Cheap Freight Doesn't Exist

Discussion in 'Ask An Owner Operator' started by BigBadBill, Apr 17, 2014.

  1. Pound Puppy

    Pound Puppy Heavy Load Member

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    Amherst, OH
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    Seems a lot of blame going to the mega carriers. I think this is primarily a talking point that somebody put out. When i ran my own I would pull from them sonetimes, the rates i would get were excellent. Even now, Im pulled a load for a carrier that pays theyre guys a low wage, I pulled for considerably more. Point here is that the mega carriers dont negotiate bottom dollar rates, period. They bid the same kind of rates that any independent would. The only time they go cheap is on a brokered backhaul if they need to get one. Do you. think they could have the multiple terminals, office staff, maintenence, thousands of trucks and trailers by hauling at low rates?

    I have a lot to learn, but I know clearing pre-conceived notions out of my head is where I have to start.
     
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  3. FLATBED

    FLATBED Road Train Member

    Do you. think they could have the multiple terminals, office staff, maintenence, thousands of trucks and trailers by hauling at low rates No but you need to realize they can generate more PER MILE PROFIT at a lower value of profit so can cut rates if needed than the smaller out fits do to the fact they cover more miles.EXAMPLE NUMBERS ONLY 250 trucks @ 120,000 miles a year with $0.10 / mile profit = $3,000,000.00 but a mega with 1200 trucks and only $0.05 / mile profit = $7,200,000.00
     
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  4. rank

    rank Road Train Member

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    THAT. That right there is why some people are employees and some people are employers.

    There are many details and stories that we all could tell you GITRDUN, but in the end it all comes down to that right there. Your most important ability is availability

    Yesterday (Thursday afternoon before good Friday) was crazy. All week had been slow with no worthwhile freight for next week. I was in no hurry to cover trucks because I figured I might get an Easter weekend off. Right after lunch the phone starts to ring like crazy and now the trucks are all covered......at my asking rates...why? Because I kept my equipment available instead of lowering my rate earlier in the week.

    Of course there are other factors also...53 ft double drop, wide load, DH Easter Sunday to load and roll Monday, crane appointment, history with this broker of never missing a crane appointments, no history of damaged freight, able to get permits on short notice.

    AWESOME story Flatbed.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2014
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  5. BigBadBill

    BigBadBill Bullishly Optimistic

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    What I don't think a lot of independents really understand is that there are different business models. Those that are complaining about rates on a particular lane typically run what I call the per-load model. They are focused on making a certain rate per mile on each and every load. They all stand on their own.

    Then you have what I call the lane model. They focus on getting a rate to the truck on the R/T. If they know they are going to get $1.20 coming from the east coast then they will only take a load into that market at a rate that will make it average out to what they want on all miles.

    And adaptation on the lane model is the tri-hual or chaser model (this is how I ran when I was in the truck). They aren't as concerned about and out and back but will take the high rate in and look for poor general markets that have some good paying lanes. And they take the next load to a good paying lane. Some will just chase rates and others will have a 3 or 4 leg loop. Example: I could get a great rate to ND form IL. From ND the rate was awful going just about anyplace other than TX. So I would take a load to TX. I could then grab something decent to KS or IA. Then I would go home MT or grab an oversized home.

    Most large carriers are running the average rate model. They need to get a certain rate for the truck over the month or quarter. But they idea that they are the cheaper rates is false. They have contract rates based on the lane history and that rate will typically be higher than what is seen in the spot market. That is because most spot market rates are driven from the contract rates. An example of the $1.20 east coast rate. A contract rate is going to be $1 - $1.10 plus fuel.

    I am sure that we could name models differently and think of dozens of others. More important is understanding what your model is.

    The biggest mistake that I see is people running the per-load model that run into markets that they will rarely get their rate and will sit for a day and then run out MT.

    The most profitable is the lane model (for independents). Often you can get a R/T rate but then grab something coming back and pad the revenue.
     
  6. rank

    rank Road Train Member

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    I *think* if the small carrier is willing to specialize, there can be a good profit in staying regional and available. There will always be trucks that fall off loads. If you can be the guy they call when the excrement hits the air circulation device, that can be a good deal. Kinda like "The Wolf" in Pulp Fiction. Nobody haggled with The Wolf.
     
  7. GearWarrant

    GearWarrant Medium Load Member

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    Mar 20, 2014
    North Vernon, IN
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    Bill - I keep reading about not taking cheap freight out of an area and just DH out of there. Are you saying it could be wise taking the cheap freight into a better paying lane? IDK, but it seems to me that getting, say, a buck a mile out of a bad area into a good area could be better than nothing. My logic is: DH=$<0 and a cheap load=$>0. Maybe it would at least cover the fuel you would have used in DHing.

    I understand the concept of not hauling cheap freight. But if the area is just not paying and you DH out of there, then you are the one paying to move the truck.

    If my brain is not working right here, please by all means set me straight.
     
  8. rank

    rank Road Train Member

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    Another thing that helps me get brokers out of jams (and therefore gets me loads) is the ability to store and/or cross dock. It seems there is always delays in the construction business and these job sites don't have storage. Problem is the shipper doesn't have room either. We will pickup the freight and store it for few days or weeks. You need a secure place to park a few trailers though. When you think about it...trailers are cheap.

    There was a thread one time on another message board by a guy names Lowboy Larry. He said that years ago he was moving steel for a broker but the steel plant wanted to load trailers on the off shift and park them for pickup later. If you've ever been to a steel plant you know it takes forever to get loaded. Broker says "Larry I want you to buy more flatbeds". Larry say OK. The way he figured it:

    1. Trailers do not depreciate
    2. Once the load is on your trailer that is guaranteed money.
    3. He is more efficient because he is not waiting on a live load..he is now drop and hook.
    4. People are lazy and shippers/brokers are no different. They would really rather pay more to just pick up the phone than to find the cheapest rate.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2014
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  9. skateboardman

    skateboardman Road Train Member

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    bill, a contract isn't a silly reason . you had a contract to fulfill. and I bet the only way you could do anything was to get your own authority and work for yourself.

    I know it isn't always the case, but methinks it may very well be in this case.

    not trying to rake the guy over the coals, but seeing as how he has no idea what stellar service is, he may very well did something he calls a silly reason.

    its there , its just between the lines and hard to see. I learned to read between the lines after dealing with drivers. only one besides me who I could depend on happened to be born on the same day I was, something was in the water that day, I guess.
     
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  10. skateboardman

    skateboardman Road Train Member

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    gear, heres an example. flatbed freight out of Laredo pays lower coming out than in, I get usually (leased to a carrier and at 75 per cent) 2.40 to 2.50 a mile into Laredo , and the rate out will be 1.50 to 1.60 to the truck. in and out I will then average 1.90 to 2.00 for the round.

    if I sit in Laredo waiting for 2 bucks a mile to the truck coming out, I may well sit for a great while.


    I don't operate on a load by load basis, I have a per mile goal for all miles ran loaded and empty over each quarter and a yearly goal.

    and I have never hauled a backhaul, I always haul the next load
     
  11. BigBadBill

    BigBadBill Bullishly Optimistic

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    It depends on your business model and I am not advocating one model or the other. More advocating that people understand what their model is and understand that others have different models. Not good or bad, just is what it is.

    The con of hauling below a certain rate is that you are tying your equipment up, putting wear and tear on it, etc. So you have to balance that out. I have seen it done both ways. From a pure numbers financial standpoint, some revenue is always better than no revenue.

    Where I see the argument fall down is the driver that sits looking for a load at a better rate then moves MT after a day or so. They should have pulled the trigger on getting MT and moving MT or taking a load ASAP to move them. The "tie the truck up" argument is lost when you just sit MT and not moving right away.

    For independents I am not a fan of the average out of a period of time because that is based on miles. And I believe that an independent can do much better focusing on less miles and better rate.
     
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