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Ethanol in the gasoline

Discussion in 'Tanker, Bulk and Dump Trucking Forum' started by GasHauler, Jan 30, 2012.

Page 1 of 4
  1. Jan 30, 2012 #1
    GasHauler

    GasHauler Master FMCSA Interpreter

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    Vegas/Jersey
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    I was sent some information on the problem they had at the Magellan tank farm where the gasoline had ethanol in it when is was required to be clean. Anyone affected by this? I know they had to pump out the underground tanks and restock them with ethanol free gasoline. I wonder who made that mistake?

    Years ago when ethanol just started to come out the drivers at Texaco in Vegas told their boss the mixture was looking wrong. The bosses told them it's just a little water and don't worry about it. They kept telling them it was getting thicker and thicker and of course the bosses knew better. Water had got into the large above ground tank and turned few thousand barrels of regular gasoline into a thick milk shake product that finally couldn't even be pumped. The company was forced to pump dry all the stations they had delivered to for about a month or so. I know it cost them millions in the end. They had to even pay for engine damage to cars the got gas when this was going on. To this day you can still see some above ground tanks that had Texaco at one time with a dome on the top of the floating roof. It pays to listen to the people that know!

    Ethanol does not mix well with gasoline. They can not ship the product through the pipeline with ethanol in it because when the pipe dips down the ethanol collects all the water that gasoline just flows over. That's one of the reasons the companies were so opposed to ethanol because it's a shippers nightmare.

    Just wondering.
     
    GasHauler, Jan 30, 2012
    GasHauler, Jan 30, 2012
    #1
    jcroom76 Thanks this.
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  3. Jan 30, 2012 #2
    Kittyfoot

    Kittyfoot Crusty Ancient

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    Doesn't surprise me atall, they used to sell alcohol as a diesel "addative" to pull water out of your tanks. Likewise for your air system. Rough on the injector tips.

    Just another con job by the "earth is dying" folks.
     
    Kittyfoot, Jan 30, 2012
    Kittyfoot, Jan 30, 2012
    #2
    pathfinder1361 Thanks this.
  4. Jan 30, 2012 #3
    FLATBED

    FLATBED Road Train Member

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    Back behind the Wheel and out of the OFFICE
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    Lot of problems up this way with the low grade ethanol mix gasoline. 2 cycle motors do not like it , hard to start and fouling the filters ( water ) in chainsawa and outboards.
     
    FLATBED, Jan 30, 2012
    FLATBED, Jan 30, 2012
    #3
    pathfinder1361 Thanks this.
  5. Jan 30, 2012 #4
    fishhook

    fishhook Light Load Member

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    Ethanol adheres to water. When a station switches from straight gas to ethanol gas , unless the tank is empty & cleaned theres usually a problem. Ethanol cant be pipelined because it'll eat the pipes. Everything here is 10% blend, if the blend is off at all, your not leaving the rack until its corrected or pumped off. Theres rarely a problem.
     
    fishhook, Jan 30, 2012
    fishhook, Jan 30, 2012
    #4
  7. Jan 30, 2012 #5
    Marksteven

    Marksteven Road Train Member

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    My snowblower has been in the shop 3X for a gummed up carb. i never leave stale gas in it. this time the shop called me and told me "absolutely do not use ethanol gas in small engines" I started putting premium non ethanol gas in it and its been fine since. I try not to put it in my 07 suburban, but non ethanol gas is hard to find here.
     
    Marksteven, Jan 30, 2012
    Marksteven, Jan 30, 2012
    #5
    CondoCruiser and Big Don Thank this.
  8. Jan 30, 2012 #6
    pathfinder1361

    pathfinder1361 Light Load Member

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    Aug 19, 2011
    miami, fl
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    down here is mostly if not all 10%. there was a particular rack i went to,where the ethanol would stop mixxing in during loading. that would cost you about extra 45-60 min. you had exit out of the terminal, circle back in the gate, go on lane 1 so the operator could add in a few gallons of gas to make the mixture correct. pain in the butt, for no extra money. this was happening to at least 3-4 drivers a day on average. most of the ethanol comes in by rail about 3 miles from the port. then usually eagle or kenan transports from the rail over to the port. i noticed a few times that ethanol laying in the discharge pipe of the trailer looking kind of thick/milky. i think it swells up the gaskets in the caps also sometimes.
     
    pathfinder1361, Jan 30, 2012
    pathfinder1361, Jan 30, 2012
    #6
  9. Jan 31, 2012 #7
    CondoCruiser

    CondoCruiser The Legend

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    I watched a show just a couple days ago that was talking about storing small equipment with engines. They said to never leave gas with ethanol in it as the ethanol draws more moisture. Another thing I didn't know unlike cars, small engines like lawnmowers and 2 stroke run better and love premium. I always used the cheap stuff. I'll watch what I buy this next year.

    Running it in your vehicle is okay as the moisture gets burned off. But I wouldn't store a vehicle like many truckers do that has ethanol gas in it.
     
    CondoCruiser, Jan 31, 2012
    CondoCruiser, Jan 31, 2012
    #7
    Marksteven Thanks this.
  10. Jan 31, 2012 #8
    albhb3

    albhb3 Medium Load Member

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    yep ethonal sucks hence the reason polaris was making there sleds with 2 different plug ins 1 for premium w/ ethonal and 1 which was non oxy you would not believe the preformance difference. you know the stuffs bad when they had to ###### the performance
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2012
    albhb3, Jan 31, 2012
    albhb3, Jan 31, 2012
    #8
    Marksteven Thanks this.
  11. Jan 31, 2012 #9
    GasHauler

    GasHauler Master FMCSA Interpreter

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    It must be nice to load and not worry about the rack shutting down. Our Ethanol was not loaded proportional and when the rack slammed shut during loading you had to figure what percent you load was at then load the Ethanol to get 10%. They didn't load proportional because of Ethanol temp. The engineers told us that the Ethanol was colder at the first part of loading then warmed up. So your mixtures were not 10% during the whole load. You might get 25% for the first 500 gallons then would adjust. Don't ask me if this was correct but I do know my company used the Ethanol to it's advantage the most they could. How many people out there had to deal with sub-grade gasoline? I would love to see a finished product come through the pipeline and only inject additive at the rack.
     
    GasHauler, Jan 31, 2012
    GasHauler, Jan 31, 2012
    #9
  12. Jan 31, 2012 #10
    25(2)+2

    25(2)+2 Trucker Forum STAFF Staff Member

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    Adding 10% ethanol raises octane by 3 points; when we first started getting Gasahol as they called it back in the 80s, the mix had either 90 or 91 octane depending on whether they had started with 87 or 88 octane gas. They are now adding up to 10% ethanol and coming up with 87 octane, first I noticed under 90 was 89.5 in the early 90s. Lot's of places are adding ethanol to all grades, and some have ethanol in the lower grades and the premium is straight gasoline.

    I had trouble with 1 vehicle, mostly because of a dealer shop that didn't repair the tank inlet properly. we also had a car that sat too long with ethanol gas and had multi-port fuel injection, the ethanol ate the insulation from the windings of those injectors, shorting them out. The fix repaired that problem. Clean tanks through the whole system avoid troubles.

    I had to tell my wife not to get ethanol gas for the mowers, too.
     
    25(2)+2, Jan 31, 2012
    25(2)+2, Jan 31, 2012
    #10
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