werner per diem

It's a ripoff!
No two ways about it!

What is your dog in this fight? You show us no experience or time as a driver?
Both of your posts in here support this BULL CRAPOLA Plan! That's starting to tell me that you know trucking from the office! Not behind the wheel!

Of course Warner doesn't "lay off" anyone! A trucking "layoff' is what companies like Arrow does. Just close the doors and go hide!

Others, they fire drivers! As to the office personel I could really care less about them! It's the drivers that do the money making as trucking needs a driver to pick up and deliver the load and that ain't done from driving a desk!

If you are an accountant of course it looks good to you as you aren't on this end of the equation! The driver is not getting squat! He's getting screwed in all four of the areas I mentioned! Unemployment, workers comp, social security and money for a loan as they don't "see" the per diem pay, just his taxable income and this loan could be for anything from a bicycle to that nice shiny Peterbilt or house or life saving surgery!
Yes it does help to get "out from under" the ex wife in alimony but if he's using it to "get out of" child support I have a gun to put to the scumbags head!

Warner gets a large tax break from paying into SSL, and FDIC and everything else NOT to mention the ripoff charge to the driver for this FREAKING privilege!

Per Diem should be an opt out decision and NEVER a must do! It should NOT cost a driver for some scumbag BFI company to make that kind of money for a cheap arsed service they came up with! They "make" over $500,000 a MONTH off of their backbone personnel not to mention the screwing they are doing to the gooberment in taxes in a "legal" manner!

The ONLY reason these companies do this is for their own wallet! They get out of paying taxes, they make money off the driver which is a win win deal for them! Not so for the driver! They know this but not to many drivers realize this as with the fleece plans they can be gullible!

Again, DRIVERS especially you new people per diem is a $59 a day deduction from your taxes at the end of the year. This price goes up almost every year! Per diem PAY isn't helping you any! It's a few dollars in your pocket but it does not add up in the long run!

I hope you don't get hurt while on the truck! Workers Comp pays you from your taxable income! So guess who comes out ahead on this? Do I need to point? Yeah I do. WARNER!

Unemployment is the same thing! Say Warner fires you for something stupid and your state decides after the arbitration meeting that they have to pay you. Are you ready yet? If not I'm going to do it any way! WARNER wins again! You didn't "make" that much (that before tax thing) and well instead of say $300 a week unemployment you get a great $225 a week! OH WOW take care of your family on that pathetic amount!

And then there is Social Security. That is if it's still going when you retire! Do I have to spell it out for you? I hope you understand who made out better than you in all three of these examples! And it #### sure isn't any of their drivers! Or any of the drivers nation wide that got sucked into the per diem plan!

I just hope you aren't looking to buy a home, car, motorcycle, go into business or anything where you need a loan and the lender looks at your W-2. Not only do you not get the loan as your income "shows" your gross isn't good enough to support the loan but your "Gross Income" is also part of your....credit rating! Yep that score is a little lower with that "lower income!"

If that pathertic pay you're making with that mega carrier that's still cutting your pay because they are STILL telling you that rates are down is so bad that you have to "supplement" your pay to their advantage and a not so good one for you then you deserve to get this "bent over the tank" deal! I just hope you like the sand they use as a lube!

I just love it when office pukes comein and attempt to BS their way through a threador attempt to coverup the truth!

 

It gives the driver more money in his/ her pocket on a daily basis yes.
But since they lower the drivers base rate of pay to cover the perdiem it is a rip off.
You get your perdiem deduction at the end of the year anyway. So they are not really giving you anything that you would not have gotten later anyway.
Now if they give you a full normal rate, and then will pay you perdiem on top of that it would not be a rip off.
It only becomes one when they pay you a sub-standard rate as your base and then pay you the perdiem to get you up to a more normal rate.
Though most company's that pay perdiem do not pay a decent rate anyway. Anything under .35cpm is a rip off, even for starting drivers. Hopefully this will change in the next year or two, but I doubt it.

 

One point of interest is the ability to deduct employee expenses on your income tax. Those expenses are allowed on your schedule A form after subtracting 2% of your adjusted income. If you don't have enough deductions to file a schedule A then you wouldn't be able to get any credit for those expenses. The per diem is paid to you in full and isn't shown on your W-2.

So the companies do get a big advantage by paying you your normal eating and lodging expenses as per diem as they do not have to track and report your itemized expenses on that amount. But if you cannot file a schedule A then you would not have gotten your expenses as a deduction.

So for some drivers the per diem is a good deal. If you have enough deductions to file a schedule A then it may not be as good a deal. But who wants to keep detailed records on all of your travel expenses?

 

Calm down there, Super Trucker. I'd hate to see you blow a gasket or something. My point is simply that for most drivers, especially beginners, they aren't going to see the difference in their taxes because they don't itemize and they're not going to see a difference in unemployment because they are working steady now and it's unlikely that unless they get fired, they're going to need to worry about that in the short term. However, for a new driver starting out, a few extra bucks in the paycheck can help out a bunch in the here and now.

Get past yourself and everything you THINK you know and start living in the real world.

 

Thanks for a calm answer at least, but I gotta disagree. You seen a whole lot of companies starting beginner drivers out at .35 CPM, have you? Why don't you tell me who they are?

 

Oh pick my silly old arse off the floor before I Laugh it off!

ka5pfb you're not quite correct either but not like this!^^^^^^^^^

I drove for a company that put $500 in my hand before I left and when I got back I had to give receipts for every penny I spent out of that cash. Then there was the first I ever drove for that the money they put in my hand went to truck only expenses and nothing for me. Now if I DID spend any, the receipt was turned in and deducted from my pay check.I got the receipt back to claim on my taxes.

Now as for deductions it doesn't matter how much you spend if it's a deductible such as OSHA required shoes/boots which you must or should have they are deductible. SOME clothing if a uniform and required by your company. Safety equipment you are required to have if not supplied. Then you have such things as paper towels, window cleaner, windshield fluid, scales, tolls fuel, light bulbs and other things for the truck that they didn't refund you for or just won't!

Your cell phone, broadband card, computer, printer, CB, GPS, ink pens, maps (paper) note pads and on and on if they are used for your work then yep they are deducible! Almost anything you buy that is needed and used in your line of work is deductible and there is no lower limit! Your CPA can give you all the information you need!

A hint: Get a CPA that specializes in trucking! Not a big box store open at tax time only!

Your REAL per diem is figured by your log book. For every day you spend away from your home domicile is counted as a per diem day! Last year they gave a $59 deductible and it'll change again this year! You leave home at 8am you start counting until you get home! If you stay out for the usual 28 days a month then you claim 28 for that month. You MUST keep the logs for life. Get one of those office file boxes and keep the stuff in there! I have 2 in the attic. inside a steel fireproof lock box (deducted on my taxes 20 years ago!)

OK, lets kill a really bad "fact" that all Americans think is gospel! You should keep ALL tax information/papers/forms for LIFE! NOT the 7 years that all believe! The same with the logs! Just get a large manilla envelope and put them in there. I count the days and write them on day 1 and also on the front of the envelope so I can add them up that way and also put on my tax worksheet excel sheet for easy figuring at the end of the year! Now, I KNOW someone is going to say they were told that you only keep all that crapola for 7 years. OK, do that, BUT if you have to do an audit and it falls in a year past that seventh year have fun! I know I lived that hello BUT I had the years they wanted and actually got money back! The burden of innocence is on you not on the IRS!

Now kdryan: what is your dog in this discussion? You've been a member since 05 and have 30 posts. Fill in the blanks on the profile or tell us now or go away! HOW MANY YEARS BEHIND THE WHEEL?

What I THINK I KNOW is more than you even know! If they were paid a FAIR CPM then that ripoff per diem pay would NOT BE NEEDED! PERIOD! You office pukes or should I say with venom on tongue COLLEGE BOYS would finally get your heads out of rose colored libtard heaven you'll realize that bull crapoling those of us who have been there done it and aren't afraid to call a pile of bull manure who they are you just might get the respect of those that matter! That BS sentence of yours....

is total crapola! If they come out of class in July it doesn't matter?

And we've ALL seen where a driver drew a line wrong or some minor infraction or had a non preventable and got fired. POOP happens and that stuff happens! If they can get out of paying ANY unemployment or workers comp they #### sure will until the driver or trainee or rookie figures out the ropes to pull and gets it!

And why would they not itemize? Anyone with half a brain will itemize especially after several weeks of eating in truck stops listening to those older hands talking! That's how you learn is by listening and these days money matters and per diem pay doesn't look right when you see what the real reason behind this RICO act is!

My comment about FAIR CPM stands solid! if these BFI's would pay this centuries fair pay then that rip off per diem is what I'm calling it, a RIP OFF! The silly thing is you know it! Why pay someone something they'll get at the end of the year as deductions and just give him the same pay without STEALING that $.01+ CPM to "figure" or "give" to the driver pay he should already be getting! He already made the money! Give it to him! Get OUT of their pockets and quit screwing the gooberment OUT OF TAXES and the drivers out of something that could save their homes and families later with this crapola!

It doesn't matter if he's a rookie. Those payments to the gooberment do matter to him or someone with 2 years or 30 years! All this tells us or them when they finally figure it out is this company doesn't care for the money makers they hire! As long as they can make and keep "their" money then screw the driver! Why don't they start to screw with the office personnels pay like this? HMMMM? OH! I Know! They would walk out of the office and go next door!No one to LC or FM or dispatch ect! They don't have a DAC or CSA to worry about as word of what happens in any office in a town gets around fast and they'll have a job tomorrow!

 

Ok, I obviously have no idea what the hell I am talking about here, so will quietly withdraw from this conversation and leave it to the rest of you...

 

Rollover the Original,

You are right that all expenses on the job are deductable. But those expenses are claimed on the 1040 Sch A. You are already given $5700 if you file single or $11.400.00 if you file married filing jointly as a deduction.

If you are a company driver, even H&R Block knows how to prepare your return. Now, if you are L/O or O/O it becomes a whole different matter and I would recommend a CPA with experience in truck driving.

If you are getting paid 28 CPM and 8 CPM is per diem then your only making 20 CPM. The per diem is only to cover your travel expenses. That comes out to about $200.00 per week on average. If it only costs you 100.00 per week to live then you have made a free 100.00.

The real problem is that the driver usually doesn't have much choice in the matter. So the debate is mute unless it is worth changing companies over.

 

I have seen H & R Block screw up a company drivers tax return and had to amend them to fix the problem.

 

You are right, I guess that was a mistake to make that comment. Anyway a good tax guy can figure out employee expense deductions.