Question about PC

Then please show me where the guidance states that. Hint: It doesn't. The closest, again, specifically state after loading/unloading.

Here is the wording of the guidance:
Examples of Appropriate Uses of a CMV While Off-duty for Personal Conveyance
Time spent traveling to a nearby, reasonable, safe location to obtain required rest after loading or unloading.

It does not mean you can drive your 11 (or 14) then start looking for a parking spot. It means what it says. Only after running out of time at a shipper/receiver. it also doesn't say anything about moving from a e.g. rest area to a truck stop....

 

Make room... buttered?

 

why even use pc anyway. after 12-14 hour days im done. i could careless on driving from burger king and back to the petro

 

I like salt n vinegar.......take note!

 

Seems the FMCSA’s own guidance is pretty liberal. As it was explained to me by one officer, if I’m enroute from point A to point B and want to PC home as long as I’m not advancing the load or unit towards point B, PC could be applied.



Personal Conveyance
Personal conveyance is the movement of a commercial motor vehicle (CMV) for personal use while off-duty. A driver may record time operating a CMV for personal conveyance as off-duty only when the driver is relieved from work and all responsibility for performing work by the motor carrier. The CMV may be used for personal conveyance even if it is laden, since the load is not being transported for the commercial benefit of the motor carrier at that time. Personal conveyance does not reduce a driver’s or motor carrier’s responsibility to operate a CMV safely. Motor carriers can establish personal conveyance limitations either within the scope of, or more restrictive than, the guidance provided here.

Click here for a recorded presentation that provides an overview of the revised personal conveyance guidance; the corresponding powerpoint slides are available here.

Click here for answers to frequently asked questions regarding personal conveyance and FMCSA’s recent regulatory guidance.

FMCSA updates the guidance for § 395.8 Driver’s Record of Duty Status to read as follows:

Question 26: Under what circumstances may a driver operate a commercial motor vehicle (CMV) as a personal conveyance?
Guidance: A driver may record time operating a CMV for personal conveyance (i.e., for personal use or reasons) as off-duty only when the driver is relieved from work and all responsibility for performing work by the motor carrier. The CMV may be used for personal conveyance even if it is laden, since the load is not being transported for the commercial benefit of the carrier at that time. Personal conveyance does not reduce a driver’s or motor carrier’s responsibility to operate a CMV safely. Motor carriers can establish personal conveyance limitations either within the scope of, or more restrictive than, this guidance, such as banning use of a CMV for personal conveyance purposes, imposing a distance limitation on personal conveyance, or prohibiting personal conveyance while the CMV is laden.

Examples of Appropriate Uses of a CMV While Off-duty for Personal Conveyance
The following are examples of appropriate uses of a CMV while off-duty for personal conveyance include, but are not limited to:

1. Time spent traveling from a driver’s en route lodging (such as a motel or truck stop) to restaurants and entertainment facilities.
2. Commuting between the driver’s terminal and his or her residence, between trailer-drop lots and the driver’s residence, and between work sites and his or her residence. In these scenarios, the commuting distance combined with the release from work and start to work times must allow the driver enough time to obtain the required restorative rest as to ensure the driver is not fatigued.
3. Time spent traveling to a nearby, reasonable, safe location to obtain required rest after loading or unloading. The time driving under personal conveyance must allow the driver adequate time to obtain the required rest in accordance with minimum off-duty periods under 49 CFR 395.3(a)(1) (property-carrying vehicles) or 395.5(a) (passenger-carrying vehicles) before returning to on-duty driving, and the resting location must be the first such location reasonably available.
4. Moving a CMV at the request of a safety official during the driver’s off-duty time
5. Time spent traveling in a motorcoach without passengers to en route lodging (such as motel or truck stop), or to restaurants and entertainment facilities and back to the lodging. In this scenario, the driver of the motorcoach can claim personal conveyance provided the driver is off-duty. Other off-duty drivers may be on board the vehicle, and are not considered passengers.
6. Time spent transporting personal property while off-duty.
7. Authorized use of a CMV to travel home after working at an offsite location.

Examples of Uses of a CMV that Would Not Qualify as Personal Conveyance
The following are examples of uses of a CMV that would not qualify as personal conveyance include, but are not limited to, the following:

1. The movement of a CMV in order to enhance the operational readiness of a motor carrier. For example, bypassing available resting locations in order to get closer to the next loading or unloading point or other scheduled motor carrier destination.
2. After delivering a towed unit, and the towing unit no longer meets the definition of a CMV, the driver returns to the point of origin under the direction of the motor carrier to pick up another towed unit.
3. Continuation of a CMV trip in interstate commerce in order to fulfill a business purpose, including bobtailing or operating with an empty trailer in order to retrieve another load or repositioning a CMV (tractor or trailer) at the direction of the motor carrier.
4. Time spent driving a passenger-carrying CMV while passenger(s) are on board. Off-duty drivers are not considered passengers when traveling to a common destination of their own choice within the scope of this guidance.
5. Time spent transporting a CMV to a facility to have vehicle maintenance performed.
6. After being placed out of service for exceeding the maximum periods permitted under part 395, time spent driving to a location to obtain required rest, unless so directed by an enforcement officer at the scene.
7. Time spent traveling to a motor carrier’s terminal after loading or unloading from a shipper or a receiver.
8. Time spent operating a motorcoach when luggage is stowed, the passengers have disembarked and the driver has been directed to deliver the luggage.

Last updated: Tuesday, February 12, 2019
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When I was driving I was the same way. It had to be urgent for me to crank up that truck and move after I went off duty.

This is at the heart of the problem in my view. The FMCSA uses the word reasonable and IT IS these officers that in the end are defining what reasonable means. This goes even further than PC. You could ask 10 DOT cops a question on most anything and get 10 totally different answers.

 

From everyone I trust. The basic gist is if you get stuck due to unavoidable reason. Such as a traffic accident that has you at a standstill. Causing your clock to run out. They don't want you parking on the shoulder. They want you to PC to the closest safe place.

No it's not meant to save you from bad trip planning.

Others, more knowledgeable than I, have posted the verbiage. I personally don't have the links.

 

1. Yes; technically it has to be what’s nearby. If nearby isn’t toward receiver or shipper, oh well. Can’t drive by them either; if there’s a L 5mi E but a J 3mi E, gotta stop at the J. Alternatively if the L is 5mi N and the J 3mi E, both are “nearby”; nearby is subjective.

Nearby is very subjective! Is it by direct line distance? Or truck routing distance? Or driving time? I don’t know! Does it require a driver to pay for parking? Not paying means it’s not legal to park there. If it’s not legal, would it still be considered a safe location?

Don’t take convoluted paths; be reasonable and remember you might have to justify your use to your company and DoT.

Time on clock doesn’t matter. The guidance only says after loading or unloading.

2. No; trip plan better and start looking for parking earlier. If I spend the last two hours of my clock looking for parking while notating logs and go into violation, it’s not considered a problem by my company.

3. Maybe; for the first arrival it’s definitely no. If shipper or receiver has onsite parking then I’m under the impression you can us PC to leave and return.

4. No; use yard move or creep.

Consult company policy for questions on usage or call them. Some companies have a stricter interpretation then others.

 

My reply to this topic is to steer away from PC. As a retired driver, I have been in this situation before. If I get stuck in a bad situation like an accident I rather just log it as on-duty driving and get parked ASAP. Then note it. This way you are not making a false log! The same can be said for getting stuck at a shipper etc.

 

One further item while I am on this topic. I want to make drivers aware of this rule as it relates to the HOS rules. Take special note this applies to more than carriers. IT ALSO applies to shippers! I am not going to paste the full rule, here is a summary! Here is a PDF from the Federal Register detailing some of this history!

Coercion occurs when a motor carrier, shipper, receiver, or transportation intermediary threatens to withhold work from, take employment action against, or punish a driver for refusing to operate in violation of certain provisions of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations (FMCSRs), Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMRs) and the Federal Motor Carrier Commercial Regulations (FMCCRs). Coercion may be found to have taken place even if a violation has not occurred. An example of coercion is when a motor carrier terminates a driver for refusing to accept a load that would require the driver to violate the hours of service requirements. The following must have occurred in order for coercion to have existed:

• A motor carrier, shipper, receiver, or transportation intermediary request a driver to perform a task that would result in the driver violating certain provisions of the FMCSRs, HMRs, or the FMCCRs;
• The driver informs the motor carrier, shipper, receiver, or transportation intermediary of the violation that would occur if the task is performed, such as driving over the hours of service limits or creating unsafe driving conditions; and
• The motor carrier shipper, receiver, or transportation intermediary make a threat or take action against the driver’s employment or work opportunities to get the driver to take the load despite the regulatory violation that would occur.

This is why I am NOT a big fan of the PC rules outside of limited movements while bobtailing within a limited radius of a terminal or the driver's home. It's high time the FMCSA uses its rule making authority to regulate interstate commerce and nail some of these slimy (Redacted) that could not care less and habitually waste drivers valuable time.