me to “hit a ramp for a couple of hours” instead.
Require all dispatch communications to be required recorded data and fine the company when a dispatcher request a driver to exceed their HOS! If a company intimidates a driver a to exceed there HOS and it leads to a fatality, criminal charges against the company’s management should be mandated. No more out of court settlements to a widow to cover the illegal demands placed upon drivers. ELDs along with dispatch data might make for the safety of the driver a reality. Hourly pay would also be beneficial as it would require planning in shipping instead of the it had to be there yesterday at all cost!
Not enough parking, it’s only a matter of time before we see major accidents on roadsides near roadside rest areas.
I think drivers should only have to be able to work 8 hours a day on driving time and be paid $30 an hour anything over 40 should be timing in half the government should also start making companies be responsible for driver’s driving unsafe underpaid and that’s why they’re driving and safe
Canadian HOS regulation 14 on duty driving, 8 hours consecutive ,2 hours brake can be taken any time with the 24 hours .
Makes the most sense of any system out there. I drive under those rules, am paid by the mile and receive 25.00/ hour for any delay time (on dock after 90 minutes). No complaints here.
I think that being able to split the 10 hours of off duty time with in the 24 hour day that way a driver can like I use to stop and sleep for 2 to 3 hours during rush hour times and then stop in the early morning hours and take 6 to 7 hours , but if a driver likes taking all 10 hours at one time a driver should be allowed to do that to , just like a lot of others have said all drivers are different and our bodies are not the same to force people into one little mold is so wrong.
Kevin, you are absolutely right. They should bring back split-logging. I’d spend 8 hours at Heinz in Pittsburgh waiting around, then there goes all my hours. Average $4/hour. Suckola
I was against ELD’S until I went to work for a company that ran them before they were mandatory, I like them there freight is based in them I make more money now and I like the fact that when my time is up I shut down and don’t get told keep going like it was with paper logs. But that is just my opinion and I think in trucking no one can deal with change in rules…
yep
Please rid us of that 30 minute break nonsense. We are grown folks capable of stopping when we need to. Fine shippers and receivers if truck’s aren’t tended to within the hour the vehicles arrive. After an hour driver are to be paid a minimum of $15.00 hrly. Fix the gottdarn roads. Address local law enforcement and their legislators as to why they harass us or see us as a cash cow when we come through. Treat marijuana use like alcohol use when a driver is off duty and enjoying life.
ELD is supposed to be about making the highways safer, and they’re not doing it.
Yes it’s because of the running illegal however, I took a nap instead of driving during rush hour traffic in most major cities (14 rule was played with) and I was not tired when I was driving late into the night.
Shippers and receiver want you to be available on their schedule for their convenience but when they keep you tied up with one, you can’t get to the other one in the time allowed because you moved your truck 10 feet. Starting your 14 hour clock early AM or you’re in their yard but can’t take a dock because you’ll be in violation of the 14 hour’s
I don’t have the answer to the problem because I admit that my biggest problem with the ELD is a matter of I can’t break the law to keep me safer, you safer, and your family safer by breaking the 14 hour law.
Just go back to the old log book. 10 hr to drive, 8 hr break. And be able to split 5 on 4off. 10 hrs is too long. Were not a bunch of babies who need to sleep all day. Drivers who can’t work should just get out of driving not the whole industry rules changed to suit them.
The hours of service are just fine for long-haul operations, with one exception getting a good night’s sleep and then sitting around all day until late afternoon or early evening then they pop a load on you and expect you to drive all night. 650 miles.
Now you’re awake for 24 plus hours. Differentiating between day and night time drivers would be helpful here.
Where the hours of service need to be adjusted is short-haul operations Regional. 400 mile radius from home base. With all the delays of (loading, unloading) big one! traffic, maintenance issues. it’s hard to get 250 miles in a 14 hour period. Now the load is late. Even if you did split sleeper it. A 24-hour clock would be helpful here,To get in 8 hours of driving. The drivers would still be well rested here because most of these delays of loading and unloading are spent in the sleeper, napping. That is why we only sleep 6 hours a night. The split sleeper here should be 6 solid hours plus whatever nap time we get. + 2
Oh and not to mention all the napping in between loads.
Your hours of service, plus ELD makes me the most well-rested, unemployed trucker out there, because the loads can’t get there on time. And there are only 3 to 4 hundred miles away.
I found a way around sitting all day waiting for a load then expected to run all night… if I haven’t been dispatched within two hours of finishing my break I go on duty. The pressure is on them now that they see my clock moving.
Who in this world needs 10 hours to sleep? The most I can sleep is 6 hours maybe 7. If your not gonna do away with the e logs then please do away with 10 hour sleeper birth. Better yet get rid of the clock altogether and make it 800 miles in a 24 hour day. Then take your sleeper birth, whatever it might be. And that 1/2 hour break, who comes up with this . Certainly no one that ever drove OTR.
That is one of the most ridiculous suggestions I’ve ever seen. The law does not require ten hours of sleep. It’s ten hours of offduty. That’s a shower, a meal, and rest. Use the half hour break to your benefit.
thank you!
Why do I get the feeling that we are just beating a rotting corpse of a dead horse, and forever will be?
Howdy Ray ,
How about parallel the Canadian Hours of service for Provincial Drivers ?
These 24 hour clock/10 off comments are good too. It’s hard to understand I know. Think of it as a big game and the rest after.
Thank you for listening
ELDs force me to drive when I’m tired, even on a dedicated run sometimes my start time may change depending on shipper downtime Etc.
Don’t get me wrong, I think 11 hours of driving in a day is more than enough, and I’m not interested in driving for a longer period each day.
Depending on road, weather, and traffic conditions a driver may feel fatigued at any given moment, and often because of the adherence to the hours of service and the inflexibility of ELD we have lost the ability to edit our logs and, as safety conscious adults, proportion our daily hours in a manner that does not exceed our HOS, but averages out to the required service amounts while allowing our bodies and minds to nap, or drive when we need it, or don’t.
Can any other drivers verify that some days you can drive 11 hours straight with no stops, and yet other days you’re ready for bed after 3 hours? It happens… But if you want to utilize your full 11 hours of driving you’re forced to drive for 3 or 8 hours straight, before you can take your half hour nap… I may be desperate to nap after only 2 hours of driving… I’ll decide, as I always have, based on my level of fatigue and availability of appropriate and safe parking or pull off spots, when I need to rest.
Also, and I think most drivers agree, there is no way to effectively determine how sleeper splits should work for everyone. Again, let us sleep when we’re tired, let us drive when we’re not. To have to reset for 10 hours after completing a run that leaves us unavailable for pick ups in a profitable high bid area at a perfect time of day to be awarded said run, where a pick up may only be a short drive away, is MADDENING, and the discontent of staring at the ceiling for another 4 hours after feeling refreshed after 6 hours of rest is soul crushing. No one needs to be off duty for 10 hours, that amount is arbitrary. When I’m done sleeping, I wake up, once awake we are all slowly advancing toward being tired again, so to spend 4 hours staring at the ceiling, awake, is wasting time we could have spent being productive. So instead of sleeping for 6 hours or 4 hours or 7 hours, and waking up when feeling refreshed, we spend many hours in the bunk lying awake adding to the total amount of awake time each day spent not doing anything. However once we reset, we already have several hours of being awake under our belts and are once again later in the day forced into driving tired because our productive hours have started later in the day than we had hoped. And we must use up those hours later into our HOS, than we normally would have there by driving fatigued for the equivalent amount of hours we spent lying awake in our bunks because a mundane, overly simplified and inflexible piece of computer code says so.
To be honest, if they would change the 14 hours rule to 16 hours and completely get rid of the 70 hour rule, it would be perfect. Every other job doesnt limit how many hours a week you can work. As long as I am taking my 10 hour breaks and getting my rest, why should I be limited to 70 hours? This has, in the past, forced me to take a day off away from my home (Less then a day away) when I could have been at home, in my own bed, to take my day off. The 70 hour rule needs to be addressed, in my opinion.
Change is unavoidable and times are really changing quickly. In my opinion the 14 hour rule is the real problem here. The 11 hour driving in 24 hour period is fine. 10 hours off before driving again is fine. Break when you need to should be the rule. Make it this way and things will work themselves out for all.
I agree. No one should be driving more than 11 hours out of day not to mention most businesses are not a 24 hour operation. That’s why we as drivers have the most of the responsibility to be flexible and have to adjust on the fly in most cases. I don’t like it but that’s part of life.
The 14 hr rule needs to go , all types of trucking would benifit across the board . I’m losing roughly 10000 a month in revenue because of it and I’m sure I’m not the only one. I liked paper and it worked well for me , and no I did not need to cheat .I’m all about being safe but elds are not the problem the hrs of service are. Also as other drivers mentioned I don’t need 10 hrs to sleep I sleep roughly 5 to 6 daily . all men arnt created equal when it comes to driving a truck .
I dont think there should be a set number of hours per week as long as you have your 10 hour breaks after all in any other industry you can legally work up to 16 hours a day
I think they need to look at these shippers they make you sit and wait for a long time and if each one does this it eats up time and a lot of it and we can’t make the delivery on time Eld,s isn’t the only thing.
I am not a fan of ELD’s but I think this problem (for me) is the 8day 70 hours.
I stay out two weeks at the time the first week I make money. Then I’m stuck in a truck stop for 34 plus hours. So the second week I don’t make money. With that being said only half the month am I making decent money. So keep the ELD’s if u like but do away with the 70 hours rules and 34 hour restarts.
Two weeks….? Oh you’re just awesome.! The industry doesn’t need any more of you.
That’s a minimum. Maybe U SHOULD CONSIDER A 8 To 5 JOB MONDAY THRU FRIDAY U POOR EXCUSE FOR A TRUCK DRIVER !!!!!!!
The industry needs less people like ur candy ass Joel
Shut up queer. Short circuit that is.
I am a driver of 40 years experience. The ELD’s do work. My thoughts are to only change the 14hr clock. Change this to a 12 hour day of either on duty or driving status, or any combination. If the status is moved to off duty or sleeper berth, then the clock stops running, and only to be reset after a 8 hour continuous rest break.
That one makes sense.! Excellent suggestion.!
That exactly right…give us back our ability
Thanks for opening up this dialogue Mr. Martinez.
The ELD isn’t the biggest issue
These are the issues, 10 hrs sleep time. My driver has had to stop at 6PM and do a 10 hour just so he could get a load to his destination the next day on time. The kicker he’s not tired at 6:00, so he’s up looking at TV, reading a magazine’s, until 10..Still get 6 Hrs of sleep. Those 4 hours he was up he could’ve been closer to his destination.
Ex: We have seen drivers run out of time on a busy HWY. One Saturday in Charlotte NC I saw exactly 8 trucks on the side of the exit (in sleeper berth) at 1:00 in the afternoon!
Ex: My driver could deliver a load at 8am (he was less than 4 miles away) but because of the 10 Hrs, he couldn’t start his truck until 9am.
My suggestion keep the ELD,but change the sleep time to 6-7 hours. Some drivers may sleep longer,just because the hour they shut down or because companies are closed. But they need the flexibility to pick up and deliver. This would also decrease so many trucks “needing a safe place to shutdown”. Parking for these trucks is RIDICULOUS! They risk fines and violations.
Lastly my driver (had to take a 30 min break) and he was 15 mins from his delivery, he was late and had to deliver next day. Though we have these mandates, we can’t always rely on the shippers and receivers to move expeditiously. I have had driver sit for 4 Hrs to get unloaded.
6-7 Sleep
30 min break (Discontinue)
36 hr restart, change to 24hr
This would be a excellent compromise. Think about the average person works 12-16hrs. People drive their cars however long they want too and sleep 6 hrs. These truckers will shut down when needed
ELDS are not the real problem. HOS IS..
We should be splitting sleeper berth him with minimum of 5 hours. No 14 hour rule, no 10 in SB. Look most of us have been driving long enough to know when it’s time to hang it up.
I work in the oilfield, there are long waits at the well to unload and sometimes 5 hours in between loads. We can’t make a living with one load a day and that is what ELD is forcing us to do. Worse than than that, our circadian rhythm is off balance due to the lack of a real schedule. Some jobs ought to be exempt from specific HOS rules, or it should be the same across the board.
EX.. PTI 8 am, drive for 2 hours, load, drive 2 hours, sit at well 4, unload.. we are 8 hours in now, if I take another load I may or may not get back to well, now dispatch is breathing down my neck, bitching about delivery, but if you d not take the load..your broke… I own my own truck…see where this is going? PLUS, customer left in need of load, and companies will be replaced with drivers who WILL break rules..
Point being HOS is the issue, the rules need to change to make ELDS user friendly.
It’s not the computer that makes drivers safe, Its rest and the realization that he/she needs to break to keep themselves fresh and road ready..
You illiterate wheel holders can barely form a complete sentence and you want to solve what problems? ELOGS, HOS, hourly pay vs. per mile?
The feds are not mandating any of these rules because they care about public safety. They do it because of the mega fleets, and special interest lobbying groups like the ATA. These corrupt organizations give greedy and even more corrupt politicians money to enact legislation to restrict free market competition. They do this under the guise of safety and public well being.
The mega fleets want to eliminate small carriers and through this, all competition in their market. Once this is done they will price fix and all frieght in the nation will move under a ” cost -plus” pricing scheme.
You people play no part.
EXACTLY!!!!!
Currently the way the hours are being regulated I am almost certain there will be more accidents now than before. When possible I drive 70 miles an hour and maybe one or two trucks would pass me up in a 500 Mile Stretch. Now I would say a hundred truck pass me up. The way the hours of service are built does not allow you enough time to do a job that is say 550 miles. Most jobs are given during the daytime hours for pickup and delivery. Therefore you are now forced to work during the daytime. Parking spots are getting harder to find so I am forced to pull over on the side of the road and miss my shower because I can’t start up for 10 hours and then I have to continue my drive because my time clock needs to get going. 5 hours on 5 hours off
Also sitting for 34 hours is retarded.
I pulled in 12 last night. I’ve been up three hours and I’m forced to stay until 10 a.m. . It just started snowing an hour ago. Where they do that at?
Here’s where I think the FMCSA could be helpful:
As a FORMER agency of the bloated, ubiquitous, out-of-control federal government. In other words, as a spending cut.
Get Reid of the 14 hour rule.and it will be better!
Ok first and foremost, ELD’s are just a tip of the iceberg. Yes I believe that a driver or a company should have a say in whether or not to run E-logs or paper, Not some politician who has never stepped foot in a truck let alone driven one. I ran paper logs for 20 years and never once had an incident or accident. I get my sleep and deliver my loads safely. I don’t need a computer or a program telling me how to do my job. As for those of you that line running the E-log… great keep with it, do what you do and keep it running. There is a saying “ To each their own”. I am sure that a lot of drivers feel the pressure that comes with beating the clock especially when you have a dispatcher or a company telling you that, that load is hot and needs delivered yesterday versus tomorrow. Before I came off the road and went local I would make it my goal to get a load delivered every day if not first thing the next morning. Most of the time I was the first truck in line before the gates opened. Now I know that every situation is different and every senario isn’t gonna be the same but we have to work together and resolve this issue of the HOS. Personally I think it should be the drivers discretion on how they operate their truck. If you get 6-7 hours of good sleep and your refreshed. You should be allowed to leave and hit the road. If you for some reason feel the need to stop then stop. We shouldn’t be racing to beat a clock. This is the only job that has so many regulations and your required to track all your movements throughout the entire day. Maybe the politicians should have to do the same. Any way these are just my thoughts.
I’m hearing a lot of complaints about a lot of different things my problem is that when I’m sitting at a customer 4 for 5 hours it is coming off of my 14 hours if we were able to stop at 14-hour clock and restarted after that little break we should help not have a problem with the e l d if anybody that is making these rules would like to talk to me and figure out where the problem is I would love to talk to him too it’s not the traffic problems is not the e l d it is the rules or regulations that is killing us
I would say coming up with a one size fits all hos regulation. The existing hos setup is hurting Americas economical growth. In addition. It’s giving too much of a monopoly to large fleets. And that’s simply not fair.
16 hr days with 8 off
It is a TIMECLOCK…..force them to pay by the hour
Companies should have to pay at least minimum wage for all on duty hours along with mileage pay. This would eliminate drivers being taken advantage of by shippers and receivers. Would also keep drivers logging legally to get the mileage pay.
The biggest problem with the trucking industry is drivers only being paid cents per mile. There is a lot of other work related to the job that drivers are NOT being paid for. Yet the industry has somehow convinced these drivers to accept it and log off duty to “save hours”. Hence, a lot of time and work the drivers aren’t paid for.
The solution is a mandatory minimum wage for all cdl drivers during on duty status plus whatever cents per mile they are being paid. Keep everything legal, profitable, safe, and fair
Increase the 14 hr clock to 16 hrs. Mandatory 8 hrs off, which seems to be plenty for most drivers. If you want a half hr break, take it.
The bigest problem for me as a driver is just as someone else stated. Sitting in bad traffic for hours and not moving and the time is still ticking away. I think there need to be and exception to the rule. There should be away to get that time back a way of editing the ELD.
Why can’t they just simplify the rules. Why can’t we have 14 hrs everyday? Why limit us to 70 hrs a week? Last week I ran on recap and because I had 3 short days the week before I could only be on duty 6 and 7 hrs total a day. I sat around 18 hrs a day. I’m an OTR driver so I wasn’t even at home. Really?!!! I did not need 48 hrs of sleep in 3 days. Come on just let us do our job!!!
Instead of complicated rules for us how about longer, stricter schooling? No profession today has school for 2 weeks and 10 day training. I’ve seen ads saying “I’ve been a “professional ” driver for 6 months! ” What!!???? 6 months no way. Maybe no winter or mountain driving!! Make driving min 6 months school. I’d prefer a year with driving then back to class then more driving etc. Bad apples? Yes what profession doesn’t have them but the day of triple digit outlaws are pretty much gone!!! Family men and woman who WANT to get home to their families safe. Please quit making us play “beat the clock” because backups, construction , shipper delays etc!!!
Well said.
Electronic logging devices aren’t the problem. Get rid of the 14-hour rule and everybody will be just fine!
Lie or no lie, being told when you are tired is an issue. If you are told that it is time for you to sleep and you have plenty of energy left, you are just going to sit there in the sleeper berth. I’m sick and tired of hearing these guys called this a “lie” or that these were the rules all along. “NO” they were not! If you are being told to go to sleep regardless of you experts at “time-management” and you are NOT tired, what do you think is going to happen when you are “allowed” to drive again? Has anyone done any clinical studies on people as they age and how difficult it is to sleep for long periods of time? The only humans that need this much sleep are babies, and ironically, we are being treated as such. A rule like this has absolutely nothing to do with “safety”. Forcing a driver to sleep or to drive when he is capable of neither is …. well “unsafe” … all of you guys who are condescending with your “time-management” know that you are incorrect. You are the guys who need to laze around watching TV and enjoying playing in your sleeper berths. Many drivers now have had to buy televisions and such just so that they can tolerate being in the sleeper berth. Call it “lies” if that makes you feel better. I call it messing with an industry that either keeps you clothed, fed and housed…. or it doesn’t. Team-driving and high-pressured recruiting tactics are not the solution here. Neither is paying someone more money for doing less work. This argument gets so ignorant when allowed. Here’s the real problem: Nobody wants us to tell the truth. They want to call us “liars” and ironically, we are the guys with all the experience and the clean driving records and the happy customers. This is foolishness and anyone who disagrees is just arguing for the sake of arguing. A lot of “drivers” here have some sort of agenda and quite obviously, driving and being productive is NOT one of them. Keep it up. I think the “powers-that-be” would respect us more if we just told the truth, not for us to diplomatically and tactfully argue a point that isn’t even valid. Which is it?
Man you hit it right on !!! You couldn’t of explained it any better!! I been reading slot of comments fir a long time and yours is the best I have ever read !!
Spot on!
Well the simple solution , if there is such a thing is , since this profession is a time sensitive profession , traffic and road conditions are not able to be controlled but what can be controlled is the time spent in docks and the loss is taken by the driver. For the most part detention time is paid after 2 hours and generally at a rate of $25.00 an hour after such , so a driver has to invest 3 hours of time to get $25.00 which is less then minimum wage in most states. So the solution is never an easy one but the change is making the shipping and receiving companies financially responsible for paying a reasonable rate to compensate the driver for their time. I have seen detention times go as long as 10 plus hours at some of the Walmart and family dollar distribution centers . This is time that the driver has a loss…
I have spent 10-plus hours bumped to the dock at a number of places (Hershey and Winco come to mind). No detention pay. I no longer drive for THAT company. It has a Blue Bird logo on the trailer, even though its name is actually a mammal.
I’ve been trucking OTR since 1977 off & on, more on than off, the 14 hour clock is the worst thing on our eld’s, we’re all pushing ourselves to get a 11 hour day into 14, just as some have said on here, when we’re in traffic, LA, Sacramento, San Diego, Houston, anywhere between Chattanooga,Tn., on I-75 to Tampa,Florida the traffic is murder, one wreck and we’ve lost several hours of driving, regardless if the speed limit is 70 or not, we’re all creeping along for hours trying to get thru a wreck and deliver on time and can’t, because of the 14 hour clock, we’re ALL SCREWED! Get rid of the 14 hour rule! And let us drive a split 11 hour or 10 hour day, as we did in the old days!!!! That’s my opinion from a old school trucker who is still driving for J K HACKL out of Wisconsin
I think shippers and receivers should not be allowed to hold drivers past appointment times. We as drivers have to be on time or pay either by sitting or hard cold cash. But they don’t have to honor their appt times in some cases I ve sat at a door for 17 hrs to 7.5 back to back loads last weekend . 15 hrs and no respect for my hard work. I’m rarely late if ever . We should either get that time back or split the difference . Something has to give not all loads are drop and hook. Or maybe the cost of detention should be such that they stop holding us . Steven
I like to think on the cause and effects. The cause of all the trucking problems are the exemption of truck drivers from the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938. The effects of all this are the drivers being overworked and underpaid.
What I was taught as a one truck trucking company you cant have a accident and you need to run your truck safely to your standards, if thats lay-down when you get tired and that takes you over your 14 hours tough.
I would like to see the split sleeper come back so I could run 5 on 5 off until I hit 70 and be done for the week.
If an attorney is deciding on the trucking HOS, expect it to be nothing like the industry needs.
Funny, this article is concerning Hours of Service.Period.But nope,it has to go right to ELDs.
Can we all,for just one day,just one,leave elds n logs out of the conversation, n discuss the pros n cons of changing the f in
Hours of Service?
I am happy with ELD because the truck owner and the big or small Cpny can’t put me behind the weel 17 hrs per day working like slave for them when they need to run a hot load,thanks haven for ELD.
I’m older and would like to see the split driving time rule reinstated. I think it would help with Loosing driving hours sitting in traffic you could sit in a rest area instead.
When the FMCSA can install an on/off switch in a drivers head, HOS rules will work. Until then it only puts tired drivers on the road. If you need to idle your truck at 2 mph to park it in a truck stop when you run out of hours, it shows you as driving.
I think this is something that the Department of Labor needs to be involved in with regards to making changes to the Fair Labor and Standards Act. Truck drivers for the most part are exempt from being paid overtime. If a company does pay fair it’s arbitrary. There really should be some federal minimum on hourly and mileage rates with mandatory overtime either after 8 a day or 40 hours a week. With that I believe that reckless behavior would be reduced and e-logs wouldn’t be such an issue for some. More of us need to unionize but of course where’s the time.
Just eliminate the 14 hour rule..keep the 11 hour drive time..im sure we all have had it happen where traffic or sitting in a dock where our load/unload time eats into our drive hours..
I’m sick of these youngsters whining about you cheat. Come on snowflake, back in my day you could sit and enjoy a meal, if you needed a nap after, there was no problem. I drove when I was wide awake and slept when I was tired. Today there’s too much government regulation. You cannot tell me it’s time to sleep and my body just agree with that. If something should be watch dogged ,it should be the damn dispatchers.
Alow minimum 2 hours on line 2, to pause 14 hour clock. Truckers can then option to wait out big city rush hour traffic.
Cont. Current time needed to pause 14 hour clock, is minimum 8 hours line 2. Majority of Truckers, cannot afford to wait, sit idle, for 8 hours.
The problem are the drivers that dont sleep period an 14 hr rule the reason for eld was to keep tired drivers from falling asleep an crashing those are the drivers that messed it up for everyone
This is only the first step. Soon the logs will automatically transmit to the DOT. Go ten minutes over your eleven, don’t take a break soon enough, gravity carries you down a mountain a little faster than the posted speed limit and the next thing you know you have received a citation without a cop being present. It’s disguised as safety, but is nothing more than increasing revenue, decreasing associated costs and making the owners pay for the transition.
I think you should be able too break your 10 hr break into 2 periods if you want 8-2 or 6-4 or 5-5 or 7-3
See Canadian Hours of Service. It allows this.
I say we don’t need ELD’S in our trucks it’s not going to help with safety at all or cut down on accidents on the highways!!! I’ve been out here on theses Hwy for years and the ELD is a VERY BIGG MISTAKE… matter fact if they want to talk about safety it should go like this ANY, ANY COMPANIES, OWNER OPERATERS, ETC WITH HIGH SAFETY POINTS SHOULD HAVE TO USE ELD’S!!! Not regular working safe drivers that would word a lot better looking at what I’ve seen all these years.
Obviously there are those of you that fail to realize that the hours of service regulations protect us from the inappropriate/illegal demands of the employers. I see one guy that says we should be allowed 24hrs to run 800 miles. What.? That’s all good right up until it becomes a requirement. Think about it. Extending the daily onduty/drive time might help on “this” day but that extended time Will become a requirement and then you’ll regret that idea. The longer this day is…the later you will begin tomorrow. That is not beneficial. 14/10 allows the driver to complete the day-rest-start again-complete the day-rest-start again. And for those that do not need eight hours of sleep…..and find themselves bored waiting for the day to begin….well hello genius…go to bed six hours before your rest period expires or whatever amount of time it is that need to be well rested. I’ve been a commercial driver for twenty two years, ten years I drove cross country. If there is anything within the hours of service regulations that I have not violated I apologize for missing one. Y’all compliment a four week out…? What.!? I ran fifteen weeks and took no more than four days at home except for vacation. Commercial driving does not always work in your favor…driver. That will never change. Get used to it and enjoy the sunset or go find something else to do.
Commercial Driving Is Not For Everyone.! Just because you have a commercial license that in itself does not make you a Professional Commercial Driver. Bottom line is that any hours of service “extension” Will become a requirement and we’ll all regret that. Best of luck to you all and I do hope that the blue lights are behind you and not me…
How do we get a message to Martinez in order to give him a suggestion since he is in the aggressive listening stage?
I was a Independent Owner Operator since 1989. Bought 5 different trucks running truckload in all 48. The HOS and ELD regulations pushed by large companies and government had pushed most of their Independent competitors out of business. I finally gave up this past September. They have a few “independents” pulling local such as containers. I got my own authority 5 years ago but the big companies put pressure on companies and brokers not to load us. What we usually get is what they don’t want. I said all along that once most of us Independents were gone (not rent to own operators) that the big companies would have the government to make “changes”.
I hate that my hour is ticking away in a traffic jam or in accident or while trying to get through Banning Ca scales you can be in that line for 1/2 an hour. Sleep once I am done I ready to go.
I think the 30 minute break should be phased out. It serves no good purpose except to make a driver sit for 30 minutes.
Want us to run on ELDs? Great! We’ll run on ELDs. They stop drivers from cheating, and more importantly, stop COMPANIES from talking drivers into cheating. This latter of which is what leads to most crashes – companies ‘bullying’ drivers into driving when they’re too tired to drive.
So yes, make us run with ELDs. But NOT with the current rules. Instead, go pre-2004. Break 8, drive 10, all with no prescription of when and how the 8 must be taken. It worked for decades. It can work again. Now the only difference will be, is that it can be more effectively enforced, both to keep drivers from cheating, and companies from bullying, than trust-reliant paper logs.
I miss the 8 hour rule .
These morons should be jailed for causing untold of hardship in an already dangerous and stressful job! When your e regularly delayed 2,3,4 hours at a shipper it doesnt take a rocket scientest to understand that the 14 hour window has to be scrapped and thrown out the window now that elds are here! Stop stealing drivers wages! Also DeLorenzo at FMSCA should be thrown in a river and replaced! He has a perpetual smirk on his face that says:” Up yours truck drivers!”
My concern is not with the regulations in regards to amount of hours regulated to each log line and also I’m not even concerned about the ELDs. Here is my problem with the whole regulatory aspect of this situation ; this country has a serious problem with truck parking, and this is how this topic fits into the equation. One : you are at a customer at a designated time, they keep you there two hour or many case much longer . You would think no problem . Right ? Well what if all you had left on your hos was two hours or less . Stop .. Before you finish that thought . NO , many times a customer will not provide parking and other times when they do , they don’t have shower facilities or allow you to even use their restroom. Not to mention no place to eat or access to entertainment.
Now two: Would be the broader aspect of , let’s say you have maybe half hour left on clock and are to get off the customers property but not too far . Well guess what? Now you find out, the local municipality has no intention of allowing you to park on the side of the street. You are full aware of this by the unwelcoming sign stating it .
It seems to me that if you want full compliance with the regulations, then ever aspect of that industry must be responsible to comply with the regulations. If the local municipality can’t provide parking in their industrial areas, then that city should not receive dot funds of any kind . If a State can not provide adequate parking fora growing industry t , then that state has no reason to enforce dot regs. If a shipper or receiver can’t provide parking for commercial vehicles, then that customer should not be able to receive commercial transportation services unless they allow for a 48 delivery window. These are just a few of the problems I have noticed, and I have been around the industry for 24 years so I have seen the 3 different changes to the regulations. Compliance by all involved . Stop expecting the drivers, who by the way have the least say out of all involved.
How about from midnight to midnight you have 16 hours to work. Drive any time and take off any time and use the 16 hours however you want, BUT. You cannot exceed 14 hrs of driving in that 16 forcing you to take 2 hrs off in any block you choose. So guys can take that mid day nap they want or during 5 o’clock traffic etc. When your day ends, whether it’s after 10, 12 or the full 16 hours, you have to take min of 8 consecutive off to reset your 16 daily clock. The midnight time is irrelevant. 16 hrs starts when you first go On Duty. Maximum 80 hours in a work week (16 x 5). Then 36 hours off to reset a fresh cycle. That should be more than enough hours in a week to satisfy most drivers and companies. Opponents will say 16 hours a day for 5 days is too much. Think about Joe executive working in downtown Chicago. He starts work at 9am, but has a 1 hour commute to get there for 8:30. So he’s up at 6, showers eats and out the door at 7:30. Works until 5, but has an hour off for lunch. Leaves at 5, drives 1 hour plus to get home, makes and eats supper, relaxes for a couple of hours, lights out at 10 pm to reset. That is a 16 hour day with 8 hours bed. WTF. Why can’t we have that option for OTR? Not every minute of our “awake time” is working, so that time should be taken into consideration. Ok, comments.
They will never go for that 14 in a 16 idea.
I agree with Michael R drivers themselves are their worst enemy. When you make a statement about losing money because of ELD’s all you’re doing is admitting that you’re cooking your logs. Whether electronic or paper, sitting in traffic or not, your drive time is still ticking. You can’t stop your drive line on paper legally. Besides according to DOT, as long as you’re sitting in the driver’s seat operatingthe truck you need to be on your drive line anyway. So someone please explain, how you’re losing money by being on ELD. Legally.
Incentivise the program. ie. If the driver has 12 months of safe driving under the current eld mandate allow companies to set their own HOS rules if any. Owner operators would be exempt at this point. Now if after said time the driver incurs even a speeding ticket then it’s back to the original mandate for another year. This is the fairest system I’ve come up with and their is plenty of upside for EVERYONE aka FAIR. Email me if you would like to hear more.
Shouldn’t it be a requirement that the people making the laws and regulations for the trucking industry at least be involved in the industry? Shouldn’t these folks have some Class A driving experience so that they can speak with at least a small amount of wisdom on the topic? What if the people making these laws suddenly had their own little black box installed in THEIR homes telling them how to live? Another one at work telling them when they have to go to the bathroom? Another one telling them that they already worked 10 hours today and that the commute home is too long? Tell them that they have to stay where they are and find a place to sleep. No going home. No extra pay. There are laws in place for nearly everything in life. Some of these laws garner no questioning whatsoever. Others? Well… let’s just ad the HOS regs to desision-making that should only be done by those qualified to do so. The lies …are not being manufactured by the truckdrivers. The lies are coming form those bureaucrats who claim that these regulations are being made in the name of “safety”, which is a lie. There is nothing more unsafe than forcing a driver to drive when he is tired. This is exactly what the rebound/backlash is to telling a driver that he IS tired and needs to go to sleep when he still has hours and hours of productivity and safety left. You force him to go sit in a box, unpaid, and wide awake. Then you tell him when to drive with a limited amount of time… and he gets tired, but is not allowed to sleep. Yes, he can stop and sleep, of course, but not without being reprimanded for it. He will be late. He will be unsafe if he does not stop. His hours that he does sleep (which are now necessary) are subtracted from his clock. None of this garbage makes any sense at all. Things need to go back to the way they were. Sometimes people need to realize that they simply made a mistake. In this case; a big mistake. Go back in time, turn back the clock, and leave the industry alone, at least this department. If you want to make positive changes in the trucking industry that will benefit EVERYONE, and not just the truckdriver; but also the consumer, start your law-making efforts on the shipping and receiving docks, not in the cab of the truck that keeps you fed, housed and clothed. This whole thing started as a disaster and will end in a disaster if it is not fixed… immediately. Anyone else noticed the empty shelves at the major shopping centers? Anyone noticed that NOBODY wants to drive a truck anymore? Anyone wonder why that is? Start thinking for a change.. and do it logically. Stop this silly nonsense before the whole nation is turned upside-down… again.
Tom Mediena, YOU, my trucking friend are absolutely 100 percent correct!!! In ever aspect of the trucking industry, we are seeing negative and unworkable regs. and laws forced on the drivers and the industry. THE CORRECTIVE SOLUTION WOULD BE TO RETURN TO THE OLD DOT/ICC RULES AND LET THE TRUCKING INDUSTRY WORK, DO THEIR JOBS. The industry will rectify the wrongs if there are any and see that the industry is operating safely. It has always worked in the past 100 years and we are still here.
There are absolutely NO ONE in D.C. that knows a damn thing about the trucking industry as a whole.
I have pictures of grocery stores and other retail business where there are empty shelves and a shortage of product visible all over the store. WalMart, with their own fleet can not get the product to the stores in time to keep the shelves stocked. I have pictures of the shelves in the WalMart two miles from my home…they are empty or near empty. That company has their own fleet. That is proof there is a problem. When the trucks stop, the country STOPS…THAT IS THE ONLY WAY TO GET ANY ATTENTION IN D.C.! When the breakfast table has NO food on it…the FAT politicians will THEN take notice and DO something!!!!! SHUT THE TRUCKS DOWN NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Per hour or per mile. That’s a problem between you and your company. Maybe you should suggest bringing in the unioun to help you figure that one out.
E-log or eobr isn’t the problem either. They force your logs to be honest.
The problem IS the hours of service. Not being able to stop the 14th our clock. The answer is like with the old rules. If you stop for a certain amount of time. For instance eat a meal and take a 2 hour nap. That should stop the 14 hour clock. Leave the 11 hour clock, the 10 hour rule, alone. Just needs to be possible to stop the 14th our clock. So we’re not penalized for stopping when we’re tired. Or to avoid being stuck in 3 hour long “rush hour” traffic.
Perhaps adding an additional line for “delay” to pause 14hr clock, for sitting at shipper/receiver or give us a ” traiffic allowance time” that would help out a lot
They need alot of OLD log book rules back..where you could split your sleeper berth time with on duty driving time..a minimum of 2 hours offduty or sleeper ( makes a nice nap with lunch) or you could ( then it was 8 hour off and 10 hour driving)split time like 5 hour driving and 4 hour off sleeper…as long as the time totaled 8 hours off within that 10 hours..if you were sitting in traffic from an accident you could get a time exemption..where if you could have done the trip in 10 hours and it took you 12..then you were forgiven those extra 2 hours..funny how those rules were fine and dandy for over 50 years.. until they go some college educated idiot in someplace that thought he knew how trucking worked.. because he took a class in transportation in college.and now along with ELD we have these log book rules that dont work..except the 34 hour restart..
Agreed!!!!!!!!!!!!
The ELD mandate was pushed through under the promise of saving lives, making roads safer. This is not true. Drivers are under pressure to get to a destination, and they drive recklessly, I see it all the time. All this has done is endanger lives.
To a certain extent I can see where the new HOS & ELD rules may help for safety on the highways; but not as a blanket safety set of rules. I spent most of my OTR years (54) following a mish mash of contradictory regulations and rules (mostly company). (“Of some of the company rules required you to drive until you were ready to drop then take a few bennies and drive some more”)
During that last 25 years of my driving career, I set a HOS pattern for myself and it worked great: drive 10 hrs, 7:00AM start, two hour afternoon nap, drive another 6 hrs; then, into bed for a full 8 hrs, like I would do at home. (of course Hunt & Knight did not like my HOS routine) There would be days of course when delivery schedule, weather or traffic would throw a monkey wrench into things; however, my hours of sleep were the same everyday so my body adjusted to my schedule daily HOS and it worked. (I rarely drove beyond 11:00PM)
I agree with many other comments on this thread that you can’t regulate sleep for a truck driver as though he/she would do when opening and closing a grocery store. That’s not the way the human body regulates its self. I doubt if there is any possible way to mandate a rule that fits every OTR out there. Some people can function just fine with six hours of sleep, where others need eight to ten or they are in zombie mode until they get some additional bedtime.
I started my OTR career in 1960 when I was 20 and could handle a 20 hour highway stint without a problem. By the time I hit my fifties, I was completely dogged out after 12 hours behind the wheel. Every rule is not for everybody.
ELD is by far the stupidest, worst, unsafe thing they’ve come up with thus far. Way to go people that know NOTHING about being behind the wheel of an 18. They sit behind a desk with nothing better to do. I’m going to release ALL my dash cam video on all SM so people can see how these “safe” ELD monitors are working. They’re NOT. IDC what they do with company drivers but Independent Contractors need to be left ALONE and let us keep running paper logs or check us individually. And the HOS are fine just the way they are. Get a LIFE and stop changing what ISN’T broke.
What else can be said
I think that a 16 hour day 13 driving and the fact is that any and every truck driver known to man goes to sleep while getting loaded and unloaded weather it be an hour or 6 they go to sleep why in gods name does it come off your on duty hours its ridiculous if you are getting loaded or unloaded for that amount of time and you are sleeping that shouldn’t come off your on duty
I get stuck at shipping and receiving. I wish there was not 14 hour shift erase that completely please give us a chance 11 hrs a day to drive but no14hrs It hurts me a lot, and they just say they dont care.
make shippers/receivers pay the driver on the spot- before they leave cash/check for detention would resolve 95% of that issue. Especially when the owner of the truck still could charge for the delay of their equipment
rememeber alway know the storm your heading into so you can do some changes?bad weather rout change and so so its not that bad fellows ok it all depens who you are working for
I know it is much better for everyone if the driver is able to split his or her hours like when I started driving in 1989. You didn’t have to sit on a long break nor did you need a 10 break at one time. Also get rid of the 34 hr restart. There is nowhere to park in many states because drivers have to shut down so long. Yes please get rest, and be safe to drive, but running out of hours because you are sitting at a shipper or in traffic isn’t right.
I get the whole traffic problem thing, i think the best solution for that is for the DOT to add a traffic button to the ELD!! That would allow to use up the on duty time instead of the drive time! The problem isn’t the HOS on the ELD, the problem is dealing with Traffic in city areas, shippers taking too long to load or unload and then them telling you to get off their property when your out of time, not enough truck stops nearby city areas! Rules like being able to drive while your clock is out of time should be allow!! Being able to get to a nearby truck stop or a safe place!! The DOT needs to regulate these warehouses to taking too long on truck drivers!! Things like that need to happen!!
Why are we not given an email address to contact in this article? Kinda useless to tell you to talk, but not tell you how. Must be a government thing…'”We’re listening to everyone, but we never heard you.”
16hr of service
14hr driving
2on duty
8hr off duty
30min break (opt)
Settled! I’ve been saying this for years.
If we do this, then it’s almost like we’re still having 14 hours with the exception of traffic and waiting time at the shippers and receiver
16hr of service
14hr driving
2on duty
8hr off duty
30min break (opt)
Settled! I’ve been saying this for years.
If we do this, then it’s like we’re still having 14 hours with the exception of traffic and waiting time at the shippers and receiver.
You rookies don’t have a clue eld is the end of irregular route trucking put it on the rail.
A big problem with the HOS is 14 hour rule doesn’t afford time for a driver take a nap if necessary because he is expected to drive the allowed 11 hours,eat,fuel, plus mandatory half hour break doesn’t provide time to nap if tired.
Wow overdrive is now in talking, you drivers need to unite,overdrive represents nothing. Wake up people, are all of you this stupid?
1. Keep ELDs.
2. 12/16/8 (12 hours drive time, 16 hours on-duty, 8 hours off, per 24 hours.)
3. 30-min break/6-hour continuous driving.
4. 2-hour break stops 12-hour drive clock.
Q.E.D.!
The powers that be…the ATA and other money grubbing indites in the industry want complete control and will do anything to get it…
THE BIGGEST PROBLEM WE HAVE IN THE TRUCKING BUSINESS IS QUITE SIMPLE; NO TWO DRIVERS WILL AGREE AN ANYTHING.
THIS, my fellow drivers/o/o is the problem, therefore giving way to the federal government taking on the problem, the problem of which none of them know anything about or how to correct. As long as this continues, there will never be any fairness and the large will consume the small. Then, the feds will step in with their misguided rules and regs. that never work. How long is going to be until truckers grow some balls and say enough is enough, THEN SHUT THE TRUCKS DOWN UNTIL WE GET SOME SATISFACTION…LET US DO OUR JOBS!!!
I have been driving for over 23 years. I understand why the government want eld in the trucks. I was hoping that once we had to have and use them. That we would finally get hourly pay. Hope it would start around $28.00 an hour. I would like for all truckers to push for hourly pay. That would salve a lot of problems instead of being paid by the mile.
Hourly pay sounds good but their is also a down side. Hourly pay could mean less hours worked. Which wouldn’t drown you just keep you treading water.
You’re company driver!!!! We’re playing two different games.
I say do away with the 14 hour and run a start and stop 11 hour clock. Therefore you wouldn’t lose or gain any advantage. You drive your alloted 11 hours after which a mandatory 10 hour break is required and the system nor your truck will start until the mandatory break is complete. Therefore this would help end wasted time and perhaps more loads completed and more money in the drives bank account. Sounds like a win win if all party’s can agree. Don’t make simple stuff hard.
The mandatory 8 hour break does nothing but prolong the day! It makes matters worse! Elogs should NOT log driving unless the truck moves over 15mph. That ends the sitting in hours of stop and go accident traffic. The 14 hr rule must go and team drivers should have more flexibility to choose when and how they want to plan their shifts without shutting the truck down!
As I’ve said many times……..shippers and consignee are part of the industry. If ‘they’ do not get regulated we are just continuing to go round and round. I mean they have to run out of more regs for drivers eventually!!! Lol.
I think the 30 minute mandatory break has to go. If you start to run close to the 8 hours, but are sitting in a traffic jam, what do you do? Pull off into the breakdown lane? What if there isn’t one?
It also takes away a half hour of work everyday, 1 hour of you need to take a second.
We don’t need mommy DOT telling us when to take breaks.
Running in the northeast for 30 years, I’ve seen driving times increase so that some days I run over hours or really close because of traffic, weather and traffic, road construction, and accidents.
Am I going to stop driving when I’m 1/2 from home, even an hour? No. Am I going to stop for a second 1/2 break if I’m close to home. Hell no.
There needs to be more flexibility in the hours.
All this back and forth, you can distinguish the company drivers from true o/o’s by the comments.
You guys are always arguing multiple points. No one wants to cheat, if HOS are changed to allow for a driver to make a decision to pull over to take a nap &, or avoid a traffic or weather situation there should be and option to stop the clock to avoid the more stressful and unsafe parts of driving. The current HOS basically forces you to drive through it in order to be productive. THE ONLY MESSAGE SHOULD BE CHANGE HOS AND WE WOULDNT NEED ELD’s. You drivers that continue to say “they aren’t that bad” are defeated airheads that will continue to give in to everything this government will throw at you. Question did any actual truck drivers vote this horse crap mandate into law? I don’t remember seeing it on any ballot, and the uninformed legislators are willing to push any agenda that can yield a profit. You dummy’s that think ELD’s stop cheating you’re sadly mistaken!!! All this crap 💩 is another expense I have to write off on my taxes dictating yet another dollar 💵 controlled by the government. The fools will never learn it’s all about money. If you ever think this government cares about your individual safety your head is 💩!
The old days are gone 14 hour clock the problem split sleeper also half hour break in first 8 hours joke .
Watch what you ask for ??
Ever change on elogs leave a notice why you change entry an who change it
Study the reg not truck stop talk
Tomorrow the first crack down begin
Have fun see the none truth be on the side shut down
ELD’s are garbage! Plain and simple. Once you are on the clock, you have 14 to get your work done, 11 hours to get the driving done. If you are stuck in traffic and only doing 5 mph for a few hours, that means you only make a few dollars and you can’t get the miles in to make a paycheque. ELDs do not care about weather, traffic, how well you are feeling etc, it says 14 hours and you’re done. If you are in the middle of nowhere and have no place to pull off, it doesn’t care, you’re done and if you go past, you are in violation. As far as I’m concerned, it is simply a way for Big Brother to try and control you. On another note, ELDs are electronic and can fail, so what happens when one fails mid trip and you have no way to log?
Boys get over the eld thing, they are here and that’s, that. Be constructive when it comes to good intel so this new director might be able to get us a better situation when it comes to how we have to run. For instance. Look at a munitions hauler, he has to take that stupid 30min. break, but, he also has to gaurd his load which means that he has to just set there in the drivers seat for no reason. As many time’s as I’ve had to do it, i can assure you it’s not restful, just annoying. I know they were trying to see that drivers broke up their time in the seat, but its a waste for drivers who can’t leave the seat. I also agree that each driver should be allowed to determine how he needs to split up his drive time so he can be as safe and prosperous as he can. Nobody wants to hurt anyone, or be hurt. We just want to ne able to make our living without being crushed by the weight of over regulation.
There is no difference between running on paper and running with electronic… Paper is for the guys who want to run 16 hours a day just to make the almighty dollar… I have been on ELD for four years and love it… I have no problem pulling into the scale house …. bottom line… Paper is for cheating….
If I arrive at my stop 9.5 hours early, drive for 3 minutes to back into a door, take 9.5 hours to get loaded/unloaded, I can’t move from the dock because of the 14 hour shift. I have to sit for 10 hours even though I’ve done nothing for 19 hours except back into a door.
Also, I only sleep 5 hours a night for over 30 years. By the time I’m legally able to drive, I’m tired from sitting around. When the truck stops and rest areas are full, I’m stuck on a ramp 10 hours.
So…for all of you that used the words “I cheat”……You mean..?you are falsifying Logs.
Or…? please explain…..
If you have been driving 5 years or less. You need elds. Driving accident or incident free over 5 years no eld. 10 years or more accident no moving violations, liberal hours of service. There is you good comment FMC
I drove team for a while and he current HOS does not really help teams. It is very difficult to sleep or actually get rest in a moving truck. If the HOS permitted team drivers to switch every 4 to 5 hours without any mandatory extended rest periods, that would help.
Solo: Sometimes I am up all day, in the sleeper, searching for a good paying load on my smartphone. A big one bites at 5 pm and requires me to drive 10 hours, all night after 1 hour deadhead. I am legal to drive according to HOS, but physically I can’t really drive or stay awake for more than 4 to 5 more hours, because I have been up since 6 am. How is the HOS keeping anyone safe? I know my limits and I shut down when I am tired. But on the flip side, if I get delayed in traffic and need to drive just another 15 minutes, past my 11 hours, in order to make it to my intended truck stop, I cannot.
Shippers, truck mechanics and truck dealerships don’t give a rats ass about a drivers’ HOS. Often we have to wait hours at a time just to get into the shop and find out its another 8 hour wait for parts. We’re not allowed to be in our truck, so that’s off duty. By the time the truck is fixed, 10 hours are elapsed and we are legal to drive. But I can’t because I’m tried. But a company can force its driver to roll because he/she is legal to drive. How is HOS making it safe for anyone?
I brought some discussions to the table. Where are the sandwiches?
The hrs of service should be changed to a straight 14 hrs on duty or driving . Still leave the half hr break within 8 . And the ten hr break remains in affect. 70 hr rule should be changed 98hrs or a 14 day period and leave the 34 hr rule in place to get your hrs back . This would also would open ones clock up if they did run into any traffic problems for the most part . There are better ways to do this that’s makes it better for the driver and for the public.it would open up drivers earning potential. With driving themselves into the ground. It also opens up the possibility for more home time. Cause drivers will have more earning possibilities within the time frame.
That was without driving themselves into the ground
1. E logs did not come about as a result of accidents by tired drivers.
A. E logs are a result of companies wanting to gain control over their drivers by monitoring their every movement.
Example : 8 years ago i went to work for a company hauling reefers. Short version, after being up all day and delivering at a food wehouse at 2 am logged off to sleep at 4am qualcom went off. Message said head to charlotte international dealer and pickup trlr # cccc I replied out of hours tired. Miraculously my Qualcom went off again only this time my hos had been edited and I had 11 hours available. I was threatened to run or be fired. So I did , it was a load of fish high value to the company.
2. The 14 hour rule is the only rule that should be revisited as it causes many drivers to drive recklessly in the last few hours of their day
WHO GIVES A DAMN!!!!!! I’m tired of listening to a bunch of 😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢! If ‘WE ALL’ would have just followed the rules on the paper logs, we wouldn’t be talking about this! Paper logbook or electronic logbook, you do the same thing, one you can tear out and redo ‘illegally’ and the other you can’t! I like how these crybabies think they’re above the law!? If your late for pickup or delivery who cares, not your problem. It’s your dispatchers problem. It’s ‘ALWAYS’ been dispatches problem! They are the ones booking the load, we drivers just took it upon ourselves to run illegal to make the pickup and delivery times just to make our dispatcher look good. Anyway, you😥😥😥 keep getting your blood pressure up over nothing!
I hear alot of complaining on here i have been using ELDs for three yrs and I dont mind them at all. If your smart and plan your day they are no different than paper except you cant cheat or make mistakes on them. I maximize my hours every week. Sure once in a wile Ill get stuck in traffic but its rare. You just have to be smarter than the box. Plan your trip and go. Its really not a big deal.
Its not fear you kill us drivers with this eld device. i cant sleep sometimes and yet when i want to sleep i cant because i have to finsh my 14 hourse so i can sleep for 10 houres . i am not a ropot i am a human just like you . i am traing to make a living for my kids . you let big fish eat small fish . its really unfear .
Just eliminate the fourteen hour rule.let us split the rest time to two periods of our choosing ,as long as it equals ten hours per day. This would go a long way to alleviate the pressure to drive as far as we can, as fast as we can under the current rules.
If a 14 hour work day minus a 30 minute break isn’t enough time to make a decent living, no matter what happens during that time, ie… back up,held up at a shipper/rcvr, bad dispatching or whatever. Just a guess on my part here, your not getting paid enough or you can’t manage your own money. PLEASE quit working for companies that won’t pay, or quit hauling cheap freight which ever one applies to you. thanks
34 hour reset is what really kills me
30 min break I can get around 99% of the time. I used to only work 14 hours a day so that’s not the big thing. It’s the 34 hours off that bugs me. I usually stay out for 12 days at a time take 2 days off and get at it again. Now I gotta take 34 hours off in the middle of that 12 days out
That’s a lot of $$$ I’m losing out on or I have to stay out for 13 days and only get 1 day at home to make the same $$$. Thanks DOT. Isn’t that great a bunch of fucktards who get to sleep in there own beds every night get to regulate us guys that sleep in a tiny little box and eat shitty truck stop food. DOT or better known as Dictators Over Truckers can go to hell and burn for all care. I wouldn’t trust my dog to be alone with a DOT officer.
I usually try to support law enforcement but the DOT put so many rules, regulations, fines, fees, taxes, registrations, laws down on us that it’s impossible to move, fart or pick your nose without them having a say on how you do it. And we are supposed to know all of them rules to. I know not all of em are bad people but I’m sorry if you work for a tyrannical agency that’s out of control I’m gonna lump all of you in the same basket. All truckers company drivers and owner ops should park their trucks call in sick for a whole week and bring the country to a grinding halt. And demand that we make the rules not them.
Here’s a real world example. And we’ve always been on ELDs. Most drivers aren’t paid for on duty, non driving time. Think about it, a driver that is paid by the mile sitting in the truck waiting to be loaded at a shipper, doing nothing, one would think they could stop that clock from moving if the truck isn’t moving. Yet, if they started their clock that morning at the truck stop, they can’t stop the clock once started. That clock keeps rolling and counting down from 14 hours until you have to take either a 30 min or 10 hour rest break.
Say that driver sits for 10 hours waiting to be loaded which happens a lot when you’re hauling reefer loads, you’ve already done a 30 min break, that gives them a shorter amount of time to find a place to park because that shipper took to long to load them. Imagine it’s 7pm and all the truck stops are now full. The shipper said you have to leave their property and can’t park overnight. You are now are stuck without a place to sleep for the night because a clock told you to park and even though you’ve been sitting all day you can’t drive now. It’s happened to us more than once.
The rules need to be changed to fit into the challenges drivers face today. Challenges are different today than even a few years ago when the rules were put in place. Either shippers/receivers need to be more respectful of our time, or we need a way to pause the clock with a bad shipper/receiver. And don’t say contact the FMCSA about cohersion. We did that last year in Idaho on a shipper and sheriff. We’ve never heard anything back. Perhaps if drivers were more apt to report bad customers, then this would be an option. However, who really wants to put that customer relationship in jeopardy.
The HOS rules set drivers up to fail. They should’ve been changed prior to rolling an enforcement of electronic devices. Electronic devices do not make drivers safer. A well rested driver, who is allowed to rest on their bodies clock, without more stress of finding parking, one where their time is respected, makes drivers safer. The last thing drivers need is more restrictions. Their job is too important to America to have to deal with all this undue stress. Unfortunately until it affects more Americans in the wallet, they won’t change anything. Obviously the ones doing the job aren’t being listened to.
Good to see drivers mentioning about 6 hours sleeping,day time rest and about all other problems connected with paper and ELD logs.We all need rules and law were no one can’t cheat. Our life, others life plus trillions of dollars goods,bridges,roads, buildings.We have to keep and love what we have and build better for future..We have new drivers.How many hours or years they have to work to be able teach others ?All different like sleeping issue. We need rules and law for them.Driving records helping to find out their progress and proffessional entry.Trucking industry need rules for every level.Same rules for beginners and seniors #1 problem.
Paper logs first problematical start in trucking industry.This papers makes thousand drivers become a cheater,but they hate to cheat and they do,because 14 hours,11 hours and 10 hours can’t be right approach to driver job.Driver have no business to touch pen paper or electronic devices. Driver need 3 commands to read or hear.
You can start working.
You have to park for break.
You are ready to stop for today.’
Driver levels
1) 10 ….or more years experience
2) 5-10 years
3) 1-2. . years
Plus how clean is record to get right level.
Every level should have correct rules and regulations.
More than 10 years I’am witness of how truckers hanging from paper and electronic logs.We are people looking out of our planet for life and start new life.How shame to put truck drivers in this condition?
For how long?
This logs isn’t only problem for people.
We have to fix this and go forward
Never stop.
Easy fix to help every driver. Get rid of the 14 hour clock rule. Allow us to start and stop our clock. What kills our day is the time it takes to load and unload. And get rid of the stupid 30 min. BREAK. It does nothing but get in the way of a productive day, and again eats at the clock.
company drivers have different needs than OOs. Many company drivers are teams. We all have different needs and thats why hos and elds cant be universal. So for us we are OOs. We would like 12/16/8. 12 drive 16 on duty which would include bad weather, loading etc. 8 sleep. One 30 minute break After 6 or 8 hours driving. 40 years driving exp. and almost 4 million miles.
This is ridiculously crazy. On 95 South Carolina 15 mile backup due to construction. Workers should be working on road at night not in daylight and make more problems out here. Guess food market’s will start having empited shelves as don’t care if load gets there or not. Got e log so waste a HR or more in backed up traffic.
FMCSA needs to look at the issue from a different angle. Every driver’s complain about ELDs is that they don’t have the flexibility to meet the road conditions, shipper/receiver disregard about the waiting driver’s HOS, and ever changing energy level of the driver from day to day, or from sunny day to a gloomy one. It is just not one size fits all.
I rather if we didn’t have any of this nonsense, but, if we must have them because of few bad apples in the basket, how about allowing a driver to travel only 700 miles per 24 hours. once the truck starts traveling at a speed over 35 miles the 24 hours starts. this will solve the yard moves, and if you limit the truck’s speed to 70 an hour, we can make sure that he/she isn’t driving like a crazy, and when the truck is parked for 8 hours straight, the 24 gets a reset. This will provide the driver the flexibility needed, and FMCSA the safety they are looking for. In addition, the FMCSA can change the equipment inspection intervals from 90 day to 45 to avoid crashes caused by maintenance failure.
It is simple folks, all the FMCSA needs to do is listen to us instead of being narrow minded, and dead locked on HOS, and ELDs.
Waste of time on this article, it says it may be changing, however at the end it says he is ready, rope us in with false stories. On the ELD, 14 hours is plenty to work in one day, the fact that so many are so pissed off tells you how many has been cheating their log books. Been driving for 15 years and I know how and why they are doing it, but 14 hours is plenty when most these jokers only work an 8 hour day.
If you’re stuck at the shipper or consignee for several hours the driver should have the option of adding some or all of that time to his driving time without a 14 hour rule violation.
Changes need to be made. I was forced to take a 10hr break at 12 noon. I couldn’t sleep, got 3 hrs in and laid there awake for 5 more. Now I have to drive 11hrs without falling asleep. This is worse than a midnight cowboy because at least they sleep when they want!!! I feel so safe on the road!
“We shouldn’t be racing to beat the clock.” That sums it up all in that one sentence. There isn’t one aspect of a drivers job that is NOT about that. Every second of every day when your eyes are open, off duty, on duty, driving. Its in your head from the moment you wake up. Appointment times, traffic, construction, weather, breakdowns, sitting at a shipper or receiver, where to park for 10 hours, when to start looking for that place to park, your next load, etc. Stress makes you tired faster than anything. The powers in place are not adding these factors into the equation when they decide what makes a driver safe. That is their responsability. As for drivers, every human needs sleep. If your a driver and your load is more important than being safe then your NOT a driver. Sleep when your body TELLS YOU TO SLEEP. The load will get there when it gets there. If you don’t have the balls to tell your dispatcher that one flawless fact of human nessessity then find another job. When I drive my truck I’m the boss. I’m in controll. Nobody else. Nobody. I’m the one driving the 80,000 truck. Not anyone at the company I work for, not the shipper, not the receiver. Only me. I’m a company driver and I’m the best person at this job to decide what it will take to get the load there safely and hopefuly on time.
Implementing 3 consecutive hours The Rest Amendment is goes against the bodies natural cicadian rythem. The problem is sitting in traffic rather than being able to use those hours to avoid high traffic times. Detours,construction.
Drivers know and want to be safe they have a lot invested in their trucks so why wouldn’t they want safety first. The ELD is nothing more than lazy book keeping.
FMCSA pointed out 71.1 % of accidents caused by Four wheel vehicles for driving unsafely aound trucks. Push to pass putting on breaks, follow to close,
Outrun on ramps , no blinkers changing lanes the hits keep coming. Those 3 hours should be used as needed to enable drivers to drive at the best times for their route.
I don’t see elogs as the problem. In fact I kind of like it. At the end of the day and at each stop it cuts down my paperwork so I can get back on the road. What I think needs to be fixed is the HOS. I am a short haul driver and I sleep in the truck two nights on each trip then home in between trips. The problem I have is I can make it just under 30 miles from home on my back haul and I’ll run out of on duty hours and because there is a rest stop between where I run out and home I have to legally stop for 10 hours because it advances my load. Now i can speed and be unsafe and make it home if I wanted to risk it. I’m not going to say I’ve done that but the day will come I’m sure. I do us the 16 hour rule but you can only use that once a week. If I could use the 16 hour rule every day I could easily make it home every other day. However, they do need to keep the way they figure out the 16 hour rule, meaning using your last 5 days at the same stop. Otherwise companies would extend there service distances to use the whole 16 hours.
To Mr MARTINEZ: statistics show that 6 to 7 hours is sufficient for adults over the age of 24 to 64 by the Federal Sleep Foundation. I believe we should make HOS 15 hour shift and add an hour to make it 12 hour drive… Reason: Health, TrAffic, pulling in to fuel and a driver to make up for loss of drive time because weather,traffic or safe haven reasons… 1st point is Health!! DOT and Major Companies don’t give an account that 80% of drivers are over weight and die by obesity, Diabetes, cancer and Pancreas deseases… The extra hour would help for drivers to get some gym time in and exercise of some sort for their health and relieve the pressure of OTD WITH Dispatch not caring the health condition of the drivers.. I know we have PC time but most companies will not allow a driver during his 11 to go exercise or do Laundry or pray to God or take a beautiful walk in this beautiful country we have… I believe we should create a bill of rights for drivers to have the right to drive to a gym or stop to the restroom and utilize that extra hour for the health of the driver to not be pressured for OTD…a lot of things go against a driver out here on their drive time . For example: weather, the Law, Fueling, bathroom, traffic, construction, texting for family emergency, accidents and careless drivers…and breakdown time…Truck driving is one of the highest unhealthy jobs to have and I think we should create an extra relief hour to not pressure a driver to rush for OTD if need be.. only If can provide proof of reason for that extra hour if questioned… examples: zGym membership receipt, Laundry Receipt, images of Traffic GPS logged or a log of PC time for health reasons : This is only one reason why an extra hour or Nuetral Hour should be Inforced but this is mostly for health reasons and a solution to not pressure drivers .. Thank you