Life in North Dakota "Man Camps"?

Discussion in 'Oilfield Trucking Forum' started by sexystuff911, Sep 8, 2013.

  1. sexystuff911

    sexystuff911 Light Load Member

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    Not paid less to work harder! What I'm suggesting is a fair hourly wage (whatever amount that may be?). I used $15 or $20 as an example based on my current pay scale (which is $21 an hour when I do hourly work for my employer) not your pay scale, which is probably much higher... plus percentage to encourage us to run harder if we want to make more money. Something that would balance our interests for consistent pay with the companies interests of not over paying slackers...

    Basically, a combination of hourly plus percentage as a motivator... kinda like sales people earn, but better...

    I was aware that i would make less money for a while because I'm inexperienced in the oil fields and don't have winter driving experience. I accepted this fact, and can live with it. I didn't come to the oil fields as a "get rich quick scheme". I came here to acquire the skills I need, and I hope to eventually earn a decent living. I want to succeed, but I have a lot to learn first. My compensation will increase as become more proficient.

    I'm sure some of you are thinking that drivers who take less money, or percentage of pay, are undermining wages for the whole industry. I agree with you! I know that makes me a hypocrite, too! But, the fact is I'm not worth the money many of you are making, and you would be ticked if I hired into the job at equal pay when I'm not proficient.

    I'm not trying to start a fight here. I don't want this to turn into a debate about compensation in the trucking industry. But, inexperienced drivers have to start somewhere because we can't compete for jobs against experienced drivers who can go anywhere and demand higher wages. I believe the "undermining the pay in the industry" only comes into play when you have TWO EQUALLY QUALIFIED DRIVERS, and one opts for lower pay than the other.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2013
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  3. nd-newbie

    nd-newbie Light Load Member

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    The last haul job I worked, I negotiated to get ALL the chain-up pay since I was doing all the work. They proposed 30% of the $100 chain-up fee and I replied with all of it. That's easy money for the company, so don't try that line unless you have already proven yourself to be a good employee. Worked for me, though. $100 is better than $30, especially when you're chaining up and down on every trip.

    That's too complicated for o/o and too much driver pay for the big boys.

    Sexy (really?), that's a good concept. I have been approached by people about starting an oilfield workers' union, for both rig hands and drivers (you know, the bottom-of-the-barrel pee-ons to the corporations). I told them that there is inadequate adhesion among such a diverse group of people coming from all over earth to stake their claim at the American dream here. Most workers are just glad to be working and making a darned good living. In that atmosphere, without a common bad-guy to rally against, I doubt unionization for this group would have a better chance than a lit match on a Tioga Winter's night. Not saying there isn't a cause, but there is no common enemy to fight.

    That said, ND wages HAVE started to top out for most jobs. Four years ago, it wasn't so. Now it is evident to those who have been here awhile. Elsewhere in this site, I have written about the newest breed of o/o seeking drivers to drive their trucks, and how poorly they capitalize and manage their business. That bunch contributes to wages topping out, and indeed to some big companies paying less than four years ago. IF wages were to stagnate AND the cost of living were to continue to rise up here, that still wouldn't be enough to start a riot... I mean a movement.

    The one thing I see as a tipping point in the direction of drivers calling for collective bargaining is REGULATION. For those of you who haven't read it, CSA2010 and HOS2013 changed the responsibilities and liabilities of a driver and his company. You can be PERSONALLY liable for damages well above your earnings, should you be found guilty of negligence in certain circumstances. This was always so of civil proceedings but now there are CRIMINAL CHARGES ready to fire into your life, sanctioned by the government and practically unknown to 95% of the drivers I meet and know. Companies have been relieved of some of their liability for how you drive, and that financial and criminal burden is now on YOU. Better read up.

    That said, I hauled oilfield fluids because I wanted a management position and I had to have hauling experience to supervise haulers. Makes sense. But I feel sorry for oilfield haulers who don't have an escape plan to get out of this line of work. OK, so you're new here. It's all exciting and the paychecks seem bountiful. Well, two things can happen that you need to plan for and not just hope neither happens. One is the boom. It could go away tomorrow. Half of the haul trucks in North Dakota are owned by small o/o firms who operate with very little financial risk. Most of them do business out of their truck with an inverter, cel phone, laptop and fax machine, and have no offices or office personnel to get rid of. All they have to do is leave the state and go home. Two is an incident where you are found partially or wholly at fault for someone's injury. The government now says YOU and your estate (read: even after you die) can be locked up, fined and held responsible for someone else's bills, for life. It's no longer just a civil claim you might run from for awhile by working 1099 or other means, it's the government hunting you down. Good luck renewing your CDL!

    Not trying to scare anyone, but I suggest you read CSA2010 and HOS2013. Sticking your head in the sand won't pay your bills if something happens. I know most drivers won't, because "it can't happen to them" or "I don't have time" or any other grade A excuse that comes to mind. But it had to be said anyway, if only for the record.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2013
  4. sexystuff911

    sexystuff911 Light Load Member

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    No, not really! Lol! My screen name is a long-running joke amongst me and my friends. There's obviously a story behind it, which I'm not going to share on this forum! I'm just "me", and I don't think I'm sexy at all!

    I'm typing this on my Kindle, which is a real pain in the arse! I'll reply fully when I'm back on my laptop!
     
  5. Toddwalker

    Toddwalker Bobtail Member

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    Criminal charges?!? They were talking about this in my last orientation so I read up on it and it didn't sound fair. I think it's time for me for start on my degree and get out of trucking…this is getting scary. At least the oilfield paid off my bills, but I think I've put in enough time.
     
  6. nd-newbie

    nd-newbie Light Load Member

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    That was my point. Over-regulation, to the point of arbitrarily lading down more responsibility onto the individual driver and off the company, without requisite compensation from the company for assuming their previous responsibility, may become a straw that breaks. We'll see. It depends on how bad the economy stays as to whether drivers will see past all the distractions and organize. You can bet such a move would be fought by employers who have, for many years now, been able to pay drivers without overtime. Watch the news for claims of rising prices, just like they try when a higher-minimum-wage law is proposed. Always hyped, but little truth to it.

    Kudos for having an exit strategy. Most do not have one beyond their next home-time.

    ... which means that you probably ARE sexy. It's the belligerent and proud girls touting their qualities that usually have little of which they speak. :)
     
  7. sexystuff911

    sexystuff911 Light Load Member

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    N. California
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    I'm happy to report that I'm still working! That's why I haven't had much time on my laptop. I've been filling a "niche need" for my employer lately. Kind of a "gopher" driver for various divisions of the company. I really like it! I learn a lot, and its not as chaotic. Im feeling better about myself and my skills. I did apologize to dispatch for my tizzy fit last week. I feel like an idiot! It was a perfectly . legitimate mistake that I misinterpreted... I'm very embarrassed!

    Hammer166:
    I think I understand about the Jake brakes on the ice... basically, the Jake's slow the tractor, but the trailer is still pushing with the same momentum. Because t he trailer is almost always off-kilter for one reason or another (like leaning w curvature of road)' th e momentum of the off-kilter trailer (that is now traveling faster than the tractor) will push the slowing tractor into a Jack knife on ice. I think the physics of t his is beginning to make sense for me!

    Also, to correct a trailer that has begun to swing or slide on the ice, tap the trolley brake to pull the trailer back in line behind you....


    Do l have t his correct?

    ND newbie:

    When you say driver's can be criminally liable, are you talking about circumstances in which no prior crime was committed that contributed to, say.. an accident?

    I can understand a driver being criminally liable if he, for example, was in gross violation of hours of service, fell asleep at the wheel, and killed somebody. The violation of HOS was a crime that contributed to the accident. Please give examples.

    I admit I have no idea what CSA 2010 and the new HOS say... I've never been stopped, never had an accident, my CSA, DAC, and DMV are all spotless. I've always worked for excellent employers (except the aggregates job in CA). I'm admit this has made me complacent...
     
  8. Hammer166

    Hammer166 Crusty Information Officer

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    I'm sure this will start a peeing match, but that isn't a good habit to get into, and here is why:

    A tire has only so much traction, divided between that lateral forces that keep everything in line and the fore and aft forces of braking and acceleration. So when your trailer steps out, it is an indication that you have exceeded the traction limit of the tire. Applying the trailer brake by the trolley (I call it a johnny bar, but trolley is used, too.) is asking the tire to provide even more traction, when there is no more traction to give. It will either lock up the trailer or cause it to slip even more, further lowering the lateral force the trailer tires can provide. You can do this in a straight line on ice or snowpack, and the trailer will step one way or the other, depending on wind and camber. Now if you are accelerating, the trailer may pull back in line a bit, just from the physics of the straight ahead tug, but it would do so whether or not the trailer brakes were applied.

    Also, that trick will work if the brake balance isn't correct, and the truck is out-braking the trailer, but be very careful as you have little feedback through the valve and can easily apply too much trailer brake and just cause yourself problems.

    I've never used the trolley method, and I've got plenty of miles in nasty stuff over the years, but you'll find guys who will swear it always works. Even when the traction and road conditions are such that there could be no possible benefit. The only time I ever used the trolley when moving was if I was playing and tossing the trailer around, or loading the trailer brakes in deteriorating conditions to check the available traction. (Or to heat the trailer brakes up in wet, freezing conditions, just before dropping the trailer, so the next driver didn't have to bang the drums to free the shoes.)

    Glad to hear you got things patched up @ work!
     
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  9. sexystuff911

    sexystuff911 Light Load Member

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    Im from the San Francisco Bay Area... I think the term "trolley bar" is endemic to t he West coast
    because we have cable cars which, in my neck of the woods, were referred to as "trolleys".

    I keep getting solo much conflicting information about driving on the ice!!! I think I like your idea of not using the trolley bar better, however, as I prefer to keep both hands on the wheel when I'm in scary situations! I'm sure my grabbing for the trolley bar in a panic would be a disastrous situ a tion! Do you advise just gently accelerating out of a skid on the ice???

    I'm mad at myself, right now... I have a flat on t he rear, outside passenger tire of my trailer. I wiped the treads down with de-I c e spray and I can't find a puncture mark. That mean s I had to have bumped some thing last night... I'm completely baffled. The tire was fine on my pretrial. I drove 3 miles and dropped it. Picked up another trailer, did a load, then grabbed my empty trailer, drove 2 blocks and the tire is flat. Again no puncture wound. Is it possible to bump a tire off the rim rubbing against a frozen pile of dirt?
     
  10. Hammer166

    Hammer166 Crusty Information Officer

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    Sometimes you need to gently accelerate, other times just going to neutral throttle is enough. And you want to ease off the brakes enough to keep the wheels all turning. All you are trying to do is have tension on the 5th wheel connection. This is where guys get the idea to use the johnny bar. And that can work, provided you could quickly find the point of very light trailer application so you don't overwhelm the trailer's traction. But the no feedback mechanism of the johnny bar makes that a very difficult thing to achieve on a consistent basis, and why I never used it.

    Is it possible? Yes. Likely? NO! At least not if the tire was aired up. And if you hit something hard enough to break the bead, it will have left an obvious mark on the sidewall. And I've had plenty of flats over the years that had to go in the water tank to find the bubbles of the leak, as there was no visible indication of the puncture. So don't waste your time like that, get it in tire shop and let them find it with the wheel off the truck. I understand being conscientious, but there is no sense in field-hunting a puncture unless you are going to do a field patch.
     
  11. nd-newbie

    nd-newbie Light Load Member

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    Sep 15, 2011
    Minot ND
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    One thing to avoid in the mancamps is prostitution. The management does their best to keep working girls outside, but when money is involved there is always a way. I recall a few girls being busted for trespassing into one of the Target Logistics camps a few years ago. The "clients" got summarily booted from the mancamp that night. If you're into that kind of vice, Williston has more flesh for rent than Vegas, just go to a bar or two. Not my brand of tea, but those girls wouldn't be here if there weren't adequate demand.

    Why bother, anyway. Just work, rest and save you money for home.
     
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