Navistar Sued for EGR/SCR Fiasco

Discussion in 'Trucks [ Eighteen Wheelers ]' started by durallymax, Apr 11, 2013.

  1. durallymax

    durallymax Medium Load Member

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    Figured this would've been on here somewhere by now but a search for "Navistar" revealed nothing.

    There is a Class Action Lawsuit forming against Navistar by its shareholders in regards to their EGR engines. The way it reads, the shareholders are kinda pissed they lost close to 4 billion after Navistar scrapped the EGR idea in August. The time leading up to it is what the lawsuit about, they feel Navistar lied about its progress with the EGR only engine and led everyone to believe it would be successful.


    As many know, Navistar had been extremly opposed to SCR and was determined to find a way around it. The CEO was very outspoken about his resistance to the SCR technology, this can be seen in his youtube videos. Navistar went as far as to sue the EPA multiple times alledging they "favored" the other engine makers and that SCR could be easily defeated. The cases resulted in the other OEM's making sure to implement quality sensors and derate modes for low or poor fluid and Navistar looking even worse than they already had. They kept on their EGR mission and were very arrogant about it. They had a lot of credits stashed due to meeting the previous standards early. The EPA was going to allow them to sell their engines under a penalty but the other OEM's put an end to that. Then last August they publicly apologized for their arrogance and actions the past couple years and announced they were implementing SCR to their engines and scrapping the 15L engine in favor of the Cummins ISX. They appointed a new CEO and are now talking about closing one or more of their engine plants.

    http://protectshareholderrights.com/class-action/material-misrepresentation/navistar-nav-securities-fraud-class-action-lawsuit

    http://www.globenewswire.com/news-release/2013/04/11/537724/10028216/en/Glancy-Binkow-Goldberg-LLP-Announces-Class-Action-Lawsuit-Against-Navistar-International-Corporation-NAV.html

    http://www.successfuldealer.com/firms-file-class-action-suits-against-navistar/

    http://www.overdriveonline.com/navistar-offers-updates-on-switch-to-scr/

    http://fleetowner.com/green/archive/navistar-sues-epa-again-0714

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/joannmuller/2012/08/02/death-by-hubris-the-catastrophic-decision-that-could-bankrupt-a-great-american-manufacturer/

    http://www.thetrucker.com/News/Stories/2012/6/13/CourtblocksEPAplanforNavistarengineexemption.aspx
     
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  3. Heavyd

    Heavyd Road Train Member

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    I can think of more parties other than share holders that would love to sue!!!
     
  4. Cowpie1

    Cowpie1 Road Train Member

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    Navistar really screwed up all along. They had, in their hands, a really good alternative to the DEF game. They bought 50% into Amminex, a company that had developed and produced solid block cartridges of urea to do the SCR thing and the driver would not have to do anything at the pump. The cartridge would be changed out at normal service intervals. In the event of needing one before that, a new sealed cartridge could be stored on board the truck without all the spillage and other issues of DEF. I was really impressed with what Amminex had developed, and had put into use in Europe and some other locations. Navistar could have beat all the other OEM solutions hands down if they had put this idea into production in their trucks.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2013
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  5. durallymax

    durallymax Medium Load Member

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    I think a lot of people would enjoy throwing rotten tomatoes at them. Sounds like they are hurting, wonder if someone without an NA truck like will pick them up like VW or Fiat.
     
  6. sdaniel

    sdaniel Road Train Member

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    Have heard VW has been looking at international for some time.
     
  7. JarradS

    JarradS Light Load Member

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    Yes

    well, they (navi) already have a VW (MAN d26/mf13) engine
     
  8. Cowpie1

    Cowpie1 Road Train Member

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    Well some sensibility has returned to Navistar with new CEO. They just reintroduced the 9900i. Of course, with ISX in it. It would really help them out if they also offered the 9900 as a glider truck. I think that would really gain back some market share.
     
  9. 25(2)+2

    25(2)+2 Trucker Forum STAFF Staff Member

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    EGR and the multiplexed injection make more soot, and that makes for a shorter service interval, which for the block would have been better except every service has a cost. My brother has his DEF tank filled on the pickup at oil changes by the dealer, and DEF at the pump isn't a big deal, you don't need it every time unless the tank is tiny, mine will run over 4k miles.

    Weight is a problem, and carrying enough urea as dry and figuring out a way to dose it would have been cost prohibitive, especially when they were never, ever going to go that route, when they were standing behind EGR and multiple pulse injection. It's not that hard to put in DEF at the pump while fueling if needed , and if your company runs out and back, the shop can do it when the truck is home, and since it is just a matter of topping off a tank, you don't need to carry the weight or extra if you run out.

    It was a bad decision compounded by other bad decisions to rely on their lawyers and the courts to fix it, they ended up losing the ability to operate producing engines while paying fines because of this.

    International, (Navistar), is now at the bottom of the customer satisfaction lists, and many of the companies that were thumbing their noses at DEF are now buying Cascadias and Volvos instead of Prostars.

    Cummins stabbed them in the back, so they figured, when Cummins read the same writing everyone else was seeing and decided to abandon an EGR only solution to NOX. So now they are having Cummins design their after treatment, that figures. They are in good company, John Deere resisted SCR and also lost market share because of poorer fuel economy than the competition that embraced it(Case New Holland and AGCO Massey Ferguson).And Caterpillar is now training their technicians to service DEF SCR systems

    I think the only ones that made out well dealing with the issue for them were their lawyers, but also it also helped the lawyers for the competition and the competition, while they cheated themselves, their customers, and their stockholders and employees, not to mention the dealers stuck selling those white elephants.
     
  10. allan5oh

    allan5oh Road Train Member

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    This is a joke, the shareholders are idiots. The non-DEF engines were never going anywhere, and it's not due to lack of compliance. They're just plain bad unreliable engines. The worst thing that could've happened is Navistar somehow made them compliant. When it takes 3+ weeks to get warranty work there's a serious problem. I know a service manager that quit, and he said the factory support was a joke. Updates would come and they would make the engines worse.
     
  11. Driver of the year

    Driver of the year Medium Load Member

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    Thats the same reason why Caterpillar decided to suspend their highway Engines! All because of a hoax that engine pollute? but these same politicians that make these rules dont have a problem flying in private jets polluting 100 times compared to thousands of trucks!
     
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