If you’re near Ann Arbor, Michigan on June 19th and have opinions about driverless trucks, here’s some good news: The Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration is hosting a public listening session to hear ideas from the public about the design, development, testing, and integration of Automated Driving Systems (ADS).
The public listening session follows a request for comment in the public register on the same issue. Large companies like Uber filed comments, as well as trade associations like OOIDA, but drivers also weighed in. Unsurprisingly, many expressed concerns over safety, system security, and the impact that driverless vehicles could have on American jobs.
According to the FMCSA notice of the public hearing, the comments made in person on the 19th will “supplement” the information that the Administration has already gathered. They have asked for comments from stakeholders that they have not yet heard from including insurance groups, tech developers, and academia.
If you want to make sure truckers’ voices are heard as well, the listening session is being held Tuesday, June 19, 2018, from 1:00 p.m. to 3:00 p.m., Eastern Daylight Time (EDT), at the University of Michigan’s Mcity in Ann Arbor, Michigan. Research Auditorium, 2800 Plymouth Street, Bldg. 10, Ann Arbor, MI 48109.
Standing by for the tech geeks and bots to come on here, having never driven a 70 foot long vehicle on roads that weren’t meant for it. They will say “oh, a computer will make the turn and do blah blah blah better, unmindful that’s its a very dynamic environment. Then the tree huggers will claim how it reduces emissions and how trucks will platoon since we all know that all loads leave together heading to the same location.
Finally, some suckers will claim how it will drastically reduce shipping and the price of goods, although shipping usually makes up only a few percent of the total cost. And we all know company owners are going to lower their rates and give the money back right??? Let’s hear all the praises of unproven technology in a dynamic environment among millons of peoples lives in a litigious society. You think getting a emission motor is tough to fix? Just wait till thiis overhyped cruise control starts failing.
How about this…
We’ve been replacing people with machines ever since the Industrial Revolution. A crop field that used to take a family an entire season to harvest, is now harvested in a day by a single GPS guided harvester.
Machines can work 24/7/365. They don’t perform worse on Friday than they do on Wednesday. They don’t take sick days, vacation days, or require healthcare (but periodic maintenance). They don’t argue with their boss, sexually harass their co-workers, or bring drama to the workplace. Any company that doesn’t replace an employee with an adequate machine is put out of business by the competition that does.
Within the next 100 years, computers will program themselves, and create machines that perform every human task. Once that happens, the trade of labor and creativity in exchange for financial compensation will become obsolete.
It could create a utopia, where human beings are no longer required to work to survive, but free to follow their passions and enjoy their hobbies without restraint. But human beings are too selfish. Just like fellow truck drivers, who ignore over 1 million people killed, and 50 million people injured in automobile accidents each year worldwide, because human beings are lousy drivers, they rather keep their jobs, than admit that properly programed computers will be much safer than even the best truck driver can be. (Using calculus to perfectly navigate every turn.)
Yes, there will still be injury and death with automated vehicles, but 50,000 deaths and 1 million injuries per year worldwide is a lot better than what we have now.
[I assume that this post won’t be posted either, as The Trucker’s Report has been censoring my post, ever since I started informing fellow drivers this inevitability.]
Can you name one of those automated unmanned machines that wasn’t in a controlled enivornment, weighing up to 80k lBs and travelling at 70 mph?
Sure here’s one not in a “controlled environment”:
http://money.cnn.com/2018/03/07/technology/uber-trucks-autonomous/index.html
Or you can search YouTube for autonomous truck.
You guys are funny. Like asking what about the starter, windshield wipers, seat belts, anti-lock disk brakes and brake lights on a 1927 Model-A, and swearing that there is no way the car will ever replace the horse.
I’m guessing that you guys haven’t driven a Volvo VN-780. The computer on that truck told me when anything was wrong, including tire pressure. To put that technology on the trailer won’t be difficult. The money saved, not having to pay a team $100,000 a year will easily pay for whatever sensors etc will need to be added to the trailers.
Anyone who thinks that a autonomous truck will never navigate city streets obviously hasn’t taken a calculus class. It’s not a stretch for a computer to sense EXACT distance in 360° to the centimeter, and make a PERFECT turn. It will probably be able to adjust the tandems to do it if necessary, then autoscale back to proper weight distribution.
You’re Uber example doesn’t exactly have the best track record, does it? Have you ever watched the Otto truck on video driving on top of the white line in the easiest environment? Doesn’t bode well for your calculus story. What about the city streets that I drive in daily that require you to start your turn in oncoming traffic and complete It in the opposing turn lane? I can scenario you to death with situations where you need human intervention. I’ve driven plenty of Volvo’s and that computer only knows what it is programmed to know, like the oil leak on the oil pressure sensor that shuts the motor down. It’s a simple fix by just unplugging it, but a computer doesn’t know that.
I hope in your utopiathat traffic doesn’t exist. Otherwise your computer calculus truck will be dragging its tandems over car hoods when they pull up too far.
Those trucks certainly aren’t unmanned.
Good post, It’s not going to happen overnight, but it will happen. What a lot of these guys don’t realize is that when a self driving truck encounters an anomaly that requires human intervention, every other self driving truck will be notified of this anomaly instantly. These trucks will remember this anomaly forever. I can’t say that I’m crazy about being made obsolete, but fighting it would be like getting in a fist fight with a glacier.
LOL! I live in farm country. I have yet to see a fully unmanned harvesting operation, and that DOES include combines (which you so cutely called “harvester”). City people are so gullible…
You gotta be a student, nobody is that naive… we have planes, trains, boats and space ships. the only thing autonomous are vehicles that will crash into the atmosphere or an uninhabited planet or moon (those are the ones built by the smartest people on earth. not cheap but lots of calculus! and they do occasionally fail!) just to be accurate your uber truck had a driver – thats not autonomous.
there is not going to be a single manufacture or owner of a multi million dollar company that will say “i bet my business, my vehicle will not fail” (they’re not gonna pay NASA engineers!). the only other solution would be to have standbys (which can only be so cheap) even if they got a truck to drive on its own – the first booboo that truck makes, the company and/or the manufacture will pay and the shipper will not call twice, because he will loose customers. the driver may take days of, sick leave or what ever but the load does get there, to the envy of every other developed country in the world. and uuh your statics are off, as a whole, US truck drivers are the safest drivers in the world. your “calculus” will never replace a living, feeling, thinking PT driver. it would take a computer as big as the empire state building to replace the human brain- ya see, inevitable, most PT drivers have common sense and a concern for other drivers, i dread the day we replace THAT, with a complicated math equation. i might know something, before i was a PT driver i worked on computers; from navy fighter jets down to Fort500 manufacturing companies, 30+ years- i wouldn’t trust machines and computers with my life… but you go ahead.
You hit the nail on the head. I really want to see an autonomous truck navigate a 14′ wide load thru the streets of Chicago.
I don’t think the idea of autonomous trucks extend to oversize loads. Those are always going to specialized.
Well, I am a geek and a former truck driver and I’m curious how a driverless system will know when you blow a tire on the inside dual on your trailer or that “feel” that experienced drivers get when they know something is just not right?
Prime example. Last week I had a blowout, the tread knocked the cover off the rear hub on the tire behind it. When that hub runs out of oil, it will get hot and possibly catch fire, and those rims and tires are coming off and heading down the road in an uncontrollable direction. Someone will say “oh, tpms system will catch that tire blowout and the truck will stop.” To which I reply, haha, get real, and get a luddite arm with an extinguisher ready.
The FMCSA wants to know what we think? Really? We’re supposed to buy into that? Since when…EVER…has the FMCSA listened to those of us that actually do the work they regulate? Answer – never.
AMEN Bro!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You beat me to it! Like I’ve said before, the FMCSA will listen, then go ahead and do whatever they want.
This is a desperately-needed change to the transportation industry. While it is true the technology is not 100% in place to handle every dynamic on the road, it soon will be.
You’re a bot.
Money talks-and it’s not talking to us
I get it as a business owner and driver , however I do not support this move one bit although daily I see drivers becoming non professional almost crazy drivers I swear some today driving trucks have taken there 4 wheeler skills into big trucks with no regard for anyone else on the road if you drive Trucks you to see this with that said maybe on longer hauls this could work like a loading zone and unload zone something like that . Buyers beware even your job may become outomated one day all those who say they care about the people yet stand for this one day when millions stand holding there signs wanting work hope you remember that it was you who helped make this happen where this is no work
There’s already enough brainless drivers operating trucks, why not have trucks without drivers.
…because brainless drivers usually are smart enough to at least want to live. A hacked computer/80,000lbs atom bomb does not.
For someone so convinces of how many dumb truckers there are on the road ….you don’t seem to have brains enough to think about the consequences of your suggested alternative.
They have driverless cars that weigh 2 to 4 tons that are causing fatalities.
So I don’t think it makes sense to put 40 ton driverless vehicles on the road till they perfect passenger vehicles first.
This is a extreme safety issue all based in the name of greed . Companies like Uber , Elon Musk . Google and the manufacturers of trucks ( Volvo, Freightliner ) who participate in the manufacturing of the speculative unproven autonomous truck … at the end of the day , their bottom line behind the scenes is too condense , out source , monopolize and profit off of the industry . Mega Carriers will also profit , if not more than ever also while a multitude of drivers , mechanics and various support across the industry will succumb to this process of elimination creating a mass rise in unemployment. Their ultimate objective , though they will never admit to it is too keep big business afloat while crippling the gift of human talent . Safety is no concern when you see a max amount of profit to be made in such little time , profit exceeds human life and the safety of the general public are expendable due to the fact these mega monopolisers have a goal that is based off of sheer greed despite the rising numbers in autonomous vehicle accidents which involved fatalities. To reach their numbers they will do anything to convince the public how they will save billions …mega carriers and their investors will run to this because it will accommodate their arrogance that is fuelled by the greed they offer . To the pushers of the autonomous vehicle ……. you are a safety issue with red flags all over . The FMCSA should NOT consider such a option because in safety there is no option .and our option as drivers and supporters of this industry is too stand together and fight your greed . This is not progress by no means … this is re gression into greed . .
I couldn’t have said it better…. Well said!! You hit the nail on the head!!
Why do they want to know what drivers think it doesn’t matter their gonna do what they want anyway
The article says they want info from industries they haven’t heard from yet. They have obviously heard from the trucker which is why they want to hear from the people that will raise the flag up high and proclaim “this is wonderful and exactly what our country needs”. Them holding this meeting looking for more support just means our voice is too loud and they are trying to cover it up. Let’s keep screaming till we win!
The beginning of the END , In another 15 to 20 years they will have picked up the slack
It’s just called the stupidest thing I’ve ev r heard of nuff said
Computers have glitches, humans have glitches, but we humans can’t get hacked. We all know “SkyNet” is pushing hard for this and there will be a few years of carnage and wading through major law suits b4 it becomes completely gitch free and hacker proof. It’s all inevitable, but it’s best not to rush it. Thousands working in dispatch, safety and even DOT jobs will be greatly effected, so those outside of logistics who push and support this, beware, AI is coming for you too….
WHO DO I SUE???
The business who owns the automated and the creator.. Lol
If you think it will make the roads safer well think again, From someone who has worked in the automotive fiald with electronics being the major part of the problem, There is no way this could be a safer way to save lives. Distractive driving has more to do with cellphones than anything, but don’t ask a truck driver we wouldn’t know lol , and just look at all the problems with computers and other electrical devices they all have there problems as well
I’m a line haul trucker who operates across the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. My truck is a 2018 Cascadia with the level 3 autonomous driving package. On a nice day or night, the system is nice. However…
They should take a driverless truck across US-2 in the winter. Within 5 miles I guarantee you that a sensor will be covered in snow, rendering the self driving truck useless.
Even if they go through with it, someone should be at the helm at all times. There are way too many variables on the road that will make self driving trucks more dangerous, especially on highways like US-2 that’s a beast on its own.
And if they start making dedicated lanes for self driving trucks, then why not just make railroads? It’s all silly to me. I do like the automated features of my truck, but I also understand that my technology is not perfect, and to remain aware of my surroundings at all times. I think of the system like a co-pilot, an extra set of eyes to look with me.
I’m sorry to rain on ur parade, but how could they build railroads from one Kroger to another, or one dollar store to another? That’s why we’re the most important. Gotta feed America, and I wouldn’t be able to sleep while my truck is driving itself. Haven’t u seen the people already killed from automated cars? It’s a disaster in it’s making
What do we think ?..fmsca dont care what we think..if they did all these companies whose drivers are as bad or worse than no driver at all would be out of business..swift..prime..werner..jb hunt..etc..etc….what the fmsca need do is insure PROPER training, make texting/spacebooking/online games/online anything a felony in a personal or commercial vehicle, start enforcing present laws like slower traffic keep right, no high beams, etc, but it all goes back to my answer to your question..fmsca dont care, unless, you are a big corp throwing money at them…then nothing else matters…no need for common sense nor safety..
O/O I am totally against it. It has nothing to do with eco system. Enough people died in cars pedestrians. How many do you think you could kill with a Semi exponential.
There’s enough problems on the road with people Driving cars. But the ability to think reason react are not there. Takes jobs creates safety hazard. Who do we sue
It is simple! Autonomous trucks can not outwit human behavior. They can’t think as fast as humans, and they can’t overcome the various environmental obstacles that truckers face in driving every day. If autonomous cars can’t do it (which we have already seen) what makes you think that a 70 foot tractor trailer carrying 80,000 lbs can do it. Wake up, it can’t!
you crest a hill and as you do you see the traffic at a dead stop in front of you . What is auton going to do now,he won’t turn on the brakes until the sensor says to do thats when the big crash comes .
FMCSA! DON’T GIVE A RATS ….. ABOUT SAFTEY, ALL THEY DO IS GET PAID BY THE BIG MEG COMPANIES TO MAKE THEM RICH. YOU CAN TELL THAT IN THIS NEW SO CALL SAFETY ELD THING. THE GOVENMENT IS GOING TO DO WHATS BEST FOR THEM NOT THE LITTLE PEOPLE. THEY WONT DO ANYTHING UNTILL ONE OF THESE DRIVELESS TRUCKS HIT AND KILL ON OF THEIR FAMILY MEMBERS THEN IT WILL BECOME A ILLEGAL. DRIVELESS TRUCKS CAN THEY FEEL AND MOST OF ALL THEY WILL BE HACKED.
LOL The FMCSA does not care what anyone thinks and will never do anything for the safety of other drivers as long as money is not involved
It’s coming like it or not.
Autopilot hasn’t put every pilot out of work, and unless they’re working on transformers, someone still has to sign the paperwork and fuel up.
Even with the sensors all blocked with snow, it’s probably still safer than some of the truck drivers we share the road with every day.
Enter minimum wage and skill workers. Problem solved! They’ll even do any handbombing.
…yeah, until a hacker with a laptop gets near it. When you use the word “safer”, it’s probably best to do it with a view point that’s wider than the perspective of a frightened 12 year old. You think drivers are unsafe now. Just wait until all the good one leave to go find better paying work/benefits.
But since you brought it up; autopilot has driven down the general skill level of pilots and consequently, their annual salaries and benefits. Airline employees have gone on strike more than teachers have in the last 3 decades.
Any other brilliant equivalencies you’d like to introduce?
Auto Pilot also is not full autonomous either
I have only 3 words on topic of driverless trucks: VERY BAD IDEA!!!!!!!!!!!!
my response to post about sharing road with present drivers: We need not only better and longer school training, really 3 week schools, thank you schools taught them enough to make the new drivers dangerous. Also need more qualified and caring Instructors, training new drivers has to have better attitude than just another paycheck.
Follow the Money – just that simple.
It’s the most obsurd program really driverless trucks, be real obviously these tech geeks have never drove a truck omg how stupid I don’t care how sofisticated and techy they get u can’t replace a human in a vehicle weather its a truck or car!
Welcome to Corporate America! !!
1969 song by Zager and Evens, “In the year 2525” ’bout hits the nail on the head. Man kind is expendable, and replacable. All the ELD and computer systems onboard everything from toasters to rockets, were designed to replace that gray mass between our ears. The powers that exist are trying their hardest to take what we thought was “syfi”, and make it “reality”.
I think its a huge mistake,for driver less trucks.Machines/computers just as humans can make mistakes.How many times have we heard sorry our system is down,but unlike computers,humans can at least over come there mistakes and correct them almost instantly,where as a computer could take a few minutes to hours to correct.There is and in my opinon,nothing safer than an actual human being behind the wheel of a truck
Have u heard of the movie, Maximum Overdrive? Lol, that’s what is coming to life right now! Trucks driving themselves and they’ll be used for weapons against us when foreign hackers figures out how.. I think this is the dumbest move.. To think trucks driving themselves are safer than a human operating it. I really believe the scientist needs evaluated to see what makes them tick. They could be Martians
Just another way for hackers and terrorism to use at thier convince to use as explosive devices to blow up government and other functions to kill inercence people .thanks to bright people for helping terrorist. Someone will use for the wrong perpetuation plus to dangerous to use driverless trucks to put inercent lives at risk what is wrong with people.they want to take everything away from us talk about controlling over Americans.
I am sorry, but no computer can see everything happening around a truck and react like a human. It cannot predict if that car is going to pull out in front of the truck like a human could by just watching that driver’s actions. There have already been wrecks with these type of cars. Think of the damage a truck would do!
Well, at least they could not blame a truck driver! !!
Driverless trucks cannot see the crazy, stupid things that happen everyday. We all know that a significant number of eighteen wheeler accidents are caused by four wheelers. The driverless truck can’t antisapate, anything. After the leading truck, driven by a person, has passed a certain point on the high way, the driverless unit cannot make a judgement call. There are more and more drivers on the road all the time, some good some bad. How is the driverless unit going to recognize which one is good, and which one is bad? Driverless trucks, is just a bad idea all the way around!
This is like one of those times when, your wife asks what you think, then still does it her way!
Really, what in the hell do you think we would think about it I mean it could put us out of work.
I know right. Seriously this world is getting dumber by the pound
Dad: Now son, when you grow up, you can be anything you want to be. And then, you will need to stop what you’re doing and go fight a war and lose your friends, feelings and possibly even your life. Then, when you return home, you will lose your job to a robot!
Son: Why don’t we send the robots to fight the wars?
Sure! Go ahead & remove more drivers from employment! & when, the accidental rate increases. Listen for the laugh, “heard around the world”!!!!!!!
I think that if the various types of transportation are split into their respective groups and designated to drive on either the interstate or the secondary system, then and only then can driverless vehicles be researched effectively enough to be brought online. They represent a massive step forward in transportation tech.
It’s likely this will include huge interstate and highway updates.
The only way to justify this sort of expenditure would be to bring it in under the heading of natnl. Defense.
The odds on the USA being first in this area are near zero though. Too much red tape.
Russia will almost certainly beat us to the punch and lead the way, just like the race to space……
Yeah SURRRRE they want the public’s opinion; ironically after the public is learning that driverless cars and trucks have been being tested on public highways without the public’s knowledge or consent, and that the d***n things are killing people.
This is the same mega carrier agenda to maximize profits and wiggle away from the consequences of how they’ve treated American truckers for years, and hide the connection between that behavior and the major driver shortage we are facing. It’s a scam that capitalism and the free market would have gotten rid of by now, if our politicians weren’t in their pockets.
So yes, driverless trucks will eliminate millions of jobs, and yes it’s coming soon. This is what happens when a dumb populace continues to elect rich mobsters to public office. They will work you like slaves, and then when you stand up for yourself, they’ll outsource your jobs to foreign countries or create robots to do it right here in the U.S., while you either lose everything you have, or agree to work for minimum wage without benefits.
Any questions?
How will gps and a computer know that construction has you driving in one lane on the opposite side of the highway
I went through Roadmaster in ’14, but never could parallel park those 53′ trailers at the state testing site. So, with the 200 or so miles that I accumulated during my training, I’ve come to admire what truck drivers do each day. Am a transit bus driver for the last four years, so I finally learned the p.p. thing, but still appreciate you guys and gals in trucking. Yep, they’re talking about doing this to buses, as well. Might be okay on roads like I-80 on the Great Plains, but I wouldn’t feel comfortable seeing one here in Indiana…. EVER!- Charles Bevell, Bloomington, IN
Scares me to death , we all know there will be a few deaths in the beginning until the bugs are worked out. I wil make sure my family stays off the roads as much as possible.
This idea has been going on way before trump was elected. I Blaim the transformer and sci – fi movies that put these ideas in little kids heads and those kids grow up an invent all this techno stuff.
Trump just except’s the pressure that people put on him and he might get a little more help in the polls , we all will have to Waite and see.
Technology assisted, vehicle to vehicle sensors, even if the technology was mature, I have to recall some high school physics 101 about an 80,000lb object traveling at 55mph along a blacktop ribbon driverless??? There plenty of areas to improve before we get to driverless, that includes drivers of all vehicles!!
In my opinion the only way this world can handle driverless anything is if everything on the highway is driverless, I do not believe you can have both sharing the roads at the same time for the simple fact that there is no algorithm program for human stupidity and or seanarios that a computer program cannot see coming or feel. The movie Minority Report with Tom Cruise is an example where every vehicle was on a rail system and there weren’t any adverse conditions. I’m also not afraid of being replaced because I’m an equipment operator with a CDL and no robot will be invented to take my place in my life
time. Now you freight haulers I’m sure will still serve a purpose because as we all know robots won’t be navigating through city streets in a large car! But robots will bring freight close to cities and then humans will take the loads in which I can handle cause anything’s got to be better than a swift driver in my f-in way!
I was against it, only due to the fact that the geeks who will create the software, will not be able to programm all potential situations, having no experience driving a big rig. However I am slowly starting to lean toward the idea. This is because where I live, truck driving has been taken over by new Canadians, God love them, who did not come from a driving culture. As a result they drive their trucks like drunken sailors without a clue where is up and where is down, so to speak. The roads have become dangerous. Last year was the first year in history when most truck vs 4wheeler accidents were caused by the truck driver. In all cases the names of the drivers were from South Asia. Last Friday I avoided two major crashes with rigs doing idiotic and unpredictable things in front of mine. Both were driven by the mentioned. I am starting to fear driving, a feeling that was up till now strange to me. So I’m thinking the geek programmers might do a better job than the current crop if steering wheel holders we have up here in the Province of Ontario, Canada.By the way I like them. They are mostly decent people. But they can’t drive for sh….t.
dude i am from canada and south asia and drove 1.6m miles without a single incident and dnt ask me how many in usa idiots drivers i saved from suicide both in car and big rigs. swift, prime, crst, werner, kinght list is long buddy.
dude i am from canada and south asia and drove 1.6m miles without a single incident and dnt ask me how many in usa idiots drivers i saved from suicide both in car and big rigs. swift, prime, crst, werner, kinght list is long buddy. u cant relate idiot driving skill to race or region it is universal😠😠
Forbid driverless semis !!!!
drove for 12 years both as a driver and owner operator, i say “BRING IT ON”. a human drive receive hate from car drivers, police, DOT, border agents, dispatch, broker, shippers, receivers and finally family everyone loves truck driver money and rip it off.
i will not drive on roads where driverless trucks are in operation.
Sure its a great idea. Cuz computers never malfunction, freeze up, and surely the geeks that program have thought of every potential.
I reckon I should quit trucking and hurry off to law school. Think I will focus on truck injury lawsuit. I see a fortune to be made when first driverless truck screws up.
As long as it doesn’t put drivers out of work and is done so safely then I’m all for it, but if you start putting truck drivers out of work I can’t imagine that the full list of vehicles will reach their destination. Be real. If you plan to take away that which allows us to feed our families while you enjoy financial advancements…it will never work.
I do not have a problem with robots driving trucks. If they do not wear flip flops, jogging pants, dirty tee shirt and shower more often that once a month!
GPS-based autotrucks will never be viable. Mark my words. There may be some success so far, but soon a hard limit will be reach which cannot be properly resolved until said vehicle can think for itself and act on its own. Fully auto will NEVER happen.
Self-drive with a trained monkee – er, human – always behind the wheel, that MAY succeed for a while. Until the first major accident. After that, back to manual drive.
Again, mark these words.
Driverless trucks??? Makes about as much sense as headless horsemen!!! Just saying….
Sounds good. So maybe now the trucking company will finally be fined for overloads and anything else in the truck that’s out of compliance the driver was forced to accept or lose there job. Karma