While we, the best legal minds on TR, were debating the delayed delivery method of getting paid (see link). I myself had an issue.
http://www.thetruckersreport.com/tr.../197876-how-to-hijack-freight-get-paid-5.html
THURS:
09:20 I call on a posted load. Legal SD LTL load going 50 miles. She checks my MC. Broker offers $700. I say my driver has no chains, only straps. She says straps will work. I agree to go to the PU and check for sure. If I can load, I will call back and get a rate sheet. She says "Okay". Gives me address and tel number. I call shipper and advise.
10:00: Driver arrives on scene. Shipper is not there. He waits.
11:15: I speak to driver. He says it's OK to load.
11:17: I call broker say we are good to go. She agrees to send me rate sheet "right away".
11:39: Driver faxes customs paper work to customs broker.
11:50: Broker calls me back to say my insurance cert they have on file is expired. They will need to be named as certificate holder on the revised cert before she can fax rate sheet. I say it won't be until after lunch.
12:00: Truck arrives at Canadian border. I tell him park and I will call him when the shipment is cleared.
13:13: I receive ins cert from my ins broker and fax to broker.
13:38: I get rate sheet from broker
14:08: Shipment still not cleared. I call to advise freight broker.
15:20. Call broker. No answer.
15:23. Call broker. No answer. Leave mess.
16:00. I call consignee to advise of delay. He says no problem, "I don't need it now anyway"
16:05. I call shipper. General manager says I feel your pain but traffic manager is off until Monday. I will tell him to call you then.
16:44. Call broker. Say we need to start talking about detention. I've been at customs for 6 hours. She says that's my fault because I loaded before I got the rate sheet. She faxed rate sheet at 13:38. Two hrs from then is 15:38.
16:55. I send e-mail outlining my standard terms. $75/hr after first hr. $400 for a layover. $725 if I need to take it to my yard.
17:51. Shipment is cleared.
17:58. Broker calls me to ask if shipment is cleared. I say I want $375 for 6 hours waiting. She offers 2 hours x $50. I say no. She puts me on hold for 3 minutes. I hang up.
18:00. I tell driver to return to yard (125 miles).
19:17. I get call from "corporate". She says deliver or you will be stealing freight. I say truck is on it's way to my yard. I say I want a revised rate sheet. She says I will get a call from head office tomorrow.
FRI
No call from head office as promised.
No call from broker.
I speak to 5 different lawyers about my rights and potential liabilities.
SAT
We deliver the load. Consignee signs and back dates POD to yesterday as rate sheet stipulates.
MON
08:30. Broker calls. I have sent you a rate sheet for 2 hrs waiting when can you deliver? I say nobody called me from head office yet. She calls head office.
09:00. Head office calls. This time I don't answer. They leave mess.
09:30. I call traffic manager at shipper. leave mess.
10:00. Broker calls again trying to get me to deliver. Says traffic manager called her and does not want to get involved. I say 2 hrs detention is unacceptable. She says I'm calling head office. I say call who you need to call.
11:00. I return call from head office. I say it boils down to this "Customs work was not done. I waited 6 hours. Your broker is trying to wiggle out of paying me by using the rate sheet fax time as dispatch time. This is not true. I was dispatched verbally at 09:20. Then at 11:17 we agreed on the rate. She does not deny this. Trucking is all about trust. I load on a brokers word all the time and I thought your word was good. Are you telling me your word is no good?" She says what do you need to deliver? I said I will give you a deal...$800 extra. She says I will give you the $800 but you will never pull another load for us...is that what you want?" I say no. She says that I would have got more money if I would not have held the freight hostage. I say good to hear that because I delivered already. She says "Oh". She says she will call me back.
12:00. Broker calls to say that she faxed revised rate sheet for $1075 and can I please deliver now? I say I delivered 2 days ago.
Delayed delivery cont'd....
Discussion in 'Ask An Owner Operator' started by rank, Dec 17, 2012.
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nice !!! make 'em sweat lol
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brokers are pond scum..
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awesome...
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Loved that story
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Made me laugh a little.
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Forgot to mention last week she was only offering $400. This week it was $700.
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So tell us what the lawyers said. -
OOIDA:
This was going to be my knight in shining armor coming to my financial rescue.
Not so. She said "I would never advise anyone to hold freight" and "you have no legal right to hold that freight". She advised me to deliver that freight and "hope they don't file a claim against your insurance". "When you signed their contract, unless there are terms for detention spelled out, you waived all your rights". So I ask, "What protection do I have against then loading me and using me as a storage facility forever?" Answer: "None, unless you get them to sign your terms." Yeah right like that will ever happen.
#2 listened to the story then went to consult and called me back in a couple of hours. "There is a slim chance we might be able to help you but those contracts are all one sided. The law does go back and forth on the issue but we would need a $2,000 retainer and it's probably not feasible for you." I asked her if "the law" (whatever that is) trumps the contract and she said "No it does not".
#3 and #4 never returned my call.#5 called me today.
Him:
Yes they can theoretically charge you with theft. What you need to do is get them to sign your contract but I realize that will never happen. Therefore, the alternative for you is is to honor your contract by delivering the freight. Two wrongs do not make a right. After delivery, you can go to court in the town where you picked up and try to have a lien applied to the property that you delivered. Since the consignee wants his goods free and clear, he will no doubt contact the people that owe you money and you will likely get paid.
Me:
"Sounds good, but the judge has to be willing to give me a lien and if there is nothing in the contract or nothing on the rate sheet that mentions waiting time, only pick up and delivery places and times, he may not grant me a lien?"
Him: "Correct"
Me: "Ok. So back to withholding delivery. How likely is it that the cops will charge me with theft?
Him:
Not impossible, but highly unlikely. It's more likely that they will not get involved or they may after some time goes by, contact you and give you 24 hours to deliver or they will charge you. In the meantime, the broker might be so embarrassed and concerned about losing future business that they will likely just pay you."
Me:
Can they file against my insurance?
Him:
"I would call their bluff on that. The problem with that is they must prove that a theft occurred and if none did, then they are opening themselves up to be charged with insurance fraud."
Me:
So what constitutes theft in the eyes of the law?
Him:
"You must take something that doesn't belong to you AND convert it to your own use". I gathered from this that you want to avoid saying that you are taking possession and that you might sell it, or for that matter even taking possession at all. I think the trick is to delay delivery for whatever reasons that you may want to make up out of the blue, and oh by the way can we talk about this waiting time? They will get the idea.
Me:
So merely holding it is not theft.
Him:
Probably not...Always depends on the judge though.
Me:
So then, if I must honor the contract, how about if I deliver on time as per the contract but refuse to let them unload until I am paid for waiting? I've honored the contract then right?
Him:
That is a much better idea.
Me:
What problems can I get into by doing that?
Him:
You can potentially be sued for any costs associated with your delaying the off load. Crane costs etc etc.
Last edited: Dec 17, 2012
carwreck Thanks this.
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