Owner/Operator - 7/60 hour rule or 8/70?

Discussion in 'Ask An Owner Operator' started by wadeenterprisesllc, Jun 9, 2022.

  1. Wasted Thyme

    Wasted Thyme Road Train Member

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    If the truck has cargo. As an example. Even sitting still. It's optional.
     
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  3. ZVar

    ZVar Road Train Member

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    Nope, that's not operating. Here is Google's definition of operating:
    1. (of a person) control the functioning of (a machine, process, or system).
    2. perform a surgical operation.

    2. Obviously doesn't apply. How is a parked vehicle being controlled? Even if it's loaded? Remember it's the operation of the CMV that the regulation states, not the company.
    And even giving that you are correct, which I do not concede, the vast majority of anyone taking a 34 is empty so that doesn't apply for them anyway.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2022
  4. Wasted Thyme

    Wasted Thyme Road Train Member

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    Neither applies to a cmv.
     
  5. ZVar

    ZVar Road Train Member

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    Then find a definition that applies. I can only go off the English language unless there is a specific definition in the regulations. And there isn't.
    So just because you don't like the definition, doesn't mean it doesn't apply.
     
  6. Wasted Thyme

    Wasted Thyme Road Train Member

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    Ultimately it goes back to the intent vs the literal. The intent is if the company is open 7 days a week. Not if they are able to work 7 days a week.
     
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  7. ZVar

    ZVar Road Train Member

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    When a literal comma matters in regards to the law intent doesn't matter as much as what is written.
    Yes, I agree that the intent is O/O can also use the 70 rule, which I said in my original post on the subject. Doesn't change the fact that the regulations state something different than the intent. And we are both just guessing on intent anyway. After all the regulations could have stated if the company is available to work 7 days or something like that.
     
  8. Wasted Thyme

    Wasted Thyme Road Train Member

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    But then lawyers would be bored. LOL
     
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  9. TallJoe

    TallJoe Road Train Member

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    So, you found it!
    If that's the case then, technically, the truck should be in operations every day of the week for the 8/70 to be applicable. Other than that, it should adhere to 7/60.
    Since there is no indication in the rules (?) that a carrier must a priori declare itself to be in operations for every day of the week vs less than 8 days or it can be redefined at will, the 7/60 can default automatically to 8/70, if the 8th day is used. Also, enforcing 7/60 is logically impossible until after the truck is put to off duty status.

    For example, If I arrived from a 5-day trip with 65 hours on total duty time and parked the truck for the weekend, only then they could say that 7/60 was violated but not before I actually stay off duty for at least the entire 6 day. In this example, in order for this be compliant I should come back to the truck and use it in 6th, 7th and 8th day - perhaps to drive it a little around the area .

    I think it is counterintuitive and convoluted and would take an ambitious ambulance chaser to take advantage of it but I would not be surprised if they considered it. It is kind of like having to stay in the sleeper when you use split sleeper time and not being able to put yourself off duty even if you arrive at home and there is a bedroom a few feet away.
     
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