Hello, Im new to the forum and did some searching and can't find an answer so today I joined in hopes some of you could inform me about the situation I am in and if what I am about to do is against the law or not.
I work for a off road race shop and we have a FL-70 freightliner that has been converted to a motor home with kitchen, shower and toilet (aka a toterhome). We use it to tow either our stacker car hauler to get our trucks to local races that are here in town but have recently expanded and are now traveling to out of state races and we tow a "vendor trailer".
some stats...
When the vendor trailer is attached we are 71 feet long in total.
The "toter" is registered as a motorhome and has "not for hire" on the drivers and passenger doors.
Currently, besides the logos on the toters doors we have no logos on anything BUT that is going to change soon and we are planning on doing graphics of our logos, the sponsors logos, and logos of the stuff we sell on the trailer.
I have been told that in AZ my length is legal since we are registered as a motorhome but if we add logos to the trailer that we can be considered commercial. I will only be driving in AZ, California, and Nevada and am concerned that I may get in trouble...
Many other vendors in my industry are doing what I am doing with full graphic packages on the hauler and trailer and have the exact same equipment and registration I do and have been doing so for years without issue BUT they dont know if they are illegally operating or not. Basically, they are simply getting away with it (so far).
Is it illegal? because it is my understanding since we do actually sell stuff we are commercial but since we tow with a motorhome we are not commercial. Occasionally we have a race car in the trailer and are a just a race team going racing which should be fine but what if we dont have the race car?
Does anyone have an wisdom they can lend me so that I can stay within the law?
I have a class B license with airbrake and passanger endorsements.
Thank you for your help...
Is this illegal or OK?
Discussion in 'Trucking Industry Regulations' started by dan200, Feb 27, 2012.
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Your best bet is to check with DOT.
You are a commercial enterprise but you are hauling your own stuff. Assuming the registration is legal you should be alright. -
You do absolutely need the guidance of an Attorney experienced in trucking. He can keep you legal and keep you out of trouble.
At this point, the real difference between legal and not legal is how you respond to questions from enforcement officials.
Seriously, there are good Legal Eagles on board here- you need their guidance and help. It's every Law Enforcement Officer's job to discover a crime and report it. Even if it means manufacturing one. If you don't know your status, if you're not practiced in responding to truck inspectors and enforcement employees, you're a series of violations waiting to be uncovered.
Don't expect every department's Police Officers to know every detail of the law. If they don't know for sure if you're in violation they'll issue a citation and let you defend it in Court (knowing that almost every driver just pays the fine and pleads "Nolo Contendre" or "Guilty")
So arm and prepare yourself with knowledge before you discover how outrageous those fines can be.
"Don't feed the Bears". -
Have you called AZ DOT and asked them ? They should, I said they should be willing to help and assist you with your question.
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If you race for prize money, it is considered commercial. Class B won't work either since you're pulling a trailer.You may need IFTA also since your're running out of state.
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You need to call Arizona DPS and speak to one of the truck enforcement guys. Don't hold anything out like exactly what you are doing. From the sounds of it, you will need almost everything. Tell the the VIN plate weight of each unit, because licensing deals with VIN plate weights. Also tell them the overall length of the combo. so they can give you accurate info. It may not be a bad idea to go and meet personally, take pictures of the rigs.
What I hate is someone will call in and ask a question. However, they don't exactly tell you everything. They ask the question to hear the answer they want, or they anwser shop a bunch of different folks to hear the answer they want. hen when they get stopped, they cry wolf. "well I called such and such." When dealing with the questions you have, be thorough and ask everything. But more importantly be honest so down the road you don't have any issues on the side of the highway. -
Thank you everyone.
I decided to ask about this here because the answers I got so far were basically inconsistent.
I have a friend who is not DPS but he is a cycle cop for a local agency and he is a "big rig inspector" (sorry, i dont know the correct term but i thought he said he was a level one?) he confirmed it is a grey area. He did say that the motorhome registration worked in my favor but, as you guys pointed out, if they wanna "get me" they can and will.
the school I went to for my class B wasnt positive either but said basically the same thing that my cop buddy did.
Today I am going to the MVD and I am gonna ask them (I have to go there anyway so I can kill two birds with one stone)
After, I will check with DPS.
If anyone can offer me more info I appreciate it. I will report back what I find out.
Thanks again...dave26027 and rookietrucker Thank this. -
The logos will make staying 'non commercial' difficult.
Since you are pulling a trailer that could be over 10K GVWR you also need a class A should you be deemed to be a CMV.
Hearing that you sell stuff it will be dificult to remain non commercial, the motorhome registration implys non-commercial but pulling a logo covered trailer is the same as drawing a target on your back...
You can't be a 'little bit commercial' just like you can't be a 'little bit pregnant' -
I would sit down a read your state specific tagging rules.
If you call most of these affirmative action employees couldn't find their acses with both hands. And public serpent employees are just about always going to to tell you the MOST EXPENSIVE way to go, don't hing you need irp or ifta and may not need a class A cdl depending if your setup is considered private or not. I would have the class A anyway as it is easy to get if you have a class B. I find I have saved myself lots money reading for myself. -
This was asked on another forum and the one responder had a 'vintage' racecar and he hauled it with a private rig. He was popped in Cali, they considered the small winner's prize for winning a vintage race as being a commercial vehicle...your mileage may vary.
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