Prime- only newbies sing the praises 2

Thank you. You are too kind. But you are doing a great job of exposing the pack of predators called crime/prime.

 

The terms of any lease pretty much forbid you from doing anything that materially alters the operation of the truck. I'd guess that if you had a warranty, altering the rears would void it.

As long as whatever you do can be easily reversed. It's a leased vehicle, so It doesn't belong to you...

Huh??? Who the heck ever claimed that a leased vehicle was "their" property??

Actually, even at the company level we're not told how fast to run. As a consequence of operating in Canada, we do have to limit the trucks to 65.
Company drivers are required to maintain a certain fuel economy level, as a requirement of their employment - so you can't run full bore all the time.

Actually, lease operators can fuel wherever they want to. Works better if you stay within the fuel network since Prime does get some hefty discounts, and the fuel cards only work within the network. That's the same as most companies - of course if you're independently wealthy, you can do whatever you'd like. Probably doesn't include driving a truck.

Company side uses a computer-generated fuel solution, but you can resubmit the request. You can do a comcheck for a cash po. I regularily work with my FM to fuel where I need to... not necessarily where the fuel solution tells me to. No big deal. So I don't see what your point is here. Lease and owner ops are paying for their fuel out of their settlements, so obtaining the best price goes with the territory.

If it's not your vehicle, then I guess that comes with the territory too. "No alterations" means permanent changes - so if you're into Turbo3000's or Centramatics, for instance - you can certainly do something like that.

Well, yeah, so again what's your point? Outside of making the deal work based on the freight you get from the company, what you've got here really isn't much of an indictment. But that also goes with the territory, and the currently lousy freight rates.

 

The difference between a lease and a warranty as it pertains to this discussion is that leases typically prohibit the lessee from altering the truck. A warranty does not prohibit the owner from making any alterations. It merely states that the manufacturer will no longer guarantee parts that are not original to the vehicle, and in some cases original parts that may be directly affected by modifications, within the restrictions under Magnuson-Moss (15 U.S.C. § 2301)

The problem I see with some of these lease agreements is that some of the provisions are so restrictive as to call into question the point of the whole venture to begin with. If I need permission to install a power inverter, then I might as well be a company driver. I think part of the reason some drivers right out of school get themselves wrapped up in a company sponsored lease purchase program is because many people in the general public hold the misconception that truck drivers are expected to meet certain expenses. I've talked to many people who always thought that the fuel bill came out of the driver's paycheck. So its not much of a psychological leap to basically "rent" a truck from an employer. And I think some companies know this and play on that belief a little. Its not illegal for companies to do that; its all part of the sales pitch, but a big dose of caveat emptor is a good idea.

 

Got to agree with you there. It's ridiculous that many companies won't allow an inverter to be installed. The 12Vdc crap they sell in the truckstops is just plain junk.

This is a thread on Prime, so lets talk about that... Prime installs an inverter along with the APU, so that's not an issue. They do require that it's installed that way or by the detail shop - not as a way to rip you off. Some jerk installed a 3000W inverter on his own that shorted out, and burned one of the tractors down to the frame. They want a professional installation - can't say I blame the company for that.

Agreed completely! Leasing a truck isn't something you just jump into. I'm sure that's how most folks get into trouble on the leases... too many $$$ in their eyes for them to see the trouble ahead. Even a year or two ago when freight rates were better, there were plenty of folks going belly up with the lease deal at Prime.

But just because the lease deal is difficult because of the costs, isn't to say that buying your own truck is any easier. It's a difficult business, and I think that some of the drivers posting on this thread are ignoring that fact as well when they try to influence newbs that way as well.

 

Looks like we're finally getting some of the emotion out of this...

This guy likes to call me a "cheerleader." I drive for Prime. I'm not a recruiter or an office staffer. My experience with Prime has been positive, but I didn't jump into it with unrealistic expectations, or fall for promises that can't be met. Consequently, I haven't been "lied to," "screwed over," or "fleeced." I entered my employment with this company as an adult.

Agreed. Including the one at Prime. The only way that you can make it on a lease right now is via teaming or training - you need to have the higher revenue that you can generate from a team truck in order to meet your expenses. That's not to say that all lease deals are bad - anyone who tells you that has his head as far up the anal orifice as the guy who tells you everything smells like roses up there. But you have to be smart about getting into one of those things. Its not for someone who is new to trucking.

You won't find that at Prime. Yeah, we've developed a couple of dedicated runs of late, but they're not being offered to newbs, and probably never will be.

That's called job security. Doesn't come much in trucking - if you want that, best to stay at WalMart being the door greeter.

Most of trucking, especially being an independent with your own authority, is about dealing with financial ups and downs. Especially downs. You need a cash reserve to make it work - and leasing is no different. If you start with zero in the bank and lots of personal bills, then lease a truck and expect to make it - well let me know what you're smokin'! Sounds like its good stuff!

They do their deals differently at JCT. Prime has a lease/purchase deal on a 3-year contract; JCT does theirs on a 5-year contract. JCT pays for more of the variable costs than Prime does. That being said, you'd better have a plan, and a way of dealing with bad weeks - aka a bank account.

A number of the lease guys I knew at Prime have gone over to JCT because they couldn't make it at Prime in the last year. That's not the fault of Prime Inc. - Robert Low has to keep his company in business just like everyone else. That means that they've been cutting costs, and they get screwed by the low freight rates too. I've heard biotchin' about the 28% that Prime gets from shippers - well Landstar is worse - try 35%. And if you're doing the load boards... who knows? I've heard independents tell me about loads that the brokers get paying say $3500 being posted for less than $500, and the brokers pocket the fuel surcharge too. So who's getting screwed now? The trucking companies aren't setting the rates - in this screwy business, its the shippers and receivers who determine what will be paid - and we get to the trough after the brokers get theirs.

I haven't heard bad things about the JCT program either... but that's not an endorsement. Keep your eyes open and have a plan going into one of those things. Know the financials, and understand what YOUR bottom line will be before you ink the deal. And for god's sake, take the contract to an attorney first. If the company you lease with doesn't like that, then you don't want to be doing business with them because they're hiding something nasty in the weasel words.

And you better know your way around a truck... because if it isn't new, you need to know what to look for. Full ECM download, maintenance record review. And you'd better have the jack to do the inspections on it that you would do if you were buying a used truck. Taking it into an alignment shop and having it inspected. Putting it on a dyno. Doing an engine oil analysis... and (thanks Attitude Adjuster) having someone knowledgeable look a the fifth wheel - wouldn't have thought about that myself! It's black and greasy. More to it than that!

Agreed. The idea is to ride the wave, and get into a place that you can survive the next financial crap storm. Don't get "over-leveraged." Get a green pad in the bank. Keep up your maintenance. And definitely plan on the next down turn, because it's coming! That you can bank on!!

There are a lot worse companies to work for. Werner, CRE, Swift come to mind. CJ is right here. Get in somewhere, get your CDL, get trained, and get your experience. And two years was a bare minimum a couple of years ago when trucking companies were hiring cross-eyed poodles instead of drivers because there wasn't enough to go around. I've talked to guys with 5 and 10-years experience who can't get hired. If you're going to jump, make for #### sure you have somewhere to land before you go. Quitting and expecting a job to turn up just ain't happening. What is happening is recruiters selling a crap sandwich like it was a prime rib dinner... and I'm not talking about Prime here. You can read the horror stories in threads on the "other starter companies."

Well CactusJack... I am sorry you feel you got screwed by Prime. You made a "gentlemen's agreement" in a world that no longer admits that such a thing is binding. And I find that to be a crappy world myself. It sucks.

That being said, I'm not a Prime cheerleader. I'm a driver... I work. If any of you jerks don't believe me, you can PM me and we'll sit down for a cup of coffee. I'll even buy. I've got the trip reports to show that I'm on the road. And the tax returns to show that I'm making reasonable money at this "starter company."

Recruiters have a lot in common with used car salesmen. They're going to tell you what you want to hear, because they've got something to sell you. If you're buying - hey - buyer beware! Understand this: What a recruiter tells you may be worlds different than what you experience as an employee. Recruiters are not dispatchers or load planners. I can say that my experience with my recruiter at Prime was a happy one. She really didn't over promise, and I didn't read what I wanted to hear into her answers to my questions. So I wasn't "lied to." If you've had this experience, that you were "lied to," realize that you had a part in it. Suck it up, and get on with your life - quit blaming all your bad luck on everyone else.

My experience with my FM (dispatcher, driver manager, whatever) has been positive. At Prime, the FMs are paid a small base, and the rest is basically a commision based on your productivity as a driver. It doesn't pay them to let you sit. That doesn't mean you aren't going to be saddled with a jerk or an incompetant. They don't tend to last, but you're going to have to outlast the jerk or incompentant to get past that. They'll let you change if you have the documentation to show that you aren't at fault. Just walking into the supervisor of your divisions dispatch function and whining isn't going to get you anywhere. Nor is blowing-up and acting out. When freight is available, I get good loads - meaning miles for me, because that's how I'm paid. I don't sit - hardly at all since the beginning of the 2nd quarter this year.

Nor have I been asked to run illegally. In fact my FM and his stand-ins have been concerned about doing this job safely and legally. I have only been pressured to drive a couple of times, and its been the night-shift guys doing that. Hasn't happened often, and I make sure my FM knows about it when it has happened. Prime is doing real well in the safety ratings right now - slowing down has made us safer, less accidents. It also means I'm more likely not to get pulled into a scale for a DOT inspection. So again - I'm not cheerleading! I'm only relating my experience, which has been positive.

So based on this, if you talk to me on the road, I'm going to tell you driving for Prime as a solo company driver is a good deal. Are there better deals out there? Yeah, I'm sure there are, but I'm not jumping right now! I have a good job that seems secure in a time when neither is assured.

I'm also going to tell you that you are a fool if you think that leasing a truck as a solo driver is a good idea right now - ANYWHERE!

So ya know, if you had a bad experience with Prime... get over it.

If you're going to call me a company shill or a cheerleader... well so what? I'm only on this forum for the entertainment value anyway. I know what I do, and I know how well I'm doing. I'm willing to talk to any of you - I'd post my truck number and location, but that's got other Prime drivers banned from the site. LIke I said... I'm doing ok. Your mileage and experience may vary - and if it does, well that's your problem. And frankly, I could give a trailer load of cow manure if you don't like it.

 

What is the training like at Prime? From all I read, the first year with anyone is going to be a grin and bear it affair. So, Is the training at Prime better or worse than the other schools out there. I just have to decide where I want to get my baptism by fire and get on with it. Any thoughts?

Thanks!

I am a former member of the Navy UDT/SEAL Teams...I can take whatever they dish out to get going in this career!

 

Is it bad for the owner of Prime (or any other company for that matter) to be in this business to make money?

That's what it seems like you are saying... An owner of any company is in it to make money... he is not running a company as a volunteer. It is like this in any industry, not just trucking.

I'm just saying, any business owner who doesn't run his company in the interest of making a profit for himself is not a very smart business man. If he doesn't do things like offering in-house services, like you stated... that ultimately help his bottom line, then he and his company won't survive in the business world. By the way, these don't seem to be mandatory use services... are they? It seems like Prime employees can go down the road and get most of these services elswhere if they choose. Right?

If an owner's company doesn't survive, then he will not be able to provide jobs to guys like you and I... then we are all without jobs... then what?