Drop frame van RV

mugurpe,

Thanks for the replies.

I actually have load cells and crane scales. In another life weight and balance was a daily routine, I have the tools to calculate exactly where the axles go. I don't have the knowledge to determine that the axle placement is prudent. The gent that mentioned a trailer with axles near the center and ill handling are my greatest concern. While no where near that drastic an example, the axle placement is "different"

Steve

 

I admit I didn't read every post here but I am confused on why weight would even be an issue here? We are talking about converting a 48' drop van to an RV cap Le of hauling a toy or two in the rear correct?
Currently working on that....and don't believe there are any weight concerns.

 

You didn't read the part about using a single axle tractor, my truck has a 17K rear suspension.

The other parts you may have missed is, I have a pretty good idea what the trailer will weigh and where the weight will be. The difference is your truck and trailer are YOUR project, the plan I have is nothing like it. The weight the trailer is capable of carrying is not the issue or, axle weight. The question really is how does a drop frame van handle with 36K loaded 24K on the trailer tandem and 12K on the pin.

Steve

 

I won't hi-Jack your thread further with my project but I am curious....

16KLBS for conversion to RV? You may very well be right and I always am eager to learn so can share more where his came from? I wouldn't think you would even 5KLBS for the conversion.

 

The trailer shell is just that, the interior and systems add a lot of weight. There are 4 slide, 2-7' one 12' and, one 9', with the drive, rails and support structure that is 3K alone. Generator, battery bank, HVAC, plumbing and waste water adds another 2500. There is more than your 5K before you add insulation, floors, ceilings, wall or windows. The garage area has a ramp back door and a lift platform, the cabinet work for the kitchen and bath. Appliances are residential with double oven, full size washer and dryer, fridge etc. The total added weight includes things like reinforcments to the roof and floor rails around slide openings, platform subfloor and leveling legs.

The design is what you would expect from the best 5th wheel RV's as starting point. The actual completion will exceed that, using full size appliances, residential HVAC, plumbing and electrical. The trailer is all electric with a diesel generator and 40KW battery bank. Using a plate van as a starting point the trailer shell is heavier than a purpose built trailer but, is stronger and has better suspension and brakes than a RV style trailer.

This is really a custom RV with a garage not a weekend at the races kind of deal, my plan is to spend weeks or months on the road with it and as disaster relief housing.

Steve

 

That just seems like a whole ton of weight you don't need.
For example, why use a complete residential HVAC system when you are only heating or cooling a space less than 500 square feet?
Using a double oven? Full size washer and dryer versus apartment size?
Have you started this project? Would love to follow your progress with pictures, it sounds very interesting.

 

The RV stuff SUCKS, I have a 42' Teton Royal camper, it was the top of the line 5th wheel. If you only camp or travel a week or two the cheesy RV seems OK, if you live in an RV for any length of time the stuff gets to you or at least it did to me. The air conditioners are noisy and inefficient, the stoves are too small to use with real pots and pans, the propane stuff like refer, heaters, stove etc are not designed for daily use. I also don't want propane or LP in my trailer.

A high seer mini-split is far better than RV heat and AC, the "toy size" washer and dryer are not that much smaller in physical size but, do 1/2 the wash in twice the time with SoSo results. I have a good deal of living the life in campers. The small space is not an issue, the poor excuse of stuff they build them with IS. A real stove with two ovens is 30" wide, a camper stove is 20" I would rather add a foot to the kitchen than be stuck with a camper stove. The camper stuff is light weigh and in small campers I understand the need, in a 24K RV that is less of an issue. In a 48' van it is no issue at all.

There are 5th wheel RV's that weigh 28-30K now built on RV frames and axles. They are towed with class 6-8 trucks but they still have the high capacity light duty running gear and most still use propane. There are even toy haulers made by the better RV builders that are nicely finished with quality construction, they can't carry the weight or length I want.

I am in a position to build a trailer, my shop has 4 bridge cranes, full machine shop and, weld/fab shop. There is a custom cabinet shop down the street I will use for all the cabinets/mill work. I don't have a spray booth big enough for either my truck or trailer but, I may be able to jury rig something up? I am not sure I want to do the paint.

Steve

 

What is your time frame to complete this project? I am over a year into mine

 

he's not the first to do this sort of thing and I think the reasons make sense. I've seen stuff like this pop up on bringatrailer, racingjunk, truckpaper, etc. Finding one already done and modifying it is cheaper as they go for pennies on the dollar once completed but if you want what you want and have the $$ do it. You can also get all this directly from kentucky trailer brand new for mountains of cash, sliders and all. I think with a drop frame van trailer it'll handle fine (which is the original question) with any weight distribution that's legal. Drop frames have a low center of gravity and ride well in my experience. keep the weight low and I think you can't really go wrong so long as it'll scale. The longer the distance from pin to axle on the trailer the better it'll track & handle. So go as far back as you can while maintaining legal weight on your drives.

More importantly now that you've alerted us all to your plan you need to post some pictures of the progress.

 

There perhaps a dozen companies that could build something like this, I don't have the bucks to do that. I am an unapologetic scrounger and I have looked on all the usual sites for anything CLOSE to what I have planed. In several years I have never run across a trailer that was even a good start. The old racing trailers may have a slide or two but not where or how I could use them. Your right buying someone else project or finished trailer is way cheaper than building.

I have had a semblance of this plan for over 15 years, projects and commitments focused my efforts in other directions. Now I am looking at the resources to do this, there is the potential commercial venture from this as well. There were a handful of companies that built custom 5th wheel campers that went out of business in the recession. The market for custom 5th wheel trailers is not huge but, it is growing and the two companies that are building semi trailers are doing well. They are still using a lot of the RV equipment in their trailers. My thoughts on this is, with the availability of high watt density battery banks an all electric trailer is more efficient and safer. The trailer would still be able to plug into a 50 amp camp ground service and use high watt consumers like point of use water heaters.

The floor plan I have drawn focuses on a full size home kitchen, a small but cozy living area, a large bath and modest size bed room. The RV industry focuses on vacation and week end user, while there are some full time RVers that have standard campers many, order custom trailers. The big thing right now is hauling a Smart car on the truck as a dinghy.

The toy haulers even the custom made ones are a real compromise, not much living space and not much cargo capacity. The real challenge to be successful in the RV market is to make the trailer look like an RV. The big custom 5th wheels are 45+' but, they look like a camper. This is perhaps the most important part of the project, softening the corners and skirting/belly boxes that make the trailer look more pleasing. The potential buyers want this and, to get into many RV campgrounds it is a necessity.

I haven't started to do the trailer at this point, I have most of the engineering done, the bits that remain are specific to the actual trailer. I have to reinstall my Holland hitch and remove the rear body on my truck to even get the trailer here. My truck has an RV air ride hitch and deck behind it. I will post pictures when I start cutting metal.

Steve