Swift Transportation Company, Inc. - Phoenix, Az.

The following was moved to this section and thread, as it pertained to this topic:

PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2005 6:01 am Post subject: Re: An Open Letter To The Truckload Carriers Of America

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I'm glad you brought this up. I never run from a challenge, despite your charge.

First of all, any and all articles written by the Arizona Republic, offer figures that are "quotes" of Jerry Moyes, or Dave Berry (VP) at Swift. These are not investigative articles that offer discovered "facts". That aside...these so called "articles" are nothing more than clever PR campaigns, and paid for in full I would bet, by Mr. Moyes with cash or clout. He of course, owns the Phoenix Coyotes.

Tell me....did you see any mention in that same paper of the SEC investigation into financial filings of some of Jerry Moyes business interests? Did you know by reading that same news outlet, that he was removed as chair of the Board of Central Freight, and will no longer be CEO of his own company (Swift) by the end of this year? Hhmm...I guess they missed that.

To be fair, when the FMCSA was poised to lower their safety rating this past year, the Arizona Republic DID report this fact, but the article was clearly written in a fashion that gave every appearance that Swift, and Mr. Moyes was being victimized and targeted unfairly. This was also after Swift successfully sued to have accident criteria removed from the Safer System website, thus allowing a temporary repreive from the staggering ISS-2 number of 99.

A check today of the site reveals that they have slipped again and are now at 98, from a lowering to 90 shortly after the ruling. Now how did that happen in a few months? How indeed.

The figure QUOTED in the latest article, one of many by the way written by the AZ Republic on the subject of Swift, states that the current turnover rate is 88%. It's bunk, but the fact is, no one but Swift themselves knows the TRUE and actual turnover rate, but they would be stupid to relate anything that would be negative in the press. They are of course, a publicly held company, and stockholders read everything they can get their hands on when they invest in a company.

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/business/articles/0524economy24.html

To illustrate just how that figure of 88% can actually be absolutely true or deceptively false, it would have to be established what period of time that 88% of employees were turned. None of the articles I have read in the AZ Republic has ever stated that this was a "yearly" figure. It could be a quarterly figure for all we know.

To boil this all down, my figure and claim that Swift has a turnover rate in the 400% range is derived from doing personal research, many sources of which I cannot cite in a public forum. This figure is also 15 months old. Today, it could be higher or lower, but I seriously doubt that it has changed much, because they have changed nothing in the way they operate their business. I have no way to "prove" it without violating trusts with people that I have obtained, and I will not violate those trusts to save face with anyone.

Anyone that believes that their turnover rates are as quoted in a certainly slanted "article" in the Arizona Republic, is only deluding themselves. You, Rock Salt are in abject denial.

Yes...I am one of the moderators, and as such, take the responsibility very seriously. No...I will not delete your post. Debate is a healthy way to arrive at the truth.

Have you REALLY ever counted the number of people that you PERSONALLY have seen leave that company in the time you have been with them? Can you count them on one hand....two....or do you need several people to hold up their fingers up as well? Multiply that by the 30,000 or so employees that Swift has, and you might begin to see the picture that is being painted in front of you.

You like Swift. That's great! You've got a job doing dedicated work. How long did you spend OTR? Did you train through them? Did you hire on with them as a newbie? Can you be honest enough to state what chances that one who hires on in that capacity will find the happiness that you have found? Unless my memory serves me wrong, you hired on as an experienced driver, and you probably have had little, if any insight into what newbies go through with that company.

You took offense to comments I made in MTT about drivers being treated like "children" and "having to have their hands held", and for that I apologize. It was not meant to be taken as an insult or directed at anyone in particular. It was offered to suggest that Swift routinely hires the inexperienced, and thus has to guide most of these people through their daily working lives.

I have no personal ax to grind with Swift's employees. I'm sure there are some fine people working for them. You apparently are one of them. I do however feel that they, as a company and more importantly their management, leave too much to be desired, and people deserve to know the truth in order to weigh all sides of an issue before arriving at a conclusion.

Let's try and apply some logic to this. I've never worked for Schneider National Carriers, but I have come to the conclusion that they are WORTH a nod of approval, due to the same research tactics that I use to assess a company.

My position on Swift is but one of literally hundreds out there on the web to be read, that are in agreement in part or all of my points of contention. You can ignore mine, and that still leaves all the rest to consider. You can't shoot them all down with one shot. Look long and hard enough, and the smoke trail leads to a fire.

Where are the all the defenders of Swift? I have seen only a FEW positive comments on the company. The bad outweighs the good. That is the bottom line, and there's no way to refute it. I would never ask a soul to trust anything I offer. I did tell you to do some research. There's more than enough to find that supports my stance. It's unfortunate that you consider this to be "running away" from an argument. I consider it fodder for people to do a little thinking for themselves. Find it as I have, and then my offering of the truth becomes their own.

Now...just to make you happy, when I referred to companies with 400% or more turnover in this thread, I was not necessarily referring to Swift. Right here in the Chattanooga area, there is a small carrier that operates 38 trucks. My personal physician does the DOT physicals for this company. In 2004, he performed 156 physicals, all new hires by the way, for this carrier. That translates into a 411% turnover rate for a one year period.

I wonder...did you read the most recent PR article...you know...the one I linked to above? I found one sentence VERY interesting that was offered.

"While Swift has jacked up its pay for experienced drivers, the increase only affects about 20 percent of its drivers." (the increase quoted in the article applied to those drivers with 5 or more years of experience)

Here's a company that has 22,310 drivers on staff, according to their latest MCS-150 filing, and that translates into less than 4,500 of their drivers having five years experience under their belt. They have the rest of the trucks filled with 17,848 drivers with LESS than five years of driving experience.

Is their turnover rate in the 400% range? I sure have every reason to believe that it is, but set that aside for the moment. From their own lips, so to speak, we know that 80% of their current driving force was absolutely turned within the last five. How many of them came and gone in that same last five years? How many current Swift drivers have less than a year's worth of experience? Too many I assure you. Too many.

 

Swift has the highest turnover rate, bar none. My biggest problem with Swift is due to the way that newbies are exploited for profit potential. The last time I had a finger in the dyke, and had some figures in front of me to ponder, a newbie that signed on with Swift had a 1 in 100 chance of making it past the first 3 months, and in that time, they made pennies for their efforts.

Added to this, is the fact that Swift will hound a person almost to their grave, to collect on the contracted amount of the training tuition, using tactics that normal creditors are not allowed to use, and they have literally trashed the credit ratings of some fine people that were drawn into their web of deceit.

As I've stated before, they must have some positive points, or else they would be belly up. They exude a low respect level for safety. They run a sweat shop with a revolving door that chews up and spits out people, and until recently, have done nothing to improve the situation. Their management is largely left to run the place as they see fit, and for the most part, they treat people like crap.

My concern, and this has always been the case, is to steer people that are not aware of their practices elsewhere.

Precisely. Most people that enter the industry these days ARE trying to support families. They are people that have been displaced from other careers, seeking a more stable work environment. I counsel many people, and those that seek my advice are for the most part, desperate and needing income NOW. They don't have the luxury of having huge bank accounts to tide them over until the income starts kicking in again. Of all the training companies out there, Swift represents the lowest income prospects for at least six months after they grace the doorstep to train, and that cannot be disputed. In the meantime, if they manage to make it into a truck, Swift makes a mint while they make little, if any.

Swift requires a student to pay a "sitting fee" of $150.00 on the first day of training, and this is non-refundable under any circumstance. They graciously provide $25.00 a week for meals over the 23 STRAIGHT days of training classes, which should be great for purchasing peanut butter and crackers to live on during this period. If, and I do mean if...a student makes it past the 23 day starving contest, he then makes $350.00 per week for weeks 1-2. $400.00 a week for weeks 3-4. Then $500.00 for weeks 5-6. Once they are solo, they start at .26 a mile minimum with no guarantees once solo.

Schneider does not compensate a student for the first 11 days of class (I am in error in previous statements to this regard), but then pays $200.00 for week #3, $300.00 for week #4, $150.00 orientation pay and another $300.00 upon full hire. Then they pay $300.00 per week for the next 2 weeks while training in the truck. After going solo, they guarantee $500.00 per week for 26 weeks, or .27 a mile minimum.

Neither is going to get rich any time soon, but those first few weeks are vastly different in terms of compensation. Schneider doesn't require a $150.00 non-refundable "sitting fee" either. I find the charging of a fee to start training, that is never refunded to be objectionable, and on par with those "work at home" programs. It's a scam, and another way to milk the unaware of their money.

 

Your assertion is that out of your particular class, that 60% of these people that were hired and made it over a year? I'm sorry....I don't buy it for one second. For one thing, that is a retention rate that would be totally in contradiction to what is claimed by Swift, and there is absolutely no way that newbies are turning at a rate of 40%, compared to the publicly released rate of "87%", as of their most recent claim. Why would you make up something like this?

Look...there are several factors that determine when a truck profits, and I assure you that the generated mileage is NOT one of the factors. If all loads paid the same per-mile, then that gauge could be used to determine profit, but they do not. For many years, I generated as much profit with my truck, as I could have running coast-to-coast, and never was more than a hundred miles from my home, and never ran more than 1500 miles per week.

To clear up a misconception you may have, I have never made any claim as to the amount of miles that a newbie would drive per month, and in fact, if I were of the mindset that Swift operates under, and had the option of cramming miles down a lesser paid individual or team, versus giving those same miles to a higher paid driver or team, then the choice could be obvious, from a profit potential standpoint. Exploit the cheaper paid drivers.

But let's back up a step. Swift is well known for pairing up two drivers, fresh out of training, and paying them peanuts to team drive for months at a time. My number one concern is the safety factor, and the fact that this factor is reflected in their safety numbers, which are among the worst in the nation. Secondly, they are not paying these drivers .26 EACH, are they? That's a solo pay figure, and not routine for those that make it past the 12th week. I'm merely guessing, because I have never had full opportunity to discover the current pay for Swift drivers that are utilized in this manner, but I'd be willing to bet that they are paid well below the national average for team drivers. Yes...they may actually make $400 -$500 a week, but they are driving their butts off to do it. That truck may be generating 24,000 miles a month or more, and instead of Swift paying a team the average going rate for a team, they are likely paying those drivers about 33% LESS.

The above is EXACTLY why Swift has trouble recruiting and retaining experienced people. They love cheap labor. They will USE cheap labor to an advantage of obtaining more profit-per-mile.

Now...just to show you that I am fair, I am completely aware of the fact that they have announced pay rate increases, in an attempt to boost retention rates, and to attract experienced drivers. That's great. What a shame they didn't do this years ago. Who knows? Maybe Jerry's departure may mean Swift may have a chance to improve it's image. I'm certainly open minded enough to sit back and watch to see what happens.

I'm also dubious for a couple of reasons. Last year, they bought out a Mexican carrier (Trans-Mex, Inc. SA de C.V), and this may be a back door to importing a source of even cheaper paid drivers, that is, if the policy is kept in place, allowing work visas for this industry for foreign workers. They are not the only company that is fervently gearing up to import drivers, but this gives them all kinds of training options south of the border. What would you care to wager that Swift is not actively training drivers through that company to meet the requirements for legally allowing these drivers to come to the U.S. and drive in the states?

There also does not seem to be any decline in their active recruiting of newbies. Other than to release a press announcement of the higher pay, their doesn't seem to be this big push to get the word out to drivers in their recruiting ads, or at least, not that I have noticed. Their own website does not reflect pay increases, and what they offer experienced drivers, compared to other carriers, is nothing short of an insult.

There is a bottom line to all of this. If money is the goal, as the recognition of the fruits of your labor, Swift is one piss poor place to seek that form of recognition.

I used to think like that. I was as hard lined as a person can get. But let me pose a few questions to you. When YOU were informed of this fee, were you aware that it was completely unprecedented, and unique to the industry and to Swift as well?

If you applied to any other job, would you be as equally willing to pay a $150 fee that is not refundable under ANY condition, to sit in on your first day, even if you were not extended the offer of a job?

Maybe I'm missing something. I can tell you that if I was told that I had to fork over $150 for a CHANCE at a job, that I wouldn't do anything but laugh and hang up the phone.

Nope...apparently they don't hide this from people, but it is a SCAM, that is designed to rake in dough from unsuspecting people, who are led to think that if they are told to report for class, that they are in like Flynn.

You see...I come from a generation of truck drivers that did not have to go to a school to drive a truck. In order to get my license, I merely had to get a carrier representative to sign a form, stating that I was qualified to drive. I got my license. My driving record allowed me to grandfather into the CDL in 1991, and was one of the first Georgia residents to get a CDL. So, I cannot fathom the thought of paying for a job.

The thing is, someone seeking to enter this industry doesn't HAVE to pay one red cent to get into it either, other than for the cost of the CDL to be issued by their respective state licensing bureau.

You're comparing two completely separate issues, which is apples and oranges. People that sign up for the reserves are betting on peace time continuing, and that's a subject for a different day and debate.

When it comes to this "sitting fee", and people willing to cough it up freely and without reservation, the fact remains that it is not a customary fee that is charged by any other company, save for Swift. Swift also, without question, preys upon the desperate, the ignorant and the misinformed.

The fact that you would defend this in the least sense of the word, makes me highly suspicious of your position with Swift. If I were a person, who discovered after the fact, that no other training carrier requires a student to fork over a fee of ANY amount, I'd feel a bit...ripped-off. Why? Because that's exactly what it is. It's a rip-off from the get-go.

The fee is bad enough. I'm currently doing some research into a couple of companies in regard to what they gain by signing up people for training, and why they are so lax in accepting obviously disqualified people, prior to having them show up in person for some paper signing sessions.

In ten years, you are the SECOND person who has defended that company to me. Contrast this to the literally HUNDREDS of available negative comments that are online and the FACTS that can be found, and I can do nothing but shake my head.

I can't save everyone from themselves. I can merely pass the word, and hope that it helps people to become a bit more informed, or even better, to check the facts out for themselves.

 

Well, look back at what you wrote. You stated that only HALF of the 23 drivers that graduated from your class and have not already quit, work out of your terminal, and that you see them "every once in awhile", and that they have been there a year. That's roughly 12 people out of 40, or am I missing something?

I question your account on another level as well. How are you able to keep tabs on all these people, spread out through such a large company, to know the EXACT numbers? Who has the time in their busy day to look this up for you?

I've been a driver for a long time, and I've worked in companies where there are only 150 drivers, and I didn't see people that were hired when I was, often enough to keep those kind of statistics handy.

Who said anything about a conspiracy? I get hate mail all the time from people who call me everything in the book, but rarely take me on. I don't know all the little secrets of companies that I speak out against, but I know enough about them to recognize when there are serious issues that need to be revealed to others.

When I see a post like yours, where you offer numbers that are a little hard to swallow and difficult to substantiate, then I get suspicious. I mean, let's face it. I can't imagine that all of your classmates sat around and exchanged cell phone numbers, and agreed to call each other if they decided quit, so that you could keep a running tab in case someone happened to trash Swift.

I find it difficult to believe that you went into personnel, knowing each and every one of their names and SSN's or truck numbers, etc. for reference purposes, so that they could be looked up, or that anyone would give you that information to begin with. A 60% retention rate for a class of newbies at ANY training carrier is bucking all the national averages, under ANY criteria, and for SWIFT to be able to retain that amount out of a single class for a full YEAR is phenominal. It's too good to be true.

Conspiracy? No. Incredible...you bet.

I scour the net, and trucking boards set up all over the place on a routine basis for testimonials, in order to keep a pulse on the industry and specific companies. Swift has the HIGHEST number of former drivers that do not speak well of them. Now this has to be for SOME reason. It's not ME making it all up.

The truth of the matter is that there are people that have to find out things the hard way, and they will completely ignore and overlook something as big as an elephant in front of their nose.

I don't like saying this, because it sounds egotistical, and I don't like to come off sounding that way, but I have a 2 gigabyte folder full of e-mails from people that I have collected over the years, basically stating that they wished they had listened to me, and not went against advice to stay away from a certain company. Swift again, tops that list.

Now...I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Swift obviously has some good points for some people, or they wouldn't have the doors open. You have apparently fallen through a crack that so many others could not find, or your standards are not as high as those of others. That's great, and I'm happy for you.

You are one of two people that have defended them to any great length, out of literally thousands of people I have conversed with on the subject. Now that's the God's honest truth, and may the Lord take me away if it is not.

I fall short of calling you a liar, but your attempt to do "damage control" is highly questonable, for all the reasons stated above. Personally, I don't believe your figures, and I'm quite sure that there are people out there that don't believe things that I say.

I don't want people to take my word. I want them to look things up for themselves, and make their own minds up on issues of importance to them. I'll certainly help point the way to the information that can be found.

Okay...I think you've worn that line out. It's time for a new catch phrase.