CAT C15 /6NZ trouble continues

Discussion in 'Heavy Duty Diesel Truck Mechanics Forum' started by truck 307, Dec 20, 2017.

  1. truck 307

    truck 307 Light Load Member

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    Swaan, i have a question. How do you know if injector seat no longer trued up ?
    CAT ran sight glasses , one pre, one post head, sight glasses mounted on pass side mirror, nothing showed, zero air whatsoever.
    What im thinking is , if a injector seat is failing, somewhat of a burn mark or whatever, will be on the seat of that injector itself.???
    what do you think.
     
    SAR Thanks this.
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  3. spsauerland

    spsauerland Road Train Member

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    2013-07-11 04.41.49.jpg
    First o-ring just helps to form carbon dam and is sacrifical. If gas travels past seat, it moves up and eventually passes past middle o-ring getting combustion gas in fuel. One I seen with bad seat had soot on lower part of injector above seat and blueing from heat. Middle o-ring was not gone, but looked slightly charred. This problem is why Cat wants you to replace injector hold down bolt Everytime it's removed.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2018
    KB3MMX, Diesel Dave, Oxbow and 2 others Thank this.
  4. truck 307

    truck 307 Light Load Member

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    There was a gentleman who called me a few months ago who ide love to talk to again. He had 3 Petes, 379 models with 6NZ CAT engines. I believe he was in his 70's and told me about a identical problem im having and he ended up making up new fuel lines just befor the pump to have that line higher before the pump. Reason being he had a cavitation when the fuel line sat lower before the pump. He said because the fuel tank was lower than the pump, when he shut the truck off for a period of hours the fuel drains back, leaving the primary fuel filter half full of air which i myself know it does as does many others who called me. The air , of course, then travels upwards to its highest point, and with the fuel line just prior to the pump being lower, air pockets in the pump, and sits there , unable to pump out with the fuel towards the head. Sounds nuts, in one way, but very possible, obviously, as the guy whome i seek to talk to had this exact issue with all day stumbling and popping, untill he raised that fuel line so air pockets in it, in stead, and gets pumped at high speed through the pump which breaks apart the air quickly on start up and keeps it flowing.
    Reason im looking to talk to him now (over and above the fact my issue is still an issue !!) is, i just spoke to the techs (3 of them) at the stamping plant for Honda which i haul for, and all 3 had to do just that with a diesel back-up generator. They fixed the rough running problem saying its not the first time they have had to re-route fuel lines to be higher just prior to the fuel pump because air pockets in the pump system. The 3 techs went on to say the same thing happened with the last gen-set, and the plants oiling system for the presses and coil steel rolling out just before the press stamps the parts. They have no idea why it works for a few hundred hours when it was new, and all of a sudden cavitation begins, which is remedied by re-positioning the fuel and oiling lines just prior to the pumping system. Evey time the plant shuts down saturday night, to restart Sunday night, this cavitation happens and doesnt go away, until "we reposition the feed lines just befor the pump, so to be higher for air to pocket in it, instead of the pump, this way the rapid flow makes the air flow freely and quickly through the pump, a hard to hear hick-up when air purges through the pump and, in the case of the generators (they are massive, at 100 kilowatts) its nearly not audible at all when the air goes through, and before, with the main fuel feed line lower than the pump, air gets trapped in the pump because its the highest spot, and it wont pump through, it just sits there, and the generators 80 HP motor runs incredibly rough "
    So.. im hoping the older gentleman who called me a few months back reads this and calls me again. (i kick myself for not writting down his number )
    My number, if anyone has any info or other support, is; 905 746 5505
    Call or text me anytime. If i dont answer, leave a message and ill get back to you quickly.
    Great thanks to everyone
    P.S., next Wed April 18th i go back to CAT for my 11th appointment there to try to figure out this issue.
     
    Oxbow, spsauerland and SAR Thank this.
  5. Dino soar

    Dino soar Road Train Member

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    Just a suggestion but if air in the line before the pump is a problem you could put a check valve right there and that way the fuel can not go back to the tank and it stays primed. A check valve is very simple and quick to put in.

    I only run a mechanical truck because I've always known that these kinds of problems could happen that nobody could fix and this is much more widespread than most people realize or would like to admit.

    I truly feel for you, I'm glad that you're still under warranty, and I'm happy that things look like they're on a more positive track for you.

    And it's nice to know that so many people have tried to be helpful for you.

    Good luck.
     
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  6. truck 307

    truck 307 Light Load Member

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    Dino Soar.
    Great thanks for your support and wishes. It' been a long journey, a lot of money, and worst of all, constantly thinking about it.
    Thanks again.
     
    Tug Toy, SAR and Oxbow Thank this.
  7. truck 307

    truck 307 Light Load Member

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    BIG DAY TOMORROW.
    After upteen rides with CAT tech in passenger seat, and 2x having district manager also, along for the ride, they agee theres an issue , and tomorrow, they put 6 new injectors in my horse, under warranty.
    To briefly update everyone who has been supporting me.
    Darn near every day, and always after about 10 hrs driving, the engine slowly but surely starts running free of all issues. Ive been putting the new Howes additive in the fuel, given to me at the Toronto truck show a few weekends back, by a HOWES representative (2 bottles) created solely for sticking injectors. That and some trans oil.
    Anthow, im off. Will update you all later.
     
  8. pushbroom

    pushbroom Road Train Member

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    Woohoo! Hopefully she gets all fixed up!
     
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  9. truck 307

    truck 307 Light Load Member

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    Ya. Im looking forward to it.
    Truck has never run right since I bought it.
    Strange though, I drove it like I stole it before I bought it. I know things happen at random, but dam..!!
    First mile I drove it after I bought it was when it all started, back in August 2016.
    I look forward to not obsessing, worrying , thinking, spending 100% of my energy, every second I drive it.
    Its tirring and I've shed 10 years since I bought it 21 months ago. !!!
    And of course, I'm one of those guys who just has to know !!!
    I thought to sell it but I don' have it in me to stick someone else with the problem.
    One way or another, ill figure it all out.
    Thanks for your support.
     
  10. truck 307

    truck 307 Light Load Member

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    Aged...not shed 10
    "AGED...NOT "SHED" 10 YEARS.
    ( o how I wish)
    38 years on the road. Working on trucks near every weekend. Its' taken its' toll.!!
     
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  11. bigguns

    bigguns Road Train Member

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    NEVER NEVER EVER put atf into your fuel system. I will highlight why because you have your major pain in the butt going on. Today's atf has many additives that are very harmful to today's injectors. Google lubricity tests and read the results. Somewhere on a Dodge Cummins forum there are pictures of a man's injectors after using atf. They were literally fried to death. Search on here also for fuel additives. Many of the so claimed best additives have a negative effect on lubricity as shown in independent studies (btw). I buy 2 cycle engine oil at Walmart. I add it at the rate of 1/2 oz. (US) per gallon. I only do this occasionally. Biodiesel is a lubricator and cleaner by itself. truck 307 you have my ph. num. if you want to call me. Dan
     
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