My company wants me to request two inspections at weigh stations

Actually the example has everything to do with a valid use, there is no regulation to even allow it and that is very important, the guy doing the inspection can make any use of it invalid at any time and don’t have to justify their reasons.

pc is supposed to be used in a limited fashion, not driving 600 miles home to get there in a weekend.

 

Because the FMCSA has issued guidance on this topic you are looking at this backward. There is no regulation that (PROHIBITS) doing it. Remember under the rule making authority given to federal agencies the same agencies can and very often do interpret their rules and regulations. In the case of PC the FMCSA has done precisely that!

The FMCSA can't write a rule expressly allowing PC because if they do there is a high likelihood of VERY thorny legal issues that would arise out of it. I have posted the history of why we have PC and the serious concerns carriers had during that rule making process. If I can find the time to go find those links I will later. I will just say this for the time being. PC is a grey area where the FMCSA has acknowledged that drivers are/were being forced to drive while out of hours because of how the shippers/recievers were abusing drivers time.

 

I would love to see where it is stated that driving 600 miles to get home would not be considered valid PC.

That 600 mile drive to go home would be considered more personal than a 6 mile drive from a shipper to safe parking because you ran out of hours.

Maybe issue is with the classification. "Personal" shouldn't be conflated with "Business" and in the case of the out of hours move to safe parking that is entirely business as it is to the shipper/consignee benefit, not the driver.

 

Since we're going down the PC rabbit hole, my rule of thumb is to always bobtail. If I drop my trailer in SA and bobtail home 55mi, I mark it "personal conveyance", then when I leave the house to get my trailer, I put PC to trailer". I always start and stop my PC in the same spot which I believe is in the rules for PC. I have cleared my use with my safety dept and they agree my use is 100% legal.

 

There is no maybe to it. As I said above the FMCSA is in a bit of a hard place on this issue. Without clearly allowing PC by rule they can't write specific rules. I do think that if you pay close attention to what the FMCSA issued guidance wise in 395.8 you might get an idea.

(a) Examples of appropriate uses of a CMV while off-duty for personal conveyance include, but are not limited to:

1. Commuting between the driver’s terminal and his or her residence, between trailer-drop lots and the driver’s residence, and between work sites and his or her residence. In these scenarios, the commuting distance combined with the release from work and start to work times must allow the driver enough time to obtain the required restorative rest as to ensure the driver is not fatigued.
2. Time spent traveling to a nearby, reasonable, safe location to obtain required rest after loading or unloading. The time driving under personal conveyance must allow the driver adequate time to obtain the required rest in accordance with minimum off-duty periods under 49 CFR 395.3(a)(1) (property-carrying vehicles) or 395.5(a) (passenger-carrying vehicles) before returning to on-duty driving, and the resting location must be the first such location reasonably available.

I take this to mean your line 1 or 2 time does not begin until you get stopped. This is my own personal opinion and is what always guided me when I was driving. I don't think the FMCSA wants a driver EVEN while PC to be driving for extended periods of time without rest. Driving 600 miles will take the average person 10 to 12 hours. I will never believe the FMCSA wants drivers operating a CMV for those long periods of time AFTER being on duty for 10 to 12 hours, I just don't.

Another opinion I share with some Safety critters as well as some state officers is the FMCSA guidance is open to interpretation by state officers. Like I said in an earlier post. The state of Ohio nailed a driver after he had driven close to 150 miles from his last on duty stop and could NOT establish his destination! He was placed OOS, fined and his truck was impounded and later towed! This is why I stated earlier I rather NOT be depending on an officer to decide if I am legal or not being 40 + miles from my last logged stop. Just a headache I never wanted!

 

Alot of weigh stations now days wont just give you an inspection just cause you ask for one. They like to pull you around back when you least expect it Imho.

 

In the past before CSA-2010 changed the rules drivers did do this a good bit. My father did it at the Vicksburg Mississippi westbound scale years ago. The truck was junk! To make a long story short my mother and I made an overnight trip to Vicksburg to help him get home.

Today, if a driver has a legit reason to suspect continuing to operate a CMV, would pose a danger to the public and expressed this to a DOT cop most are going to investigate. The problem is that not all scale masters are DOT/CVSA/MCSAP certified to do official inspections, or they can't leave the scale. However, if they can't do it all they have to do is make a call.

My advice to any driver contemplating taking this kind of action to give it serious thought first. Then if you feel the need you should stop in a place like a rest area or a scale. Then call 911 I would advise NOT bothering the scale master if they are alone as most are. When the officer gets there clearly articulate the issue and make the request official by recording the contact. Stay respectful but stand your ground.

 

Wait till you have been driving as long as i have . A nice surprise inspection on a side street that you fall into like in San Jose(those sneaky DOT), or in Phoenix when they force all drivers off the 10 freeway to a pop up commercial inspection.
You'll be saying that you were gonna get that fixed as soon as possible but you got caught in the DOT web of Whiners that will write you up for windshield wiper fluid.
Give it time

 

I am retired now. I am 62 years old and have been in and around trucking most all my life. I think if you will go back and re-exam my actual words you will see I also said I have been stopped at scales. My point was and STILL IS, not all inspections are in scales. I also had another point that I still stand by. I had MANY MORE clean inspections then ones where violations are discovered. As I said, develop an inspection system based on the link I provided.

 

Moose, the FMCSA doesn’t want to deal with it outside the guidance because the states would have a fit and reject it, there is no ‘thorny legal issues’ because they are the regulators, they are not held accountable nor would there be an issue for them to codify a reasonable regulation for pc.

most states will take the guidance as a defacto regulation or clarification of one. In this case the interpretation isn’t with the fmcsa, it is with the state and more so with the guy who does the inspection and the guidance says “reasonable” use, implying the carrier giving permission to use pc for the driver, so in this case the op doesn’t have a chance for a log violation because the state has already decided there is a limit, not the fmcsa.

In your quote of the guidance, as explained to me and reading the msp bulletin on the issue, there is an important word that many miss, reasonable.

Time spent traveling to a nearby, reasonable, safe location to obtain required rest after loading or unloading.

this applies in both parts of that quote, reasonable means just that, not a 300 mile trip home but rather a reasonable Distance and time to find food, lodging or rest.