Logbook language; inapropriate or illegal?

Discussion in 'Trucking Industry Regulations' started by Nuthinspecial, Jul 29, 2007.

  1. Nuthinspecial

    Nuthinspecial Bobtail Member

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    Nov 19, 2006
    Salem, Or
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    Ok, I'll make this as short as possible. I drive flatbed and was recently pulled over (way out in the countryside) by a D.O.T. officer and cited for not having a red flag on the back of my load. For those not familiar with the rules, a red flag is required during daytime hours and must be lighted at dusk for any load extending beyond 4 feet of the rear of your trailer. The load I was hauling was 60 foot material that extended 3 foot 8 inches beyond the trailer......for the most part. The material wasn't stacked perfectly even and one piece of it actually protruded to 4 foot 1.5 inches, thus the citation.
    In talking with the officer I explained to him that I haul this particular load several times a day everyday and haven't ever noticed it extend beyond the 4 feet. He said, yes I know I see you out here everyday, but today you looked to be hanging off a bit too far. I agreed that 4 feet was 4 feet and that I was indeed beyond the four feet even if only one piece of the 120 pieces was beyond the four feet. He gave me a citation that cost more than I was being paid to haul the load. Not wanting to fail the attitude test, and technically bull you-know-what as it was, I was still guilty. Before I pulled back out, I updated my logbook reflecting the time to recieve the citation (on duty not driving of course) and made the follwing entry on my logbook:
    thistown, state....cited by d.o.t. for bull**** reason.

    Yes, I was angry at the time. Yes I was looking at him in my sideview mirror when I wrote it. Yes it was not very professional. And yes it did make me feel better!

    So I get back to work and explain what happened to my dispatcher, even showing him a picture from my camera phone that I took with a tape measure showing the exact distance. His comment was, "Well that was pretty chicken**** of him." I agreed, however the next day he wrote me up (a disciplinary form) for not following the rules basically. Fine, I felt I was punished enough by having to pay the fine and then to get wrote up by the company for the same incident was frustrating. I took it well though, thinking to myself 'lesson learned the hard way.' Now I flag every load, even though I know it's only 3.5 feet or so.

    I thought this was a done deal, it has been 4 weeks, I have paid the ticket (which the court knocked off $12 at my request) and I signed my disciplinary form. Now I get called in for another disciplinary form signing session...what for this time? For writing "Bull****" on my logbook entry. Actually, it says "using inapropriate language on a federal document."

    Now, as I said earlier, I agree this was not one of my more professional choices for grammar on my logbook, and it IS a federal document. However, it is MY federal document and if I write something distasteful or inapropriate on it and the D.O.T. officer auditing doesn't like it, wouldn't he come talk to me? Or if it is illegal, he would write me yet another ticket right? Why would my company write me up for this? I haven't been written up for ANYTHING in my 22 years of working. Now I have been written up three times in the last 4 months two relating to this extended load and I can't remember the other. You don't suppose it has anything to do with me asking for a raise a month ago and still not getting any response do you?

    Now, frustrated as I am for being ticketed, and written up twice for the same incident (although differn't aspects of it) I have asked for a copy of any and all disciplinary forms in my personel file from the human resources person....TWICE. The comment I got the first time was, "I'll have to check with the owner to see if I can let you have that." The second time I asked I heard, "I haven't been able to talk with the owner about this, and I'm off tomorrow, talk to you on Monday."

    What do you all think of this fishy situation? Something doesn't add up to me. Thank you for letting me vent!
     
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  3. bullhaulerswife

    bullhaulerswife Forum Leader/Admin Staff Member Administrator

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    Jul 23, 2007
    Midwest
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    You have the right to all information in you personnel file. But the kicker is, you never know if you are getting all of the information in that file, and they have a grace period to get that information to you, depending on your states laws.

    I worked in HR for a while and the company policy there was 30 days on all personnel record requests from the employee, but on references for new employment was 3 days.

    Good luck, and honestly, they should have just included the second write up in with the first one, since the occurrence date would be the same. But thats just my personal opinion on that one.

    Good luck.
     
  4. Markk9

    Markk9 "On your mark"

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    Nov 26, 2006
    Lehigh Valley, PA
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    The logbook is the property of the driver. It is a legal document that you the driver must keep even if you leave the company. Your company is going to disagree, but in legal terms it’s the drivers. Your company must also keep a copy of your logbook for 90 days. You should get a copy of the company driver policy book and see if states any thing about language.

    All in all it would take $1-2K to hire an attorney and fight the company on this.

    Mark
     
  5. Nuthinspecial

    Nuthinspecial Bobtail Member

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    Nov 19, 2006
    Salem, Or
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    The driver policy handbook does NOT state anything about this...this is a very small company made up of mostly owner operators. I don't want to fight them on anything, I was just curious for my own piece of mind to know exactly where I stand on this issue. It was always my understanding that the logbook was my property and my resonsibilty. Of course I have to submit a copy to the company, I believe within 7 or 14 days, but what the logsheet says or doesn't say is ultimately my responsibilty and as far as I know, other than being professional or not, the language written on it is at the discretion of the writer. To my knowledge there is no "law" against inapropriate language.

    I'm not looking to make a mountain out of this mole hill, but I am a bit frustrated with the situation, and am thankful for your input and opinions.
     
  6. MACK E-6

    MACK E-6 Moderator Staff Member

    48,197
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    Sep 19, 2005
    Baltimore, MD
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    Whoa, hold it!!

    You mean to tell me that you are an owner-operator, meaning it is YOUR truck, and some dispatcher had the colossal gall to hand you hate mail to sign?!?

    That's a laugh. I'd say what I would have told him he could do with his disciplinary forms but that would be against forum rules.
     
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  7. wallbanger

    wallbanger "Enemy of showers everywhere"

    Well, even though the logbook is your property, you Really should have rewrote that day's log, once you cooled off. And don't get me wrong, PA got me (on memorial day weekend) for $107.5 that they didn't deserve, and it had me pretty effin' steamed. But , like you, lesson learned.

    As for getting written up, that's at the company's discretion, and subject to their stupid policies. I'd sign it, then set it on fire and light a stogie off it (and maybe then pee on it to put it out) and go about my day.

    Good luck bud, this all could be related to you asking for a pay raise, but of course, they will never admit that...
     
  8. LogsRus

    LogsRus Log it Legal

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    Nov 23, 2006
    Indianapolis, Indiana
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    The company should be keeping a copy of your logs for @ least 6 months from the date of receipt. So technically if you send in January now, I must keep it for the next 6 months.


    I know if a driver gets a DOT out of service for log violations he gets dinged for it by the Ticket girl and by logs so I always feel bad about that, but the outcome equals the same. It shows DOT we discussed the "ticket" policy and we discussed the log violations. It is not meant to make u as a driver feel like we are double dinging you, although I can feel your frustration.

    I am sure the dispatcher is just making notes and in the end they would not hold the "1" situation as 2! We do that all the time (just hold 2 write ups as the same "issue").

    Now because I told drivers to write down what they are doing on their log (not thinking about "what would happen") and driver made the comment he was taking a "piss" (sorry everyone) and I showed my boss laughing but disgusted in the same and he got all in that drivers bootie, but no write up was done on it. I might make a note we talked about it, and tell you not to do it anymore but no real "grudge". Maybe that's all they did???

    Just my thought, not that it helps you much
     
  9. Nuthinspecial

    Nuthinspecial Bobtail Member

    29
    7
    Nov 19, 2006
    Salem, Or
    0
    No, I'm not an owner-op, I am one of the few company drivers they have.

    I should also note that at the tine of the second write up (for the inapropriate language) I did, against my better judgment but in an effort to neutralize the situation, did offer to "correct" the grammatical errors on that log sheet. They of course were happy to have me "correct" their copy....that's what made me mad I guess. I fixed what they perceived to be a problem and assumed that the write up would go away and I would receive a verbal, "don't do that again" kind of thing. Nope...the write up, along with the original is in my personell file.

    I'm wondering to myself now, why do I always have to learn things the hard way? LOL :biggrin_2552:
     
  10. wallbanger

    wallbanger "Enemy of showers everywhere"

    Bud, I have often wondered the same thing, all that matters is that lesson learned!
     
  11. im6under

    im6under Heavy Load Member

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    Feb 13, 2007
    iowa
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    IMHO...

    its just a plain old slow day and politics at work.

    he wrote what? he can't do that !!! call him in and we'll get this fixed and documented...

    look everybody I found an error (maybe) and am doing my job, justifying my miserable existence and sorry excuse of a payday. Can I have a raise or a pat on the back ???

    Does this guy get written up for being 30 seconds late back from lunch?

    For taking two dumps on the same day on company time?

    Has he ever parked and had a tire over the little line crowding the next space?

    Sometimes people get stupid, the rest of the time they are really stupid... so have a good laugh at it, skip the diet soda and go for the full flavored version, you've earned the reward for not choking the crap out of one more idiot that desparately deserves it.

    :yes2557: smile and be happy !!! life is good...
     
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