Driving home or on errands

That's exactly what I am saying it contradicts itself.

One was under the 100 air mile radius information but to me the statement says it all. All time spent behind the motor vehicle is to be logged as driving.

I might send them two Q & A to DOT guy in Indy and see what he says about it.

Pay has nothing to do with logging. I can pay you to sleep if I want to, good luck getting that done though

 

I don't see any contradictions...

in Q 26, they explain how to log using a CMV as a POV - with no reference to HOS. It seems to me that they state that 'unless the vehicle is laden', you can use it legally as a POV.

However, at the end, they comment that if you are over your hours, you can NOT drive a CMV for any reason. Here, there's no reference to laden/unladen. You go over your hours, you are expected to get out from behind the wheel of your truck. Period. (I don't see a significant difference between bobtail and pov, so this makes little sense. But that's probably just me)

Ergo - to be as clear as I can- if you have hours available in your HOS, you can unhook and use the bobtail as a POV. If you are over your 11, call a taxi.

Q1 is more of the same. If the company directs you to drive from point A to point B - no matter what either point is, it's driving time, and on line 3.

 

No matter what happens, you're probably going to get a ticket.
The FMCSA investigator is going to see you as driving illegally, will push that issue & you'll be in front of an ALJ to prove otherwise.

I've had this long, sometimes heated debate with an investigator & even presented it to the answer people at the FMCSA.

The answer people said its ok, naturally the investigator said no.

Here's how I read the rules.

First off, the FMCSA HOS rules only apply if you are actively engaged in intra/interstate transport of freight (commerce).

Next, in order to do the personal conveyance thing, you must be "off-duty" & "unladen".
"Off-duty" means that you have been relieved from all responsibility of work.
"Unladen" means no item in the truck or trailer requiring a bill of laden.

If you are off-duty & unladen, the FMCSA HOS rules don't apply to you anymore.
You're not engaged in interstate commerce anymore.
Your logbook only shows off duty & the hours of driving don't count anymore.
As long as you didn't go over hours before going off-duty, no problem.

It doesn't matter if you have the trailer or not.
It's just part of your personal conveyance vehicle.
Having an empty trailer does not imply being on duty or carrying a load.
You do need to recognize road rules for the size or class of vehicle.
If the sign says no trucks or parking, that's you.

The rub: The investigator is going to try to say that your boss is simply repositioning you for a dispatch & cheating on logs to save hours.

If you are going someplace, doesn't have to be home, and you use the concept of personal conveyance, it needs to be a place of your choosing & not directed by your dispatcher.
If your dispatcher told you to go somewhere, that's a dispatch.

Another rub: If you are taking that truck or empty to a place for repairs, it's on duty because that is company business.

Whatever you do with the personal conveyance needs to be just that, off-duty & for personal use.

I've done this across state lines many times & never been hasseled by scales or cops who demanded to see my logs.

I just keep the appropriate rules & opinion from the answer people on hand just in case someone wants to press the issue.

 

WELL Spoken . Thanks

 

"I just keep the appropriate rules & opinion from the answer people on hand just in case someone wants to press the issue."

That right there says it all.
If you can prove your case to LEO. You may not get a ticket or shut down. On the other hand, He may not care and will make you prove your case to the Judge.

I have found that if I am polite, Most LEO's will listen. I have walked away without a driver award more than few times.

 

driving over your hours (whether bobtailing or logging it or not) is kind of like carrying a gun - it might be legal, but you still don't want to get "caught."

 

Why would you try and talk yourself out of a road side ticket? First rule is never argue on the roadside stop. The place to plead your case is in front of the DA, and then the judge. Please don't be one of the dumb drivers.

As long as you have the law in black and white you will most likely win at court. LEO and DOT really do not understand the law either, only what they are told by the shift supervisor.

Mark

 

I never said anythimg about arguing with a cop. Are you a lawyer? Three years out of driving school and you want to call me a dumb driver? As I see it you have 10% the experience that I have. (if that)
I can hear you on the CB telling us all how it is out here.

I dont have time to go to court, so if I can convince the cop to let me go it just saved me a lot of time and money that I dont want to give up.
Keeping your attitude in check can go a long way to staying out of trouble.

 

When did I call you dumb? Please post my quote!

I don't use a CB unless at shipper/receiver.

Going to court to fight a ticket is up to each individual driver.

Mark

 

From the way I read Mark's comment is he is trying to give you a heads up and for you not to be one of the "dumb" drivers that do argue with the officer to only get theirselves in more trouble. I dont think he meant it as an insult to you or "drivers" per say, just some drivers can handle it the wrong way.