FUEL IN OIL 2010 CUMMINS ISC 8.3

Discussion in 'Heavy Duty Diesel Truck Mechanics Forum' started by Kawi027, Feb 22, 2018.

  1. Kawi027

    Kawi027 Light Load Member

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    Apr 22, 2013
    LAS VEGAS, NV
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    Yes but would a clogged up doc or dpf cause fuel to get into the oil? The clogged dpf seems light a symptoms rather than the root cause...My thoughts would be to try and find what causing the dpf to get extra soot (possibly overfueling/running rich).
     
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  3. Goodysnap

    Goodysnap Road Train Member

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    The HEST lamp will usually be set to come on above 500F and below 5mph. Nothing concrete to go off of here except that the exhaust was hot. Did it complete a passive regen? Stop in the middle? or just start one....... No way to know. This is why you need to review the regen history.

    This is a toss up IMO. Engine fan running continuous does tend to keep things from heating up engine wise but you also have the increased load of the fan on the engine. Either way this should not be a big enough issue to be the root cause of frequent regens.

    Face plugging DOC and DPF soot blocked are going to be the result of the failing injectors if they are determined to be the root cause of all your troubles with the fuel dilution. Do we know when or if it has ever been serviced?The regen history will tell a story of what is going on in the aftertreatment. If it really is regening even once a day it is too often IMO. I would say given the application on a healthy engine and DOC/DPF you should be around the 20-25 engine hour mark for regen frequency. I would be getting the DOC/DPF apart for inspection and performing the snap accell test I suggested in my previous post. Heavy is correct that DOC's can lose their platinum washcoat over time causing poor temperature rise.

    If your regen history shows troubles getting up to temp and regens every 5 hours the oil will be getting fuel diluted much quicker than normal. Does this truck run OK? Does it have any history of CEL coming on? If so what faults have been logged? I know you said this truck has an idle timer set but then drivers defeat them every day.......this is why I asked for total engine hours? Please post ESN and we can look deeper into TSB's and injector updates that may apply to this engine.
     
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  4. Kawi027

    Kawi027 Light Load Member

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    Apr 22, 2013
    LAS VEGAS, NV
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    Thanks for your responses here we go:
    1.engine serial # 73134937
    2.engine hours 8328
    3. dpf regen history: seems to be regening every 4-5 hrs *no cel light since it is passing the regen everytime it passive regens. All parameters are within specs (its just passive regening too often) You are correct cummins said about 1x every 24hrs.
    4. I did a cylinder cut out test through insite: i isolated every cylinder by running the engine on 1 cylinder only at a time. Each cylinder was able to maintain between 670-730rpm when isolated. All cylinders sounded the same when operating by themselves.
    5. I tried running a Fuel injector performance test through insite but it failed about 30seconds into the test. The error was "The test was stopped because the Fuel System Pressure decay rate was excessive"
    6. I performed through insite a Fuel system leakage test. Max pressure during test was around 29,000 psi, when I shut the truck off and back on the data monitor logger dropped from 29,000psi all the way to 180psi in about 12seconds!! (failing this test).
    Cummins states that a change in fuel pressure greater than 21756 psi in 30 seconds is an indication of a high-pressure fuel system leak.
    7. I am taking the dpf and doc to get cleaned/baked this weekend as I dont think it has ever been done and more then likely has mass amounts of soot buildup due to the frequent regens and possible soot build up from the mysterious fuel leak.
    8. to answer the question regarding idle time, i dont think this is a factor as the truck/driver has no reason to idle very long + I have gps in truck and his time/route seems to match up everyday.
    9. truck engine runs strong. No active trouble codes present. In the past we had inactive codes 3232, 2771, 3583, 3597 and 3681 all associated with after treatment and NOX sensors.

    *side note, the truck did have a large leak in the charge air cooler that went unnoticed for about 5months and was affecting power uphills due to lost boost pressure. Driver just thought the truck was a dog uphills...As soon as we installed a new air charge cooler he was climbing hills about 25mph faster. (never once threw a code for this). The reason I mention this is because cummins states that excessive passive regens can be linked to exhaust leaks, I know the air charge cooler is intake air but for some reason cummins want you to check the intake for leaks in their excessive regen troubleshooting tree.

    Sorry for the essay, but I ran alot of test today and wanted to get as much info as possible to you guys!

    Thanks
     
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  5. Goodysnap

    Goodysnap Road Train Member

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    Now we are getting somewhere......You need to troubleshoot the fuel system rail decay as you have a leak somewhere in the high side common rail. One of the injectors, the relief valve , or the fuel pump head is leaking causing the decay. Check the relief valve first, it should have zero leakage and I see alot of them fail and go from there. Its the easiest to check and the cheapest to fix as well.Get the rail decay solid and get that IPT test to pass. I highly recommend a reman filter versus cleaning, but make sure you get the fuel system squared away before you put it all back together.

    I will look into tsb's and update with more info later on.........Engine software level?
     
  6. Hulld

    Hulld Road Train Member

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    That fuel injector performance test is quite telling.
    I am willing to bet your issue is a cracked injector.
    I have seen this many times with common rail Cummins.
    Remove the valve cover start it up plug in and run the test that runs the rail pressure all the way up and get a light and check each injector.
    You should not have any problem seeing fuel spraying out of the bad one.
    They usually crack up the side.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2018
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  7. Kawi027

    Kawi027 Light Load Member

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    Apr 22, 2013
    LAS VEGAS, NV
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    I will get the engine software today and report back.
    What is the tech name for the relief valve also what is the test procedure andwhere is it located?
    Thank you
     
  8. Kawi027

    Kawi027 Light Load Member

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    Apr 22, 2013
    LAS VEGAS, NV
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    Def check this when we get the valve cover off. Thank you
     
  9. Kawi027

    Kawi027 Light Load Member

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    Apr 22, 2013
    LAS VEGAS, NV
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    I called my dealer and the valve your talking about on #18 in the picture/thumbnail below ? If so is there a test procedure or just try and replace?
    Thanks fuel pressure .PNG
     
  10. Kawi027

    Kawi027 Light Load Member

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    Apr 22, 2013
    LAS VEGAS, NV
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    If the fuel pressure relief valve is bad how would this contribute to fuel getting into the oil? Or would this solely help fix the rail decay pressure problem?
     
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  11. Goodysnap

    Goodysnap Road Train Member

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    Yes, this is the pressure relief valve. Flow from the return of this valve should be zero (I believe the spec is in drips per minute) during the fuel system leakage test. You should have no fuel coming out of this valve during the test. You can replace it and recheck the rail decay if you choose to.

    Complete system diag steps are found in the Service manual on QSOL - fuel system Diag.section 005-236

    If it comes down to injectors-they want you to measure return flow and cap each injector. This is a valid test. I'll be the first to admit , I usually cheat on this and just time the rail decay during the test with each injector capped and note the changes to the decay time for each injector. If you cap one and it holds steady, you found your bad one. There will be some fluctuation in the rail pressure sensor but for the most part it should hold pressure.
     
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