They’re months behind schedule, but the Hours of Service (HOS) changes have finally been proposed. Despite having only been available to the public for a few days now, they are already being picked apart by journalists and drivers alike. Here is your comprehensive look at what exactly the HOS changes entail.
The Notice of Proposed Rulemaking (NPRM) put out by the FMCSA has five proposed changes. The first would increase the amount of drive time that drivers get in order to “mitigate the effect” of adverse driving conditions like bad weather from two hours to four hours. The second would increase the short-haul exemption radius from 100 to 150 air miles.
While the first two likely wouldn’t have an impact on the vast majority of truckers, the next three might affect everyone on the road.
Mandatory 30-Minute Break
Currently, drivers are required to break up their 11 hours of drive time with at least one break lasting at least 30 minutes. That time must be logged as off-duty.
Under the proposed rule however, that 30-minutes could be logged during “on-duty/not driving” time. So, if you’re filling up your tank and getting a cup of coffee at a rest stop, that can be your 30-minute break.
Additionally, it will only be required after 8 consecutive hours of driving time instead of after 8 hours on on-duty time.
The 30-minute off-duty break was the target of a huge number of comments submitted to the FMCSA. While the change does add flexibility, some drivers are still unhappy that it has survived in any capacity.
Split Sleeper Time
Another of the most-requested changes to the HOS rules was allowing drivers to split up their 10 hours of required sleeper time into multiple segments different from just the current 8/2 split that’s allowed. While the proposed rule does give a little more flexibility, it’s not much.
In the proposed rule, drivers would be able to “take their required 10 hours off duty in two periods, provided one off-duty period (whether in or out of the sleeper berth) is at least 2 hours long and the other involves at least 7 consecutive hours spent in the sleeper berth.”
With a minimum of 7 hours for the long block, FMCSA would essentially be allowing an 8/2 or a 7/3 split. That means it would not allow more sleeper time to be split 6/4 or into more than 2 blocks of time. FMCSA notes that the time would not be counted toward a driver’s 14-hour on-duty time.
On-Duty “Pause Button”
In most situations, drivers can have up to 14-hours before they need to fulfill their minimum requirement of 10 hours of off-duty rest time. Once you start driving for the day, it’s a race against the 14-hour clock. But under the new rule, FMCSA is proposing to allow drivers to “pause” their 14-hour clock for between 30 minute and 3 hours. If a driver does that, they will need to take 10 consecutive hours off-duty at after they’re done driving.
The proposed rule would allow a driver waiting to be loaded or unloaded to pause his clock and not lose that driving time. But the 10 consecutive hours requirement would mean that regardless of whether you’d already taken a 3-hour sleeper berth break, you’d still need to wait at least 10 hours before driving again after you turn in for the night.
Both owner-operators and large carriers have reason to be thrilled with this change. For owner-operators, it allows the flexibility they need to wait out bad traffic or mitigate the damage caused by a slow shipper or receiver. They’ll be able to drive more miles, take more loads, and – hopefully – make more money. Carriers will be able to get more driving hours out of their drivers per day, reducing the number of units they need to have on the road at once and/or increasing the number of loads they can take.
At first glance, it seems like a good deal for company drivers too. Covering more miles per day means making more money. But critics on the proposed rule point out that carriers are essentially getting the ability to extend their driver’s days by 3 hours. This could effectively mean a driver’s workday would be 17 hours long.
Source: FMCSA, FMCSA, gobytrucknews, truckinginfo, truckinginfo, fleetowner, overdrive, overdrive, freightwaves, freightwaves, freightwaves, ttnews, facebook, businessinsider
Ri ma says
FMCSA, you and the larger carriers can keep your elogs period. Drivers are unsafe. Didn’t you get that statistic earlier? Shippers, receivers are a big problem with a truckers HOS. Trucking is the most unproductive occupation there is. You (fmcsa) want input from drivers, which means you know nothing about the industry you want to control. I believe if a driver could make the same money in one week in another occupation, you would far fewer drivers than ever. Take a survey about that. Now, for those who think If you don’t like this profession then get out( f*$#@ you). Don’t tell me how to make a living. As an O/O, I will start driving OTR part-time and local part-time this coming December. If the fmcsa and big carriers wish to get rid of the O/O, be careful what you wish for.
Rawdog says
You do know that no one cares what you think or do right?
Road Runner says
Unfortunately you 100% Right!
Ladon Farmer says
Actually they need to do mileage for otr 700 miles per day or up to then straight 10. Day driver get hourly pay do hourly log simple
Mr says
Yes that sounds good !
Nathan says
Almost, they care when the SHTF.
Chris. says
I keep saying fmcas can do whatever they want. But it’s the wages that are NEVER compensated. They can cut driving to 5hrs a day but the drivers always loose. What we should do is “ strike “ for 1 month that will get the message across. But as always most drivers just bend over.
Agree 100 % with you.
Davis Hutchison says
24 hours is all it would take since no one warehouses anymore.
Rick says
GO wash dishes
JMC says
The mega carriers want the O/O’s to quit. They purposely make deals with customers to keep the freight rates at the lowest prices just for this purpose only. To push the Independent owner operator out of business.
And they work with the government to help change the rules to favor their profits. ELD’s are now a standard. Werner started it and look where it’s going now. Next is speed limiters. You watch.
Richard Gaskill says
JMC, you’re right. FMCSA is bought and paid for by ATA with millions of dollars in political contributions. OOIDA doesn’t contribute 1/10 as much as ATA.
As far as speed limiters go ATA no longer wants them so there is no concern there.
Jonesio melandes says
Very good comment!
Road Runner says
👍.Right On!!!
Richard Gaskill says
RI ma , Seriously? You’re the one that knows nothing about the industry. There are plenty of productive drivers and carriers in the industry. There are thousands of drivers that have no problem with elogs because they won’t work for carriers that set unreasonable schedules.
You say there would be far fewer drivers if a driver could make as much a week in another occupation. Department of Labor statistics show the average annual earnings of a truck driver are the same as the average American worker. So other occupations do make the same amount a week. Average means some earn less but quite a few make more. But here’s the thing. Most other workers make the same money working 40 hours a week that many truck drivers have to work over 60 hours a week to make
Rawdog says
If people would quit driving for 💩 companies and guys who own their trucks would stop hauling 💩loads none of this would be a problem! My company respects us drivers , I work 4 days a week make 80 grand a year and set my own schedule, other than one delivery appointment a week I decide when I leave and when my back haul is loaded for me . You wouldn’t need to run your balls off if you would just find a company that treats you right
Lady Doe says
WELL WHO DO YOU DRIVE FOR!!!
JPW says
please tell us who you drive for Rawdog
JPW says
every company I have worked for I have worked at least 80 hours a week, cheating the clock of course. Where should I look? Every company promises one thing and then expects and requires another. I`ve only been driving 2 and a half years so maybe you more experienced truckers out there can share some tips with us instead of just telling us how stupid we are.
Teresa says
I work for a fantastic company- I generally stay out 2-3 weeks 5-6 off and make a 6 figures!
Warren says
Get used to it driver! All ANY company wants is to get as much outta you as possible!! Money bubba!! It’s not about YOU!!
Ray Darzinskis says
I used to be leased to a GREAT company, then Quality Carriers bought them and it turned to dung. Just the admistration required by the government makes it difficult for small businesses to compete with the mega bottom feeders. Good companies hire good drivers. Bottom feeders hire anyone with a pulse.
Dan says
You do know we all think you’re full of Crap .
Kenny says
You really don’t belong up here bragging how good your life is and how much money your make.
Don says
Funny how comments like this never tell us what company you work for. I think you are full of it.
Duh says
And if idiots with 💩 for brains would stop looking at our industry like it exists all alone in a vacuum…
It the Economy, stupid.
Crappy Freight rates are determined 100% by the free market. No one is going to sacrifice their personal buying power or personal income to help truckers get better pay. You want to change that?
Just 2 Easy Steps! You have to convince the rest of America that:
A -)They should have to pay more $ for everything they buy. We deregualted in 1980 which assured that for the rest of time, it will be “Truckers vs Consumer” – But even if you do get traction, the populist politicians, say like…Far Right Leaders, who just pandered to us to get their guys in office, will now turn on us, and run entire election campaigns on “Keeping Prices Down for America: Fighting Against Truck Driver Greed” and “Should Your Kids Starve so a Truck Driver Can Make More Money?” and “The Average Truck Driver Already Makes More than the Average American Household, So Why are They Holding Our Economy Hostage for More Money?”
It’s not right, and its not fair, but that is the way it is. Ironically, over half of the truckers will vote for the people who those candidates who keep our wages down.
B-) That the government needs to regulate CEO/President/Corporate income. The Top Brass at companies aren’t going to take the hit, so either the consumer pays more for goods or the truckers get paid less for hauling them. Trust fund baby Richie Rich,III, esq isn’t going to give up his yacht for you. Good luck getting the rest of America on your side when you can’t even get truckers to support measures that help truckers!
Clint says
Sir my hat’s off to you you have found the perfect job not to many out there congratulations in a perfect world you got going on
dave bean says
unfortunately not every company in the states makes electronics.
the real burden is being carried by the raw material segment of the industry. without which nobody has ‘nothin’. most segments of this end of industry has filed for exemptions but not everyone will be granted these, the smaller you are the less likely.
it is unfortunate that those who just add zeros at will survive and brag about their acumen. and those who sweat for every penny and bleed for every delay will continue to suffer.
the real problem is the lack of parking , and the availability continues to decrease even though there has been some very good efforts on a few fronts.
-nobody wants to drive tired.
-these days everyone schedules a realistic day.
-delays will always be a part of the landscape.
if someone has more than three 18 hr days in a week they would be more than happy to reschedule, but with a split bunk this would be manageable .
your driver should know when he is tired and be able to rest wherever that happens to be. or buy a drone
Jeff says
Well good for you. Happy for ya stop preaching how good you have it. Those jobs are far and few between and you know it. Your contract or job could be gone tomorrow.
JMC says
They are all the same out here pal. You need a reality check.
Jonesio melandes says
With you 100%
Road Runner says
Hah!
I’m doing this 4 a while…,look s like you a recruiter .Are you?
Mr says
Easier said than done.
Richard Gaskill says
Raw dog, I agree. I worked a similar job before retiring. We ran elogs and had no problem keeping scheduled appointments. That’s the thing. Get away from those grocery warehouses and find a carrier with deliveries by appointment or drop and hook. Appointments almost always guarantee detention time if delayed.
Pete says
So who do you work for, get me a job
Ri ma says
rawdog, No I don’t. Now you know where I stand
Charles says
Like most all industries, and this one with so many moving parts, with many beyond driver control, there is NO perfect solution. If you have options, dont enter this field. If you work for anyone or depend on others in your business there will be some element of eating crap. Its just that simple, in this “human construct”.
Robert says
Like the article says, its another way for the mega fleets to extend the drivers workday for less money. As for the split sleeper birth, well the fact that you still have to take a 10 Hr. break after you PAUSE your clock for up to 3 hours defeats the purpose of the split sleeper rule. Back in the 80’s, we were able to split the sleeper birth continuously going up the road as long as one time wasn’t less than 2 Hrs., so it would be 5 then 3 then 5 then 3 until you took your 8 Hrs. So it should be your 2-3 Hrs. PAUSE then 8-7 Hrs. repeating until you take your 10 Hrs.
What I see coming from this is the Mega Fleets once again getting the upper hand by exploiting these New Millennial CDL Holders for more hours for less pay. There will be more wrecks out there from the Mega Fleets due to this because you know darn well that a majority of these New Millennial CDL Holders will not be in the sleeper getting some rest for up to 3 hours but on their I-Phones, Tablets or watching You Tube during this PAUSE period knowing they can extend their driving time up to 3 hours now.
Crossbuck_jim says
I, being at the start of the millennial generation, can tell you I would never defile the sanctity of a well earned nap with over prices gadgets.
*as a side note I am in fact at home relaxing and not on an fmcsa mandated 30 min break.
Bert says
Right on Robert! It IS the megas with their mega-dollar lobbying (dollars) pouring into FMCSA’s pockets. Over abundant greed covered up as “increasing profit” is the bottom line from megas to Washington. These sons of bitches need to be uncovered, spend time behind bars and away from their families. A vast majority of us drivers are spending time in our rigs as if they are prison cells, just hoping situations turn favorable. Hell, this used to be a proud profession until lawmakers (lawyers) learned to exploit it. Stay safe fellow drivers.
Richard Gaskill says
It isn’t the lawmakers that created today’s conditions. It’s ignorant wannabes that agree to work under the conditions. Nothing will change as long as carriers can keep the seats filled.
Warren says
Totally agreed
KW says
The government needs to stop trying to control the trucking industry. ELDs are not helping anyone but making the roads less safe with drivers that are forced to go to sleep at 2pm and then start driving all night after the “10 hour” break. What happens when a truck driver is not tired and can’t fall asleep that whole day and now he is forced to drive all night. This is ridiculous. This is pure dictatorship.
Kev says
I’m already driving 15 hrs a day straight no breaks. FMSCA really needs to look at ag HOS. I could drive 2 days straight and no one would say a thing. How is it safe having ag companies pushing drivers without breaks? There will always be tired drivers until everyone has to adhere to HOS rules.
Ri ma says
rawdog, after reading your other post, I don’t run my balls off. I don’t haul cheap freight, and I own my truck outright, which I believe helps. I make very good money and keep my 2005 Pete in top shape. My beef is the little box on my dash telling me when to sleep and when to go back to work. That violation on my log because of an accident, adverse weather, hung up at a shipper/receiver, making us outlaws is bs, even if only a 1 minute violation. It’s happened to me personally a few times. You’re right about working for a good company, I am with a good one for just over a year now. I do my own maintenance, but not on-duty time. We’re supposed to be on-duty. Again I’m an outlaw. What I do at home is my business not the fmcsa or anyone else’s. I wash my pickup and semi on my time. That won’t change.
Patrick Conley says
I agree 100% with you, I stepped away for driving just before elogs came around. Now coming back to driving…and the new to me blogs I see right away that their doing more harm than good. My company says take your time and drive safe, which is great for a company to tell you…but you cant, not when you have to Race the elog clock that continuously is on count down as soon as you log in. If your tired you dont dare stop and rest, or take a nap because your time continues to count down. If you hit “off duty” it should be just that…Off Duty. I’d like to know what book learned genius came up with that..your off duty but your still considered on duty and lose your time. That was brilliant! (Sarcastic) That doesn’t even make sence logically. But that’s part of the problem, the people making these rules or laws where never drivers and have no real idea of what we deal with. In fact even with dealing with the b.s. elogs I make no more now than I did 25 yrs ago driving, pay scale goes up everywhere but to drivers and we’re the one that have to deal with all the crap!
Wayne witten says
Well here is my opinion…
The broker’s are thieves. They steal the profit off the top of the loads up to 60% in some case’s they need to be regulated…. Then hou have shippers and receivers who hold trucks at bay for extreme amounts of time. They need to be fined large amounts then they will stop and think twice about their actions. Everyone thinks we make alot of money truth is us small operations are just 1 breakdown away from bankrupt. We used to be able to afford to maintain nice equipment and buy nice equipment not now barley making ends meet. So big brother is constantly on us how about getting on the right people. And the large companies who train new driver’s need tougher standards and put out better drivers that would make things saffer for everyone.
Richard A. Creitz says
I think the 14 hr rule is completely unnecessary!! As long as we get our sleeper break.. That is all important. I love the elog for the reason of no stress about being in violation.. But that being said I can’t stand being 30min or less from home and not being able to go on home. We should be able to extend our 11hr and 14hr up to 60min to get home period. One major issue is the increasing lack of places to park and stress from not being with our families. There has to be a way to get us home more without compromising safety and not losing freight for our carriers. You could extend our 10hr off duty buy the amount up to 60min that we need to extend to get home. I know tons of factory workers that work double shifts of 16hrs and still drive an hour or more home!! But that’s OK! And don’t use the excuse that we operate an 18 wheeler cause if he falls asleep and drives into me or other vehicles it’s all the same. I’ve been driving 40yrs and what I see is so many drivers using phones while driving and TOO MANY 4 WHEELERS TAILGATING WITHOUT ANY ENFORCEMENT!!!!! THIS HAS GOT TO BE MANDATED TO STATES TO TARGET!! ALSO ANY DRIVER NOT HOLDING A CDL SHOULD HAVE TO WATCH A VIDEO ON HOW TO SAFELY DRIVE AROUND SEMIS AND OR A WRITTEN EXAM AT TIME OF THEIR RENEWAL!!! THIS WILL DRASTICALLY REDUCE ACCIDENTS.
TY FOR THIS FORUM FOR US TO EXPRESS OUR PROFESSIONAL OPPIONS SINCE WE ARE THE ONES THAT LITERALY DRIVE 10 TO 15X MORE THAN MOST FOUR WHEELERS!!
Demitriy Sulima says
Let’s keep it simple
16 hours on duty
11 hours driving
8 hours consecutive sleep
And no splits, if’s and but’s.
Monica says
I am 31 years into this career. I just want the flexibility to be safe. Not be against the clock. If while driving I can take a nap and not loose my hours. Traffic is bad? Let me pull over stop my clock, sleep and continue when all is clear. It’s been done this way for years. More drivers pulled over when needed, now it’s go no matter what ! Safety is not the outcome of the rules. We have been forced to race, get stressed, and be more aggravated with the job. I make my appointment on time, but run out of hours at receiver, now I’m stuck in the door. Explain how to leave legally? Next truck parking is 20 miles away.. this is ridiculous
Richard Gaskill says
Monica, don’t you know they changed the Personal Conveyance regulation? You can now drive a loaded truck off duty to reach food or lodging. There is no stated allowable distance or time.
John Smith. says
Two sets of rules, one for sleeper trucks one for day cabs. Day cabs 12 hour. max day, nothing like running 13 hours nearly non stop Monday- Thursday, than your company holds you working a dock until you have to use your 16 hours to get home. ( not legal) but your company expects it every Friday/Saturday. Great idea now we will be working 17 hours on Saturdays. Why don’t they just the company owners permission to shoot us, this would be a kinder more humane death.
OG says
The issue we MUST look at today is this new rule that your clock starts in driver status at 3mph. This rule will not allow you to move from staging areas to dock doors. Also if you are on site at your del. or pickup for hours and get called for door you will need to start your 10 hour break over again
Alvin Butcher says
We’ll said! Scrolling!
Travis says
I suggest a 14/8/2 clock with any off-duty break time for: meals, shower, shopping for supplies, etc. logged as off duty but not counting against either the 14 or the 8.
It would work like this:
14 hours of on-duty time encompasses driving and any other on duty not driving tasks. 8 consecutive hours of off time whether in sleeper or out. 2 hours of discretionary time to cover things that happen that are not work related incidents.
In the allotted 14 hour time frame, the driver can: pre-trip, load, fuel, drive, check in at shipper or consignee, position truck on the dock, post-trip, etc.
Give an additional 2 hours per day (that don’t count against the 14 or the 8) for non-driver related incidents. Kind of like the proposed “pause” as mentioned in the the new ruling. In the event that the driver has a roadside emergency, flat tire, traffic delay, weather related closure, etc., these events should be logged and not counted as on-duty time. It is these types of events that directly effect a driver’s ability to work and are 100% outside of his/her control. In these incidents, a driver will have up to 2 hours to claim for these events that will not count against his/her 14 or 8. Should this event extend longer than 2 hours, that time then starts to counts against the 14. With GPS monitored ELDs it’s easy to determine vehicle movement so log book ‘fixing’ and ‘cheating’ hours wouldn’t need to be a concern. As a driver, when I can’t perform my job due to circumstances outside of my control, I shouldn’t be penalized for the time needed to fix that issue.
The only other factor that needs to be considered is loading and unloading time. When pulling loads that are live load and unloads, the wait time at certain places is almost criminal! The time refer drivers are asked to sit in a dock door while they get loaded or unloaded is a frustration that few people are aware of if they’ve never done it. These wait times shouldn’t count against the driver. Wait times that are 0-2 hours in duration should be logged using the 2 hour ‘discretionary time’. If the load time exceeds 2 hours (which it will many times) the hours spent waiting should be logged as off duty time and credited towards the required 8 hour off duty time.
As drivers we are extremely independent people. Though there are always ‘boneheads’ in every group that are bad examples and shouldn’t be driving trucks, the majority of professional truck drivers are responsible and more than capable of making good decisions about how to manage their day and transport loads safely and at a profit. Lawmakers without CDLs and driving experience shouldn’t be passing laws about operating and managing truck driving responsibilities.
Vi says
It seems fair except the ability to use up a drivers 17 hours without rest by the company. The fact is, good, drivers already give more time to their job than the 14 hour clock. Companies only care about their money. Bigger companies already work a newbie to death with few miles. This will potentially result in more new drivers quitting or making mistakes.
I always felt that two 15 minute breaks (pee time/short walk), at the drivers discretion,would have been more beneficial than the required 30 minutes.
*Remember that the government can’t regulate companies into doing the right thing towards their employees. No matter the department.
Mr.Peterbuilt777 says
Yeah… All this really does is give the more creative and greedy owners and dispatchers just more ways to work us harder and make more money for them.
I know two in particular who are probably creaming themselves right now as to how much more they will be making at the expense of their already over worked and seriously underpaid drivers.
JPW says
sorry for your losses Tom.
Danny Casey says
It sounds good as long as carriers don’t take advantage of the three hour rule and start putting the driver in a position that they have to work 17 hrs.flexible is great if used correctly there is enough stress in truckers
Casey says
I have never seen a bigger bunch of whiny ass cry babies in my life!!! When the existing rules went into effect, we all asked please let us be able to stop the clock. Please let us not have to take the 30 minute break.
So guess what… now we can stop the 14 hour clock when we want to. And the 30 milk and cookie break is effectively gone. AND YOU GUYS ARE STILL PISSIN AND BITCHING!!!!
Christ… they gave us 80% of what we asked for!!! The proposed rules are a good compromise between what we want… and the government says. I’m surprised and ecstatic the FMCSA gave us anything. They could have told us all to go hang. (They’ve done it before.)
And to you drivers that like to live in the 80’s, guess what… them days are gone. Get over it!!! ELogs are here to stay. Insurance companies like them. Safty departments like them. Drivers don’t like them. Suck it up Butter cup… they aren’t going anywhere.
Also your company SHOULD be raising your cpm to compensate for less loads hauled. My company has raised our pay (company truck) twice in the last year. There’s also talk of another increase coming in the next few months for us.
If a few of you would look past your egos, these new proposed rules are a pretty good thing. They aren’t perfect. If you’d try to work WITH them they just might help your day.
Farrell D.McKnight says
To whom it may concern, We have many people in Trucking and Government officials that have no idea and have never driven a rig in there life. All I can is wake up, truckers are what keep America running and we want to be treated equally and that means pay and DOT rules made to benefit big corporations. I may quit over all this it’s not worth it anymore.
Rambo1 says
” OUT OF TOUCH !!!! ” Conceivably drive/work for 17 hours and the next day it would penalize and only allow 8 hours. Who spins this stuff ? “
dave bean says
you’ll need 10 bunk hrs if you extend the day
Warren says
Great response
Gerard Mesidor says
I just think that trucking is not for truckers because we are the one getting all the troubles driving and not able to see and understand all these nonsense rules here to punish only drivers and make big companies richer. It should be about those losing their lives and away from their parents and families and just can’t see their loved ones because of companies never get enough and acting as vampires. On top of that you have the DOT waiting just to get their hard earned money on tickets sometimes companies push drivers over the top just to please them and kick them out when bad things happen to them.
southbaydude says
I drive regional and get paid by the hours based on my elog hours of service. Plus 12% commission. I don’t know if I could go back to getting paid by the mile. Seems like such a rip off when you consider the company rules for detention pay and layover pay. Which means you have to give up some free time just to get paid under minimum wage to get layover/detention. I have to follow the California employment rules which are different than the HOS rules. I have to take a 30 min break before the 5th hour if I’m working 8 hours and another 30 min break before the 10th hour if I’m working 12 hours….It also means that I only go the speed limit because if I go any faster?. I’m actually losing money. I think these new HOS rules, if they go thru. Are gonna screw up a lot of independant drivers elogs……Seems like a class will need to be taken just to understand it clearly…
Jonathan Turner says
I would like to see a split sleeper of five and five this will give drivers more time to enjoy their meal instead up having to rush back to the truck and get in the to sleep
Cassandra Chotiner says
I have a feeling that if the 7/3 split goes into effect, I, as a company driver, will be getting less than the needed 8 hours. There are many times I have to go go go as soon as my 8 hours are up now. 7 hours is not enough sleep for me usually. My company utilizes every second I have now. I do like the idea of the pause button though. Sometimes needing a nap or getting stuck at a shipper for hours makes that nice.
Long Hauler says
More focus should be put on the shippers and receivers to get us loaded and unloaded much faster. Every load is in the computer, they know when we are going to be there for the PU why should we have to wait for hours ? With the equipment now a truck should be loaded in 30 minutes or less. Lowering our down time and increasing productivity.
Donald says
Replace everyone in the FMCSA and put DRIVERS in to run it then and only then will things get done I will bet my last dollar the only thing FMCSA know about trucks they have seen a picture
Concern says
I think you need to leave it alone as it is ! No more changes and if drivers would stop thinking of them selfs and think of all the people around you that might have children in the car you would learn to appreciate the elog ! I’ve done it both ways and its honestly nice to be able to break and not be pushed to go when you tired after 10 hours
Brian G Benson says
Ok, we’re talking crap and I don’t blame you. Trucking isn’t perfect, but it doesn’t have to be so freaking difficult either.
The Difficulty being caused by
1) bad and/or wrong types of regulations (basically ALL of them)
2) non-knowledgeable people (of all kinds – public & government) trying to
control our trucking jobs (we don’t tell you how to work)
3) shippers & receivers (refuse the troublemakers)
4) Mega-fleets who don’t care about their drivers ( who know who you are)
Now, because these things are part of our lives in trucking, we have to deal with them. But we don’t have to accept whatever comes around from them. Thank goodness someone in the FMCSA is listening.
As for the HOS changes, my comments are:
1) 30 min break – STUPIDEST THING EVER REGULATED, PERIOD. DISREGARD IT
TOTALLY. I’m all for breaks, but I know I’m smart enough to take a break WHEN I want or need to AND for how long. Don’t regulate it, jeez.
2) 14 hour Duty clock – NOT QUITE SO STUPID, BUT COULD DO WITHOUT. I’ll give this 3 hour extension a chance, just because if that’s all we get, it WILL HELP, BUT I WOULD ASK THAT ITS PUT TO THE GRAVE along with the 30 min rule.
3) Sleeper Split – I’ll be using all the splits, I would love to have more options available such as; 8/2, 7/3, 6/4 up to 5/5. NONE OF WHICH COUNTS TOWARD 14 HOUR CLOCK, BUT EXTENDS IT. The 10 hour break rule stays the same.
4) My Own Rule I Propose (I think I may speak for 90% of truckers AND all O/O’s such as myself):
For every 24 hours:
1) maximum 11 drive hours (consecutive OR split)
2) maximum 3 hours onduty not driving (as needed throughout the drive shift, may also use this time for nonconsecutive/non-regulated breaks)
3) minimum 10 hours offduty/sleeper, split however we need it, up to 5/5.
4) 24 HOUR DAILY RESETS after 10 hour (or any 2nd split 10 hour) completion within 24 hours. 24 hour starts with first onduty status after any complete reset (rather than a 14 hour onduty clock).
BASIC EXPLANATION: In 24 hours, you can do 14 hours of work – includes 11 driving, max 3 onduty ( may use this for breaks) & 10 hours off – USE AS YOU SEE FIT. No 14 hour clock, nothing consecutive needed except Sleeper split up to 5/5. No regulated 30 min breaks
PLEASE CONSIDER THIS, FMCSA. It’s easy, not complicated. Saves EVERYBODY money, saves grief, saves jobs, saves economy, SAVES MAKING AMERICA STAY GREAT!
Warren Kennedy says
This proposal will let me nap when I need to when I’m tired and there has never been a dispatcher good enough to exploit me. I can drive 11 hours and rest for 10 everyday. I own my truck and I find my loads. As long as I trip plan I make good money and dont drive tired. This industry is not about me….it about what I can bring to it. We all need to grow up and see that all the whining will get us replaced by technology sooner than later.
Jay says
True!
Owner operator says
Let’s the damn robots run the trucks . See what happens. These damn no trucking pencil pushing law makers make me sick. ELD’s suck. Treat us like children. Wake up. Strike is what needs to happen. No common sense out here. That’s what’s wrong.
Kenny says
I ran 10.5-11 driver for nearly 4 years before that regime ran me into the ground of exhaustion. Now i run everyday on recaps and it’s a little better. Whatever FMCSA decideS I’ll be the one to decide how and when I run. I had one cocky broker question me cause I told him I don’t run nights. Lol, I will if it’s absolutely necessary but I didn’t tell him that and didn’t for that particular load. DRIVER, YOU ARE IN CONTROL whether you realize it or not. Don’t let money control your life. Regardless, we work too many hours never any overtime and never living a “normal” life getting to visit with friends or just hanging out on the weekends. This is a lifestyle that is quite isolating but I value that time to get closer to God and to escape the bs of the 9-5 horse crap that goes on in the warehouse sector. Anyway, you drivers know what you can and cannot do. Choose wisely for the welfare of public safety and peace of mind. They can change these hours all day long. I’ll work my 8 hours and be done and that’s that.
Stephen P Smith says
Kenny, I think you hit the nail on the head, “I’ll be the one to decide how and when I run.” Ultimately it is YOUR CDL, it is YOUR life. YOU decide when you’re safe or not and if you’re going to run. If a company, load, shipper, receiver, broker or anyone else pushes you, YOU still make the decision to be safe, period.
Jay says
True that!
Jt says
I understand your feelings and empathize with you, they are very ungrateful and devoid of compassion. Hope life will improve soon.
Gil says
Large truck accident rates were on their way down before the law changes were made in 2004. The 30 min. Break can now be used while fueling or what ever. Why make this stupid thing complicated. Simple, get rid of it. Now we can split our birth from 8 n 2 to 7 n 3. What difference does that make. The only decent part is now we can pause our 14 hours for up to 3 hours. That allows us to work around some traffic situations but it allows the shippers and receivers to hold us, which it is these factors that are the biggest issue. It also allows these larger carriers to push us for longer days with less in pay. It allows them to raise their detention times before paying out. These detention times are so stupid anyway. When an individual is on company time waiting for a load. He or she should be paid the minute they are at that customer til they start driving again. These carriers with their beuarocrats and lobbyist have screwed over the drivers for decades. We have to ask ourselves as drivers how is it these large carriers are so large, small carriers are so few and CEOs are so damn rich while drivers have been barely scraping by, yet we still hear the same BS we have heard for decades. Driver Shortage. Give me a break.
dave bean says
has anyone ever documented wasted time at shipper/ receiver?
i mean industry wide.
or is the liability of this number too scary to compensate for.
we all know it is a problem but it is still only a part of ‘delays’.
i imagine the number is disputed because of demurrage pay.
i get a little irate when someone ‘offers’ 50 bucks an hour after two.
-perhaps if we log on to ‘personal use’ every time we feel like we are unreasonably delayed at ship/receive we could work that into our paychecks. at least we, as drivers, would have some kind of bargain chip for future negotiation; just notate it as ‘delay time’.
Michael Blosser says
When does this actually go into effect?
Charlene S Mcgowan says
Well Canada was the same thing. Their great answer was strike .when everybody did or most it all stopped pay increase ten times even when their over here I’ve talked to them their pay is tripledon loads I’ve seen their sheet verses the exact same mile and place sitting next to me. I almost got 😠…can we strike ask the Canadians how they all got together and did this. They bent everybody backwards and forward on that strike demanding that everything change..I’m in who’s with me. Talk to Canadians. It worked for them now their only working sux months a year. If they want because of that. And other awesome ways. I would build a website and advertise on radios to start get ears rolling out there..three days a week we can go that much without pay most of us.
Matt Newsome says
then when driverless trucks come out and yall gotta listen to your wife bitch all week, you’d agree to wear elog necklace to get back out on the road. Also, yall bitch about corporations and then vote republican. Problem with it all is greed and ignorance.
Irelandgirl58 says
Upside, the 30 minute break can include fueling time, the break being from driving. Plus being able to stop the 14 hour clock for up to 3 hours at a shipper or reciever could help a lot. Guess time will tell. Still would have loved to have seen the 14 hour rule eliminated entirely.
Henry Big Boy says
Can someone tell me how the hell in the world do they know what the fauck do I do with my 10 hours, if I’m rested, or partying? What a load of the HOS & ELD are? Land of the free, and home of the brave my arse.
kenneth mckenzie says
FMCSA can use all the smoke and mirrors they want, but it still all come out the same. The biggest issue and most damaging rule, is the 10 hour sleep break. I don’t for one minute believe these rule makers go home and sleep 10 hours a night. That said, why in the hell do they think we need 10 hours of sleep. If we could do 8 hour sleep break and 12 hours driving time, the rest would fall into place.
Rob says
I spent 7 hours getting unloaded and loaded yesterday. How do I get to earn a living FMCSA?
Stephen Palmer says
This will 1000% screw over drivers it will certainly lead to 17 hr work days for drivers. You want to make things efficient then make companies have to pay a driver for all the time he puts in for them. Guaranteed they will get onto shippers taking 8 hrs to load when they have to foot the bill.
Warren says
Forget it driver!! Companies will NEVER be in this for YOU! It’s all about their wallets thickness! PERIOD
Suck It says
The split sleeper option is lackluster at best, but being able to pause that clock even for just three hours would help me a lot. If I had been able to do that two days ago, I would be sitting on my couch right now instead of sitting at a shitty ass truck stop for 10 hours. I don’t mind a longer work day if it means I get home Friday evening instead of Saturday morning. The proposed rule changes aren’t perfect, but it’s better than what we have now. But, as sure as the sun rises in the east, truck drivers will complain about everything.
Alyssa says
I like the change to the 30 min break rule. The sleeper berth doesn’t apply to me since I drive day cab so no comment there. But I’m VERY concerned about the possibility of having a 17 hour work day. Carriers already abuse the 16 hour rule for day cab drivers, you KNOW they will abuse the “pause” button!
Jeremy says
Solution is simple: mandate all company drivers to be paid hourly. This will put pressure on shippers/receivers to work faster on our loads. Carriers will not want to continue to flip the bill on 8 hour unloads.
Tredder says
I will and do only work for companies that pay hourly. All pressure is on the company and shipper to get you loaded and offloaded as quickly as possible , while drivers can drive more safely at the speed limits posted, and not be as stressed out in traffic jams ect.
Jay says
I agree 1000% jeremy
Robert Phillips says
If you’re going to allow a 17 hr day why not make it 17 hrs of driving and Working and then a mandatory 8 hour period of sleeping time you make it so confusing and its just a good way for people to mess up and take away the 70 hrs and 60 hrs rule because it is going to cause a problem with the work time allowed in the week everyone will run out of hours sooner.
john says
Short after they did the mandatory elogs, I quit OTR and went local, took a paycheck cut, but I’m home daily and I don’t have to worry about hours of service, I haul agriculture within 150 miles of the company.
Derek says
Jeremy, you’re the only logical, coherent minded person here.
You’re all on the road to make money for your time.
That’s where ALL focus should be. The big wigs, whether it’s the FMCSA or a lobbying company conglomerate, have baffled all of you into focusing on the “rules”.
…as they continue to pick your collective pockets…smh
Warren says
My next job is paper log! Perfect! When I wake up! Coffee n roll! And I don’t mean cinnamon roll! Lol. And as usual; when I get tired I pull over and SLEEP!! Not fuel playing on phone getting coffee or stay awake bulshit! I get the job done and I’m safe as hell on the road!! All y’all big shot rules are for thickening YOUR wallet!!
Michael DiMatteo says
If you don’t know by now 99.9 of the driver want paper logs with 11 hrs.,14 hrs.,and 10 hrs.
Go back to before you screwed thing s up then just leave us the fuck alone things will be all right!
Jerre says
Well in my opinion instead of making things more complicated. The simple fix for everyone. Get rid of 14 hour rule.let us have 11 hours driving and we have to take a 10 hour break in that 24 hour period. That gives us 3 hours to spare.Then we can work the day our way with out racing the clock. Quite simple I think everyone would agree.
Stephen P Smith says
Love these comments . . . proof that Drivers will never be able to organize and try to gain any control over anything within the industry we live and breath in. So many unfounded opinions, arguing, egging each other on.
Grow up people, be the professionals you want people to believe you are. If YOU can’t respect each other, how do you expect anyone else to???
Oh, and as for these proposed rule changes and the “Safety” of everyone, the drivers, the public etc., this is all typical industry status quo, were going to talk about safety like it’s something to believe in, but behind the scenes we’re really going to find more ways to manipulate the rules and make drivers drive even longer (extend your 14 hour rule . . . SERIOUSLY!?!?!?) all in the name of chasing that almighty $$$, NOT safety.
ELD’s have made it much more difficult for drivers/companies to cheat, resulting in less freight moving. This in turn has produced this so-called “Driver Shortage”, causing wages to (Finally) go up in an attempt to lure more drivers to the industry to keep that same amount of freight moving.
This isn’t brain surgery people. Stop trying to drive more hours per day, let this “driver shortage” keep getting the pay rate to increase to a reasonable wage, and you won’t NEED to drive more hours, you won’t NEED to drive tired and/or unsafe. If we drive the same hours we do now, we need more drivers. How do we get more drivers? Raise wages. Result, you drive the same hours (NOT more) and you make more money, and isn’t that what you’re REALLY after?
We finally have wages trending in the right direction, driving more hours per day to keep freight (and YOU) moving more hours per day is only going to hurt that trend and we’re right back where we started.
“DRIVE LESS – MAKE MORE – BE SAFE”, this should be the cry of every American Truck Driver, IMHO.
Eaglet8118 says
Been out here on this road for over 20 yrs and one thing is certain is this industry is always changing and that will be our constant reality. It still beats being in a factory or in a cubicle. The road has been good to me and has put 2 girls through college and 3 more girls opportunities they would have never had if I wasn’t out here so no matter what the politicians and government decide I will still be out here as a paid tourist until I am able to retire.
Jonesio melandes says
With you 100%
Bill says
The 14hr day with 10hr driving 8hr split break was the best. Use the same rule with the ELD. All they are doing is bouncing around the problem. The original rule worked just fine but was easy to cheat with paper. Compliance and safety would be achieved by simply reinstating the same rule with ELD. I realize the people making the rules have never held a CDL or driven or tried to sit in an idle truck for 10 hrs waiting to be able to move but as a driver I get more tired from waiting to drive somewhere than actually driving. Safety declined in the trucking industry when the face of the driver changed, NO not a racist so don’t take that the wrong way, our industry has been flooded with untrained drivers of all races and ethnic groups that are being pushed beyond their ability and exploited due to ethnic background ..inadequate training, low wages push these new faces beyond their ability to be safe. And finally .. if your working by the clock then get paid by the clock, drivers should be hourly paid if we are regulated by time. Ok I’ll give you .xx cents per mile and this 65mph truck along with the ELD that’s gonna limit your ability to make a living even more..what experienced driver is gonna take that? Here’s the new face of driver I was speaking of… be safe
Trucker 309 says
The FMCSA will keep asking for public comments on rule changing. But at the end of the day the ATA gets what ever it wants.
For those of you who question that need to dig and do a little homework. The millions of dollars being paid to these leaches will blow your mind. The ATA mouth pieces include those from mega carriers like Swift Werner FedEx Prime Inc. JB Hunt Schneider etc. The ATA basically sets the stage of the industry. Essentially they are the reason for the ELD. Reasoning: To keep drivers out of the truck stops and casinos and behind the wheel. They call it maximizing productivity! Guess what it works, look at you go now compared to 10 years ago. The OOIDA group fought tirelessly to keep the ELD from being law but at the end of the day the ATA is bigger and financially more powerful. Quit arguing about the ELD and HOS, work with it and do your best, your real fight should be on driver compensation and benefits. They’re about 20 years behind on this issue. If you felt well paid there would be no bitching about HOS or ELDs.
RL says
FMCSA—- ALL IN THE NAME OF SAFETY!! RIGHT
Chris says
What I don’t understand is why they can’t just make commen sense rules. What’s with all these complicated 8/2 splits, 7/3 splits within 2 blocks bla bla bla… wtf
Common sense rules like:
– voluntary 30 minute breaks (if anything, government should mandate COMPANIES to give drivers time for a 30 minute break, not mandate it on the driver)
– company standard but driver voluntary 10 hour reset (you know, sleep as much as you need to feel rested. Ain’t no computer going to determine that)
– company standard but driver optional 11 hours driving. An acknowledgment popup should come up on your logbook reminding you when you have reached your 11th your driving and are no longer expected to drive further (basically your shift ending). But if you wish to continue driving, that should be up to the driver.
– 34 hour reset? Get rid of that sh…
Anything government mandated should be imposed ON THE COMPANIES, such as a standard 10 hour daily reset and 11 hours daily driving, and used to calculate delivery schedules so no company can push drivers. And for those complaining saying it will cause accidents, mandate EXTERNAL front, side, & back cameras on all commercial vehicles to see who is truly at fault in accidents. It’s not fair that commercial drivers are immediately assumed at fault in accidents and risk losing their license, which is also their livelihoods.
What I like though is that Ray Martinez is actually open to take in suggestions. I was considering sending him my suggestions a while ago. Maybe this is my chance.
Pete says
100% right
Randall Lowe says
I’m a company driver, I’ve been told several times”you can work past your 14”.
Carriers typically don’t care how long you’re up combined with a long drive day, I’ve been threatened with disciplinary action, and I’m sure a lot of other company drivers have as well.
I’ve believed for a long time the American company driver has little to no representation in the industry.
Bryan Carlile says
I’m not sure I agree with the off duty fuel time. Drivers that work for companies with get taken advantage of taking care of company rig for no pay. If you get paid, you will have to show on duty . I’m an O/O it would help me . The pause would save me a great deal of stress, pushing to get off the road by the 14. This is a huge safety issue that it may help big time. Also get out of heavy congestion rush ours going through cities. Hard on driver and equipment. And help a great deal on parking when things have some flexibility.
But there is a big issue still not being addressed in all this.Shippers and receivers need to be held accountable legally for delays. You have appointments but they rarely hold up their end and cause all the down time. Split time helps a bit, but doesn’t solve anything of the problem just drags day out more.
Maybe detention time needs more enforcement, personally I start after one hour, if I have an appointment time, then that is the time they are committing to start. If they have their act together an hour is usually more then enough time. I don’t always get paid for it, but if I don’t I don’t haul for them. Why they waist my time and don’t compensate, why would I give them my service for free?
Stephen Day says
Working over 14 hours has always been allowed as long as your not driving. I was being written up for being over my 14 on a previous day by the DOT. I told the guy “you cant do that, as long as im not driving after that 14 hours is up i can work as long as i need too.” He took the charge off. A scale operator saw my logbook when i first started driving and logged it like i did it 17 18 hour day and he lookef at me and said ” i dont want to see this. You do what you have to do but when you log it i want to see that you quit driving after 14 hours”, gave me a warning for log book violation for further training. Im retired now. Im not asking yall to be safe, sometimes i got really tired of hearing that, be safe, be safe. Like what do you think im going to do drive off a bridge on purpose? I told one guy that i think was an off duty cop, he said, dont be careless then. i said yea i can do that.
Stephen Meyer says
I’ve been trying to tell all you clowns to pull a Nation wide strike for years on end and 95 percent have just stuck your noses in the air,all you think about is job security and your damn pay checks,I’ve been out here for 45 years and the drivers in this country have gone to the dogs for the past 30 years,as one police officer told me once long ago,the truck drivers in this country are nothing but a bunch of misfits and idiots,and you know something people? You have provided him right,so just shut up,bend over and do exactly what is thrown at you,You’ve earned it
Gryphon says
I’ve sat here reading all of the comments and some very good points made by many. Here’s my two cents, which is pretty much all it’s worth.
WE, the entire driving community are our own worst enemy. We brag, we argue, we chastise and we continue down the same path. Why? Because as a culture drivers refuse to come together as a whole. We have drivers working for companies, lease drivers, owner operators, the day cab driver to the long haul. It doesn’t matter where you are or where you came from, we are all DRIVERS. Yet, we cant come together as a whole, for whatever reason it is.
From the individual who brings in 6 figures to the guy who barely scrapes by on his per mile pay, we are all DRIVERS.
You want to change the way things are, then quit the hate, knock off the BS and do something about it. If, and it’s a big IF. If, every driver would come together for one month and shut down their rigs, stay home, take an extended vacation. This country comes to a screeching halt.
In less than a week, every grocery store shelf is empty, every fuel station shuts its doors and mass panic takes over. Within the second week, every state governor is activating the National Guard to assist with riots and attempting to get supplies to the people. By the beginning of the 3rd week the government is negotiating deals to get drivers on the road, deals that will put more money in your pocket. Life is good, but only for a short while.
You see. If you havent been paying attention, every major manufacturer is working tirelessly to perfect the driverless automated truck. Within the next 20 years it will be a reality, push for better pay, less restrictions and government oversight and it won’t take 20 years. It will be in five years.
If you dont think the carriers out there are looking into it, you’re fooling yourself. For the cost of the most recent lawsuit that garnered a 350 million dollar payout, the company could have 300 trucks running 24/7. No accidents, no hometime, no sick time, no health/life or disability benefits, no vacation pay, no late loads, no HOS and no more bitching. As for being an owner operator? If you think the mega carriers are pricing you out of a load now, wait until they make the prices so low you can’t make enough to put the diesel in your tank.
I would love to put a better spin on our chosen professions, but I can’t. The more you look toward the progress they are making with automation, the more you start to realize it’s just about over for all of us.
Pete says
Ok they need to get rid of 34 hr brake as we weekley drivers have 20-25hrs left each week that we cannot use. We all want to come home so why regulate us to sit in the truck at the truck stop instead of being at home with our families. Also there’s problem with parking closer to any big city that nobody seems to be addressing, once the shippers / receivers take their sweet time to take care of us we’re out of hours not to mention 90% of time they don’t want to pay us detention we’re stuck between 🔫 and the bullet. No you can’t park by most of the shippers yet dot can give us a ticket . That needs to change ASAP!!!!!!!!!!
Pete says
People who make those rules have no idea about trucking business