fight a speeding ticket in MO or pay ticket?

OMG,,,,I emailed their site today, and got this response tonight: WAY beyond what I can understand now. Will have to take some time to sort this out.

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Wednesday, December 22, 2010 6:10 PM

From:
"CSA Feedback" <csafeedback@dot.gov>
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To:
"ed" <

Ed,
Thank you for taking the time to submit your question on CSA, drivers, the new Driver Safety Measurement System (DSMS) data and the Pre-Employment Screening Program (PSP). The DSMS is a component of the overall SMS. At present the DSMS is simply a tool that enables law enforcement personnel to assess individual drivers in the Behavior Analysis and Safety Improvement Categories (BASICs) using 36 months of roadside performance data, across employers. At this time, FMCSA will NOT use this system to assign formal safety ratings or Safety Fitness Determinations (SFDs) to individual drivers. This means FMCSA will not be removing any drivers from their job, only the State can do that as they do now. DSMS does not impact the CDL. Neither drivers nor employing motor carriers will have access to the DSMS. However, both drivers and employing motor carriers will have access to driver data through the Driver Pre-Employment Screening Program (PSP). PSP differs from the DSMS in that it does not compare or assess driver inspection/crash performance. Instead, it provides a list of crash and inspection activity associated with the driver over the previous 3 years of inspections and 5 years of crashes. FMCSA does not address drivers the same way it addresses carriers today, nor will it under CSA. While carriers are prioritized for intervention based on the SMS, drivers are only investigated during a carrier investigation. Therefore, no Intervention Thresholds are in place for drivers.
In the Operational Model Test (Op-Model Test), Safety Investigators (SIs) look at driver history when investigating a carrier; specifically, they are looking for egregious violations of FMCSA’s safety regulations by drivers. These violations are sometimes referred to as Red Flag Violations, which are driver violations that are, by design, always investigated as part of a carrier investigation. The Safety Investigator (SI) looks to see if the violation has been corrected. At present, there are 12 such violations, though this list may be updated periodically. These are outlined in the table below, along with the Behavior Analysis and Safety Improvement Category (BASIC) to which they correspond.

BASIC​

Part​

Violation Description​

Driver Fitness​

383.21​

Operating a CMV with more than one driver's license

Driver Fitness​

383.23(a)(2)​

Operating a CMV without a valid CDL

Driver Fitness​

383.51(a)​

Driving a CMV (CDL) while disqualified

Driver Fitness​

383.91(a)​

Operating a CMV with improper CDL group

Driver Fitness​

391.11​

Unqualified driver

Driver Fitness​

391.11(b)(5)​

Driver lacking valid license for type vehicle being operated

Driver Fitness​

391.11(b)(7)​

Driver disqualified from operating CMV

Driver Fitness​

391.15(a)​

Driving a CMV while disqualified

Controlled Substances/Alcohol​

392.4(a)​

Driver uses or is in possession of drugs

Controlled Substances/Alcohol​

392.5(a)​

Possession/use/under influence alcohol-4hrs prior to duty

Fatigued Driving (HOS)​

395.13(d)​

Driving after being declared out-of-service

Vehicle Maintenance​

396.9(c)(2)​

Operating an Out-Of-Service (OOS) vehicle
Any driver violations identified and addressed during carrier investigations that are not corrected may result in a driver Notice of Violation (NOV) or Notice of Claim (NOC). These are the only driver interventions at this time. Carriers and the public are not informed about driver interventions. Drivers will be notified by mail and may be contacted by a FMCSA investigator.
PSP is a new FMCSA program mandated by Congress that is designed to assist the motor carrier industry in assessing individual operators' crash and serious safety violation history as a pre-employment condition. The program is voluntary and is not part of CSA. Motor carriers may request, through NIC Technologies, driver information for the purpose of pre-employment screening. The driver must provide written consent. Individual drivers may request their own driver information record at any time. The information will be retrieved from the Motor Carrier Management Information System (MCMIS). MCMIS electronic profiles will contain five years of crash data and three years of inspection data, however, MCMIS will not include conviction data. There will be a fee for this service. People can enroll now at http://www.psp.fmcsa.dot.gov/Pages/Enroll.aspx. People who have additional questions about PSP can go to the PSP website and review the PSP FAQs (http://www.psp.fmcsa.dot.gov/Pages/FAQ.aspx), and/or visit the PSP 'Contact Us' page (http://www.psp.fmcsa.dot.gov/Pages/ContactUs.aspx).

To know how many severity points a speeding violation is worth simply look at the violation code (392.2s, 392.2-SLLS1 ... etc.)

The SMS Methodology is located here: http://ai.fmcsa.dot.gov/SMS/HelpFiles/SMSMethodology.pdf. Appendix A lists all the violations, which BASIC they apply to, and their severity points.



I recommend you keep up with the latest information on CSA as it becomes available by signing up for the email subscription service or RSS feed. You can do this on the CSA website http://csa2010.fmcsa.dot.gov/Stay_Connected.aspx. I hope this answers your question, feel free to contact me if you have additional questions.
Jonathan Mozenter
CSA Team


​

The message above was in response to the following feedback submitted 12/22/2010 12:00:00 AM
Name - ed
Company/Agency -
Role - Driver

 

WORST ADVICE GIVEN OR YOU COULD TAKE! Go back and reread my post! This guy does not have all the cards needed for a poker game!

JUST PAYING at ticket is admitting guilt and it WILL come back and bite you later!
DO NOT PLEAD GUILTY unless your lawyer tells you to IN ANY OFFENCE from spitting on the side walk to being seen with an ugly woman or man depending on what floats your boat!
Would you volunteer to stick your head in a noose?

Not only if you have an accident but your company can have a big say when you report it to them as you have to by FMCSA rule! It's better to hand in a parking on pavement or a seatbelt or failure to follow a traffic device to a 15 over speeding ticket not to mention that 3, 15+ or any other "reckless" ticket WILL get you a 90 day unpaid vacation first offence, then a 120 for second offence then a complete loss of CDL privileges for life for the 3rd!

Yeah take this advice and just pay but see if whats his name will take those days off or the loss of job or pay a law suit for you! I doubt he'll be there for you with this advice!

Heck, you worked hard for that ticket, might as well pay the rest of the penalty and get the lawyer after trying to sweet talk the Clerk of the Court or the DA!

 

I had a speeding ticket once, 15mph over, when I went to pay 7 days later, due to clean driving record, they offered me to either contest in court or pay the fine & they will reduce it to Defective Headlamp on my record. I chose the Defective Headlamp, so no speeding will ever show up for that incident. All you can do is ask if they do not offer it to you.

 

Ok, you pay the lawyer $350 and it will be reduced from a moving violation. In Oklahoma, your 'minor' speeding ticket is 2 pts. Every year you have a NON-moving violation, as per that link in my post showed on their page 94, you will get 2 pts removed off your State license. You can take a class and have 2 pts removed off OK. license, too.
Get it changed to 'non moving' and it is 1 pt State, and 5 pts CSA.
No matter what...
If you pay the $350 you still WILL get a "Failure to obey traffic control device" which is 5 CSA points, per that chart.

Ok, say you just pay the $85 ticket. It is 4 pts on the CSA system. See that on the chart??? So, is 4 pts better or 5 pts better? You aren't going to get out of ticket. It would be better, per your State, to not have many moving violations. No doubt. Especially if you have a lot of tickets. Hey, they are gonna knock guys out of driving if you get lots of tickets...expect it in the coming years.

I would just pay the ticket. I'd first call the Court, and ask if they can reduce it to a 'non moving violation'. Heck, it might work. I dunno. If you don't try you will never know.
If it don't work, you have your option to get a lawyer.

I will not pay that much, for a 'minor' ticket. Just is me....I gotta right to not do that. I know to not speed. I've had 2 in 7 years and 700,000+.

You WILL get CSA points, no matter what the charge is. They aren't so important unless you are a habitual screw-up. I see you got out of a Log Book violation. Maybe you need to 'tighten it up' a little bit... just sayin'. No offense. Just trying to help.

4 pts or 5 pts, 2 pts or 1 pt. on OK. state. I don't know the points of your State. Call up the DMV and find out. Weigh your options. Me personally, I'll play hell before I'd pay $350. I don't get many tickets tho. Good luck

 

No matter the outcome, not the ticket, but the inspection report is permanent record and you'll have the points for three years. You don't go to court for inspection reports. They have an appeal process if you feel it's unjust, but you'll have a tough time getting the report destroyed or lowered. With CSA2010 firing up, you can expect a DOT man to pull an inspection with every traffic violation. If it was just a ticket from a local cop, I would say fight it. Any future accident, a lawyer can dig the info up and follow the paper trail. The old days are over with. You don't get a ticket dismissed and oh well, throw that inspection report away.

If it was just a ticket. the first thing a traffic lawyer will do is sweet talk the cop and try to negotiate the ticket. He and the judge are the only ones involved with the case. I don't think a DA would waste his time with misdemeanor traffic tickets. His job is to fight real cases. Maybe someone else knows different, but in traffic court, it's you, the cop and the judge. Or an attorney representing you. A court clerk takes money and uses a keyboard.

I would pay the ticket and keep your nose clean. A 10 over ticket is not that big of a deal. One ticket doesn't make you a habitual offender as if you were in an accident and suing attorney would seek in an accident trial.

As a truck driver will drive million of miles, it's almost impossible not to get a ticket in your lifetime. Many drivers are accident free, but not ticket free. Don't feel bad.

You must of come off US-61 if you weren't doing something local. I-64 starts at the I-270 loop. It's 60mph inside the loop and 55 downtown. I don't think it's 70 mph until you get above Troy. Take I-70 next time, it's quicker if you come off US-61.

 

A cdl holder should never just pay a ticket.....................................

end of point.

 

Good luck then. Ask him about the inspection report. The ticket goes to local court. The inspection report goes to the state.

Let us know the outcome.

 

Is a 392.2 construction zone fightable?? My load was heavy and my breaks didn't react properly

 

I did it a few years ago in Texas. It kept my license clean,couldn't have any violations for the next 12 months. It was pretty pricey,but i guess it was worth it. The tough part is finding the right Lawyer. I started on the web looking for Atty's in the town that the court was located. Got turned down by several Atty's,finally one gave me the number of the right guy. You can also contact the Bar Association for the area.