The Owner-Operator Independent Drivers Association has filed a lawsuit against the FMCSA over their new E-Log ruling that would mandate an onboard recorder in nearly every commercial motor vehicle in the United States, which OOIDA has called “absolutely the most outrageous intrusion into the rights of professional truckers imaginable.”
According to OOIDA, the new Electronic Logging Device (ELD) rule would have catastrophic repercussions if it was ever enacted. But OOIDA isn’t going to let that happen without a fight. OOIDA president and CEO, Jim Johnston, promised to fight the new regulation “with everything we have.”
“This rule has the potential to have the single largest, most negative impact on the industry than anything else done by the FMCSA,” said Johnston.
The rule would mandate the use of an electronic log in every commercial truck model year 2000 and newer.
While some trucking groups including the ATA have applauded the rule, many driver advocates are still concerned with a lack of protections in place to prevent driver coercion or mistreatment.
The ruling does allow for fines to be levied against carriers, shippers, receivers, and any other company that might pressure a driver to use all of their allowable hours regardless of driving conditions, their health or alertness, but driver advocates claim that the fines won’t be an effective deterrent.
OOIDA also claims that the rule is flawed on a fundamental level since it won’t actually make truckers any safer. Johnston claims that the rule would “do nothing at all to improve highway safety. In fact, we firmly believe it will do exactly the opposite by placing even more pressure and stress on drivers than they already deal with.”
No dates for initial arguments have been set.
Source: overdrive, overdrive, gobytrucknews
My safety guy said he doesn’t care if Ooida wins the ELD fight he is going to make everyone get one. I guess he will just have one less driver.
Every employee should have that very opinion… See how many trucks will be sitting then.
I’m right there with you. Your safety guy had no clue how much harder his jobs going to be. Just ask swift or jb or Warner.
I work for JB. My job is still easy. I wish they would get rid of the 30 minute break, but I think the benefits of elogs are worth it.
I agree. All the e-logs are doing is making sure the driver is not going over their 11 hours of driving.
elogs can be really stupid. sometimes i had taken like a 20 or 25 min break but then i my 8h are up like 30min before my destination. so now i have to take an additional 30min and make my day longer. even though with a paper log i could have turned the 20min into a 30min break or the 25min would have been logged as 30 on the paperlog anyways
I agree. But JB recaps hrs so a driver can never take there 34 reset. I don’t know how that’s legal. Its just there policy!
Yeah for a big company the ELD is greatbut for an O/O with 5 trucks or less it doesnt do a damn thing for us just another costly expense that we dont need.
guess that your safety guy has never driven a truck before? I had a dispatcher that told me I didn’t fill out my log properly and I told him a smarta$$ answer . I asked him if he ever drove a truck before and his dumdass answer was “NO”.So how can someone tell you that you are wrong if they have no idea if you are or aren’t. Just because they are the dispatcher or safety director . B S
Is Billy your dispatch or safety director?
I heard that.
Now You know Billy how much You know obout Trucking. Like Hair styllist running a Hospital. Oh Billy..Billy…..
So far as I’m concerned, if someone else (government or employer) mandates it, THEY MUST PAY FOR IT!
They’re all a bunch a pussies, they need to make law makers have an e-log and sit somewhere with no bath room for 10 hours
There is no benefit in the OBD’S until they can’t be “edited” by the company after the fact to remove violations. I can still be pressured to drive over hours, because my company knows it can be erased. It’s simply a cat and mouse game for ticketing purposes, and serves no safety function whatsoever.
Yes, your company can edit the log, but it leaves a marker that the log has been edited.
You guys are a bunch of dumb people. I agree that government steps in where they shouldn’t. However, if your company or dispatcher is telling you to go over your hours, you should be calling the authorities about such companies. See if they still have a job.
So my question to the guy that said where All a bunch of dumb idiots . who do I call to report or even question. What is legal . The Authorities ?
thank you. has anyone though how this is going to affect the agriculture and construction driver. crops left in the field, road projects taking longer than they already do. There’s a driver shortage now good luck finding drivers when you limit our paychecks.
So what you are saying is you can not do your job legal now ?
Drivers have never wanted to do the job legally. The company’s have got these suckers stepping and fetching for free and they love it!
Elogs dont force me to rest, they force me to drive. It has no compromise,and is a safety deterrent.
how does it force you to drive? you are in charge of when you turn the key after a 10 hour break. do you not sleep during your 10 hour break?
of all trucking accidents, you have the highest % to crash after 10 hours of taking your 10 hour break, it stays under 5% up until that point, then leaps to double digits for all hours past 10 from the 10h. Nobody is forcing you to do anything, if you are not making your appointments, then its either poor time management, poor dispatch or both, which is it? One of the first things you learn in driving school is how to manage your time, how to preplan your route including 10h breaks. If you can’t do this properly, then you should go retake that portion of the course.
The world does not revolve around anybody preplan. Can not count how many times I planned on stopping someplace, making it someplace and falling short.
That’s just a bunch of bull my friend. Your either a rookie or a seat warmer. This is TRUCKING there it’s no pre plan there is no time management. Every trip every time there is one thing or another that’s going to screw your rookie pre plan all to he’ll. That’s the facts Jack…. And if you believe any different you have lost your mind. All the computer logs do is make a good driver bad. He’s going to have to run no matter what the situation the weather or how he feels. And that’s the facts too. It’s going to turn out just like the stupid 34 hour rule they quietly got rid of because people were getting killed by the truck load. Fmcsa is a joke there rules are a joke and they need to be shut down. This is coming from a trucker of 12 years accident and ticket free and I run paper logs and my truck is governed at 119 miles an hour. So yes safety is real and it’s up to every single driver to do the right thing. Don’t castrate a real driver to try and make some dumb set warmer act right. And that’s the facts.
Wow. ..real trucker. With 12 yrs no accidents or tickets. ..talk to me when you have 35 yrs and the same
LOL! Mines bigger. Like 12 year olds. I think 12 years accident free is a good record. We haven’t all been out here for 100 years. I only have 6 years. Am I less of a driver than you? I’m an owner operater with my own authority and all my equipment is paid off. Success isn’t measured in time it’s measured by what you have done with that time.
12 years accident and ticket free does not deserve any kudos in your mind?? G**damn your a hard a**
I do have 40 years experience with one ticket no accident never needed a baby sitter they do promote bad driving behavior
You are 100%right. And I have been doing this for 30 years
On paper you get in the habit of driving down your clock; then find a place to park. You can’t do that on E-logs. On paper if the stop you planned on stopping at is not available; you move on to the next. When you sign your logs, it’s all looking LEGAL. Not so with E-logs.
I left at 7 am
for pick-up at 8am
loading 8:00 hours
5 work hours left
when making money?
Every driver here talking about what elogs do or don’t do,cause or don’t cause needs to have used elogs first because it’s clear from what I’m reading here every single driver and yes even u 20 yr veterans don’t have a clue about what you are talking about.I’m experienced with both and I can do with one what I do with the other except cheat my hrs .actually less of a hassle than paper.the only thing I don’t approve of is companies ability to edit without me knowing.I always figure it out though .try elogs or stop trying to school the rookies or seat warmers on facts u can’t know
I have done both. And I still stand behind the fact that they force you to drive. When you run under your own authority and have a client base it’s a lot different. No matter what laws they pass concerning pressuring drivers it won’t matter. If I am not making runs on time then the shipper will find someone else and make up a different reason. When you commit to a load and a delivery time they expect you there at that time. This is a business. And they want their product delivered when you say you will deliver it. I hear some people say “oh, well you should preplan better and not take the load if you know you can’t legally run it”. Great argument if you have someone dispatching you one load at a time. What about if I’m booked 4 loads out. I can run all 4 loads and never exceed 500 miles a day. But guess what. Somewhere during those 4 loads a shipper is going to hang me out for 4 or 5 hours and screw me up. I’m still responsible for delivering those other loads. Because I told them I would. You want to regulate something then regulate the wait times. I have no problem running 600 miles or less a day. But due to some of the delays we experience at shippers and customers that’s not possible. So as a driver you are faced with fudging a little or potentially losing a customer. I love these company drivers who get emptied and then have another cheap load 20 minutes later and keep running that way..one load at a time. As an OO you can’t wait til you get empty to start looking for freight. You’ll be doing a lot of sitting if you do. Most plan out several days and there’s always a monkey wrench thrown in there during your week. Not the drivers fault. He/she does what they have to do to fulfill their obligations. I can always tell on the comments who is a company driver, who is leased to big companies with tons of freight and little wait times, and those who are true OO with their own authority. Those who are company drivers are just jealous of those who run on their own. Company drivers figure “oh, well I have to have it so it’s not fair that you get to run without it”. Well all I have to say to you is get off your butt and buy your own equipment and get your own authority and then you can make your own decisions. Until then don’t try to make decisions that affect my company and my ability to produce revenue and keep my customers happy. Never had a ticket of any kind. No log book violations and never failed a DOT or had a chargeable accident.
you see a lot of opinions in a narrow frame of perspective but i think bill clearly shows the larger perspective and the bigger picture. And bill is addressing the side of the industry that is at risk. Due to the inability for bill to fudge and adjust according situations his logs he would eventually loose his customers because legally he would constantly be late in the deliveries. or have to cancel customers and loose his credibility. The DOT makes rules and rolls the dice but the dice are rolled over peoples lives and futures. This is the bigger picture. The giant mega companies want the freight independents are running. ITs worth billions of dollars of income spread over a handful of mega companies. They have been setting themselves up for this very opportunity promoting laws that cripple independents abilities to satisfy the customer. All the laws are angled towards this move. The Mega companies are ramping up and preparing to move in and gobble up billions in freight. They needed a driver base. So the laws were changed to open up a fresh driver base. Younger drivers. Naive and gullible and easily disposable drivers. The roads are being loaded down with them. Theyre vicious and cocky behind the wheel. Rude and have no regard for their jobs or others. Not all are like this but the companies are taking whatever has a pulse. So they arent looking at quality and character of the person. This isnt a myth it is a fact to be seen on a daily basis out on the road. In the past 5 yrs i have seen a massive change in the morals of peoples driving. There are few courtesies practiced at all. No politeness on the radio. No considerate thinking in their actions or interest. And without a doubt in my mind later down the road we are gonna hear that the number of accidents has gone UP severely. I say later because the data is always hidden by existing administration in government to hide their failures. When a new admin comes into power they like to expose the previous ones failures and thats when you will hear of it. I dont need to hear it. I can see as i drive the number of accidents escalating. Is there a connection? Indeed there is but in the bigger picture. Perhaps in your lil cozy box of a life it works for you but the rest of the industry is being demolished by irresponsible coercion of government. The mega companies are sitting back watching the clown acts of the independents who simply arent organizing and acting as the mega companies do.. The independents are honorable and decent people who just wanna work and do their bit. They dont want anything to do with politics and payola to the feds. The mega companies are playing dirty and know theyre gonna get away with it because of the dysfunctional lack of organization of the independents. Ooida is basically the only real solid organization representing them. Unless Ooida comes thru the independents are about to get the hatchet. Again what bill is showing is the BIGGER picture of his particular situation which is reflective of most of the independents out here. And im not saying much here..Ive only painted a scant image compared to what lays down the road. When the mega companies are in charge of it all. I predict a repeat of the mortgage industry crash , the internet crash, the stock market crash, and the likes that all were a product of power and greed and an inability to manage it. Once in their hands it is the country that will suffer from their irresponsible management of the control.
24 year driver here. I agree wholeheartedly.
I mess with my customers with long wait times all the time. I always ask them ‘what are you gonna do when the country is so short on drivers that detention fees exceed shipping costs?’ always the same answer ‘what driver shortage?’ Detention fees only work if everyone gets on board though…..
Excellent. I’m with 100% leave the real driver alone.
I’m with you on that
You said it all .ive been driving fir 25 years on paper logs no tickets or accidents. I use the smith system it works.the ones who have the wrecks are those on e-logs always in a hurry,weaving in and out of traffic cutting people off not paying attention just to get 5 miles down the road
You are absolutely correct, I’m a 22 yr vet and there is no planning. Traffic alone can ruin a preplan the FMCSA has turned the trucking industry into a joke. They think they have a shortage now, wait til they implement these elogs. I believe they’re getting their pockets greased by the larger companies, cause the Owner Op is a threat.
Jeremy eld ‘s may work for 2 week driving school grads like your self . I bet you get 2 or 3 days to run a 1,100 mile run. Every time I ever got dispatched on a Schneider, JB , swift, or other BIG trucking company back haul run of over 600 miles. My delivery date was minimum of 2 days. Which would ruin my week putting me back close to home on Thursday instead of Wednesday. Can’t go back out and still get home Friday night. So that’s a out and back that week. Can’t live on that. If I can’t deliver and reload same day and deliver next day it’s not worth being on road all week. 3000 to 4000 a week is not a problem for a REAL professional driver like me. But driving school doesn’t teach you that. You live in your truck 10 to 14 days if you want. I like being home EVERY weekend. And bringing home $1,400 a week WITHOUT the O/O headaches. 26 years exp. telling you this young man. Need to get some experience before running that mouth.
Erik, YOU are the reason why we have all the stupid regulations to deal with. 4000 miles a week is only attainable if you falsify your log, there is no way you can do that many miles legally… so yah, you are the problem, and you call yourself a real trucker, that of course is until the time some stupid 4 wheeler decides to pull in front of you, and slams his brakes because he’s having a bad day… then try to explain to his lawyer how you manage to log 4000 miles a week.
What you don’t’ get is that no matter how good or safe a driver you are, you have to worry about everyone else around you, and if you are currently driving with a falsified log, they will get you no matter who’s at fault.. so go ahead and take the risk with your falsified log, I prefer to run legal, and since I run legal, I don’t care how I document my hours, electronically or manual, either way, they get documented.
Here’s a suggestion for the OOIDA, rather then fight the elog rule, why don’t you fight the regulations instead, make them more flexible so that we all can run 4000 miles a week legally. What people forget is that by fighting the elog rule, you are just admitting that you falsify your logs now.
Like your post! Yeah,I get tired of hearing the super trucker stories… who really runs 4000 miles every week c’mon. That’s just an accident waiting to happen.Sad as it may be,this isn’t the “Chris Christopherson” days. “You want me to drive that truck where”? Listen up Old Road Warriors,they have Rules Now. If you know a lot… don’t follow them. Read about you in the paper some day. I know the type a Renegade.. pass everybody speed always.Is that a Good driver?I’ve only had a Cdl 22 years and I’m tired of putting hammer down . I do the speed limit and I like to drive in the Middle lane (2 lanes of escape) does that P off the mileage guys. Oh yeah it does.
22 years of driving, and your claiming you can’t do 4000 miles a week legally, guess you still haven’t caught on aye, but you proved that by saying you drive in the center lane for saftey reasons. 1st off I’ve did 4000 miles a week in a truck with elogs many a times, 2nd how to you have more of an escape route in the center lane than the right, if you are in the right lane there is always the shoulder, if you are in the center lane, you typically have someone on both sides. At least have the balls to admit, you drive in the center lane because you are to lazy or incompetent to change a lane every now and then, or you do it just to try to piss people off, which don’t work anymore because all you 60 mph trucks do it, so we can stay in the right lane and hammer down with no worries.
To Jose.
Your reply shows that you probably run a lot of california and/or Oregon; because if you ran the states where the speed limit for trucks is 70 – 80 miles an hour, you would know that 4000 miles a week is 110% attainable legally.
A person running those higher speed limit states not at 80 but only at 60 miles an hour average – which gives time for slow-downs …ect..
70 hours x 60 miles an hour – 4200 miles
Yea..I know a person isn’t going to get them miles ALL of the time, but for you to say that a person can not legally run 4000 miles a week without falsifying their logs is total BS. Just because some states make trucks run at 55 miles an hour doesn’t mean all of them do.
So how about before opening your trap and putting a brother down, you put a little more education into your answer.
Jose, how much do you (you, actually out of pocket) pay a month for elogs. How much did it cost YOU to have them installed. I’d be willing to bet not one red cent. Your company says you will run elogs and that’s it. I am an owner operator and run dead legal. Don’t give me that crap about ” if your fighting it, you run illegal” . I am so sick of that argument. I stop at the scales and ask for inspections, do you, or are you scared of the DOT? If you are with elogs that’s fine with me. I’m not telling you to give them up, so don’t tell me what is best for me. I run a regular route, it passes through a town that has four lanes and a turn lane for about 5 miles. The speed limit is 45 mph. The only trucks speeding through this town are the big company trucks on elogs. I see it everyday. I mean, everyday. Folks like you and Jeremy above are an insult to trucking.
He said 3-4k. 3000 in 5 days is only 600/day. 3500 is 700/day. Very doable depending on where you run. I’ve run over 800 in a day in the Midwest and never broke the speed limit or exceeded hours. He didn’t say he did 4000/wk. Probably closer to 3. He just said in the 3-4 range.
Sounds like driving school rhetoric.
OK Mr 26 yrs experience,I do exactly what u say u do every week I choose to.3000-4000 mks we and home every week.yes get 2 days on loads but doesn’t to 2. Full days .only I’m on elogs and do it 100%legal n by the rules
That would be nice if time management was part of every course. When I took the course ($10,000 later) 1st thing the trainer told me was “I not here to teach you to be a truck driver, just to help you pass the driver test, everything else you learn on the road”. There was no classroom time.
Amen, same experience here. My daughter and I took a cdl course with Sage and what a joke. On the first time in the truck we spent about 15 minutes each behind the wheel and we hook up to a trailer and on the road we go. My daughter who had never been in a truck before is driving about 50mph and the trainer says the speed limit is 65mph and she needs to get her speed up. He tells us the same thing you were told ” I’m not here to train you, just help you get your license you will learn how to drive with the carrier you choose”, We lasted a year and then we were out. Not worth it.
Driving school? ????
What about those of us who have never been through a driving school..lots of drivers still out here who manage time
Loads etc that haven’t stepped one foot in a truck driving school! !!!!!!
You said the magic word to this whole problem with accidents on the roads is SCHOOL to many clowns out there that think their hero’s cause they have a CDL but no damn experience on the road while this poor guy thats been driving over 30 40 yrs is getting put out of a job because all this electronics BS. Their never was this many problems or accidents in all my 39 yrs of driving till all this crap started with all these damn CSA rules and electronics BS.of course you’d disagree sitting behind a desk and earning a good fat pay check and not worry about having to pay your bills maybe they should put a Qualcomm on your desk and see how it affects your paycheck.
This industry is much too diverse to say a one size fits all. Clearly you’ve never owned your own company and obviously don’t have your own authority. What if you load somewhere and they take half the day to load you. You already made a commitment to have that load there the following morning. If you don’t deliver they will find someone else next time. Trust me. They don’t care why you’re late. You’re late! And we will find someone else next time. This industry is cause and affect. If I am delayed through no fault of my own I still have to make that delivery. It’s my reputation and future business on the line. I can’t imagine you would understand this. You’re a one dimensional driver who only sees your section of the industry. If you’re late it must be that you planned your trip poorly. It’s obvious you’re fresh out of driving school and don’t fully understand what you are saying because that’s the foolish rhetoric they preach. Or maybe you picked it up from your safety guy. Either way it doesn’t coincide with reality.
Seems to me that y’all are looking at this the wrong way . Loads are loads. The price of a load is dictated by what a company/ owner operator is willing to haul said load for. Less drivers, less illegal over limits driving pushes up competition. Which pushes up the driver pay. I have been driving local now for 2 years after spending 16 years OTR. Nothing like making 55k a year working Monday thru Friday, home every night
You a right 100%
Jeremy, your answer show us that you just don’t drive a truck. You thinking is true from the point of view of a theoretician… but over the road, in the real world the things are going different!…
Sorry Jeremy but I must disagree. The problem I see with ELD’s is the mandate and hos. You can mandate something all day long, that doesn’t mean people can afford it. Equipment costs, monthly charges, more holes that need to drilled in the dash maintaining the equipment. That money has to come from somewhere. Soon owner-operators will get to point to where they’ll be lucky if they can’t take home 25% of what they earn. As far as company drivers, all these regulations, not just from the FMCSA mind you, is the excuse companies use for not paying employees more, shrinking benefits, buy equipment that is less driver friendly and fewer driver amenities. So you’ve lost money there. Hos, it’s obvious how you lose money there. But let me give you this example. If I have to shut down at 12 noon, then I’m good to go at 10 pm. Well I just wasted 10 hrs because I wouldn’t be sleepy. I wish I could snap my fingers and pass right out into a deep sleep at anytime But I would need an additional 2, 3, 4 hrs. What company is going to stand for that. By your question “do you not sleep during your 10 he break?”, you sound as though if you were my boss you’d fire me. How do tell a driver with 26 years experience, no accidents, impeccable work history never a late load that’s been my fault and I’ve never even used an alarm clock. I listened to my body. I’m willing to bet that Im as safe if not safer than a driver on ELD’s. Look around these ELD companies are still having accidents. Now, I’m late with loads and now I must use an alarm clock. It’s all about money, control and surveillance. By the way as I mentioned before I have 26 years experience but I don’t consider myself a seasoned veteran. My hat goes off to the drivers that have been out here 30, 40, even 50+ years. And I’d like to thank the ones who helped me get my start and hopefully I’ll make it to their level.
OK ,bottom line,we all have 14 to do 11 and a required10 off after 11 driving.I’m good with either e or paper and I do think independent ,o o should have the choice to use either they want.company drivers ,just deal with it .if u are a real driver then u can get your 3000 plus a week,dispatcher allowing that is.
I guess Jeremy never hear of “road construction” and “accidents” and “traffic backups” and “breakdowns”. I would love to drive in his fantasy world. I bet they pay the driver decent wages there too.
Working hard and long hours does not cause accident. Reckless driving is the major cause of accidents. It happens every day, tailgating in fast lane, 80 mph in fog, rain, snow. I love driving and like to make money so driving more than 11 hrs a day is not a problem for me but I am forced to drive 11. I used to work in construction for 15, 16 hrs/day without problem. It’s all politics. Democrats want to keep your earning down to bridge the income gap. Look at CA now. Politicians all want to grow the economy but limit our earning with regulations. Those that drive recklessly should be punished by traffic laws and their own actions should weed themself out and not to drag down the whole industry .
sometimes 10h are not enough to get 8h of sleep or in canada we only 8h. so if im having a shower at night and breakast and getting ready and all that goodness in the morning when its all set and done i only get 6h of sleep and my company will be on my case that i start driving after 8h again
School?? Did you just get out ??? Drive for 10 years or more then flap your jaws in this page !!!
exactly, elogs don’t consider the fact that everyone has different biological clocks/ we are not robots. Everyone has their own sleeping habits. Some are rested in 7 hrs, and some may need 8. The fact is that we are not robots. You can’t just sit behind a desk somewhere in Washington and know that a trucker is now well rested so he/she should drive now.
The fact is many would prefer to take 2 5 hr breaks per 24 hrs or something similar because many sleep well for 4 or hrs and are ready to go for about 8 hrs +-. Something like 5 off followed by then allowing 7 on followed by 5 off would work for many.
Then fight the regulations in place now, they are the problem, not whether you log it electronically or manually. If the OOIDA was fighting to change the regulations, then I’d be happy to support them, as it is, they are fighting to help their members break the rules… how dumb is that?
Not exactly, they are not fighting eld’s, just the mandate.
That is a good point. I think they should change the 14 to 16 or 18. You can still only drive 11 but you have more time to do it. There are plenty of business owners out here who work 16-18 hours a day..every day!! Why can’t we. If everything goes without a hitch I get parked up in 11-13 hours. If not I can work an 18 hour day. Either way I have time to do my job and keep my customers happy.
How many times has shippers and recieve ing left drivers sitting dor hours especially u.s steel there the problems for sure
The E log rule has built in penalties for shippers and receivers who leave drivers sitting
BS.
hahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now that there is funny!
Very true
Once you log in you gotta go
Uh, no! Do you have any idea how e-logs work?
Explain it.
i observed 5 accident for the last 2 years, all were elds, now who do i trust???
I’m trying to keep an open mind on this. We too are getting ELD’s. I told our new Safety guy, “if I can’t make the same money as I’m making now, I will have to reconsider my career”. Hauling meat and produce with multiple picks, and heavy traffic slowing me down, I don’t see it being possible to make good money. I will try it.
I lost $1000-$1500 a week as an owner. They are not worth it. I too hauled meat and produce with multiple stops.
Then you did not do it legal if you lost money
How do you know he didn’t ?
If you think what is legal is what is right, you are a moron.
Take it from me, I’ve hauled refrigerated both ways and i promise you will not make the same money.
Tim, go ahead and start looking. I didn’t have city traffic but I had multiple stop runs and started with the company on paper logs then forced onto blogs. It cost me about $600 a week. Because I would finish a delivery and wouldn’t have enough time to make it to the next store where I could sleep. It would take three days to do a 2 day run.
You couldn’t do it legal before then
I too haul refrigerated products. Sometimes I just have to make my trip/day longer. Do I like it, no. I still get my job done. All this is doing is making the driver safer to haul freight. I wish all these guys would quit crying. They aren’t going to change things.
If the FMCSA thinks this adds to safety they need to go to any truck stop fuel island and watch how fast the drivers with ELDs drive and they may rethink this! But that would be common sense and after all this is our government we are talking about !!!!!
I agree speeding through truck stops because of that electronic clock. I ease through the truck stops and never speed. These guys driving for these ATA companies fly through truck stops and construction zones. Elogs and governing trucks at 62 is the problem.
I have been one logs for going on five years now. The only thing slogs have helped me do is drive fatigued. While I was on paper logs I could rest when needed. I know it was cheating but the fact is I could stop the 14 hour clock and still rest when I needed to.
I have heard this from other drivers. I too like to take nap now and then. Yea, I may cheat a bit on my paper, but I’m being safe by napping because I’m tired. I also notice drivers in 55mph states speeding-because their on ELD. Their pressed for time and trying to make $$.
You can still nap, have you heard of the split sleeper rule? The way your comment reads you need to learn how to use it. As for the 55 mph states, you did exactly 55 going through them while you were on paper? I bet you didn’t, whether I was using paper or electronic, I was 3 to 5 over the posted speed limit same as everyone else.
Can you explain to me the split sleeper rule and how to do it ? Can’t find it on Fmc website. Thanks.
We use to be able to split our logs anyway we wanted. I use to take a nap every day. Hours of service laws; took my nap away.
Maybe you guys should read up on the split sleeper berth rule. Or if you get tired during the day, pull over and take a nap, if your dispatch has a problem with that maybe y’all should start recording your phone calls or take pics of the messages you send over the computer.
E-logs make me press harder to make time commitments. With the clock ticking, I feel more pressure and I’m always strategically planning on how to take a break and make my destination, safely. Breaks? What breaks?
Mark, I’ve tried to work as if I’m using ELD. I’ve found, at least with most of our shippers and receivers, you can’t sleep on their property. Therefore, I had to start my 14 hour clock early by leaving from a truck stop then waiting for them to load/unload me. This, killing 2+ hours.
Thank you everyone for your thoughts. I’ve never used an ELD. I do feel this is going to smash owner/operators. Our government is really messed up..
Missed up YES! ! They don’t care about us owner Operator small business owners we are the biggest part of this industry when we are gone look out America
That’s why they are pressing for Elogs, it will help eliminate the O/O. The big trucking companies have lobbyists in Congress. They can’t compete with the O/O one on one so they will work to get regulations and laws passed that will eventually put the O/O out of business.
the elog takes my bathroom away. instead of sleeping at a truck stop then driving over and keep slepping as they unload me which would start my 14h window i now sleep in loading docks, doors opened paperwork glued to the pallets tellin the recievers to note wake me up till they are done. and then the 14hs start as i pull outta there
I think its sad that they feel eld will make the world safier bc u have a simple contradiction carriers and shipper want to put all the stress on drivers I mean u can fix the problem by allowing for split sleeper berth and doing away with the 14 hr rule bc a driver day consists of delivering between 6_ 10 am and trying to load but it ends up most drivers loading between 12_ 4pm then having to 4 to 6 hundred miles away by morning to start another day eld wont prevent the want are the need for this.
I have been on E logs for about two years now and switched over from paper… I absolutely love it… I make the same amount of money if not more…I get the proper rest and relaxation… And feel healthier all around
What type trailer do you pull. Do you run dedicated routes or do you load at different shippers every day. Do you run the Midwest or the northeast? All of these things make a difference. Its not a one size fits all. It may fit into your company model but that doesn’t mean it will fit into everyone’s.
Bill, you may as well be speaking French. It works for him but not for everybody. He thinks every run is the same no matter what you haul.
my friend must sleep for 2 hours, after a 4 hour driving, such a body, what to do?
Everybody hates E logs before they even try it… if you have to sit in that seat 20 hours of the day and run illegally… Go ahead… But not for me… Don’t knock it before you try it
I’ve been on E-logs 3 yrs now. It’s a lie to say it does not impact your life, if you are hauling general freight OTR.
I have been using them and I hate them…..not because if the log itself but because if the ignorant laws they enforce.
I bet I sit in that seat less then you. The thing I love is the guy who is parked next to me who gets up and sits for 3 hours waiting for his 10 to expire before he can roll out. Meanwhile I’m just as rested as him and 100 miles down the road by the time he rolls out. You know what that equals? I’m parked up 2 hours before him at the end of the day. Think about that for a minute.
My gosh, you meat, produce and dry boxers think this is bad for you… When you carry OD loads, you have curfews around nearly every city in the U.S. And you can’t really go by your 11 hour rule especially during the winter as the days are shorter, because I can’t drive during the night. So what that means is one has to exceed speed limits to get around a city or to attempt to find a truck stop, or shut down earlier to ensure a parking space.
This being said, you guys don’t have near the restrictions we have, so ELD’ S are worse for us. Try living in our world and having an ELD, that’ll give you something to bitch about!
ELDs is why I gave up Flat bed. I know what you are talking about.
I feel for you guys. There just going to make your life that much more dangerous.
Absolutey! I’m flat too and haul some OD. I know exactly what you are saying.
E-Logs forces us to drive even when we’re tired!! Also, you can loose many hours On Duty sitting and waiting in Traffic, or Waiting to Load or Unload!! When you’re out of hours 14* And the truck is in the Shop, they often take the truck for a test drive and that will put you in Violation also!! In what other Industries are people Forced to Sleep, Break, or Rest!!
Ever hear about logging off the E.L.D to sleep when you are tired? I’ve done it, never ran out of hours.
How did you stop your 14 hr clock?
What does any of what you just posted have to do with E logs. If you drove legal on paper it would look the same as your E log
Electronic logs, or “smart logs”, are used in home construction. They will reduce energy costs and improve quality of life. CEO Tim Reid of Advanced Homes was quoted as saying, “Smart Log technology is something I’ve been interested in for a while now.” These are exciting times to be alive. God bless the United States of America.
You have no clue in what you are talking about
It’s my opinion both as a truck driver (5 years) and a paramedic (16 years) that the only reason not to have one is if you want to run illegal. An E-log will get you out of a speeding ticket, make doing taxes easier, and keep your travel agent from pushing you down the road even when he knows you’re out of hours but you’re on paper logs. When I worked for Heyl I was on E-logs and never once got harassed. They usually called me about an hour before I was out of time to tell me to look for parking in case I wasn’t paying attention.
I hope you know more about being a paramedic than you do about trucking ’cause you don’t know jack about trucking. If you don’t, keep your hands off me.
That’s funny . E logs are bs it puts you on someone else’s schedule and that in itself is bad for driving.
Wake up. You Dont know what your talking about. It won’t get you out of a speeding ticket. If your speeding, your speeding.
Is it fair that you start your truck up, drive 1/2 mile to get loaded, sit there for five hours waiting to be loadedloaded and then it takes another two to three hours to actually get loaded and secured and loose 8 hours of your 14 hour day because you started your truck up and drove it 1/2 mile to get loaded. Dont tell me it doesn’t happen. I’ve been there. And I haven’t been in the industry 5 years. I’ve been in it since 1977.
Well said Larry. Exactly why Elogs are BS.
You are so right Larry then you get to a shipper and they kill let’s say 5 hrs left and tell you once loaded get off there property or they will call the police. At a need to look in to that
Yes, there is a certain amount of flexibility with paper…no doubt about it.
I’ve been in positions of using paper and have been bullied by my various dispatchers to drive when beyond tired. The E-Log has kept that from happening. That being said, there have been a few occassions where I had to sit all day, awake, and then asked to drive all nite when I was clearly tired, but the E-log said I had hours available and therefore expected to drive. One cannot just lay down and snooze cuz the machine says you’re not driving. The companies cannot just turn a man off & on like a machine.
I have the same thing happen every week and with this slow Prime truck it’s only 65mph regardless of speed limits in most occasions because of sitting at shippers all day awake listing to when they call you
So tell me this. Lets say you are about 1.5 hour away from home and just like that in 30 minutes your 36 hours restart kicks in. That means you will sleep 36 hours in your truck 1 hour away from home right. You have to stay legal ifni am correct.
Yes that also happens but I drive anyway, our Elogs have an off duty serve line that suppose to only be used when you’re not under dispatch and not pulling a trailer, so if you deliver and have to leave a property with no over nite parking, you are in violation
First off Wojciech… your 36 hours don’t start on their own, in your situation, you would have to sleep in your truck 10 hours, not 36… how dumb are you? Maybe you should learn the regulations before commenting.
I am still trying to find a 36 hour restart I usually just get a 34
You don’t have a clue rookie. It’s has nothing to do with safety it is about control and you just proved that by your statement about the company calling you.
Exactly lol
Maybe drivers like you need that kind of babysitting…I don’t! They’ve successfully co ditionsd you new guys to accept and even expect this kind of micromanagement. Sad
I disagree, and Im a 19 year Policemen and a 6 year truck driver. E logs are for lazy drivers with poor time management. I’ve been running paper logs for the entire time I have been driving and I haven’t cheated logs. E logs forces a driver to drive hard with against a clock that’s why you see so many drivers flying down the highways racing the clock. Paper logs allow you to break if needed without the pressure of a clock race.
10-4 police man
Not true at all. The only difference between paper and a elog is one forces you legal. You have the exact same amount of time on both if you are running completely legal.
If you run legal now, meaning you log as you drive, then what difference does it make whether you log your hours manually or electronically? The rules haven’t changed, it’s still the same rules, so what’s the difference?
Agreed
They work great if you do drop and hook what about the small man who doesn’t drop and hook or in my case we can’t! We live load and unload. Just cause it works for one doesn’t mean it does for others. If I park at a truck stop 5 miles from my pick up on elogs it would trip my computer and then I’d be stuck on duty while they load me which times takes 5-10 hours. Why should I have to log that when who’s to say I wasn’t back in the sleeper resting more?
All I’m saying is that it shouldn’t be illegal to drive from the TS to your shipper/receiver. Even on paper, if you get inspected & the officer knows their stuff, you get busted.
You can edit all information on the elog though apart from the driving time though can`t you ? Would this not be an option to allocate the time appropriately ?
No. Your 14 hr clock is running
Could you not use 2 hours of your off duty time whilst being loaded then you only need 8 later ? At least you`d be losing 2 hours less – I think the onus will be on the companies to plan the work better or their driver turnover is gonna be ridiculous
You can edit the log to show you`re in the sleeper if you need to as long as the wheels aren`t turning
Yes I agree! and I am a truck driver. If you arent breaking the law you don’t have trouble with the logs. And for people who say they like to take naps been taken out if your tire in your company can’t force you to drive and if you get in trouble for that they’re breaking the law
Running ‘ illegal’ is a relative term …I personally don’t need the govt intrusion ..and frankly ..any IDIOT knows when he needs to pull over if he/she is fatigued .. the hours of service rules are BS …and does nothing but interrupt commerce ..another fine example of the govt’s attempt to make things better for all of us ..
Lol. Are you sure you have5 years? There is a difference between wanting to run illegal and wanting to run safe and make money. The only idiots I see running over the speed limit on construction zones and parking lots are the ones with the elds. Look up the facts before you voice your opinion. Most construction semi related accidents are caused by governed I trucks running elds. Most parking lot accidents and fatalities in parking lots are directly related to drivers on elds. Ect ect. The list goes on. Read ooida’s web page some time and get the real facts.
I can tell by the way you write you was and never will be a trucker let alone a paramedic
All the above are absolutely correct. Your money WILL be affected in a negative way and eLogs FORCE drivers to drive making finding places to park after an 11 hour drive difficult beyond belief. Also, I was more alert during long drives thanks to being able to get in a power nap once in a while. ELogs made those ‘a thing of the past’. ELogs were created from nothing more than a great big Ego! No room in the industry for those whom have no clue! And eLogs installed for ‘safety’ reasons – get real! There are many of us whom can drive our rigs more safely with our eyes closed than what an eLog could ever provide. The entire project is nothing more than bully tactics. To get rid of a bully one must beat him around his own game!
Ok look here I ran ELog for almost a year. It does exactly as ooida says. But as a real driver I learned how to make it work for me. I however do not agree with them. As far as the guy in the construction industry. Dude you have no idea what your talking about. Go OOIDA!!!!
We’ve had E-Logs for 5 years now. No biggie. I don’t feel pressured any more than I did when I ran on paper. Our trucks run teams 100% of the time and it’s actually simplified our paperwork. That being said, I don’t believe it’s the job of the Federal government to mandate E-Log installation. If an employer wants E-Loggers installed, fine. It’s their truck, their cargo and their call. If an O/O doesn’t want one in his or her new rig, that’s fine too.
Elogs work good for teams but a 1 person operation, not so well
Has anyone actually published a survey of truck accidents in the past five years to include how many of these trucks involved were operating with the ELD?
I know that from what accidents I have seen on the highway, most were the large company’s who operate with the ELD.
I am an owner/operator and was leased to a company who was requiring the use of the ELD. I found that I was driving more fatigued because of the device than I was using paper logs. I changed companies solely for that reason.
Besides…. If I’m an hour and a half from the house, I don’t want to stop for 10 hours just because some stupid computer is going to put me in violation when, if I DO get tired I can pull over and take a half hour nap to be refreshed well enough to get home.
And what about 1999 and older trucks? OK for them to stay on paper logs? Where is that fair? Do I need to sell my new truck, buy an old one to stay in business?
Are they making taxi drivers, bus drivers, limo drivers, etc. install ELD’s? They are a commercial vehicle?
What about Law Enforcement? They can legally operate double shifts (16 hours) and moonlight at construction zones? That state trooper writing you up for driving over hours may have been behind the wheel longer than you!
I’m just saying…….
That Wal-Mart driver had E-log and Bendix and still fell asleep & wrecked
That Walmart driver your referring to drove his personal vehicle 700 miles to his work location then got in his truck and attempted to drive for additional 11 hours without sleep. Not smart!
Technically speaking though, he was legal.
Tony, wtf are you talking about!? “Travel agent” !?! I can’t speak for all truck drivers, but I for one am not out here on “vacation”! I’m out here to support my family and E-logs tend to restrict a certain amount of “movement “, if you will ! E logs are just another way for ” big brother” to keep tabs on us and it’s bull crap! If we are going to be forced to use E logs than companies should have to pay more, because they do restrict your ability to make the same money as paper logs!
Seriously? The only reason not to do elogs is because you want to run illegal? Well let me tell ya this, my husband ran elogs and was harrassed every time he turned around by dispatch. It didn’t matter if he was tired if he still even a few minutes left on his clock they’d tell him to run it out. You have hours to drive you drive. Elogs, so NOT help you with taxes, that’s just basic business knowledge. I worked doing taxes for a living and even did,my husband’s. Elogs are not accurate on mileage or anything else for,that matter. They do nothing but dictate when a driver can sleep, rest, eat or even take a piss. A driver knows his body and knows when he is tired and needs to stop for rest. A driver knows how to tell time and knows when hes,driven his 11 hrs out, don’t need the govt dictating every step you make. My hubby now does paper logs and it’s a lot less stress, sleeps better, and still runs legally.
Amen..
There’s no difference if you’re logging correctly. Elogs just do it automatically for you. You just have to push which status you want to be in. If you’re running correctly, elogs should benefit you, rather than hurt you. Its the same 14hrs, same 70hrs and same 11hrs. And yes, I am a truck driver. Been on both sides.
I’m still banging the same drum. E-logs wouldn’t be as big as an issue if hours of service laws worked more in our favore. We argue against them because we can’t lie anymore with them. So why do we have to lie in order to drive alert? Because the rules are the problem.
So, what I’m taking from the majority of the comments here is that many would rather run illegal on paper logs? Ok. And what happens when some blue hair drives under your trailer, and winds up crushed under your rear tandems, no fault of yours, other than you’re over on your 11 or 14? Prison. No thanks. I’ll stick with my elogs. I don’t have to worry about corporate pressure to run illegal. Your actual mileage may differ…
Paper logs are not illegal sir or madam
Who said anything about running illegal? If it takes you 7 hours to load but you only parked 5 miles from your pick up, why should I have to start my log to go sit again?
Because you drive on a public road. You must be on the drive line. That’s the law.
That is the law whether you`re on paper logs or elog so how many people are working illegally and logging illegally is more than apparent from the comments on here – don`t complain about the elogs, campaign against the regulations which are the same however you log your hours
Sir may I refer you to the current case of Tracy Morgan.
If you think you will never have to run illegal on e-logs you are fooling yourself. Traffic, weather, and slow customers are still going to be there causing the same delays as before. The only difference is now they can catch you when your are forced to drive past your limit.
I have been on e logs for six months now and at first I hated it, mainly because of all the issues everyone has posted. My solution was lease on to a better paying company one that pays more than $2.50 a mile, plan your trips better, and find out if your stop has overnight parking that way your load and unload time is off duty. I bring home about $1.000 a week less, but I do not have to worry about weigh stations, accidents, fines, lawsuits, or prison and yes all are possible if you cheat just by one hour on one day, even if it was five days prior to your incident.
You should still be concerned about about all the above. Even on E-logs you will find yourself in violation eventually. You can be fined. If they come to audit or get involved in an accident, they can go back as far as they want.
Dario, you do have to worry about DOT, lawsuits, and even prison. You also said you lost 50,000 dollars a year. And you like elogs ??
So you are fine with taking a $40k plus pay cut per year. Good for you. I guess I might be too if I was getting over $2.50 per mile but that’s bs.
You keep thinking your safe with elogs, and they’ll protect you.
Who is going to pay for these eld,s ? I understand they have a monthly fee , they don’t turn off and drain your batteries , how much to they cost to install? FMCSA mandates it they should pay ALL COST to the driver or company if not I’ll take the fine and stay on paper D.O.T doesn’t even know how to read them , again more money spent on training , IDIOT’S
You may want to educate yourself before babbling all those false statements.
They do turn off after the set idle time has been reached, the DOT can read them, in fact, if they want to see your logs, you simply send it to them.
Just more excuses to drive illegal is all I see from your comments.
My husband has drove for 25 years now. We’ve tried both paper and elogs and I agree hr was more tired on elogs because they pushed him harder. Now we run rgn and only drive daylight hours but I personally think the elogs are going to be a pain more than they are worth. He doesn’t have to run illegal just because he’s on paper logs and don’t. But if he gets tired he don’t have to run so he don’t loose time on a computer.our agreement was never drive tired and we don’t. Also we are going to be owning our own truck soon so who is going to pay for this thing? Its going to cut the industry bad. Not all paper logs make an illegal driver
Hey Charlie, wake me up when you get that answer. I should be able to get a 10 hr break in before you do.
I don’t know about that Jeremy. Seems it would work the same way a stereo would. A powered memory wire that takes a low current to hold your presets or settings.
The battery drain is negligible, but they can be unplugged. I used to unplug mine every night to avoid racking up idle time. (Yes, they can monitor that too. And speeding, hard braking, etc.)
I got a ticket once for false log because I got stuck behind an accident just before my 14 was going to run out. I put it on off-duty and unplugged it until I could get to a truck stop. Later that week my logs got checked at a weigh station. It showed me going off duty at one location and comming back on duty at another. On e-logs you are always guilty of something. It’s just a matter of what and when.
Isn’t it amazing how truck drivers run out of hours in traffic?? But they never run out when there heading home !! Lol
Yes of course we do, and for the exact same reasons.
If everyone noticed in the article. It said all trucks in the United States. Does that mean Mexican operated trucks from mexico Are going to be exempt from the eld laws? If so! Then that is favoritism! And misuse of the political system. To force Americans to quit so the rich man can get his cheap labor and avoid the federal eld laws and regulations.
It depends on the eld used. They work no matter what. No you don’t have to pay a monthly subscription fee. Only mayor fleets or larger fleets use those. And yes they can be powered down when the truck is not used. It will update when the system powers back up. There are some that are owner operator spec. And they do come as a diy setup. Just plug it into the service port and turn it on. Many of the elds. Can be downloaded via a USD cable. A few have a built in printer to print out the log sheets. I personal think all elds must come installed with a built in printer. Makes it easier to get a copy of logs for tax and drivers record keeping reasons.
E-logs will definitely cut the pay of a driver. If you or your company are not 100% drop and hook then you will loose money due to loading and unloading times at the shippers and receivers. There are no sanctions place on them for taking extra time to load or unload you so you and your e-logs are at their mercy. Traffic and accidents are another factor not to mention weather. I’ve been in situations after starting my 14 where I was at a customer getting loaded for 5.5 hours and a 2.5 hour delay in traffic. Even though I was in the sleeper for most of that 5.5 the time still counted against my 14 hrs and finally into my weekly pay because I ended up being a day behind for the week. This happens a lot in this industry. E-logs are anti friendly to the driver. It will not solve much of anything but it will drive a lot of companies out of business (mainly the smaller ones) and cause a lot of drivers to leave the industry that is already at a major shortage now.
It is truly a bad idea. The shoppers will find out first how bad it will be. The math doesn’t lie. There is already a shortage of drivers & the new drivers have a longer learning curve & since we are coming out of a recession. Drivers will want to run, but the clock will stop them. They will jump from company to company. More owner operators will lose their trucks. And fewer owner operators will join fleets. Because the revenue will drop. Sometimes you might have a repair that takes 1 hour. But if your on that elog you better pray that their is no long line & the mechanic is super fast. That’s just 1 example. Been driving for 20 yrs. Out of all the changes I’ve seen this is by far the worst. And like most of the government changes. They have to go back & repeal it. We must push back hard guys!!!! This is our careers on the line.
Is it too late to push against the hours of service? So that we are not lieing on paper or have that box make noise and flash red.
Where is this shortage of drivers? If there was a shortage of drivers, we would see rates increase because shippers would have to compete for the trucks that are on the road. That isn’t happening.
no all elogs do is put the bigger companys bigger. And run the smaller companies out. They put flight down under running cost and they still did not do it and put use out.Elogs will ruin the industry for the smaller companies..They want control on what ya do an it will not be a saftey measure, if they would hold the shippers and delivery places responsible for putting truckers behind on their deliveries then ya would see safety change.It is nothing but a money maker for companies that are larger then 100 trucks,, what people fail to see is the smaller trucking outfits can not afford to put elogs in every truck. On another note,where is parking going to come from if people tell you it is time to park? there sint enough space now, are they willing to buy places to make extra parking? the industry is starting to go south on rates of the freight and it is only going to get worse if small trucking companies are ran out of buisness by the greedy over sized companies.
E log..haaa..There is no safty in mind just $$ for someone..Most are commenting on the coercion aspect..If you work for a company that pulls crap like that then its time to move..If you haul freigjt(ex reefer guys) plan for the extra down time,its almost expected..Your the driver,you make the decision to go or not,run longer or not..You as the driver have the power NOT dispatch or company owner..If you get hasseled buy a device to record phone conversations and your covered..
With the clock not stopping now on paper we are still in the same boat as e logs but just held to a different standard of honesty..If anyone were to have an accident and lawyer digs enough he can still find out what the trucks been doin via ecu and qualcomm,cell phone…Hell if need be your points card from the flyin j/petro/ta can rat you out…I dont want elds but we are still being tracked as is..I can go on and on but its mostly been said already..Oh last point…Elds are just taken work away from the dot and or cops is all..Safty..lol its bs..Its all about the $$ thats floating around the trucking industry..
Because we are saying that we don’t like E-logs because we can’t hide breaking the law; only makes a bigger argument for E-logs.
Mule …the laws are flawed ..that’s the point …I and most here protest the govt intrusion into the industry …we don’t need the govt telling us when I can and cannot drive …as I said earlier …any idiot knows when he/she is tired and should pull over .. all DOT is doing is getting in the way with HOS rules …the mandated eLogs are one step further away from freedom of movement and greater govt control over earning potential …but …should not be an issue …the govt knows all …I mean …look how they have they have enhanced the health care industry and the VA ..and the IRS ..and the EPA ..and the …etc etc ..
10-4 Mark
I have run log books since 1976. I run them straight and legal. I do not kiss the a@@ of a dispatcher or company and run illegal. I do not “tweak” my log books to extend my running time. DOT officers usually know where the construction sites and other traffic delays have been and can calculate from Point A to Point B where you should be able to have gotten to. I have had one (1) speeding ticket since I started driving a car in 1972 and a CMV in late 1976. My CSA score is squeaky clean. So people that are arguing that they are a good thing, “IF YOU LIKE HAVING A PROCTOSCOPE UP YOUR A@@, AND AGREE THAT THEY ARE NECESSARY, THEN YOU ARE A DUMBOCRAT SHEEPLE”!!!!!! AND A STEARING WHEEL HOLDER, THAT CAME OUT OF THE PUPPY MILL TRAINING SCHOOLS OF THE TRUCKING INDUSTRY. Me, if and when they are mandated, I will jump out of my truck and put a driver in it.
Typical of government. Enforcing laws that don’t work.
If they would do away with the 14 hour rule, elogs would be great. Until then, the logs tell you when you have to rest and everyone knows that isn’t always possible. I prefer to drive a few hours and take a quick nap, that way I’m always on my game and if I know I’m gonna hit rush hour traffic, I can take some time out and start back up once traffic clears and I’m well rested.
Now who in the FMCSA couldn’t go along with that?
We need everyone on board to simply refuse. If we all took a stand they could do nothing. I have been using elogs also. I never felt more stress, and pressure in over 25 years driving. Elogs are dangerous.
That’s a good idea, but there are too many Joses’ and Jeremys’ out there to believe in individual rights.
Everybody says that this is a free country. Yeah right. I don’t understand why the government has to make it so hard for people to make a living. Electronic logs are all about government control nothing more nothing less. I don’t know what proof they have To show that electronic logs are safer. When these studies were conducted nobody ever called me to be a participant
I agree.
I bet we all know that one driver who has been up for 18 hours on 5 hours of sleep, would you be ok with your family driving past him when that driver falls asleep.
E-logs don’t tell you how long a driver has been awake or how long he has slept.
Who says that taking a nap instead of driving fatigued is illegal? I say its smart…there are many laws that just dont make sense and they DO get changed. Trucking Associations should come up with a solution that fits instead of waiting for lawmakers to play politics with the industry.
This is ridiculous.
As many have pointed out, ELOGs just make it more dangerous by forcing you to drive. I used to run oilfield hot shot and sometimes, I needed to stop for a couple of hours to take a quick power nap towards the end of the line. Had I been running ELOGs, I would have ran outta my 14 hours by taking that nap and had I continued driving, I would have ran off the road.
Another example is being “forced” to run that would benefit from a little bit of logbook fudging: Say you’ve been driving as a solar powered OTR for three months. Dispatch tells you to nap it out, you will be picking up a load around 11pm and you are gonna be driving through the night. Of course, the first few nights are gonna be rough as you try to try to acclimate to driving when you have normally been sleeping. You’ve got a tight schedule and it’s doable, but around 4am, you are bumping the zipper line and have to slap yourself to stay awake. Can you go take a quick nap? Nope. You’ll be late. May as well drive dangerous so you can keep your schedule.
I miss the road, but it’s crap like this that makes me glad that I had an opportunity to experience it when it was fun and you could make a decent living.
Hate to rain on any OOIDA parade, as I’m both a longtime member and a big fan, but unless I’m missing something here, this claim that e-logs cause or promote in any way drivers driving MORE than with paper, presumably against their will, is wrongheaded. It’s stupid for OOIDA to use this line of reasoning because for it to make any sense, one has to assume that drivers are powerless, robotic peons forced to do anything their boss tells them to. This is a needlessly confining, false picture that OOIDA should never be painting—especially when there are so many other reasons, all legitimate, that e-logs are so bad for pretty much everyone except the e-log industry!
As everyone already knows, the main problem with e-logs is they routinely PREVENT the driver from driving for no legitimate reason. As a result, they frequently occasion predicaments a driver would never have to face with paper. It’s as simple as that OOIDA…please Keep It Simple Stupid.
Don`t they prevent the driver from driving once he`s reached his maximum hours ? Is that not a legitimate reason ?
The same kind of system has been in place in the UK since 2007 and it was brought in because drivers were bending the rules on a similar paper type recording system. This is something that has been brought on by drivers behaving irresponsibly and expecting to make rock star wages. Truck driving is unskilled labour and as such, pays very well so anybody complaining they`re not getting rich(living beyond their means) should have studied harder at school. There`s nothing you can`t do with an elog that you could do with a paper log so whats the issue ? you can still split a break etc and all information can be edited apart from your driving time so can one of you who is bitching about this tell me – if its not about over running your hours and working legally then what`s the problem – i`m not having a pop at anyone but i`m finding it hard to understand what your issue is ?
Another puppy mill driver heard from. Which puppy mill did you graduate from? Swift, Werner, England, Prime, Schneider, JB Hunt. These are the companies that give you minimal training on a lot, put you out with a trainer for as little as 21 days and then put you in your own truck. Maybe after you have been on your own for 30 – 45 days then they call you in and tell you that you are going to be a trainer for a year or two. This is “THE BLIND LEADING THE BLIND”. Beside being shown in the puppy mill of driver training how to fill out a log book, have you ever used a log book for any real period of time??? Doubtful.
You know nothing about my past so i`d appreciate less of the condescending attitude, having 23 years of experience in Canada and Europe i`ve probably forgotten more about transport than you`ll ever know. You wonder why people think truck drivers are assholes – take a look in the mirror your attitude stinks !!
Unskilled labor? Are you a moron? Pays very well? Are you a moron?
I believe the people that think e logs will work compare us to a electric motor with a timer on it.Turn it on and when the timer goes off, it turns off.
On the bright side of it .The e logs will make us maybe more skilled instead of the unskilled labor we are .Skilled labor requires so many hours of education to keep a license in force.It may raise our wages and give us benefits . It may stop all the wild things we do today.
It will remove the rebels etc from our workforce that years ago in the 70’S the drug tests accomplished.(Iam one of them).
Hopefully we can all conform to the new standards.
I have E-log but under the current law, would be loving paper right now. I delivered @ my final stop this morning @ 3. I’m out of hours in Brooklyn until13:00. I’m parked on the side of the road. I can’t get a good rest because I may have to move my truck and as the other trucks come to make their delivery; there’s way too much noise. If I was on paper, I would break the law & find a better spot to sleep.
you did not manage your time correctly and that got you in the situation you are in, parked on the side of the road. take your lumps and blame nobody but yourself dude. elogs do not force you into bad situations, your poor time management will though.
Dude. You don’t know what you are talking about. I started my day. Drove straight to shipper. I didn’t stop. Drove straight to first stop. Only stopping twice less than five minutes each. Drove straight to final stop. I got here @ two. Only having thirty minutes left of my fourteen and two hrs of my eleven. Place opens up at three. Hrs are three to seven.
You are an ignorant person, Jeremy. If elogs don’t make me leave this business, people like you will. You think you are perfect and God’s gift to trucking. Unreal.
Ever heard of this thing called a “traffic backup”. I guess those don’t happen in your La La land.
I believe the law allows you to travel to the nearest safe place on line 1 as long as you are unladen. Might check local laws first though
Nope, a while back there was a story about a woman who unloaded at a govt warehouse. They held her too long and she ran out of time. The warehouse told her to leave, she called the FMCSA and they told it was illegal to move the truck.
If you are not under dispatch you are allowed what they call a line five. This allows you to drive to a safe haven, If I am under dispatch I just drive some where safe, when I’m parked Ill call dispatch and let them know, as long as you have a good excuse and don’t make it a habit you will be OK.
Look up, or ask you safety supervisor about “Personal Conveyance”
You don’t understand. I am parked at the nearest place. I just got woken up for the fourth time is all. I’d prefer to drive to a big TS or rest area.
Also doing that mean you have to restart the ten hr clock. I’m awake now. I get to drive in twenty minutes.
You cannot log personal conveyance if you are pulling a trailer, loaded or MT.
It may be “breaking the law” but the “law” shouldn’t be writen like it is in the first place. The point of driving 5 miles and restarting you of duity time is a joke. Let’s stop at a receiver and they will not let you stay on the property so you drive down the road to sit for 5 hours for them to get you in. You drive 9 hours to get there so now you can’t move. So now you have to sit to reset your clock. Then you go to the receiver 5 miles away and they get you in. Your clock just started. 6 hours later your unloaded. Now your hungry and need a shower. You drive an hour to a truck stop and eat and shower and take a break. After all we need a 30 min brake. Now we drive an hour to the shipper. They load us in three hours ( 2 of them you sleep). Now you have about an hour to drive after PTI and BS that is part of trucking. So you start to drive and there is a wreck. You sit in traffic you can move in for two hours. Now LEGALY some one else MUST drive your truck 2 miles up the road to a rest area because your out of time. I’m sorry but that is NOTHING but a joke. There are many possibilities to the HOS not working for everyone safely. I have a medical condition that if I sleep for more than 6 hours I get a migraine but can’t drive yet because of HOS. That makes me totally different than the next guy that can’t function unless he sleeps at least 8 hours. On and on. EVERYONE is different.
Some are hitting the nail on the head. I’ve been in the truck stop since 5 pm yesterday getting plenty of sleep. I’m 10 miles from delivery which delivers at 3 this afternoon. I will spend 3 to 4 hrs back in the sleeper waiting for unload, then drive 15 miles for pickup at 8 tonight and go back into sleeper for a couple more hrs. I’m going to have more time in sleeper than on duty and driving put together. If we could split our time I could get loaded and then drive all night until I get tired. Instead I will be lucky to get a few hundred miles and pray I can find a place to park
1 thing I noticed about the previous comments is the I cheat on my logbook, way to guys keep it up. We are our worst enemy out here. The ONLY reason you drivers don’t want electronic logbook is so you can rip out the page & back up everything you did that day. I did that for 15 yrs & don’t miss it 1 bit. What are you gaining? Is your company paying you a bonus to cheat on your logbook? I doubt it! This is not an invasion of privacy, the little green book says we have to keep record of our hos, doesn’t specify paper or electronic. Again we done it to ourselves out here!
We all lie on the log. We only show on-duty the amount of time we have to. I think it’s better to keep it simple. Log it as you do it and don’t drive fatigued. Throw all the other rules and laws were the sun don’t shine.
It could have kept EZMule from being stuck on the SIDE of the road for 10 HRS.
You must be paid by the hour.
I honestly don’t understand all the fuss over e-logs. I do understand the fear of change especially for veteran drivers like myself (25 years). A few years ago I fell in lock step with all of the negative opinions posted here but after using e-logs for the past 3 years I’ve come to really like them! There are a lot of misinformed people out there including OOIDA who wrongly feel that these devices are an invasion of driver privacy and safety, nothing could be further from the truth. On the contrary I’ve found them to be helpful deterrents to the occasional over zealous dispatcher who wants to run you over your hours to get a load done. It’s nice to be able to simply say ‘check my logs and the arguments done! I’ve also found that DOT inspectors are less likely to level 1 you when they see your running e-logs(haven’t had to show logs in over 3 years). It’s also nice at days end not having to fumble with calculators and rulers trying to get those lies straight through tired eyes. For those drivers who simply want to continue cheating the rules all I can say is “good luck with that” .The truth of the matter is that we’ve bought this on ourselves. In all my years of driving I’ve never seen so many dangerous inconsiderate and unprofessional drivers on the road as I have lately. By the way, if you happen to work for a company that forces you to drive sick, tired and through blizzards here’s a little hint…..YOU MIGHT NEED TO FIND ANOTHER JOB!
I had to show my Elog twice.
Hmmm interesting maybe your company has a poor safety rating. I can only relate my experience.
Two arguments unrelated here.
It’s the law. The law is flawed. If safety is the objective then the law ignores safety issues. If a 30plus minute nap allows a driver to drive safely then it should extend the 14 hour clock. My point is change the law, but no, they won’t do it.
Safety. There are countless situations outside the law where a driver can safely operate proving the law is unreasonably too restrictive.
This should be reason enough to repeal the law until further study can be made.
When the law ignores safety the we have an obvious problem.
10-4!!! The big enemy is the14, 11, & 8 hr clock and the fact that we can’t split log like before.
When E-logs are law, the result will be driver “racing” the clock to get off the road before the almighty 11 hours time out. Say hello to more trucks parked on exit ramps, driving too fast for conditions and more drivers living like cavemen because they had to park somewhere without adequate facilities. Now there will be piles of fesses in addition to piss bottles littering the countryside.
Want to make the industry safer? Apply all the labor laws that most people take for granted- to truck drivers. Pay them for their time not just their miles. And then pay them overtime as required.
Problem solved.
We should be getting paid to unload, secure and what ever else we have to do to do the job.
Everything you just described to me sounds like it would be attributed to piss poor planning on the drivers part, and NOT the ELD’s fault! No difference between everything you described being done on paper! The only difference is you can cheat paper!
But company drivers don’t get to plan their pickup and delivery schedules. Many of them don’t even get to choose their own routes. So you can’t say it’s all just poor planning on the driver’s part.
Cary, you are a moron if you think unexpected delays never happen. Obviously you are not a driver.
I am an owner operator because I want to be home every weekend. I run my truck like a business, unfortunately I’m in the wrong business because if you break it down I bought a 5 year old truck $60.000, I bring home on average $2.000 a week minus $400 a week truck payment x 48 weeks because of down time for repairs and vacation that leaves me $76.000 a year minus taxes, tiers, oil changes, repairs, maintenance. Company drivers make what 0.50 a mile in the long run they make more.
You have people talking about making minimum wage $15 an hour it looks like ill be flipping burgers.
BINGO.
I likes the old logging where you can take a nap an it won’t effect your drive time
The arguments for ELD’s could easily be won simply by allowing us to stop the 14 hour clock the moment we go “Sleeper”, and to eliminate the stupid 8 hour break rule, which screws me every day. I am on E-Logs, and I am an Owner Op. E-logs are a requirement to lease to our company. Nonetheless, It is a good company. I had to pay $400.00 to have the MPC 50 installed, and I pay $20.00 a week for the service. It is powered by Qualcomm, just like your cell phone, and signals bounce off of cell towers and GPS for the precise tracking of trucks. Now, I wouldn’t care if I was being tracked if I worked for UPS or FedEx as a company driver, being that they offer people the ability to track packages with a number. People want to know where their stuff is. But as an owner op, and a flatbedder, I can’t see the need to track me.
People don’t have a right to know where their product is on your vehicle? Why not? Is a $20 FedEx parcel package more important than what you are hauling to the customer needing it?
“People don’t have a right to know where their product is on your vehicle?”
No. Because the company I drive for does not offer this service. There is no law requiring them to offer this service.
E logs are great for those attempting to make money from the trucking industry but for the driver they can be a pain in the seat. If a driver is not trust worthy enough to make the right decisions concerning his health and getting the load safely delivered on time then perhaps he shouldn’t be driving a rig. This is basically a way to justify positions of management where none is needed. Law enforcement may look upon drivers as wild-eyed maniacs who must be controlled and kept under surveillance for the safety of everybody but I have discovered that most drivers are just trying to earn a decent for their families. If they really want to make proper decisions regarding the trucking industry then they should go out with some of the company drivers for about 4 weeks and see how they live and experience what really happens in the industry. There is room for improvement from everyone but to assume that driving hours are the problem is pure garbage.
The first problem I discovered in the trucking industry were the so called “driving schools” which are really nothing but diploma mills. Schools should at least be forced to graduate students with minimum acceptable backing skills and for what they charge they should teach reality rather than theory.
The second problem is forcing people to drive beyond their capabilities. It takes time to develop the stamina to drive under the demanding daily circumstances facing any driver.
Another problem facing the trucking industry is the lack of respect shown to the experienced drivers.
We should police ourselves and help those with less experience to stay alive at least until they learn to fend for themselves. I am very impressed in the wrong way when a dispatcher tells me a blatant lie to “Make” me do the job or gives me an impossible run and expects it to actually be delivered.
The negativity in the trucking industry needs to be a thing of the past. When we learn to work together then things will improve. If there is one thing I would like to say to the transportation department it is “Give the truckers a break.”
Kum-ba-ya with everyone in his circle of love and friendship!
As a 30 year veteran I can unequivocally state that trucking was never this way during my time!
Here’s the bottom line. Elogs don’t work for everyone because we all do very different jobs. Chew on these examples:
Try hauling live cattle on the back of a Flatbed.
Why not use that same Flatbed to haul 41,000 lbs of -10 meat?
Or, load up some oversized steel in a dryvan!
Perhaps youd put hazardous flamible fuel in a concrete tumbler.
Maybe you could use a dump truck to deliver produce to various grocer dc’s.
Please, add to this very creative list because it’s how they see us. The point is, while driving is the common denominator, we all do very different jobs, we’re not just drivers and the rules should have various differences depending on what you drive and what you haul.
I totally agree I got out of flat beds because you go to a steel mill and it can take up to 10 hours to get loaded and then tarp in -10 with winds at 30 mph. I now do van most are drop and hook 30 minutes to an hour. apples and oranges.
The only thing ELD’s are going to do is remove nearly all aspects of being able to falsify a log. Other than that, it’s business as usual! All the whiners need to get over themselves, or get of the road and go work at McDonalds as a bun stuffer!
AGREED!
All the whining and crying from the Super Truckers tells you how many are probably running illegal to begin with. If your doing the same driving at the same time it shouldn’t matter if your recording it on paper yourself or if it’s being recorded electronically for you which many drivers DO NOT have a problem with.
If it’s soooooo bad, STRIKE! But many of these goobers have been told to hate unions (albeit against their own best interest) or act as one, yet all they want to do is hear themselves whine and cry! Hear em all the time on the radio and @ truck stops saying what they’re going to do, which is NOTHING!
Whos logs do you think DOT Officers want to check and scrutinize, the paper logger or the ELD’er? It makes their job easy too. It’s not Rocket Science for Heavens sake! SMH
Ha Ha I like this response a lot 🙂
So let me ask you a question smart guy. Here’s an example of a day in the life of a flatbedder. I load at Alcoa in Massena, NY from time to time. Suppose I arrive at the shipper and am out of hours when I arrive. They send me to the back to get loaded (which is about 3.5 miles, all on Alcoa property) which means I’m driving over my 14. once loaded, which could take about an hour or more, I roll to the tarping station which is about 1/4 mile. Guess what…you’re elog is going to kick on again. Then after roughly another hour of tarping you have to drive about 3 miles to the front gate. Your elog starts again. By the time you get outside the gate where you can park up you’re at 17 hours on duty time. Now you tell me how to avoid that smart guy. And don’t tell me your company can go in and change it because I’ve already talked to OOIDA about this and they said you can but it will still show that it has been edited. If all you’re going to do is edit it then why have electronic? Plus I run under my own authority so I am my own administrator. Its stupid. But this is probably a mute point to a company driver. My truck also runs 128mph but I never run over 70. But they could come out with a law governing trucks at 72 and even though I never run 72 I wouldn’t like it. Its an infringement. There may come a time that I need to run 73…74 to get around someone. Its all about eliminating my flexibility. Just because I don’t want an elog in my truck doesn’t mean I’m going around here breaking the law every day. Now in the above scenario…Yes I would log the time I arrived and then the time I left. I would not log driving around on Alcoa property. That’s the difference. A computer doesn’t know the difference.
Good answer. But they’ll never understand common sense reasoning.
Sure!!…lets put cameras in your house and a monitoring chip in you so the gov’t can monitor your every move. Hey if you have a problem with it then it’s because your out here doing something illegal…right?..I mean why should you care if your not doing anything wrong. Lets chip and put cameres in everyone’s house in the country. It’s an infringement on you freedoms. Don’t you see that? Why is it ok for the government to take a driver of 10 or 20 years or more who has never had an issue of any kind and start monitoring him electronically. It’s wrong on so many levels. This is never going to pass anyway. It will get pushed and pushed to 2020 something. In the end it will be in the supreme court. And I think the supreme court shoot this down. It’s definitely an infringement on the individual freedoms of every American who happens to drive a truck.
Amen!!
You obviously haven’t had any experience with them yet.
If you’re talking to me, Mark, you are wrong. I ran elog for 2 years. Paper gives more flexibility and I get more rest and never drive tired. And make more money. On elog I made less and drove tired more. That’s from my own personal experience. But this isn’t even about that. You can’t take a US citizen and monitor him/her electronically without cause and without process. You have to have a reason and you have to go through proper channels to authorize that monitoring…ie a judges signature. Look at all the people up in arms about the NSA listening to phone calls. And I’m not even that upset about that. I could care less. How do you think mainstream America would feel if the federal government wanted to monitor everyone’s comings and goings electronically? That would never fly. But yet most truckers just bend over and take it and say” oh well, that’s just how it is now”. Well I say BS. Stand up people. This is a huge privacy issue. If a big company puts these devices in their trucks by choice then that’s on them. If you don’t like them you then have the choice to NOT work for them. Still you have the choice. That’s something they’re not giving us. A choice.
It took me a long time to learn elogs, there are at least a dozen nuances that are not clearly explained and companies engage in a wide rage of variances when it comes to interpreting not only obscure situations but common parts of the laws as well.
In short, it is a cluster f…!
My instructor told me decades ago that there would never be better laws developed . He was right.
E-logs wouldn’t be an issue if the hos rules made sense. I believe mandating hourly pay vs by the mile for drivers not being paid by the load would improve safety as well. I no longer rush to beat the clock. Whenever I need to stretch or take 5 I simply stop, do a walkaround, and get the blood going again. That gets logged on duty as a load check and doesn’t cost me a dime.
just imagine if we all fought for a change of hos, get paid for all of our time, and miles, just imagine a united force of truck drivers, just imagine if all trucks would stop for two days.
If elogs become mandatory it will turn this industry upside down, and change every with logs and driving rules as we know it now. If you think that things are bad now, we’ll wait and see. I have used both paper and elogs, and I found that the elogs had to be the hardest to learn because I spent some years using paper.
This is why I’m a lifetime member of OOIDA. I’m a member of other organizations as well, but OOIDA has a PAC that works for us all. Whether you’re a company driver, owner operator or small carrier, OOIDA not only alerts us when we need to contact our politicians, they also fight the political battle for us. Even as a small carrier we can’t afford to take this action alone. But together we can all help at
http://www.ooida.com/ooidamembers/PAC/pac_fund.asp
Pitch in today, it’s OUR fight.
By most of your comments I can tell none of actually are independent. There’s a big difference between being leased on and totally independent. One , if I wanna drive one of my truck as a person vehicle for a day will elogs allow it. No . Two, there are plenty of violations on elogs,mainly off duty driving. Three, it’s illegal to make changes to logs period. But every company has some programs or person making changes. Fourth, elogs drivers speed to make up time. Most people on elogs can’t log on paper when elogs go down. Then there’s a double standard, (log correctly exactly as you do it )( unless it come to paying detention lol). Elogs are almost as easy to cheat as paper logs. No they don’t make you safer. They do not make dispatchers stop trying to force you to do things ( which is illegal also,but they still do it.) Oh I’m sorry the proper term is asking for favors lol. But even with that being said you always have the right to say no. Why do you need elogs to say no? My best guess ,fear you need a machine to help you stand up for you. They will keep you from making clerical errors.they will keep you from being pulled in most times.they will help map routes for fuel taxes. But that will only matter if you independent. Etc, etc
Amen! Well said.
I am also a produce/ meat hauler, and I too feel like the ELD’s are only going to make matters worse because until they realize that the driver cannot make shippers/receivers work different then they do and that the ELD should account for this situation, not to mention all of the daily problems a driver must deal such as traffic or construction.and that the more drivers there are on the road the more likely there to be more chaos, I have been driving for more than 25 years and have seen so many changes ( most have not done anything to benefit or improve the industry) I firmly feel that they should reconsider going back to the old ways of the 8/10 rule. if drivers today could go back and do old school they would really see just how stupid this government and its need for a nanny cam really is. most of those who make these laws have probably even seen the inside of truck let alone driven one.
We just started with e-logs, and I can tell you I have not been so anxious in all my life of driving. FMCSA is try to make a perfect system in a imperfect world. There is way too many variables on the road to be perfect.
I thought when we drive these big trucks were considered to be professional drivers, then let us make the professional decision. We are the captain of the ship, then let us make our professional decision not some damn computer and pencil pusher.
The ups and downs of elds. This is going to be a mixed story.
I went on elds in 2011 with Martin trasport. Testing the idea of what they are like to use. Not bad for the most part. They can hurt you as much as they can help you. And everyone in the office can see the hos up to the minute for each driver. And it brings an end to being forced to work long hours for someone else’s benefit. The eld does keep perfect track of the hos regulations. Pretty much making it easier to manage time. No more estimating hos to see where your at in hours. Its already done for you. The d.o.t. don’t even bother me about log books. No more outta service or log book related tickets. The eld is driver correctable. The only line that can’t be changed. Is the drive line. And once the clock is started. It can’t be stopped or set back to get more hours to drive on that day. So planning becomes key. Along with team work. Which depending on who you work for or with. Can be a good thing or a bad thing. Get someone in the office that either won’t listen, doesn’t care. It becomes a problem. And one that gets noticed quickly. The down turns. Making on time appointments is hard. Miss an appointment. Disbatch/planners can turn and will turn the eld on you. And over work you on short miles. Running you broke and under paid. It has become a very common practice for operations to force drivers to run every last second of the hos out before having to park it. Example. Have 38 minutes on the clock. They force the driver to work. Another problem. Unable to make an appointment on time due to hos or time line problem. Prepare for dispatcher to tell you how to drive the truck and work the way he wants to plan your trip.that ilegal to tell a driver that. And it makes the trip and the profits from the trip illegal. Another growing problem. Is being woke up by Disbatch during rest periods. To discuss loads, or work. That is also illegal. Not allowed to disturb driver during off duty/rest periods. Another problem I have seen. Is operations forcing safety to back off elds. To force drivers to work. Prepare to get into a lot of fights over hos. They are massive fights. So harrassment has become a big problem.Disbatch or operations retaliating on drivers is another big problem. A tool that gets used as a weapon on drivers. Another big problem shippers and receivers running drivers outta hours. And then forcing them to leave after. Very common problem. There are some businesses that don’t have the space available for parking. Then there are major companies that have it. And just won’t allow it. Using the insurance as an excuse to force drivers out. Having to work when tired. Been down that road too many times. Eld Will be good to go. And will be sleepy. And be forced to work under those conditions. Very hard to do. Being in the office and listening to planners whine about a driver having to stop soon after loading due to length of load time. And limited hos left to drive on.
Here’s what can say. Just as the listed problems above. Many drivers on less. Are parking way to soon. And they are only using the 11/10 rule on hos. And they are also only running during the day time. Which is causing parking issues. So where drivers are using the 10 hour break. Most of the time. They can use the 8 and 2 rule and get more done. The reason. Chances are they still have a few hours left in the 14 hour rule. So they can start working sooner. Which will give more parking for drivers who are tired and need to park. The miles per day on less. Can very. This depends on how the truck it’s self is setup. And it doesn’t depend so much on speed as it does on horse power and gearing. And how the company cuts it back. You can have a truck speed at 70. And the power cut to minimum. And it will only gross about 540 miles in a single 11 period. Where a truck set to 65mph. And the horse power set to the maximum. Will go 686 mile in a single 11 hour period. The consistent steady pull is what makes the difference. And those number where done in the same truck. So there are many factors in elds. The benefits and the problems. Plus how the are actually getting used. And who can see them. If I thought I could find a paper log book company. I would be there. For many of not all the reasons above. Lastly. Many drivers about having to wait to go home over elds and being outta hours. I do that completely different. If I am running short on hours. Yet have enough to get close to home. With maybe a 20 minute shortage of reaching home. Then I go the last 20 minutes to get home. Because once I am there. I know I am going to be there for 5 to 8 days. And it just seems silly to have to wait an extra day to go 20 minutes more to get home and get off the truck. And fatigue is bad working under a eld. Which is when I am going home. It is more important to make it home in spite of being a tiny bit over on the hos then it is to wait the extra day and drowning in fatigue. That does get rampid working under an eld.
The only drivers that would not like on board recorders are the ones who don’t run legal..
no clue once again
Agreed !
Have a happy life in Rainbow Land, Jim.
Hey people, and OOIDA… stop fighting the elog mandate, and start fighting the regulations. THE REGULATIONS HAVE NOT CHANGED!!!
Extend the 14 out to 18..keep the drive time at 11. I think it would work well.
The absolute bottom line problem is the 14 hour rule! If we were allowed to drive whenever we wanted as long as we had a combined 8 or 10 hour rest period in a 24 hour period drivers could be as flexible or rigid in their driving styles as they wanted to be. Because of the 14 hour timer clicking off as soon as you start doing anything in a day, drivers are Mario Andretti’ing it around trying to race the clock being reckless so they can cover as much ground as possible before being shut down.
The FMSCA forces you to accomplish all your going to do in a 14 hour window with no exceptions for traffic, accidents, loading time, breakdown issues or anything else that can happen out there. They don’t trust us to make our own decisions because they feel that we’re all just renegade crack heads trying to run 1200 miles a day and we need to be leashed. We don’t need to be babysat! We know better about our own specific operations than they do.
And to the person that asked if you wanted a driver out there on 5 hours of sleep? THAT IS ME! I only require 5-6 hours of sleep to be fully rested. My body has been that way my whole life. If I’m going to choose to be away from home then I’m going to use all available time to drive and do the job I’m paid to do so that I can get back home to enjoy said pay with my family. This is not the minimal government the founders had envisioned…
I’ve been saying this for years. Either eliminate the 14 or at least extend it to 16-18 hours. You can still only drive 11 but it gives the driver more flexibility. I always hit my 14 long before my 11. Sometimes its all I can do to drive 7 hours before my 14 is up due to delays at shippers and receivers.
There are many sleep studies out there that say 7 hours is more than enough sleep.
Pre-plan ??? Now there is a “JOKE” for you..!!! How do you pre-plan a blown out tire, a bad injector, ECM going out, sensor going out, water pump, primary fuel pump, water in the fuel, just to name a short few..!!!..
Have been trucking 40 years 29 as an owner/operator seen it all heard it all, and “PRE-PLAN” is my favorite..!!
Trucking Why do i do trucking ? Becouse i make money that why i invested 230 000 dollars in traktor trailer .Elogs will limit my income .If so what is the point to be truck driver? Spend so much time on the road and miss your family . This is a profeshion for a real profesionals who know there stuff if u cleim edl is a good thing u are no profesional to me.
If everyone noticed in the article. It said all trucks in the United States. Does that mean Mexican operated trucks from mexico Are going to be exempt from the eld laws? If so! Then that is favoritism! And misuse of the political system. To force Americans to quit so the rich man can get his cheap labor and avoid the federal eld laws and regulations.
Welcome to the new world. I’ve got electronic logs, gps, 98km speed limiter and a camera facing me and the road. This is the future. Don’t like it? Me neither…. I should have tried harder in school.
The E log will cause the driver to rush all the time ..its happened all ready I see drivers rushing in parking lots arguing with people to move it…IT WILL CAUSE MORE ACCIDENTS …
An easy way to eliminate the EOBRs, Change the regulation that is you get a log falsification ticket you lose your CDL for life. How much will that cost you.
The eobr just make the drivers hammer down to save every second zig zaging through traffic if it goes through im guessing truck related crashes and fatalities eill sky rocket but who am i lets keep letting people that know jack about the industry sit in thier cubicle and decide are fate for us
The eobr just make the drivers hammer down to save every second zig zaging through traffic if it goes through im guessing truck related crashes and fatalities will sky rocket but who am i lets keep letting people that know jack about the industry sit in thier cubicle and decide are fate for us
This is the ATA trying to level the laying field. Nothing more. Safety is the umbrella they put this under but its all political. Speed limiters are next. And why? Because all the companies in the ATA have speed limiters and they don’t want independents having an unfair advantage. The rights to individual privacy trump any safety policies. Maybe they should put an ankle bracelet on every citizen. Hey if your not breaking the law why should you care if the gov’t is watching you…right?
all has to do with money next will be to get everybody to go the exact same speed, that will be next, swift, prime, Schneider and a bunch of other major carriers wont be happy until everybody is forced to run as slow as them, first the logging then the speed, i am a real owner operator with own authority 100% me not a puppet thinking i’m a O/O, i do the crap that the bigger carriers cant even dream of doing,, but I do really good so ill do that until Im run out by govt regs
If truckers had any damn sense, they would ban together and strike for a while. Bet that would get their attention in a heartbeat. Count me in.
Logs of any kind are highly dangerous. If fatigue is such a big problem, then make more rest areas, regulate brokers & shippers that they cannot push you with unreasonably tight time frames, which takes into account weather, construction zones, traffic, the difference between day & night driving, the difference between city & country driving, what type of road you’re on, and so forth. Logs increase accidents.
If logs are so damn safe, then the ATA should put them in their own cars, as well as safety directors, truck company owners, dispatchers & anybody else who thinks they’re safe. The ONLY reason anybody in this business is pushing elogs is because they don’t have them in their own vehicles. However, that day is coming. The DOT has plans to put everybody in the entire supply chain will be under the same rules as drivers – logs, physicals, vehicle inspections, etc. The DOT tried it with farmers – yes farmers – a couple years ago, but backed off when word got out & there was an outcry. But, they will be back. They will not be satisfied until they drive the entire economy into the ground.
I use e logs and love them. I get paid by the hour.
Sure, if you get paid by the hour. Most don’t.
If the FMCSA was really concerned with safety, as they claim they are, then they would be looking into, and doing something about, the CDL mills out there. They aren’t though so instead they opt to force the drivers to run Elogs and in the near future, speed limiters.
The #1 rule is safety first!!!
The E-logs are the most dangerous component in the trucks. You are force to drive, regardless if you more than enough time to get point A too point B. I’m my 15 years on these highway, I see more driver trying to beat the clock, and trying to find a safe place to park. Driver’s losing their job in some form or fashion, because bad load planners and the E-logs. I’ve see more trucks these days, swirving, and im the ditch. No company’s load is that important, to the point where I have to put my life a risk to receive a pay check. This is not the military!
No computer could never determine how a driver body is feeling from day to day. The E-logs were designed for DOT, they were regulated for officer’s to be able to read a driver’s log. It should have stop, when they 14 hour rule came into effect.
Again the ONLY reason drivers don’t want e-log is so they can back it up paperlogs. The E-log doesn’t make you have to rush, you drivers make yourself rush. For what…what’s the big hurry out here? I like you drivers who say I gotta hurry up to get the shipper/reciever…why so you can sit in there dock & wait for hrs on end to unload/reload? Who says you can’t stop to take a nap? Maybe if you clowns would sleep at night instead of watching tv all night you wouldn’t have to take a nap during the day! I’ve been in e-log almost 6 yrs & make good money doing it. You can tell this is a truck driver issue….you drivers aren’t happy unless your crying about something. Get over yourselves already! This is the way it’s gonna be from now on, don’t like it get out. Your wrists aren’t handcuffed to the steering wheel! Think about it, is backing up your logbook really worth it? Is doing that favor for dispatch worth it? For you drivers who run illegal remember this. If a driver comes thru your town with his/her logbook behind & falls asleep at the & happens to plow his trk into your family’s vehicle with your kids in it & hurt or kill 1 or all of them, remember it’s ok because running an illegal logbook is ok according to you outlaws. Is risking your life or anyone else’s worth it?
What do you mean good money? I have asked a driver who drive on e-log and he said I am making average $700 after taxes. For $700 I will find local job and will be at home every night and off Saturday and Sunday. Won’t spend my life in this stupid truck
Have a happy life in your rainbow land, Jason.
Again the ONLY reason drivers don’t want e-log is so they can back it up paperlogs. The E-log doesn’t make you have to rush, you drivers make yourself rush. For what…what’s the big hurry out here? I like you drivers who say I gotta hurry up to get the shipper/reciever…why so you can sit in there dock & wait for hrs on end to unload/reload? Who says you can’t stop to take a nap? Maybe if you clowns would sleep at night instead of watching tv all night you wouldn’t have to take a nap during the day! I’ve been in e-log almost 6 yrs & make good money doing it. You can tell this is a truck driver issue….you drivers aren’t happy unless your crying about something. Get over yourselves already! This is the way it’s gonna be from now on, don’t like it get out. Your wrists aren’t handcuffed to the steering wheel! Think about it, is backing up your logbook really worth it? Is doing that favor for dispatch worth it? For you drivers who run illegal remember this. If a driver comes thru your town with his/her logbook behind & falls asleep at the wheel & happens to plow his trk into your family’s vehicle with your kids in it & hurt or kill 1 or all of them, remember it’s ok because running an illegal logbook is ok according to you outlaws. Is risking your life or anyone else’s worth it?
You have no idea what you are talking about. Go back to pushing paper or whatever you do.
Electronic logging is okay, but I don’t think everyone should be forced to use it. And in honesty, it amplifies the biggest flaw in the trucking industry: the clock.
Everyone is running against the clock, heck the Qualcomm even has a screen that just shows your clock while driving. When you run against a clock, you will make rash and unsafe decisions, always.
And pay by miles, because the only way to increase your pay, is to increase the amount of miles you drive in an hour. Distance over time, is velocity.
In conclusion, to get anywhere with all these legislations, a driver has to operate his equipment, at high velocity, against a clock. It’s all just a recipe for disaster.
I drive with E LOGS and the worst of it is that They just updated the system so You don’t have 2 miles lack no more, now if You r driving around the parking lot it will take that time and put it toward Your driving.
The biggest issue is that we need more parking ,more truck stops , more rest areas , so that We can park closer to shipper or rcvr , they should all provide O/N parking for Carrier , Instead walmart stores are banning truck parking , You will get truck impound by parking at walmart. So We have a huge challenge up ahead of Us.
I run local/ OTR and average 450-600 miles daily and legally. If they mandate e-logs, so be it. I run paper logs and get my rest and no complaints from my company of how I run. I have been to driving schools and I don’t feel assured that they can cut drivers loose after 2-4 weeks on the road to be safe drivers, companies probably need drivers to run locally for at least a year to practice safe driving techniques to find out their operators driving habits/skills.
My opinion. And we all have our own the road is our work place and for every sign that says no trucks in left line there should be a sign saying give way to trucks.I think we should have priority on the roads were there to do our job.It’s our work zone.most truck accidents are not because speed or lack of sleep they are caused by cars.Educate the car driver and it would be 100% better for everyone.That’s my opinion driving since 1992 O/O Carhauler.U.S.Carhauler Cartel.
First of all..elog forces the driver to keep the left door closed compared to paper, an owner who governs a truck to 65 and pays the driver 45 cents a mile is manipulating the system! Most trucks off the lot are 7mpg. @ 2500 miles a week, his 34 is revolved every other week? Thus, compare to a driver with a 74 mph @ .38 pm and 3000_ 3400 miles a week! My boss said; he and some other owner ops got together and got their own ins. package. But I ask for more top end, it’s no!!!
But I’m asked to run the miles?
I’m @ ,37 @ 73, I do the produce also!!! My checks vary? If I had the money…Ild get my own company going…! I’m for the driver! It’s all on how you look at it? E logs sucks!!!
I don’t buy into it…No one, No one should be forced into installing an elog just to pursue a career in trucking!!!!!! I feel it infringes on his or her rights and forced into something to be employed or have a job! Not allowing someone to become self employed without a catch?
I really hate the way logs are set up. I find them counter productive. There have been many times iv had to drive super slow for 3 or 4 hours because I had to stay within the 14 hrs while in bad weather. Instead of shutting down for those 4 hours sleeping and starting a new when I woke. Honestly I’m fine after a 6 hr break. I wish I could break up that 11 hours over a 24 hr period. I could take long naps when I’m tired and drive when I have energy.
It’s so much more healthy for a human to drive when awake and sleep when tired. Instead of cramping all your driving in a 14hr window. Plus sitting for extended periods is bad for you.
I think a lot of you who love elogs must pull van. Probably don’t break a sweat all week. If I just bumped a dock and then went to sleep til I was loaded I probably wouldn’t care either. But when it takes 5-6 hours to load and get chained and tarped and then I’m all sweaty and nasty dirty I’ll be damned if I’m gonna shut down right there and get in the bunk all nasty when there is a shower 20 minutes down the road. I’ll drive down the road and take a shower and then park up and go to sleep. There’s nothing dangerous about that. Matter of fact its more dangerous to try to sleep without a shower. For me anyway. I can’t sleep for s**t if i’m dirty. Then I’m driving tired the whole next day. It’s ridiculous to take that flexibility away from us and think that it’s going to make things safer out here.
The problem with our gov’t anymore is that they only know how to say this is how its going to be and that’s the end of it. What ever happened to being creative. You want elogs in all trucks…fine..make it attractive for me to put it in..like a $10k-$20k tax credit for those who use it. If I don’t put one in I don’t get the tax credit. If you make it worthwhile I may “choose” to put one in. But to tell private business owners that they HAVE to do this is plain wrong. I’ve owned several businesses in my life and I can tell that a majority of people on this thread have never owned one. I’ve never seen anything like whats going in lately in this industry. Our gov’t should not have the power to MAKE anyone put a device in their vehicle so they can watch you. Lets put breathalizers in all vehicles throughout the country. There would never be a DUI ever again. The reason is that the citizens would never allow it. They would argue that since I have never had a dui why are you forcing me to use this device. Its the same thing. If a driver has been out here for 10 or 20 years having never had a log violation, why would you make him submit to be monitored electronically for logs? It makes no sense.
Ok so I have read a lot about this elog crap know problem running legal now but what happens when a shipper or receiver holds you for 6 or 7 hours you can not make your del on time or pickup but it eats up your time not to mention it could cause you to miss a load so my question is how do you plan on making any money, I have been out here for over thirty years and have never had a log book issue so why mess with it now.
Small company owner and driver here. What it comes down to is; logs help control irresponsible drivers who would drive beyond safety limits without them. Elogs work ok for some situations and not for others. In those situations where they don’t work they could easily reduce safe driving. Paper logs allow more flexing of the time by adjusting the record, which helps a lot on those jobs where the rules don’t fit the situation. But also allows those drivers without self discipline to abuse the system easier. Some driving situations would be safer without driving time rules at all, but only for responsible drivers who would manage their own driving to be safe. My small company is a vehicle transporter, doing mostly single vehicle pickups and deliveries at random. Which creates a totally random schedule. Driving time limits get in the way very badly sometimes, and do not improve safety for us. They actually reduce safety occasionally. Sometimes I’ve felt like I had to keep going when I should have been taking a nap just to get in my miles before I ran out of time, when without the 14 hour limit I would have stopped for a couple hour nap, been refreshed and finished the trip in better mental condition, and safer. Sometimes I’d drive a while in the morning, sit and nap for several hours in mid day waiting on someone, but the 14 hr clock is still running. Then get in a short drive in the evening and run out of time while still fresh and safe. Fixed time limits just don’t fit our situation. I think 11 hours a day driving time is plenty, but the 14 needs some help. I heard where a driver had elogs and ran out of time 10 miles short of a good rest stop. He got off on the access road and drove under 10 mph for an hour to get there. Wasting 50 minutes of rest time over 10 minutes. Where a paper log would have been a non issue on a 10 minute adjustment.
I am working for a company now that runs the Elog system and it also tells them everything else you do. If you take a 25 mph corner at 30 it sends a signal out. If you hot the brakes to hard if you have to swerve to avoid running over someone it tells. But they tell us no cameras in the cab yet looking at us. I have been doing this a long time and I don’t see it getting any better for any of us. And if you like the e logs I guess when they make it mandatory that we all have cameras looking at us you will be ok with that because you have nothing to hid. Because if we are against e logs we must be running illegal. Same ting right?
Log Book drivers have fewer incidents and fewer accidents, compared to ELD drivers.
Does anyone know if there are or will be some amendments for us local construction drivers. Living in the northern tier states we work long days on road projects, maintaining pipeline roads. Between Trailer dump and low bed
and a shorter construction season than most we drive 12 hour plus almost every day. I hear drivers from large companies like the rule, almost everyone else doesnt. I no for fact this will hurt the construction and agriculture industry. OOIDA please look into this aspect of the law
Ok, let’s see if everyone gets this. It’s nothe about safety, it’s about supply and demand. Even without the ELDS think about the rules of service hours, even on paper logs once you start the clock time is ticking, the powers to be believe that drivers, Driver more miles in an eleven hour day and for the most all do at an average of 650 a day times how many trucks on the road 2.5 million that’s alot of mile that’s also a major shortage of trucks and drivers, why do you think the speed limits have increased. So that product moves faster down the road. Something everyone needs to remember. 100 percent of everything needed or used is moved by a truck. The trucking industry is trying to service 410 million Americans with 2.5 million trucks the math doesn’t work unless you change things hamper that movement. The fiscal would be better off and so would American if the hours of service went back to 8 hours on and 8 hours off! Why because each Driver can and probably would work 16 hours a day. So think about all that.
I have read most of the comments posted and the topic of legality is the question raised , shippers and receivers should be mandated to load or unload a truck within an hour of arrival , we all know loaders and unloaders don’t give a hoot about drivers and some seem to take great delight in holding you for as long as they can . One of their favorite quotes is ” product not ready,” and obviously you ask when it will be ready , the answer is never good ! In situations such as this , who has your back ? , dispatch ? No ! You are on your own and sit and play the waiting game , e-logs or paper it makes no difference for the simple reason the hours are slowly ticking by and the detention rate is peanuts compared to the wheels turning !
Mandating 1 hour for load and unload benefits all of us . I run paper logs and the advantage I have over e-logs is that I can move to find parking and we all know how difficult it is sometimes to get parked , for those of you who say you should have planned better then you’re eyes are wide shut and dumber than a bag of rocks , for those of us in the” know” we read traffic patterns in relation to 18’s therefore T/Stops which are normally easy to get parked in suddenly fill up quicker because more trucks are moving freight through the area , how many of you have arrived at a T/Stop and said this place is quiet today ? Each day presents it’s own challenges and each day we scratch our heads and think W.T.F. ! Those of us that run Paper Logs and are not afraid to say NO to whoever , leave us alone….we are happy to a point (H.0.S.)
Those of you who enjoy e-logs , I am delighted that you are happy with them ….enjoy !
Elogs puts truckers on a higher stress level, creating drivers that speed, tailgate, and take unnecessary risk. Coupled with the fact, most are company drivers…suffer from “it aint MY truck” syndrome, are the roads most dangerous drivers.
The last days of the paper log cowboy I guess. I’ve used both and paper logs allow me a little more freedom to do things like find a better meal than at a truck stop or take a tractor home for the night. So good for OODTA but by the time this thing goes to court my company (which HAS been dragging it’s feet on this as it prefers paper logs as well) will have made the investment in 20-30 eobrds.
If anything, it’s time for the major DC’s to start providing parking for tractors, or maybe hiring an onsite CDL “valet”, as the days of the 10 hour rush delivery followed by an 8 hour unload will FINALLY come to an end. Especially when trucks are equipped with ignition interlocks that prevent a truck from starting after the 14th hour.
The Most safety elog is in your mind .
Im excited the company i lease too is going to e log. Tired of living off 4 hour naps and running like an outlaw. Sure the money i make might be good…. Some might even say terrific but ill live
You will like it until you have it.
These guys freaking out about elogs are so off base with their thought process. It won’t make it harder to drive, it’ll just make you actually follow the rules more.
And to the whole rate issue and how elogs limit how much money you make, it’s the guys running illegal that are driving down rates. If elogs force these renegades to shut down after 11 hours instead of cheating their log books, they’ll be less overall trucks available and hence rates will tend to increase.
The only negative thing about elogs is the potention cost for Qualcomm units and monthly service charges. The mega carriers will easily absorb those fees while individuals might take a hit in that regard. I hope this drives old timers that won’t adjust out of the industry, higher rates for the rest of us
The rules are idiotic. If you don’t get that, you are part of the problem.
You only show your inexperience and ignorance by your comments. I never drive over 11 and neither do 99% of the drivers out here. The problem is there are many situations we run into where you might hit your 14 and haven’t even driven 6 hours. How the hell can you make a living like that. Very few are trying to run 1000 miles a day. I know I’m not. So for you to say everyone who opposes elog is running illegal and exceeding their 11 every day is ridiculous.
In this industry, the guy behind the wheel is always expected to be the one to take the hit. This is just one more example of that mindset. I left driving for 10 years to come back to it and find out that it never got any better. Until drivers unite, it won’t……but that is not going to happen.
Funny how driver logs used to be a tool to protect him, now it’s used to hang him. This is exactly why I left trucking early even though I still love it and would like to get back. Too many out there gunning for you.
besides bankrupting so many owner operators and dishing over the freight business to the mega companies who will no doubt make a disaster of it all, stress seems to be the one most dangerous item that isnt given any credence whatsoever. Who doesnt know that the ATA is simply inventing opinions that are intended to dupe and persuade (along with payola) the federal government into creating rules that will serve its customers. You look at some of the characters that press the hardest for these rules in the ATA group are the most crooked companies guilty of lease scams,coercion, and labor violations galore but somehow their credible to give safety advice to the Administration. You buy that and then you can believe im the easter bunny.
Or planner thinks he will be able to schedule our deliveries. This company makes sure you never get a full 10 hour break. This is going to make his life hell. And we might get some sleep
so why is nobody mandating shippers and recievers to pay me $50/h for everything ater 2. why not get their ass into gear if im constantly rushed.
and then i can also be fine with only driving 300miles after waiting around all day cause i made my money sitting
This is without a doubt going to force alot of us independent drivers to lease on to company’s to receive less money to support there family or park there trucks. This is all because some big shot sitting at a desk wants to control the way we as Americans Truck Drivers support our family and the way survive.It is wrong but this industry is surely going down hill without a doubt and is the biggest talk among us independent guys out here.There no freedom in country anymore and we are being stripped away of our way of living while some big shot thinks he making a difference behind his desk.Come live in the real world where we take pride in driving a truck for a living. Personally I plan to take on another trade away from driving even though its what I know.Talk with a driver who said instead of his 5 runs a week he will be cut down to 3 runs week which is going to cut his pay tremendously and he don’t how he going to make it other than losing half of what he has for his family. Now how many drivers out here, thousands and thousands, yes it is going to really hurt us but do they care HELL NO and we know it.Watch how trucking sinks for the Independent guys.
Well you all can take this for what it’s worth. I’ve been an owner/operator since 78 and a true independent for the last 8 years. I was looking at that new limited edition ICON W9 today but have decided to back up and am now in the hunt for a 90’s model. I figure I can rebuild the whole truck for about have of the cost of the new one and I wouldn’t have the computer, emissions, and Elogs to worry about. And yes you can call me an Outlaw and bitch about the jet trails that spew from my stacks. You can condemn me for the loose leaf paper logs I keep. Some of you might wonder how and why I shift my standard tranny with a clutch or bitch that all my chick lights are too, too much. This has never been a job , it’s the life force in me. So tonight as I leave Cali for the last time on the 40 heading to Point with 50,000 pairs of shoes on and not one a walkin’. I hope you West bounders have your ears on as 40 is closed just past the 15 split, brake out the ole Rand McNally to find your way around or there you shall sit with your pretty Pink panties and a frown. Sorry driver don’t know what the South bound scales are doing cause I went thru the woods. Phantom 309 showed me the way, That’s right, that’s right, I heard all that driver ……….. You keep the big rig between the ditches and don’t take nothing home to Momma that itches……Moral of the story, do what ya want cause ya can. Can you imagine the look on the DOT cops face when I tell him I don’t own a cell phone? “Here’s my pager and they didn’t make that app for it yet. Go figure”…………
Right on brother. Wooop Wooop truck it up.
I have just read a ton of these with good points and some ignorant points. I’m just going to run my old 1995 and continue being an Independent Owner Operator. You guys running ELDs just continue doing what you do and I will continue doing what i have been doing safely for 39 years. In my day in the truck driving school i went to my father punched in the arm when i scratched a gear i didn’t get a grade.
E-Logs are just another way the Government are trying to play Big Brother.
The next step will be, Every time you go across an overpass and your cruise control tries to catch up and you go over 3mph of the posted speed limit, a speeding ticket will be automatically issued. This is also just another tool Lawyers will use when they sue you. We are all grown Men and Women. We are all Professional Drivers. We know when we are tired and when we aren’t. E-Logs are just another way the Government is using to control our Personal and Professional Lives. They need to concentrate on Cell Phones and Texting before coming after us.
I dnt oppose the elog or support it. I do agree it will cause more problems. Time is money…getting hold up at shippers or receivers cut into that. Raise the price of freight to be move to compensate drivers . That will help alot….then drivers wont be out their with the truck on auto pilot….( if u a driver u know what that mean)
Hoss …i like that drive and ambitions…now that is a tru billy big rigger….. origanal outlaw trucker…keep on truckin driver
Does anyone know if there is a appeal to the the Whitehouse, the President who is not in favor or of more government or more more such regulations, on this whole mess. Especially considering the negative economic and and safety impact this is going to have?!
E log drivers don’t long on duty five hours loading, a half hour or 45 minutes is enough. The rest of the time log it sleeper birth. Trucks don’t shut off when your out of hours. If you have to run over call the log department the next day and tell them why you had to run over, couldn’t stop in a safe place, traffic jam or whatever and they right up a report and put it your file. You can edit anything on e logs except driving time or any any logs you approved. You don’t have to approve any logs till the end of the day or as long as you can get away with. You have to show fifteen minutes on duty for a pre trip sometime during your 14 hours on duty. You have to log a thirty minute break either off duty or sleeper birth every eight hours on duty or eight hours driving. Nobody should ever long on eight hours on duty. Just waiting your hours. E logs automatically figure a 8 and 2 hour split sleeper birth rule. 8 and 2 rule in the green book. If the road conditions are too bad to drive in your opinion you don’t have to drive. They can’t make you. They may try to bullshit you into driving but your decision is final.
I can see one thing. No one ever really rushed if they were going to be a little late or over the hours a little bit. Now with the clock that will record what you do to a T. I can see drivers now getting detained loading or unloading and then driving like ass hats to make up for time detained. I am sure you will see the alleged 7 lives we will save more a year now turn into 7 more a day that will be killed. Hate to say this, but if you can’t trust me to do my job or drive the truck. Why should I trust you the government for all your horse shit laws you keep hindering us with. I really have no problem with an e log. Now you can get rid of many well paid and non productive officers who most of the time don’t know anything about a truck other than what they read in a book. Secondly what are you going to do with the illegal alien who has three jobs and drives a car. That is one of the big problems today. Just general population going to work and they go to job one, then to job 2 and maybe even job three and are asleep at the wheel and drive up under us. Beleive me, a car hitting the steers on a truck will most likely render the truck out of control and the truck driver generally gets the hit because he should have been aware of this situation. So why don’t we curb the general public now also. Make them put an E log in their car and if the company keeps them for a few hours extra, they can sleep in their cars at work. You have closed most of the rest areas because of lack of funds or extortion of the funds for that purpose. Truck plazas are gearing up more and more for the weekend traveler and less and less for what a driver really needs to keep good hygiene and physical fitness with junk food or fast food as the main course. Many places you can’t even go into and sit down to even enjoy a meal or get a clean shower. Now think of all the ones who are stuck in a rest area. Nothing there and you’re lucky if they have a shitter with any paper or a couple of empty vending machines. Shure there are a few companies making it big, then you have the ones who do well, but the reality is you have the government subsidized making a killing and doing it with minimum wage steering wheel holders. So while all you asshole lawmakers and politicians go home every night and sleep in your cozy bed with your self proclaimed payroll. you had better wake up, because we are all getting sick of you. Most of us are trying to make a living above poverty and follow the rules. Why don’t you just enforce the laws you have and get the rotten drivers or steering wheel holders off the road and stop the cheap freight hauling companies you are in bed with who actually make big money and employ cheap help that is the reason for all this crap.
E log is best for drivers. I am working with Challenger motor freight and since 2011 I am on e log book. I have never face any obstacles with hours.my company have best of best planning for his driver’s. I am thankful Challenger motor freight have e log. Happy and satisfied owner operator.
Man it’s not the 11 hour rule that is the problem. It is the 14 hour rule. Grocery warehouses. Dock yards. Chemical Plants. Do nothing but eat up the 14 hour rule only leaving driver’s with about 5 or 6 hours to drive. Truck drivers like everyone else has to get the job done or get fired. All elog and 14 hour rule is going to do is get a lot of drivers killed trying to get it done or they will get fired. Just like anyone else who failed getting it done. Shortening the time to work while having the same work load only forces drivers to go faster and taking curves faster. All elog 14 hour is going to do is kill a lot of drivers. Thank you fmac and your infinite stupidity
So many rules and regulations, aren’t we supposed to be living in the country of freedom? Who are you kidding?
Stop talking obout EDL. We can’t avoid or change it. We all know some of the people in power, made a lots of the money on it and governtment has huge revenue on it. Who carres about safety on the road and about us.For the first time I can say: I am lacky because I am old. I am 64 and next year I’ll be of the HWY… If still alive. They said there is 1.5 millions driver seats empty, 1.5 millions drivers shortage, It is B.S. Even if cuple hudered thousends drivers quit, get of the road, it will be not driver shortage, but they would have to pay rest of the drivers more fairly. Untill then, you can see your wife, your kidds on Skype or Messanger and keep running just to make enough money to cover debits and put food on the table.They need 1.5 millions of drivers yet to easy manipulate them and pay them less.
About time what took you so long?
This thing is killing me and or other drivers on the road cuz i can’t stop or slowdown when conditions are bad am latterly racing the ⏰ just to keep up with the expanses not taking money home..