As the compliance date for the ELD mandate looms ever closer, opponents of the regulation have filed for repeals, delays, and waivers. They’ve mostly come from truckers, small carriers, and trade associations. This past week however, a new ELD opponent appeared in the ring: The state of Indiana.
Curtis T. Hill Jr., the Attorney General for Indiana, has sent an open letter to FMCSA Chief Counsel Randi Hutchinson asking that the ELD compliance date be delayed by 90 days. According to Hill, going forward with the current December 18th compliance date would “place undue burdens on drivers and operators.”
While it may be surprising to see an Attorney General throw his hat in the ring, if it were going to happen, it makes sense that he’d be from Indiana. According to Hill, nearly 200,000 truckers call Indiana home and one in 14 jobs in Indiana are related to the trucking industry. So if the ELD mandate does indeed cause as many issues as some fear, Indiana could feel that impact greatly.
Hill’s letter, dated November 29th, brings up a whole host of unresolved issues, but focuses first on the problem of ELD providers “’self-certifying’ their compliance.” Hill claims that since the government has provided insufficient oversight on which devices are and are not compliant, there’s no way for drivers to know if the “ELD-compliant” devices they’re purchasing do in fact meet federal standards.
Even if the manufacturers are attempting to be above-board about their compliance, there are multiple ways that they can fall short. Hill cites “extremely complex” technical specifications that “can be interpreted differently by individual manufacturers” as well as manuals provided to manufacturers that refer to sections of FMCSA’s website that say only “coming soon.”
The full list of complaints – which you can read in Hill’s letter here – is quite long, but Hill sums it up nicely toward the end saying:
“At present, too many questions surround the mandates with which drivers and operators will be expected to comply. As the deadline for compliance quickly nears, even a cursory perusal of industry trade publications provides clear evidence that many drivers and operators are completely unprepared for the proposed changes.
Recently the FMCSA has granted a few waivers, including a 90-day waiver for some ag haulers. Whether a state attorney general weighing in on behalf of truckers will sway the FMCSA to extend such waiver even further is unclear. According to Heavy Duty Trucking however, FMCSA Director of External Affairs Sharon Worthy said that “FMCSA is operating under a statutorily designated deadline for ELD implementation.”
Source: truckinginfo, fleetowner, overdrive, overdrive, wave, truckersreport
This whole ELD deal is crazy. There are people guilty of dealing drugs, child rape and even murder that are not tracked 24/7/365. Yet as trucking companies and driving a truck will be. This is just crazy. Welcome to 1984.
Very well said ELD is a modern days slavery
As soon as all the super truckers stop throwing their ripped up log paper confetti all over for everyone to see, maybe everyone would believe that paper logs are safe but most drivers prove the need for more safety regulations on the daily so get a different job if you dont like it.
Peter, this is a driver compensation issue. Recruiting people into the industry has become a matter of dredging the sewage pit of employment candidates, running them through a drug test to see if they can pee clean, and them treating them like garbage until the screw up or quit.
The kind of people who stay, under those conditions, are almost invariably the ones whose judgement is suspect. It takes a special kind of person to put up with the things that truckers do, and be happy doing so. Most of the time, that type of person is “desperate”, and as soon as they stop being desperate, they usually find better work and leave trucking. (With notable but rare, and possibly inexplicable, exceptions… 😛 )
When this describes the vast majority of the workforce, it’s no wonder that you are experiencing problems with “supertruckers”. But the answer isn’t ‘love it or lump it’; that’s actually how the problem started, and how we perpetuate it – even make it worse! The answer isn’t to try to regulate away judgement, to accommodate the stupid – The right answer, here, is to make the job and the industry attractive enough to quality employees, that this kind of mommying isn’t necessary.
Refreshing to see some intelligence in the trucking community!
40 years here. Don’t need a computer to do my job safely, legally and
well rested. I don’t need or want permission to stop to pee, take a break, tell when I’m tired.
What the industry needs is intervention upon the shippers and receivers and brokers,etc…whom seem to think we are their slaves and hold us way beyond minimum acceptable loading and unloading hours. Safety men and dispatch not on the same page.
I have trained people recently, who came out of “trucking school”, who cannot fill out a log book or drive. No common sense or aptitude to drive. Unsafe, distracted, unkempt, etc. UN-business like , and expecting a device to control them,
therefore we now have the ELD’s.
600.00 take home for 168 hours on the job every week.That equates to 3.57 per hour. Do the Math!
America in the trucking trash can.
The real truckers adapt to their driving situation. Now a days you can have a 20 year driving veteran that doesn’t know the first thing about trucking because they don’t even fuel their own trucks among many other things. This country depends on super truckers everyday as opposed to the by the book crybabies. The crybabies will be the first drop out of the industry due to failure to adapt, I’ve seen it time and time again in my 25 years of trucking.
Not helpful….
Why is govt not installing cameras in cars to check mobile phone usage?Do you believe that phone distraction accidents are far fewer than fatigue relatec accidents?
Its funny you want to blame “super Truckers” and their paper logs for an unsafe environment…. You might want to check the statistics here bud! Mega carriers that already run Eld’s have far more frequent and far more severe accidents than these O/O you are blaming.
As an O/O now using an official led I’m starting to come around to the idea. Stick with me here. We already have a shortage of drivers but load pay across the board is not really rising much because of it so far but mandatory eld use is going to compound this problem and at some point, because freight has to move, it will start affecting rates due to an ever growing lack of drivers. This means higher pay for less driving and who is really against that?
Man i am sorry to say i don’t think that will Happen for a very very long time. The problem i have been told buy other drivers that have eld’s is there dispatchers are taking anything they can get there hands on regardless of the rate to keep the truck moving so they do not set and burn there 14 hrs up… so in that respect there will not be any rate increases do to that fact, i hope that changes, and i will , over time, but we run 22 trucks and it is costing us 20,000 bucks on a two year contract with Bigroads, were can i make up that ? i have been told by two of my main shippers they are going to go with the rail road ,except for when they need a day or two quicker move, they say they went truck because we could beet the rail service by at east a day or two, but with the eld’s it will cost them more with somewhat the same service,,,, i see the rail getting rich over this, who owns the rail roads- that’s right , the goverment…… hope i am wrong, but i don’t see it…
Our Railroads except for BNSF are public companies they’re not owned by the government. The STB, and Federal Railroad Administration are reagulating authorities
Warren buffet owns BNSF
Technically Amtrak is owned by the government, but that has nothing to do with freight. From 71-99 Conrail was owned by the government but it was split up between CSX and Norfolk Southern.
On the subject of trains gaining a larger share of freight. Look up CSX performance under their new boss, and how the boss got his job. Also if you think 5pm in Chicago sucks, for rail freight Chicago is worse than that 24/7/365.
Dude. Don’t be so paranoid. The government doesn’t own the railroads. Even the freight railroad companies are privately owned. As well as the tracks they ride on. The government may have donated the land to the railroad Co’s but they, in no way, own the railroads.
more money for OOs yes sir right in brokers pokets,we wont see it
There is not, and never has been, a lack of drivers. Store shelves are not empty. There *is* a lack of willingness to pay drivers for what we do, and this has resulted in extremely high rates of turnover, where this problem is found – which, for the most part, is at the mega carriers. The outcome of that, is evident in the desperate, chronically-unemployed, or just-off-the-boat/refugee recruits which these carriers “train” to drive their trucks.
It’s not that there is any shortage of warm bodies to put in the seats and hold the steering wheels; it’s that the low compensation only appeals to people whose circumstances are so bad as to make their judgement skills questionable.
Instead of paying what it takes to recruit (and retain) quality employees, we bring in the dregs who can squeeze past a drug test. With those judgement skills on the road, it’s no surprise that the public and/or the government feels the need to regulate our every thought, right down to bedtime and eating your vegetables or you can’t have any dessert. When someone worthwhile does rise out of the muck, they almost invariably find something better to do than drive a truck, and we lose them.
Rates are not going up, and neither is driver compensation – not in any meaningful way. Quality is going down in favor of quantity, to resolve the “shortage”, and eventually we will be largely replaced by computers – “self-driving” and/or “drone” trucks.
You might as well bang the drum about raising the minimum wage to $15/hr. Right or wrong, it just ain’t hap’nen…
Absolutely spot on, Yowler!
Your thoughts seem to be right on point!
I’m not against that Mr truck driver but when u sit at a shipper like last week 6hrs 47min made me late cause of 14hr crap plus I needed to show 10hrs off,yes poor load planners but my point I’m getting at is that happened & I got blamed plus 2 loads before that I was 25min late & again showin my 10hrs off lol,that week I made $770.67 when my checks r between $1300 & $1500 so I keep going thru this & yes I’ll walk away without looking back,I’m not saying I’m better than folks but I have zero time for this & I honestly believe this industry is for these new age hands now so let bum have it lol,peace & b safe out here
Higher pay for the big truck company with 2200 trucks and the computer is driving the truck. These smart intelligent politicians on the hill don’t care bout a man who just wants to work and provide for his family. Eld’s and regulations are ruining the truck industry. For an owner operator like you to support the takeover means you are gonna support yourself out of a job pretty soon.
That’s my point exactly! Why kill yourself driving illegal just to make a few extra bucks. When we all get on the same page, wages will go up. It’s always been more freight than drivers. But, as long as there are driver willing to do the Dirty Work, we’ll never move forward.
They need to pay o/o right. To start with, so many owner operators are not getting pay right. The middle man taking all the money.CH Roberson is cripple the East Coast. The load might pay $4500.00,He will tell you it pay $1600.00 Crooks Crooks. I wish the government would make shipper pay people right.
Just think about this why is the middle man getting all the money.T hat ashamed.
I’ve already seen a rise in freight rates because of the ELD’s coming online. Company that I’m leased to decided to go with a system called Samsara and it’s been truly a nightmare come to life. If you have this system I feel for you. I stopped for my 10 break put the ELD into sleeper berth hit the green tab and it saved it to sleeper but I
went to bed and at sometime during the night the ELD put itself into sleep mode imagine my surprise when i got up to discover the ELD moved itself to on duty an hour after i put it into sleeper. That thing is in my bunk now, company can go screw themselves picking such a B’S system.
In you need a training how ton use the ELD. Am using ELD since i start driving big rig so no issues come out if you know how to use it, if you made mistake to your status except the driving status you can edit to correct it the the right status to your ELD. Now lot of drivers they dont know how to used properly the ELD. Once you know all the operation its easy and convenience. Unless your cheater so thats another issue right.
He mentioned a ELD from a specific vendor. If you don’t have that specific model then you can’t say that he needs to learn how to use it.
Right, the nerve of some people. So, you believe the ELD and not the driver. 🤔
That’s not necessarily true. Some ELD’s are garbage, JJ KELLER MOBIL/ENCOMPASS for one, and will change your duty status on its own unilaterally and I’m not talking about the “on duty to driving and vise-versa. It’s how the software is programed is what’s going to determine how it works and what does and can’t do.
I had a similar issue with mine. The safety director told me right before I got it that the company has a zero policy when it came to non-compliance. The very next week, the device said I left 10 minutes early off a 10 hr. break, twice. When they brought me in to chew me out about it and to fire me, according to the device, I was driving, even though I was in the safety director’s office.
Had a company GPS tracking device do something quite similiar.
Geotab is another piece of garbage.
It isnt a rise in freight rates,if I have to spend 2-3days on a one day load because of elog. It is called wasted time. I drive in every state except the one the FMCSA spends its time in, and that is the state of denial. I am not the problem with America’s roadways. If my government spent it’s efforts making things safe for me,then things would become safer for everyone else in the process.
The rules haven’t changed, you just have to follow them now.
If you were doing 2-3 days’ work in a single day before, we can basically thank you (and your supertrucker ilk) for the necessity to monitor HOS electronically.
The same way we can all thank morons who pop pills for mandatory random drug testing.
I’ve only been driving for 4 years so maybe I don’t get it. Every company I’ve worked for had ELDS. I don’t have a problem with them. Less paperwork. Personally, I dont want to drive more than eleven hours. I thought the reason for the ELDS was to get the truckers off the road that have been driving 20 hours. I haven’t been turned into a robot. I need sleep. I’m looking to get my own truck and trailer. I really don’t plan on taking a load that’s not going to sufficiently compensate the time it’s going to take me to deliver it. But what do I know. I’m still green.
You are absolutely right, there is no issue with ELDs. The driver’s that are complaining are upset that they will not be able to cheat any longer. This is coming from a driver that started driving in 1985.
The issue with ELDs is that they grant final authority and control over your logbook to a computer and some desk driver in an office, but leave you responsible for whatever they put in there. Now, maybe you’ll get lucky, and they won’t ever make a mistake. But if they do, it’s your driving record on the line, your fine to pay, and it’s you that gets shut down in a scale-house. That guy in the office still goes home at 5pm to his wife, his kids, his dinner, his bathroom, and his climate-controlled house.
If it happens to you, you’ll probably be angry about it, but by then it will be too late to do anything about it.
Also, do you think that these systems are free? Do you think that your carrier is just taking a hit on profits, to implement them? That’s money that could have been in you paycheck… Maybe it still wouldn’t have been, but somebody, somewhere, is getting paid, and it ain’t you.
Just sayin’… 🙂
Why are you even worried about going home that night when you likely weren’t gonna be there anyway? Do you go home every night
Mr. Yowler, are you on ELD now? Im not sure how the desk driver has control of the log book. In my experience, any adhustment / edit of the e-data requires driver approval and signature on a printed log for filing in event of log audit.
Ive driven both paper and elog. Ill take elog any day, even with the down to the second negatives. Too many times dispatchers gave runs with delivery parameters outside my legal hours of service, knowing fully well what i had left on the 11/14/70. Elogs keeps them honest, takes the burden off tge driver. Anyone that thinks they can skate hos now needs to think about LPR, cel tower pings, intersection cameras and GPS memory. Some blue hare pulls between your drive and trailer tandems and bites it, the folks in the unusual hats will pull all of them .
Peace
YOU GOT THAT RIGHT! YOU HAVE NO CLUE!
If you’re gonna tell someone they have no clue, shouldn’t you at least tell him why? I’m sick of ‘old timers’ telling people they have no clue but not trying to resolve the issue. If his problem is ignorance then educate him. If you just wanna bitch at someone without resolving any issues, take up politics.
No you are right elds are awesome been driving 15 years and i love them this is all the old guard who needs to retire anyways that are complaining.
Haha good one. Is this a comment from a deceased person like the FCC net neutrality comment section in favor of what the govt wants? If not Verizon then who could this be? BNSF? Caught ya. And yeah you don’t know much.
When you get your truck, then… you’ll get it! If you experience the dock waiting time now, it is different when you have your own. Not to mention that the shipper/rcvr will have a different appt time from the scheduled broker appt. There is more…
So what happens when you wake up and you can’t WAKE UP. Do you go back to bed after starting your 14 hour clock and waste your day or do you drive tired, but if you do then how are you being SAFE. LEAVE EVERYTHING ALONE AND STRETCH THE 14 HOUR RULE TO 24 WITH A 10 HOUR BREAK AFTER YOUR 11 HOUR SHIFT and everything will be fine. I’m smart enough to know if I need sleep and I get it. In the old days if I needed sleep I would pull over and get then I would finish my shift. It’s not about staying up 3 days to make more money AND ANYBODY THAT SAYS OR THINKS IT IS, IS A DAMN IDIOT IT’S ABOUT ( SUPPOSED TO BE ABOUT) BEING SAFE.
The only people that benefit from this is the large trucking companies due to the fact that they have the ability to do 90% drop and hook which for them means less down time but for us single truck owners as well as small fleets we are at the mercy of the shippers and receivers who can tie us up at the docks for hours which means lost time and productivity the end result is lost income
I don’t do 90% drop n hook. I guess you never worked for the larger carriers. in the refrigerated part of the industry alot of times it’s not drop n hook. Especially at the major department store chains like Kroger, c&s, Walmart, shop rite, Publix, Costco, Target and others I haven’t mentioned. Drop n hook is mostly at the meat plants, JBS, Cargill, Excel and National Beef.
This is speaking from my own experience.
I agree
If we can be monotremes 24/7 why can’t shippers and rcvr’s?? Very simple card swipe with arrival time and ‘THEY’ are on the clock!! And NOT with the carrier that they can threaten with pulled contracts and loss of business!!! But with the DOT who will collect all fines!! Would this work??
a good start there!
Never thought I would say this but!! THANK YOU INDIANA !!!!
Yeah usually Indiana seems like they are against trucks. The toll roads are a joke, one mile over the speed limit on mile 0-19 of i65 and you’ll get a warning (automatic unfightable CSA points). All of 30 and route 41 is a nightmare. Construction zones for years, like Illinois it’s cone storage I guess? And the DoT love messing with the locals that they know will probably be overweight. But good on them for realizing this electronic logs stuff will make some people jobless and hurt their economy. I still don’t think the care to much about the driver.
No excuses for waiting until 18 days before the deadline. The law was passed 2 years ago. Company I work for has had E-logs for 6 years, even before the law was passed. Why do people want to fight it until the end instead of getting compliant last year.
In the two years since the passing, the issues outlined in the letter should have been addressed. Now that it’s obvious there will not be enough time, they’re asking for a delay.
Many carriers have been trying very hard to become compliant, sometimes at great expense. Because the compliance rules are a moving target, and most trucking companies are not also technology companies, a lot of carriers have been forced to outsource this activity to service companies who have no individual stake in compliance, and therefore no imperative to bring their system/s into compliance in a timely manner. Switching systems is often cost-prohibitive, and may negatively impact compliance, as well, so carriers have had to tolerate technical as well as regulatory problems from service providers and regulators, alike. Small carriers are especially hard-hit, particularly if they were on less-than-rock-solid financial footing, before.
It’s an expensive bad idea, being shoved down the throats of individuals and carriers who don’t want it and aren’t prepared for it. The three-truck carrier, for example, that started out as an owner-operator with a farm truck – he doesn’t have an information technology department to manage driver log records. So he outsources it to, say, GeoTab, who makes the maintenance port monitors that he already uses on the trucks, to keep an eye on equipment performance, and also watch for drivers running excessive speeds. But GeoTab’s log system turns out to be terrible… so he tries to switch, but now they have all of his driver’s log records in a database, which has to be converted to some new system. They’re based in Canada, so they aren’t even subject to DoT regulations, even if they has rolling stock, which they don’t, and he bought service through a reseller in the States, so he doesn’t even have a legal agreement with, to start with…
It all gets very messy, very quickly. Small carriers (in particular) are often not equipped to handle the vagaries of information technology and international civil law – it’s messy. It’s great that your carrier was able to implement something on it’s own schedule, when it felt both technologically and financially fit to do so, and I’m glad that you are fine with someone in an office having the authority to make changes to your logbook. Not everyone is similarly prepared, or as tolerant of that loss of control. I hope that you (and your carrier) never have cause to regret it.
Very well said!
Right on.
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What gets me is how so many that’s been on Elogs are excited by the fact that everyone else will be mandated.
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I don’t get it.
If a guy wants to do something illegal with his log book then why are you concerned?
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I say allow DOT to do their job and fine them a hefty cost of they do. Not regulate every truck on the road.
Not to mention many accidents happening are with trucks with Elogs so the safety BS argument is moot.
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4 Wheelers cause the majority and far more accidents than any big truck.
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So I guess next, all 4 wheelers should have a black box monitor for the FMCSA and government to monitor also right?
Yes. Let’s push for all vehicles period to have a monitoring system.
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Does that make sense?
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Oh and those 4 Wheeler speeders are breaking the law.
Let’s regulate all vehicles speed also to around 70 mph.
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Come on man.
My truck.
My life.
My log book I certify and allow you to check.
Great damn point!
I don’t see how they can regulate a cattle hauler or any livestock hauler to be honest we have certain rules while we are loaded n they are for animal welfare so basically once ur loaded u get to point b ASAP better for the animals. N I think it’s mostly o/o not wanting to be tracked 24 hours if they wanna stop n sleep 3 hours or shoot the bs wash the truck w e they can do so any continue the day. Or sit for 5 hours at a dock n still can get the load there the next day n not have minutes ticking away. I run eld local n I tell u that ticking bomb is a stresser some days
One of my biggest complaint on ELDs is the definition of ‘compliance’.
With paper, if I drive 650 miles and over run my log by 10 minutes, it’s easy to fix, I’m a hero amongst mankind, children love me and little dogs smile.
With ELDs, if I drive 600 miles, but over run my logs by one minute, I’m treated as an axe murderer, a fascist and terrible villain.
There is no movement towards the spirit of the law….everything is absolute and without mercy.
I don’t drive anymore, I’m inside. I see drivers shut down every day, often causing a load to be late because they’re not sure they can drive 45 miles in the next 55 minutes due to traffic, weather or whatever. One minute late and they will be summoned back to the mothership where the compliance department will flog them for this egregious sin!
Yet I speak with compatriots at other companies and they tell me that the compliance department ‘just fixes it’.
Well, for one, thanks for caling it a compliance dept and not a safety dept. Many consider themselves safety techs when their job is nothing more than covering for the company, which is why they can make “adjustments” on their end.
The driving scenario you presented is the truth. They can play games all day about why ELD’s are bad, but in the end, it’s all because the drivers are bound by a rigid digital counter, which counts without concern.
They should have just stepped up enforment of excessive logging, IF it was really about “safety”.
This is an HoS compliance isdue, not an ELD issue. It’s a valid complaint, but it’s a valid complaint against HoS, which should be more flexible.
Phrasing this as a complaint against ELDs, makes us look like axe murdering villains who flaunt existing safety regulations. And as you describe it, there may even be some truth to that interpretation, no matter how justifiable.
To beat this thing, we have to very clear that we are not objecting to compliance with safety regulations; we are objecting to losing control over a document whose contents we are responsible for, to machines and people who are neither responsible for the record, nor knowledgeable about the events that it records.
Seperately, we may also object to specific safety regulations, on the basis that they do not contribute to safety – or may even detract from safety. But if we object to ELDs, based upon reasoning that disagrees with the safety regulations that it is supposed to enforce… what people hear is that we want to keep on violating safety regulations.
In some ways, the battle over the ELD mandate, muzzles truck drivers, with regard to stupid, crazy, and unjustifiable “safety” regulations, because the argument is now about enforcement (and not implementation) of those regulations.
It is what it is, though. To beat ELDs, we have to focus on the problem with ELDs. That nobody would listen to us about HoS, when that was the issue, does not give rise to much hope for success, with ELDs, but we can only try… :-/
Yes man. Absolutes. Totalitarian.
Damn.
It seems to me there are several of you guys that need to read the Federal requirements for the processing of info by the ELD.Line 3 info. is NOT editable by anyone !
In 17 days name two groups of people who are monitored electronically 24/7/365.
A. Convicted criminals who wear ankle monitors as part of their sentence
B.Professional Truck Drivers
Let me make little adjust on Bpart
B. Electrical truck timers
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•ELD: gggggGO NOWHERE, or WHERE2GO.
•ELD said: i wellcome you to my sleeper time like a kid whether you want it or not, then walkup and drive whether day or night, you refreshed or can not sleep at day it doesnt matters, it your fault but I expected NO ACCIDENT and drive like refreshed.
•Professional drivers said: Sleep at the same time he used to sleep last 40 years, then drive or works refreshed, there should be NO wolds, No regulations, No rights, to force a human going to sleep at day when he used to sleep with moon, and so on others?
Exactly!
The Arcadiam rythym of your body. Can’t be forced to sleep on rotating computer schedules.
All commercial Pilots, All train Engineers, All near coastal Maritime Captains and Mates, and starting soon All Passenger Bus Drivers
Lose the 14 hour rule and I wouldn’t mind the ELD. THATS because the way I run with my own authority it shouldn’t matter much to me. SIT BSCK AND LOOK AROUND YOU AT THE NEXT TRUCK STOP YOUR IN AND THIS ISVWHY THEY WANT TO BABYSIT THESE MORONS. THEY GIVE CDLs TO ALL OF THESE UNQUALIFIED IDIOTS AND WE ALL SUFFER.
10/4 to that.
Your right rick. I think everyone that argues for eld on here. Are fake profiles. They are not real drivers. Trying to push this eld over on us. A real driver would understand.
You are absolutely right, the 10 hour rule, enforced with the ELD, would clean up a lot of the trash and let the innovative O/O, make a good living, moving that freight the big boys can’t manage !
When are we gonna take back the power that we gave this government
God Bless Indiana and there Amazing Attorney General
As a small carrier I am always looking to be more efficient and paperless is by far a more efficient way to review and store driver logs. The real issue is the HOS rules, specifically the 14 hr rule and the 10 consecutive off rule. Eliminate the 14 hr and modify the hrs off to allow split shifts will give the flexibility drivers want and need. We can’t control traffic, weather, or dock time, we can only react to each situation which requires flexibility to schedule around these events. It’s not the ELD causing the problem, that is recording what is supposed to be put on paper anyways, it’s the onerous HOS rules.
As a Libertarian I have a general issue with government overreach which in some respects the ELD rule is. But as a businessman I also want to be efficient and profitable and embracing technology is good business. I’ll say it again, when you step back and look at the issue as objectively as possible it’s not the device, it’s the HOS rules that are the root of the problem. There needs to be some flexibility, but with that comes the responsibility to not abuse the rules. Laws/rules aren’t written for the ones who follow them, they are written for the ones that abuse them.
There are issues with both the HOS regulations, and the ELD mandate. They are separate problems, but yes, we often confuse the issue by discussing HoS problems in an ELD context. This happens because the ELD mandate enforces the problems associated with HoS regulatory requirements, but the ELD mandate does also have problems all it’s own.
It is an unbelievably bad idea to take control of the driver’s log away from the driver, and give it to a peice of technology or some desk driver in an office. A wandering satellite, or transient voltage spike in some corroded wire, does not know more about the driver’s activities than the driver, and cannot be held responsible for it’s errors. And no one behind a desk has a better understanding of a driver’s activities, than the driver who is engaged in them. And the desk driver isn’t the person responsible for the contents of that log, either.
It’s the driver’s log. Not the computer’s, not the company’s, not the safety or log department’s, and not DoT’s. The driver is the person most responsible for, and knowledgeable about, what should be in the driver’s log. Everyone else trying to influence what goes into that log needs to step back. If you can’t trust drivers with their own logbooks, why the heck would you trust them with trucks and cargo?
True.
I feel is both. HOS and the eld mandate.
Digital is cool. Keep Trucking app is awesome. Digital for past 2 years but yes I can correct 10 minutes here and there for those situations that call for it.
That leeway is priceless and not abused.
Not to mention certified by me and accident free.
My business. Not the governments.
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HOS and keep digital papers but just not mandated recordings for the government.
If they want to regulate us by the hours we work.
Then we should get paid the same way as everyone else does,including overtime.
Does the phrase”Equal treatment under the law”sound familiar?
If they keep it to pay by the miles we drive.
Then they should give us a set amount of miles(say 650mi)we can drive per day with a ten hour break between drive times.
This would be simpler for drivers,planners,and DOT to deal with.
It also gives you leeway when dealing with traffic,weather,and parking issues.
Leave it to the Government to over complicate something that should be simple.
This is a reason to object to HoS/employment compensation regulations, not the ELD mandate. When you object to HoS requirements, and phrase it as an objection to the ELD mandate, you make it sound as though we are all cheating on our logbooks to make more money, and in doing so, support the reasoning under which the ELD mandate was issued – that this would force drivers to comply with existing safety regulations, where drivers have previously evaded doing so.
You make legitimate points, yes, but you ate making them in a misleading context, and undermining your own position, in doing so.
This is why ELDs are seemingly unstoppable, despite their problems. Our arguments against them keep getting turned around on us, this way.
We have to make it very, very clear, that there are problems not just with the ELD mandate, but also HoS, and employment compensation regulation, as well.
Good point.
Contact http://www.whitehouse.gov ask President Trump to issue an executive order to delay the ELD mandate. Real truckers supported him and now we need action. This is an unnecessary and costly regulation that he promised to stop. Take action while we still can.
There is one reason and one reason only, for mandating the use of ELDs: To take final authority and control over the content of the driver’s log away from the person most responsible for and knowledgeable about it’s content; the driver.
ELDs create an environment in which fallible technology and office staff have more control over your logbook than you do, as the driver, while still holding you responsible for any errors or omissions, whether or not you have the capacity to fix them.
There is no other value or purpose to mandating ELDs, and it is an unbelievably stupid idea.
Sharon Worthy, would you like to spew any more irrelevant 💩 about statutory guidelines? Sooo, we’re suppose to believe you can’t change what you helped create? Oh yeah, I forgot, no one in the top 1% has yet to ” persuade” your decision.
I have a funny feeling this guy that wrote the letter is going to run for governor next election
Guys look I’m an O/O ive been running ELD for 3 years by my own choice…if you think you are not going to make money in this industry as an O/O then you are obviously not with the right company..find a new one and fast
The question is what is causing more accidents, is it fatigue driving or phone distracted driving? Why does’nt govt order everyone to install cameras inside the cars for monitoring phone usage?
Without common sense grace periods for out of service deadlines, single unit owner operators will be put out of business first in a manner that shakes the core of a capitalistic, free economy as it’s no longer a free market but a dictated one where in the flow of goods is choked to a point of efficiency far below that of other industrialized nations. Second will be small manufacturers who can no longer compete due to monopolistic shipping rates the culling of small carriers results in. 3rd will be the industrial/ag equipment manufacturers and their distributors. 4th will be the service worker industry as the patrons from the first three evaporate. 5th will be everyone else as store shelf prices increase, especially grocery – necessaries hitting a reeling middle class – while income drops as higher unemployment floods the labor pool. Regulation is the worst kind of tax – one that devalues the monetary worth of one’s effort rather than simply take a portion there-of. Any regulation should be fairly written and applicable to a realistic level of compliance. ELD in it’s current, “minute over zero grace period” automated penalty process is to date the most clear example of administrative law that turns otherwise upstanding, good people – into criminals. Fix it or STRIKE.
It would be wise to prepare to survive for awhile without everything the trucks carry. There’s going to be interruptions, regulating every detail of shipping will help create interruptions. Looks like it’s about time for another trucking strike. Things might have to get worse before it’ll happen though. I’m planning on starting a different business anyway and get out of the mess of over regulation.
Hey guys why don’t we just call for a national 3 days shutdown starting the 18th everybody park the trucks let’s get United
Get over it!
Next in line are speed limiters…can kiss this industry buh bye.
Get over it!
Wahhhhh wahhhhhh….I have to obey the law….OMG such a life ending thing.
I love truck driver stories, tell me another one there big rigger. 🙂
Just man up and park!
As there are 38 states that are not even equipped to inforce these ELDS it should not even come in as a law till all states are equipped to inforce. But as a 30 yr OTR I find these ELD to be effecting my pay check, forcing me to drive futiged often, and against my constatutional rights (dictateing on how much money I am allowed to make) I can’t even do what I wish on my home time as the ELD tells me to not work
I drove for 13 years and I’m so glad I’m not driving no more I quit in 2012 and glad I did, it is what it is,deal with it or move on I’ll never go back ain’t worth it long hours low pay nah I’m good, yay electric trucks.
We’ll boys it’s here ELD’S Wow as an o/o i have to invest $500 + for one to drive my 5500 Dodge flatbed W/36’trl. We’ll ok it’s going be interesting at least, here’s my/there problem I use it around my cow’s back and forth to ? And we had to get my wife and medical card the trucks rated 10001lbs so now she can drive MT. Anywhere she wants store hosp.moms ect… so now what ? We are retired and travel wherever we care to go and grab a load to cover cost ect… sometimes we go 300 mls. Or more to go see someone or something maybe pick up an older vch. Or bike hay feed whatever HELP is this little box stopping our retirement !! 22year’s of driving as an o/o due to hip and pelvic crushed had to stop 3 pedal driving and didn’t care to buy another truck No one seems to know the answers all i get is One fits all answers! From FMCSA, Dot. I travel more then once a month and sometimes load all week ANYONE THAT CAN STEER ME TO ANSWERS PLEASE DO SO, Thank you in advanced and merry Christmas David & Tee