Idiling...a Criminal Offence

• Actually, it's been empirically found by a poster person right here that his truck (& I assume others of similar type) actually consume about 0.5 gals per hour.

• And at 0.5 gal per/hr it's $12 a night.

• $12 x 5 nights = $60 x 48 weeks = $2,880
• Or $12 x 7 nights = $84 x 48 weeks = $4,032

• Has anyone come out with an industry standard specifying:
• (1) The validity of that 6hrs idling = 1 mile of driving ratio?
• (2) The longer period between oil changes?

• When you add (or deduct) the fuel surcharge, your cost per hour of idling diminishes further.
• So instead of that $3.00 gallon that you figured on, it's less by the amount of the fuel surcharge.

• With units going for upwards of $10k installed, add the probability of incurring additional debt for financing spread out over x number of years, add some maintenance, deduct some tax break, you "might" break even in 2 yrs but probably closer to 3 yrs.
• In three years, you'll have added another 150k per year in miles equaling about 450k miles.
• Now it's time to replace the truck unless you got it with no miles on it & can afford to squeeze another year out of it.
• When the truck is replaced, the APU needs to be refitted..if it can.. at a cost of $2,000 or so?
• What did you save?
• It looks to me like all you did was swap one expense for the other.

I'm still waiting for someone to enter this topic with real empirical data showing how much they actually saved due to the APU.

 

I can't find the post of the man that chose to perform the idling tests.
I think he included the engine make but I don't recall right now.
I figure if his can do it, so can others.
At least other makes might come close & probably below the "given" of 1 gal per/hr.

I tried to include that when I said:
In three years, you'll have added another 150k per year in miles equaling about 450k miles.
Now it's time to replace the truck unless you got it with no miles on it & can afford to squeeze another year out of it.
If you bought the truck with a few K on it already, it'll be way past 450k at trade-in time.
I chose 150k p/yr as a comfortable median.
3k per week X 48 weeks.
Seemed reasonable to me as a guide.

Good points.
I'm just working with the per unit costs that were presented here.

Which is why I went the lil extra length in providing this @ $3.00 per/gal x 8hrs:

• $12 x 5 nights = $60 x 48 weeks = $2,880
• Or $12 x 7 nights = $84 x 48 weeks = $4,032

Which I agree with but modify the statement to say 2 to 2.5 yrs to the "break even" point.
It hasn't yet begun to make or save you anything yet.

Figuring in the eventual cost to refit it to the next truck will cost you another 0.5 to 1yr before you get past the "break even" point.

If you don't refit it, you're back to where you started at square one.
Who knows what they'll cost in a few years.
Who knows if the goobermint will continue offering a $1000 tax incentive.

I agree.
I'm not trying to act as the last word on the subject by any means.

I'm just a poh dumb ol' boy who needs a bit more proof or at least some written evidence sporting the "actual" savings enjoyed by an APU owner over a period of time.

The only numbers I can come up with suggest an entirely different story than what I'm reading.

 

Well, I'm thinkin' if anyone runs in areas with restrictive
Big engine idling laws, an APU, that IS legal to run would be a welcome comfort on cold and hot days and nights.
And don't forget idling at shippers and receivers while waiting to be loaded and/or unloaded. That adds up quickly also.

How does one factor comfort?
What's that worth?

And if the APU produces 110 volts, you can power a buffer on site. Or lights for loading -- unloading in remote locations.
Our show trucks with APUs could and did power lighting for special events also.

How does one factor convenience?
What's that worth?

As for the Big trucks that claim to get 0.5 gallons per hour at idle,....
are those the engines that start and stop according to interior temperature?
I think that'd drive me nutz(er).

Also, if a Big truck equipped with an APU were traded in, I think that the resale price would reflect the APU that was included. To be fair, wouldn't that amount be deducted as a savings? It could add as much as $5,000, I figure.
So, if an investment breaks even around trade in, that extra amount for having an APU should be credited.
Shouldn't it?

And folks with pets on board tend to idle more for the comfort and well being of their pet(s).

And if for no other reason,...........they'll help by polluting less and burn less fossil fuel.

As for extended intervals betwixt oil changes, if you use an hour meter, compared to the odometer to determine when that service should be performed, you might be surprised.
When internal combustion engines run, they wear out the oil quicker.
If a Big truck runs 100 miles and idles for 8 hours every day, how many MILES before an oil change is needed?
An hour meter is more accurate for determining that.

 

so pets and cargo are more important than the driver

except if its below 25

so what do you do at 26-45?

what are you to do at 72-100+?

has there been any address to these scenarios? just freeze or sweat?

not to mention not one cop or politician will be in his home or his vehicle at these temperatures

i remember when cops fought for air conditioning in their cars, they claimed it was a work environment, and they won

is it that the fumes from diesel are that detrimental? then there should be an alternative

cigarette smoke is worse and that is still legal

 

>> Not so!
Beverly Hills, California just recently joined other cities by banning cigarette smoking within, I think, five feet from a public place, at least where food is consumed.

Restaurants and bars?
No Smoking.

But as far as I know, Big trucks are still legal in most places they need to go.<<

 

Reading the replies to this particular thread I think reveals that there are wide divisions within the truck driving community on what to do about the burgeoning anti idle laws. What is for sure is that there are diverse operating schedules from on driver to another.
So I thought I would throw a few more thoughts into the pot.

Essentailly to keep warm in the bunk on a cold overnight stop you could install a Webasto style air to air bunk heater. These things use about 16 to 32 oz of fuel for an overnight operation. They can run for about 30 hours on your regular chassis batteries without the need for dedicated deep cycle battery set. Costs vary but a $2500 budget would cover the cost.
And what about cold starting, yes there is a coolant heater unit for that too! Raises the block temp to about 135dg f
Ah but what about A/C you might ask?
Well there are units out there (8 to 10,000 btu) that will run for about 8 hours on a set of deep cycle batteries, all you would need to do is replace the alternator for an upgraded unit with about 180 amp output. This would make you fully Calif compliant (now and forever!) Budget $5000. This area I believe will eventually be the answer as technology advances.

Something I haven't mentioned but it is pertinent and that is the "R" factor of your cab & sleeper box. Most trucks have a dismal insulation factor, by improving that area and perhaps painting the outside in heat reflective type paints the thermal losses can be improved enormously over what is the norm today.
Actros
The APU HQ
Golden Co

 

I share the feeling that batterys & fuel cells will probably dominate the APU market soon enough.

Lithium-Ion cells in current production pack a lot of energy in very small devices now.
They remain pretty pricey though.

I'm not sure that the powers-that-be will be too accepting of hydrogen fuel cells in a big truck all that soon.
These are also expensive & finnicky.

The insulation in most trucks is mainly for sound deadening, not climate controls.
However, some sound insulation materials have a decent R factor as well.

I can't see any company affording their drivers any kind of insulation retrofit nor a new paint job with your suggested heat reflective paint colors.

I can see a new truck being spec'd with these but not something presently rolling.

 

Bob
Nice post.
Yes I believe lithium ion are the future as we have seen with the Toyota Prius. The problem seems to be not only the cost of the batteries but charging them. Essentailly they don't like a continual charge like our old lead acid jobs. The method is to employ a charging computer that pulse charges each battery for a short period then the computer looks at another linked set and charges those for yet another period and so on until the whole pack is charged. The down side of all this is not only the cost of the batteries but that charge computer as well.

As for insulation I see some truck makers are now offering an insulation package these days and I am working on some ideas for heat reflective paint but at present the colors are limited. I will most certainly offer this service in our shop shortly if we can get it all together.
Actros
The APU HQ
Golden Co