3406B/C piston bowl shape

@wore out

 

Nothing really matches that piston but a 130-5187. That absolutely will not work on a B pump.
OR-3425
OR-8785 (7W-7031) new number sorry I can’t remember the number for the 3425 new. Both of these are close and many people run the 8785. Pressure is a little higher on the 8785. Pin time it do not advance it ANY. You do you’ll be sorry.

I’ve hashed these motors to death. I’m not being rude or a dick. But usually a 100 questions follow the simple question. The search bar feature on here will tell you what you want to know and then some. Again I’m not being a Richard. I just don’t want to type it all out for the 100th time

 

You are 100% correct, seen you post plentiful of countless information on basically on the same thing over and over. I should’ve directed the OP to the search feature above, instead I tagged you, my Apologies. I understand it could get irritating especially when one is busy. And by absolutely no means, your not being a “Richard”.

 

I don’t mind being tagged a bit. I don’t mind helping a guy with a specific problem even if I’ve covered that one before. On these performance builds there is plenty of info already here for sure

 

Again I’ve covered this. 3421’s are gonna haze at idle I’ve seen it,


7W-7031 will work but not quite right your gonna have a smoke trail.
Pop pressure will work on your pump


8789 and 8790 will not work on your pump period.


yes IPD says the 8785 works on that piston but it in fact isn’t right it’s close cause for the 10th time the 1258869 comes from a 4ZR gen set engine. 4ZR used a 130-5187 nozzle with a 140 degree spray cone. 18 degrees timing.

None of these other nozzles use a 140 degree cone absolutely none. The 130-5187 also has higher pop pressure, and a 7 hole spray pattern not 6. So it uses 130-6634 plungers and barrels not the 130-6633 that the rest of the C’s use. They are also the only 7 hole spray pattern in any B or C.
You want it to burn clean and not carbon pack that top ring your gonna use it or it won’t live long and you’ll blame parts and scratch your ### and cry. Put a C pump on it put the proper plungers and barrels in it and have the timing set with a meter. Anything less and within 200k you’re gonna be sorry.

Let me explain to you the difference in me and all this other advice you read. I’ve first hand tried it, not sat on the ####ter surfing CAT SIS and turbo catalogs.
I build 15 to 20 3406’s a year. Everyone is power hungry. My personal rig was 700 to the ground with conservative fuel. Had to shut it down at 1800 because the dyno was getting hot. I by no means think I know it all, but I’m #### sure not regurgitating info from any well respected source.


Before you come at me with a B pump flows more than a C that’s ######## too.

 

I’ll be honest here if you’re gonna put a crank in it etc what’s a pump?

If it was me I’d leave the crank alone buy the b enhanced durability kit. The wide rods of a C ain’t enough to help it live. Just isn’t. All the V engines still use that narrow journal. And with you guessing on the injector that puts you in the same spot as the using the C kit since the B enhanced kit uses a 3408 HUEI piston. Same end result less money.

 

Piston design is completely different. As in the 9Y-4004 has a lot more meat from top ring land to top of piston which is why they can handle the high timing.

the 160-1131 is also a small pin B 14.5 to 1 B piston used in the 5YG 460hp with the 3425 nozzle. They were a PEEC engine with 14.5 degrees initial timing. Wide bowl with a lot shorter distance from the top ring land.


The 3408 HUEI piston is a wide bowl, and doesn’t even use the standard ring packs. Their rings are thinner, it’s also advised to use a split ring compressor to prevent from breaking the inner ring lands. If you use a universal or 1 piece taper the odds of that are really high. It resembles the 160-1131 way closer than the 9Y-4004. Sad IPD sells this #### and doesn’t understand what to sell with it. Because everyone thinks 14.5 compression is what sets the nozzle when in truth is bowl design, spray angle, and timing in the pump and advance.

See another thing you run into is base timing on a 7 FB starts at 21 ends at 32 if your pushing it. Starts advancing at about
1400 if your shooting for high side of OT spec.

A 5yG starts at 14 and ends at the same 32 or so. But starts advancing at 1300. So see how using just the PEEC internals with a 7FB pump can get your mid range where you run and need power outta whack. And even with a meter you gotta split the difference. There’s no way to have perfect efficiency. Timing is more that hitting the bowl in the right place with the spray. It’s about hitting the bowl in the right place at the exact time in the pistons rotation to make optimal burn and power. So you go to ####ing with nozzles and pistons you have to choose, you can hit the bowl at the wrong time in regards to where the piston is in its circle or you can miss the bowl and hit the piston at the right place in its rotation. Finding some middle ground helps but it’s never right. Now I’ve really tried to simply that explanation I can give you the very technical one if you wish. Timing is the one part no one understands and this is the exact reason I spend hours helping people with the exact same problems cause their brain don’t get how I explain it. Some where here I helped a guy a while back get a B/C cross back together and running good. I posted pics of used pistons that showed these differences very well. I will also tell you that #### about this nozzle flows more that that is crap. Your flow is in your rack travel. The difference in most nozzles is crack pressure and spray angle. This is getting to be a book so I’ll stop there


Yes that carbon is a combustion issue

What’s the spray pattern on top the bowl look like that will tell you if it’s timing, bad nozzle or most likely your running a 160 degree thermostat and kick your fan on too often and it can’t ever get to operating temp.


That rumor not to let a CAT get to 200 is a farce. They need to run at 190. Heat doesn’t crack a head. Pressure does. As in boiling coolant pressure or pressure from a blown head gasket due to low liner etc.