E450 why is it lower towing capacity than a F450?

Discussion in 'Expediter and Hot Shot Trucking Forum' started by crocky, Nov 12, 2019.

  1. crocky

    crocky Road Train Member

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    Yea but they are the newer style with sheet metal unibody frames aren't they? Like this as example.. It's not a real frame like the previous generation vans. The newer ones are unibody and can't handl the weight the older one did so far as I know anyway. Also they don't have diesels now.

    [​IMG]


    But then look at this the previous generation like what I'm after. This is a full frame van just like a truck.. The above example doesn't even have 8 lug wheels so there is no way it has the towing capacity of the previous generation e450's like in my 2nd picture.

    [​IMG]

    One is a heavy duty commercial vehicle the other is like putting a duelly rear end under a 1980's toyota and calling it a 1 ton.. lol
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
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  3. crocky

    crocky Road Train Member

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    Yeah I wouldn't touch the v10 with a 10ft pole.. At least the 6.0 can be made decent with a bit of work.. Those v10s are like buying a 6.4 powerstoke.. it's gonna go sooner or later and nothing you will do to stop it or make it better

    They actually used to make a E550 too that had 7.3's in them but they were all super long frames and built as box trucks but I imagine they'd be a rough ride because they were all the old style leaf suspension no coil overs.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
  4. Lite bug

    Lite bug Heavy Load Member

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    They look like the picture on the bottom. Some of them guys used them to haul and tow campers from the manufactures up there.
     
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  5. crocky

    crocky Road Train Member

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    Any certain lots/areas that you know of or just all around IN? Far as I know though they only sold the diesels to the ambulance builders after 2008 because Ford was only allowed to build a limited number of them each year after 2008 due to the DPF requirement and they didn't have a DPF system for the 6.0 and they never put the 6.4 into the van..

    edit.. ok for the heck of it I jumped on FB marketplace and looked up Elkhart, IN and looked for E450's.. I found 1 or 2 but more importantly I found a picture of a 2012 door sticker.. It's a V10 van but V10's are same as 6.0's far as weight rating..

    Anyway the weight rating is 14,500 the front axle is 5k lbs (less than my F350) & the rear axle is 9600 (more than my f350) so that's defiantly more than my SRW F350. I'm not sure off hand but perhaps that's pretty close to a F450 truck? Meaning the 20k lbs on the ford brochure can't be correct as this particular van with my current trailer would be rated @ 29,500lbs combined.. (for the record my SRW truck is 11,400 F/5,600 R/7000 so this would be quite a bit more than my current truck so I guess it can legally haul more. I wonder what the deal is with the 20k lbs in the Ford brochure though?

    So I guess I'll be fine to go this route and build a E450.. on plus side I found out these vans have 55 gal fuel tank from the ambulance configuration. The odd thing though is the front axle being rated less than my F350 but the rear axle is way more.. I wonder how much the 5k rating on the front axle would affect the ability to fully load out the total weight rating..
     

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    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
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  6. Lite bug

    Lite bug Heavy Load Member

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    Michiana, it is a area between Indiana and Michigan. They build campers large and small. Very industrial many small and large companies. Transport companies move the finished product out. They will use any and all kinds of rigs to move them. Interesting area I move products for the electrical grid and up that way about once a month.
     
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  7. 24kHotshot

    24kHotshot Medium Load Member

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    The gcwr you see on the van is for bumper pull not for a gooseneck setup. That's why its lower. They don't give you a rating for 5th wheel towing because they didnt plan on these vans being setup for it. Even the pickup trucks have separate towing capacities for 5th and bumper pull and bumper pull is always lower.

    Don't have too much experience with it but I would just go ahead with it. Add the gvwr of the van and trailer and then register for it. No weight station ever questioned my registered 41k lbs combined for a cab chassis 3500 ram which according to the company has a gcwr of just 33k.
     
  8. crocky

    crocky Road Train Member

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    Yeah, I just wonder about the 5k lbs front axle rating. Even my F350 SRW is 5,600. I honestly don't have enough loading experience with hot shots to know if that 5k on the front axle will be a problem or not.. Seems a bit low to me..
     
  9. Brandonpdx

    Brandonpdx Road Train Member

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    I seriously doubt an E-450 cutaway has a 20,000 lb GVWR since an F-550 is only rated between 17,500-19,500. That is how much the truck can weigh maximum on it's own 2 axles.

    Don't get that confused with the TOW ratings and GCWR where the truck is dragging around a trailer on it's own set of axles. That is addressed by the SAE J2807 standard, which was not adopted until the 2013 model year. For tow ratings on your 2009 or even 2012 E series cutaway you would need to refer to Ford's own literature on that. As far as I know the E/F series trucks use basically the same hardware and the tow ratings listed in the owner's manuals of towing vehicles prior to J2807 is fairly arbitrarily from what I have seen. Usually much lower than the vehicle is actually capable of moving. For instance my 99 F-350 DRW cab and chassis owners manuals says maximum tow is only 10,000 lbs which is a joke. Weenie little half tons are rated higher than that nowadays under the newer and much more stringent J2807 standard, which is a rating that should be paid attention to on 2013+ model year trucks as it is fairly scientific and rigorous.
     
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  10. crocky

    crocky Road Train Member

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    The 20k lbs came from that Ford brochure I posted in the 1st post. The e450 seems to have the same rear axle rating as the F450 but the front axle on the E450 is 500 less it seems.

    https://www.fleet.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/towingguides/09RVTTguide.pdf
     
  11. singlescrewshaker

    singlescrewshaker Road Train Member

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    Every truck door sticker I've ever seen has a lower front axle rating for a gasser vs. diesel. I bet you find your van equipped with a diesel, it will be 4-500lbs higher rated on the diesel steer..

    If you want to spend 11 hours a day behind the wheel of a E series, then by all means go for it. DOT cares not about those tow ratings. @24kHotshot is right. Tag it for van GVWR+trailer GVWR & don't exceed any axle or tire ratings & you'll be legal..

    Not sure how a leaf spring front axle E series rides, but my buddy had a '99 f250 with leaf's in the front & that truck rode very smooth. Surprisingly smooth actually..
     
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