HOS rules and working in yard.

I think you are right, as long as you keep the wheel in your hands you are driving, but hey.... my logbook has only 3 lines while I work: sleeper, driving and on-duty. I would be crazy to put anything offduty since it could mess up my 8-2 split. Also onduty for a driver otr like me is never more than 15 minutes. And that is 15 pu, 15 drop, 15 fuel, 15 PTI. Never had a problem with that.

I think that someone who spends time in the yard and wants to log that and he logs everything on-duty can argue that he only moved trailers which was not more than a minute each move, but most of the time he was on-duty....

As long as we do not have E-logs that log minute by minute it is a question of common sense....

I am sure the driver who started this post was abused by the company in the yard and that is why he started it

 

Here's the definition of "Driving time":

Drivers need to remember that the rules aren't in place to limit you as much as they're there to give you leverage against your company to keep them from forcing you to operate when you're fatigued. A good company expects their drivers to not be lazy #####, keep the left door closed, get loads picked up and delivered on time, and get that occasional crappy load delivered without too much complaining. Do that, and they'll listen when you tell them which driving schedules work for you and which ones don't. There are plenty of good paying driving jobs out there, available to safe and hard working drivers. Don't risk your CDL and clean MVR by staying with a company that doesn't give you a schedule and hours that you are able to work without being fatigued while working.

 

I know this is an old post, however, I would like to share my interpretation of the HOS and yard work. According to section 395.2 Definitions - Question number 9, any yard work has to be logged in as On Duty - Driving. The reason for this is simple, the HOS were created to keep fatigued CMV drivers off the road. Driving around the yard on a CMV should and will count against your HOS driving time. It is all for liability reasons. Lets say a CMV driver worked a few hours around the yard and he did not logged those hours because if he did he would have not been able to complete a trip he intended to take that same day. He then leaves the yard and gets into an accident. Everything will look good on paper, that is, until the other party hires the Texas Hammers (Texas Lawyers) and hammers the driver and carrier into court. Once there the lawyers will probably cite this definition and get into a big legal battle with the carrier, which most likely will end up in a settlement (lots of money for the other party).

Also, XFM2013 asked the question about a placarded wagon and Hazmat endorsements. My answer to that is, yes, they do need a CDL and a Hazmat endorsement. Again, it is all about liability for a company. Lets say something happens with a non CDL driver or a CDL with no Hazmat endorsement and the chemicals spill or other people get injured. When a lawyer or a regulatory agency such as FMCSA, OSHA, or EPA come asking questions about the qualifications and HOS of that driver, some will have to face the consequences. But then again, everything is legal until you get caught >

 

I get your point(s), but I disagree. Both scenarios you describe would require yard men to have CDLs (and endorsements). Many of them (most, at some carriers) are non-CDL dock workers. It's on private property, therefore the vehicle is not a CMV requiring a CDL or any endorsements (or even a license plate) to operate. If they take it out on the street that's another story.

Also, even as a CDL holder, doing yard work is not considered driving time. It's On Duty, Not Driving. This is widely accepted, even with electronic logs. The newest version of ELDs even have an option for On Duty - Yard Moves to prevent it from automatically going into Driving status.

 

LOL

Ooops Sorry

 

Thanks for clearing that up Bob! I got confused with their guidance on 395.2 question and answer number 9. However, after reading your reply it makes more sense. I changed my point of view and agree with you. I read over the latest ELD mandate and they go back and forth about the personal conveyance and yard moves. On page number 78367 (last paragraph) it even talks about how non-cdl drivers can have their own unique login for and ELD. That way they can account for the miles and not have "unassigned events".

Sadly, the FMCSA never fully defined nor gave parameter limits for mileage and time thresholds for drivers using these statuses. Which leaves me with two questions. Can oilfield drivers use the "yard move" status for leased roads? Can non-cdl drivers operate on lease roads? They are technically not a public road and they lead nowhere but oil field pads.

 

Good info, and good question. I'll leave that one alone (I'm glad to have no clue about oilfield work).

 

then why can you still yard dog it w/o a cdl then. C'mon dude common sense goes a long way. You can be a yard dog 16hrs a day if you want you just can't be on the road in till you do your reset. You can even do 60 hr straight. You wouldn't be able to say take a trailer across town to a drop yard until you've had a 34