Anyone else deal with this...

Discussion in 'ELD Forum | Questions, Answers and Reviews' started by Littledreamer2224, Aug 29, 2021.

  1. Littledreamer2224

    Littledreamer2224 Bobtail Member

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    I am new to this trucking forum. I am a DOT compliance coordinator of whom I work for a particular company as safety consultants. So I am a compliance coordinator consultant for a trucking company out of northern Colorado. I admit I'm a bit new in this position so I'm still learning DOT compliance, but I understand a lot.
    There's a few things that the trucking company I consult for is doing that I've seriously questioned the legality of.
    One of the main concerns I want to get answers for if possible is that some of the job sites that the trucking company works at has the drivers driving a non-CMV from the reporting yard to the job site, then they swap drivers in the truck and work their shift then at the end of their shift they drive the non-cmv vehicle back to the yard. What's happening is they are stretching out their hours to 14 hours and they still have an hour to drive back to the yard, so most days these drivers are driving well over 16 hours a day even though 2 hours of that day is in a non-cmv vehicle so they are not regulated. The drivers have come to me with concerns in regards to safety as they are driving exhausted at the end of their day. For me to help show the company that this is illegal and a huge safety concern, what are some options to work around this? I know of the oil field exemption which will help with that but it still put in the drivers on duty for 14 plus hours each day as they're getting paid for their drive time to and from the job site and the drivers are still exhausted and it still a safety issue. Does anybody have any recommendations?
     
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  3. xsetra

    xsetra Road Train Member

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    What do you mean "job site". Do they drive on public roads or private property?
     
  4. Littledreamer2224

    Littledreamer2224 Bobtail Member

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    It's oil field work, so they have to travel out to the oil field pad, so when traveling from the company yard to the job site they are driving public roads in a non-cmv pickup. Once they're at the job site then they're in their truck in the pad which is all private
     
  5. God prefers Diesels

    God prefers Diesels Road Train Member

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    What line of work exactly?

    For compliance, they can reset by pulling ten hours "off duty at wellsite". Illegal (since they're actually working on duty, but good luck proving it Mr. DOT man!), but it will cover you from a compliance standpoint.

    As far as the actual "it's not safe" part - that's a company culture issue that will only change if management is on your side, and are willing to change the culture. Even then, it will take forever to get most hands on board.

    If your company has the resources and you really want to be legit, do like Halliburton, and have them shuttled to and from location at shift change.
     
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  6. Littledreamer2224

    Littledreamer2224 Bobtail Member

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    Most of the work is oil field.
    Can you explain more what you mean by resetting by pulling 10 hours off duty? I do know about the oil field exemption which when they're waiting at the pad it's considered off duty, so is that part of what you're meaning?

    I think what really concerns me is that they don't seem to care about the safety aspect because they just want to push as much as possible to bring in the money, and these crews at the oil field pads are the ones that bring the company the most money. So I know if I'm going to stick this out and try to help the company I've got to be very creative to help them see the proper way of handling this and change it.

    I really do like that suggestion of shuttling the employees to and from the job site, and that is definitely something to look into. It doesn't affect the whole company, as there's only a few of our crews that do this particular work, But that definitely is a good suggestion so I'll have to look into how to make that happen or even to see if it's a possibility.
    Thank you for your thoughtful response!
     
  7. brian991219

    brian991219 Road Train Member

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    You will not change the culture at that company.

    Now, to answer your question, any travel time at the direction of a motor carrier must be logged as on-duty not driving unless they are afforded 10 consecutive hours off-duty before operating a commercial motor vehicle. If given the 10 off then all travel time must be recorded as off-duty.

    In plain English, they must log on-duty when they report to the off-site location and are traveling to their trucks at the well pad. This time counts towards their 14 hour window. The trip from the pad back to the remote location where they get in their own cars and go home or otherwise are relieved of duty can be logged as off-duty if they are given 10 consecutive hours from when they get out of the company provided/directed transportation before they must report back to the work site (meeting location). If not then it is logged as on-duty, which will then put them in violation of the required rest period rule.

    Look to 395.1 for the definition of teavel time, this is the controlling regulation for your scenario.

    (j) Travel time—(1) When a property-carrying commercial motor vehicle driver at the direction of the motor carrier is traveling, but not driving or assuming any other responsibility to the carrier, such time must be counted as on-duty time unless the driver is afforded at least 10 consecutive hours off duty when arriving at destination, in which case he/she must be considered off duty for the entire period.

    Also, FYI, here is the FMCSA guidance related to travel time. Ignore the references to 8 hours, this guidance was issued before the 10 hour rule. Yes, it's that old!

    Question 14: How must a Commercial Motor Vehicle CMV driver driving a non-Commercial Motor Vehicle CMV at the direction of a motor carrier record this time?
    Guidance: If Commercial Motor Vehicle CMV drivers operate motor vehicles with Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR)s of 10,000 pounds or less at the direction of a motor carrier, the Federal Highway Administration (FHWA) requires those drivers to maintain records of duty status and record such time operating as on-duty (not driving).
    Question 24: If a driver is transported by automobile from the point of a breakdown to a terminal, and then dispatched on another run, how is the time spent in the automobile entered on the record of duty status? How is the time entered if the driver goes off-duty once he reaches the terminal?
    Guidance: The time spent in the automobile would be on-duty (not driving) if dispatched on another run once he/she reaches the terminal, and off-duty if he/she is given 8 consecutive hours off-duty upon reaching the terminal.

     
  8. brian991219

    brian991219 Road Train Member

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    Are you sure it is a non-CMV. Remember a commercial motor vehicle for hours of service purposes is not the same as a CMV for CDL or drug testing purposes. For hours of service it starts at 10,000 GVWR, which today encompasses many pickup trucks including the Ford F-350 single rear wheel and up.

    Also see my other reply to this thread regarding proper logging of travel time, it appears this travel time is still on-duty not driving time.

    395.1
    (j) Travel time—(1) When a property-carrying commercial motor vehicle driver at the direction of the motor carrier is traveling, but not driving or assuming any other responsibility to the carrier, such time must be counted as on-duty time unless the driver is afforded at least 10 consecutive hours off duty when arriving at destination, in which case he/she must be considered off duty for the entire period.
     
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  9. Littledreamer2224

    Littledreamer2224 Bobtail Member

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    Thank you for posting the specific regulations!
    They are allowed the 10-hour reset between off duty to on duty, so if I understand this, then even if they hit their 14 hours in the semi truck at the job site, then they can drive a non-cmv pickup back to the yard as off duty and still get paid for that travel time without penalties?
    I hope I ind we stood that correctly.
     
  10. Littledreamer2224

    Littledreamer2224 Bobtail Member

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    Yes, they are Non-cmv pickups, I believe 2500 and nothing on them so I believe the weight is below or right at the 10,000 lbs. They are what our company considers the supervisor trucks that have the company logo, but no DOT or VIN number, if that means anything in regards to CMV or not.
     
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  11. brian991219

    brian991219 Road Train Member

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    Almost, they would be on-duty not driving on their log in the noncommercial pickup truck if it is at the directionof the company, which is fine. You can work past 14, just can't drive a CMV on public roadways. Their 10 hour break would have to start at the moment the got out of the pickup to head for the house or bunk or whatever not work related.

    FMCSA does not tie compensation to on-duty time, it is both possible to be paid and be off-duty at the same time, or be logged on-duty but unpaid such as waiting time at a dock.
     
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