HOS question

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[TD]Drivers, here is the information that I have gotten from from the FMCSA when I went to a safety compliance held by the FMCSA back in 2005. Once again you can check this with your safety department, FMCAS local rep, and you can even pull into a weigh station and ask a DOT office, they will be more than willing to answer and give conformation. Thank you and I will now call this case closed, all the data is there. Thank you and I am thankful that you all were questioning me, that is great however prove it to your self. Thanks drivers this was great! Be safe.

34-HOUR RESTART - Section E
E-1 . Does 34 consecutive hours off duty automatically restart the calculation of the 60/70-hour on-duty period?
A driver may restart the 60/70-hour period by taking 34 or more consecutive hours off duty provided at the beginning of the 34-hour period, the driver has not accumulated more than 60 or 70 on-duty hours in the 7 or 8 consecutive day period. If a driver has exceeded the 60/70-hour on-duty limit, the driver may not utilize the 34-hour restart and must continue to operate under the provisions of section 395.3(b) to calculate the hours available under the 60/70-hour time limit. This would continue until the driver ends a 24 hour period under the 60/70-hour time limit.
Time spent to gain compliance with the 60/70-hour limitation may not be counted as part of a 34-hour re-start period. As soon as the driver ends a 24-hour period under the 60/70-hour limit, the driver has the option of either using any available time to drive up to the 60/70-hour limit and then beginning the 34-hour period, or remaining off duty for an additional 34-hour which would then restart the 7- or 8- day period.[Posted 12/30/03]
E-2. If a driver works at another job, unrelated to trucking, during his 34-hour off-duty restart period, and then begins a duty shift for the trucking company, does the 34-hour restart provision apply?
No. Performing compensated work for a person not a motor carrier is considered on-duty time.[Revised 12/30/03]
E-3. If a driver must take one or more days off to get into compliance with 60-/70-hour requirement, can that same time period be counted toward the 34-hour restart?
No. Time spent to gain compliance with the 60/70-hour limitation cannot be counted as part of a 34-hour restart period. As soon as the driver ends a 24-hour period under the 60/70 hour time limit, the driver has the option of either using any available time to drive up to the 60/70 hour time limit and then beginning the 34-hour period, or remaining off duty for 34 hours which would then restart the 7- or 8- day clock.[Posted 12/30/03]
E-4. Is use of the 34-hour restart period mandatory?
No. However, a motor carrier may establish an operating policy for utilizing the 34-hour reset when a driver qualifies for it under the provisions of 395.1(c)(1)(2).[Revised 2/2/04]
E-5. If a driver is on-call, but has not been called for 34 hours, may those 34 hours be counted as a 34-hour restart?
Yes, provided the carrier has not required the driver to report for work until after the 34-hour period has ended. [Posted April 2003]
E-6. How does a roadside inspector know that a 34-hour off duty period used during the previous 7/8 consecutive days may legally be used to restart a driver's 60/70-hour clock when the inspector does not have access to duty records prior to the restart to ensure the driver did not accumulate more than 60/70 hours on duty prior to the restart?
As stated in 395.8(k)(2), a driver shall retain a copy of each record of duty status for the previous 7 consecutive days which shall be in his/her possession and available for inspection while on duty. Therefore, during a roadside inspection a driver is only required to provide the inspector with records of duty status for the previous 7 consecutive days. Any time prior to this period would not be taken into account and the records reflecting the 34-hour restart should be accepted as accurate unless the inspector finds other records to prove the 34-hour restart was used inappropriately.[Posted 1/16/04]
E-7. If a driver takes the 34-hour reset in Canada just before entering the U.S., will it be recognized as such in the U.S.?
Yes. Duty status changes and periods occurring in Canada before entering the U.S. are included in hours-of-service calculations while in the U.S. [Posted 12/30/03]
E-8. How should the "recap" section of the logbook page be completed when using a 34-hour restart to begin a new 60/70 hour period?
The record of duty status (RODS) pages printed by most commercial firms include a "recap" on each page for drivers to calculate compliance with the 60/70 hour limits and show "time remaining" within those limits. This "recap," however, is not required or addressed by the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations. Therefore, the "recap" may be completed in any manner desired.[Posted 2/24/04]
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Local drivers are still subject to the HOS rules and regulations. They don't have to keep a RODS, because under the terms of their exception, it is nearly impossible to go over on drive time (allowed 11 hours in a 12 hour day...factor in loading, unloading, fueling, pretrip/posttrip, paperwork, etc...just not enough time to be in violation). They are still required to have a record of hours worked, which must reflect ALL time worked (including the time at the 2nd job)...which would put himm over the 12 hour start-to-finish requirement for the exemption, meaning he would have to complete a RODS just like any OTR driver.

Could he get away with telling an officer "hey, I'm local...don't need a log book."? Sure...but IF he's involved in an incident and the other person's attorney starts digging, he'll be in deep doo-doo if he isn't in compliance with the regulations.

 

Your information is outdated and just plain wrong. That is not, and to my recollection has never been, an actual part of the regulations. JJ Kellar (or whatever 3rd party publisher put that out) may have jumped the gun and ran with something their inside guys caught wind of that MIGHT have been being considered, but all that doesn't amount to a hill of beans. The regulations are what they are, and they say no such thing. Period. End of sentence. You can argue the point 'til you're blue in the face, but the simple fact is you are wrong. A 34 hour restart is 34 hours, whether you are sitting at 58 hours or 158 hours...makes no difference, because the regulations say what they say. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

Town Drunk do you teach all your FMCSA classes with information that you received 10 years ago?? Do you teach about a 30 minute break?? You better go back to class before you teach any more just sayin. This info is the kind of dreck that is spread on this site as actual truth all the time by blowhards that can never allow themselves to admit they're wrong and I for one am plain tired of it.

 

I was thinking the same thing, even gave him a chance to acknowledge that he had out of date info in a post last night. I had the same compliance manual he was quoting from, it was dated 2004, pulled it out of the attic last night to double check. Even after that he continues to spew the same outdated crap, I sure hope he is not teaching anymore!

 

Yes I am teaching and yes I have been up to date on compliance Sept, 2014 is my latest updated manual, and the changing of the HOS regulations and any change in the FMCSR. I get the regulations updated every time via the FMCSA. I have shown you when the updates were on the past posts. I have also said for you to go to your safety director, contact the FMCSA directly, or got to the DOT next time you pass a weigh station. I am not having to prove anything to my self, but where is your documentation on MY information being outdated, not current, or even removed and reserved? Drivers, I am current and current on my information, my question is this, where are you getting your data and when was the last time that you attended a FMCSA compliance meeting? If you are talking about false information being spread, look again. Everyone can believe what they want but and they should also never take a persons word on anything. But I have said on several occasions, CONTACT the FMCSA, your SAFETY DIRECTOR, and ANT DOT OFFICER. Why would I say that if I was wrong?

 

In this post you say that this information came from something (we don't have any idea what it by whom) you were given in 2005 ergo it is 10 years old. You are the only one arguing that your info is correct so yes you need to prove it. I can go to the FMCSA site and I have and there's nothing on if about not getting a restart until your under the 70 hours. I have looked in my newest most updated FMCSA manual and there is nothing there. I'm done beating this dead horse. Until you prove us wrong your in the minority. Like I said nothing but a blowhard that can't admit to being wrong.

 

The regulations are what the regulations are, and what you're claiming to be true just isn't in the regulations. It ain't there now. It wasn't there then. It has NEVER been in the actual regulations. Your information is flat-out wrong, and the fact that you claim to teach compliance classes makes me feel sorry for anybody who has paid you for the course. You DON'T know the regulations, because if you did, you'd be able to cite the regulation that proves what you are saying. I don't mean retyping something out of a 3rd party compliance manual published 10 years ago when the 34 hour restart was first introduced. In an effort to be timely with their information, they likely jumped the gun going to print with hearsay over what MIGHT be included in the regulations, and failed to correct the error once the final regulations were published.

Before you pass on any more incorrect information, I suggest you follow YOUR OWN advise and talk to somebody who knows what the hell they are talking about...or better yet, just read the #### regulations for yourself instead of relying upon outdated and incorrect 3rd party publications.

 

I can explain it to you . But I can't understand it for you. : )

 

First, to fix the mess...

Now that's done...

The problem for Town Drunk is this information is old... way old, as can be seen by the date highlighted in blue.

I did a search on the text string highlighted in green. The third link on Google took me to a FAQ page for Drivers Daily Log Customer Support Web Site. That page is exactly same as Town Drunk's post above. Verbatim.

BUT...

when you go to the VERSION HISTORY page and do a search under "34" you find the following:

3.2.6.8 11/07/2003

2. USA 2004 rules - added 34 hour Off Duty reset cannot be used if violations precede the 34 hour Off Duty period.​

THEN...

do a search for "hours available" and...

3.3.0.0 - 08/28/2005 -- With New '05' Rules

3. USA2005 rule - 34hr restart does not need 'hours available' before 34hr off duty clock starts.​

If you really want, you can go search the CODE OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS (ANNUAL EDITION) by year and see the change and/or search the FEDERAL REGISTER for the same.

So, in a nutshell, Town Drunk you're way wrong and I sure hope you don't teach anymore wrong stuff to drivers.