Independent Front Suspension on trucks in the future?

Discussion in 'Trucks [ Eighteen Wheelers ]' started by allisonisatranny, Oct 12, 2014.

  1. 98989

    98989 Road Train Member

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    i would not say this, buses here usually have about 7-7.5t on front axle , zf independent axle is 8t , volvo 8.5t capacity
     
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  3. Pablo-UA

    Pablo-UA Road Train Member

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    Local made big buses are made of steel, heavy, about 16-25 ton. They have engines from trucks, I saw bus with MB V8 engine.

    But usually Ukrainian bus makers use Cummins ISL and ISM, sometimes ISC and ISB, MB OM 906 and 926.

    Yep, OM457 (a bit smaller than MBE 4000 OM 460) is also used.
     
  4. Darky

    Darky Light Load Member

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    Buses here a lot lighter than that. Still steel, but closer to 10-15 tons, iirc
     
  5. 4x4_Welder

    4x4_Welder Medium Load Member

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    I was looking at buses last night and 16k front ends seem pretty standard. The main issue I see as far as strength is the angles of the arms vs force angles. The springs under a standard front end are inline with with the main stress while braking, keeping the metal in it's strongest state, tension. The sections of the beam outside the springs are a short lever, working against the middle both fore and aft along with vertically. Being an H beam, the metal is also under tension in a given direction, makeing it strong. There are some shear loads, but usually only in the case of an impact, and the only impact related failure I have seen was actually the u-bolts. The side to side location is maintained by the springs being captured parallel to each other at either end, and sideways stresses are against the larger dimension of the spring. This system allows for fairly accurate locating along with only a few components and relatively light weight.
    The independent system has links at an angle to stresses, typically being placed in a weaker compression state. Metal is more prone to deflection and then a rapid failure when operated in the state. Those systems also have either four bushings and two ball joints or six bushings and one or two kingpins per side, versus the six total bushings for the leaf setup.
    Then you have, what, five main components for a leaf and beam (two springs, two knuckles, and the beam) versus a minimum of nine pieces for the independent.
    Being newer and more complex doesn't make it better, but I do know the straight axle is far from perfect. I'd be thrilled to see a solid swing arm style front suspension, but the change in caster angle is a problem.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2014
  6. allisonisatranny

    allisonisatranny Light Load Member

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    Just look at the double deckers running on the Interstate, they had to switch from 315 80 R 22.5 because they were over loading the tires. They carry 16k plus.

    As far as "truck are heavy then buses." IF you used theory and logic, you would know that the front axle of a truck weights around 11-12k loaded, a bus weighs 12-18k loaded. We are talking about independent front suspension, the rear we aren't concerned about.

    Besides, a bus carries more weight than a Class 8 tractor. Class 8 tractor, typcially 12k front, 34k rear which totals 46k. A bus, 16k front, 23k drive, 16k tag axle, which is around 55k pounds. I think the weight classification for the double decks now is 60k pounds. A typical Greyhound style coach weighs around 32-36k empty, and upwards of 50-55k loaded.

    Independent suspension would work just fine fine on a Class 8 truck for a steer axle.
     
  7. barroll

    barroll Road Train Member

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    I think you're confusing legal weights and axle rating. Most 3 axle tractors are rated to 56,000lbs+, but bridge laws and tire ratings keep them shy of that, and the same laws and ratings apply to busses.
     
    Darky Thanks this.
  8. allisonisatranny

    allisonisatranny Light Load Member

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    Correct, so the double decker should be 20k, 20k and 20k for the tag. The axle may be rated at 23k, but legal weight is 20k. I don't think bridge law applies to buses. Or does it?
     
  9. barroll

    barroll Road Train Member

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    They're CMVs, so bridge law applies to them just the same.

    I've never seen tires rated at 20k per axle outside dual configuration, and last I checked, buses still used single tire steers and tag axles, so the only axle with a 20k limit would be the driven axle, assuming the tag is up and it is rated for 20k with dual tires installed.
     
  10. allisonisatranny

    allisonisatranny Light Load Member

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  11. me myself and I

    me myself and I Heavy Load Member

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    Didn't Freightliner offered it in Cascadia?
     
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