want help from the pros

WalMart is a factor in it now . They told their vendors not to ship anymore would pick the products up . http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-43940562/walmarts-endgame-take-over-shipping-from-suppliers-killing-their-markups-as-it-goes/

 

Geeze Rick that Figures Huh

 

One of the biggest problems is that many companies, not the "Big 5," will not hire a driver if they have to train the driver. Most companies require 1 or 2 years experience as they seem to think the time behind the wheel will replace the need to train; it doesn't.

Statistics available through the National Safety Council do not bear out the belief that experience itself replaces the need for ongoing training. Instead, the study that has become part of their Defensive Driving Program shows that drivers with between 5 and 10 years experience have more accidents per capita than do new drivers or those with more than 10 years; complacency is believed to be the cause.

It is true that new drivers account for a larger portion of accidents as a whole and drivers with over 10 years have the lowest number of accidents of the three groups. The nature of common carrier operations and the stresses involved are the likely cause of newer drivers accidents and high turnover rate. Many drivers have their first accident around the time they get their first million mile award; not inexperienced to say the least.

Since a majority of companies will not train or hire a driver fresh out of school, they force the new driver to drive for Swift, Werner, etc. That means the non-training companies have to pay more to the experienced drivers they hire and Swift can pay less because no other company will hire the new driver. These new drivers become a slave to the experience requirement and therefore find themselves driving OTR or Regional when they would have otherwise taken employment at a local company. That is NOT the "BIG 5" causing the situation, but rather the companies that will not give the new driver a first look look. The "Big 5" DO take full advantage of the situation; ie. 22-25 CPM... AND the "Big 5" use the low paid driver to compete against the non-training company when it comes to bidding a load. You are correct; LOW WAGES = LOW BIDS.

.25 CPM, I can remember those days not that long ago.

I would recommend a prospective driver attend an accredited school that they pay for, rather than a company school. Most of the companies that will be willing to hire you will likely reimburse you any ways. However, if you cannot make it happen any other way, then you have to do what you have to do.

I believe those days of local companies not wanting to train will be a thing of the past soon. They may not find suitable drivers as baby boomers retire.

Also, if someone has 20, 30, or more experience it is unlikely they can truly understand the dilemma that new drivers face. You were a new driver once, but not for a v-e-r-y long time now. Your experience in the industry is a valuable asset to those that get to talk to you, however, you are too far removed from newbie-ism to fully grasp their pain... and I do mean PAIN.

 

How much "training" do the training companies give ? We've all read posts that prove many "trainees" are just $300 a week team drivers .
One member posted he ran 7,000 miles in 12 days . How much training do you get when 95% of the time is cruising down the highway ?
Why should other companies give newbies a chance when tens of thousands of experienced drivers are out of work ?
Wannabes cut each others' throats by their numbers . They should research the industry . Read carrier financial reports . Why do carriers like Werner keep filling orientation classes when their freight was down 11% over the previous year ? They're running less trucks so where do all these newbies go ? 90% go home after wasting thousands on school . It's foolish to pursue a career in an industry with 100% turnover .

 

oh i have do doubt skip i am far removed from what they have to go thru these days and yeah i was new at one time just like them but without all the BS they have to put up with..We were just stating that yrs ago the BIG 5 were cutting rates and that its now a dog eat dog world out there for all of the newbies to us oldies..LOL...Companys training will soon be a thing of the past i also believe..I dont begrudge anyone wanting to drive a truck...i have always made a great living in this business and continue to this day and i saw what the new people go thru when my sister 7 yrs ago decided to come out and drive truck..she went thru hell and now shes an O/O leased to United Van Lines..

 

Answers:

1.) I was not new to logistics, driving, or freight moving when I entered trucking. With over a thousand hours of classroom instruction and many more thousands of hours of study outside the classroom while earning multiple education certificates and a degree in logistics management through college and military tech schools, one would believe I have a firm grasp on what it takes to move freight; I do.

My education supplied me with vast knowledge needed to operate a common carrier but did not address what I needed to know to be a truck driver. My commercial transportation training provided me with knowledge I needed to operate various straight and combination vehicles safely and legally. In addition it provided me with a Class-A CDL. However, it was not till I started with Swift that I received the first real truck driver training; the things a driver needs to know to be successful on the road as a truck driver. For that in depth training I owe a thank you to Swift.

I also had experience driving various other commercial truck routes and even managed a fleet of local delivery trucks; cargo van and box trucks doing pick up and delivery for a parts supplier locally.

Yes, I hauled freight while training with Swift... what the heck can you learn pulling an empty trainer around? Surely not double clutching a 40,000 lb load up the face of a mountain or braking on wet roads at highway speeds with a load on. You need a load in the box for that. I logged about 70 hours a week (5 days) driving and studying. I spent roughly two weeks in all, out of my first 6 weeks of orientation, training, and testing with Swift in a classroom environment literally duplicating everything I learned in my college accredited driving school that I had finished just weeks before. Nearly a week doing close quarters maneuvers, it was spread out over my four weeks driving with a trainer. I learned various close quarters maneuvers that were in addition to what I learned in school. I have learned even more watching other drivers since. I drove in every type of traffic environment while training; open road, downtown traffic, and narrow back roads. I completed more than 50 backs of all types, day and night. If the truck was in reverse, I was driving it.

Many other drivers did not make it; the industry calls this "Wash out rate" "Turnover." Truth is they simply did not cut it. Log violations (Severe), accidents (Trainers gone also), family issues and various personal reasons sent others packing. I don't know about you, but I would rather they wash out early then risk someone else's life or live a depressed life by trying to make it work when it was just wrong for them or their life situation.

Swift actually went to the point of over training things such as log book operations. I had three log book classes in a month and a half; I have had NO log book violations ever.

2.) Small companies, by not hiring and training newer drivers, actually handicap themselves in so much as they miss the opportunity to take advantage of less expensive drivers. Lower wages = lower bids or more profit. The initial expense is more, but when a driver is able to be home daily or several times a week they tend to stay around, even if the pay is not high. Also, newer drivers are often younger with fewer medical issues. With a few newer drivers in the fleet it is possible to replace drivers that retire. Seems there are a lot of baby boomers that are going to be doing that for the foreseeable future. I am talking about newer LICENSED drivers.

3.) High influxes of drivers result in higher wash out numbers. Baby boomers retiring are causing a shortage in OTR, regional, and even some local companies that are not common carriers.

I interviewed with a temp to hire company earlier today that I found had just reduced their experience requirement from two years to one year experience due to a shortage of drivers applying for temp to hire jobs.

Why a temp job? Because a few highly desirable positions at local companies are ONLY filled through this service; the companies want to try a driver out before they offer a full time permanent job to them.

That 100% turnover rate is misleading (actually read recently that it is above 100%) - Turnover rate does not differentiate between baby boomers retiring, those that become medically disqualified, those that are legally disqualified, and those that are new who wash out. Instead most think of "Turnover" as newbies that left the industry; it's all inclusive.

 

1.) Yeah newbies put up with a lot for sure.

2.) I agree. Rate cutting still happens and until smaller companies hire some of the better newbies out there and take advantage of the lower wages the big 5 will continue to swallow larger and larger percentages of the freight that is moving because they can afford to run freight cheap. Smaller companies that band together in the effort will greatly benefit in the end.

For example, the loss of short haul revenue to a big 5 company would push them to focus on long haul.

If the local company efforts are duplicated by long haul O/Os, the market share to the big 5 is reduced.

Both of these things force big 5 to increase drivers pay, which causes them to increase freight rates.

The business model of the big 5 cannot be sustained if higher wages are a factor. This is the reason companies like Schneider own Mexican trucking companies. Do you think they are not pushing for cheap Mexican drivers?? If so, you would be sadly mistaken.

These are not separate issues, they are tied together.

 

Baby boomers don't make up that high of a percentage of drivers . There are plenty of experienced drivers in their 30's and 40's that are out of work .
Many segments of the industry don't even consider cheap wages in hiring . Customers in oversize , chemical hauling , flatbed , and other specialized hauling pay premium rates for the best equipment and drivers. Carriers serving them don't need an amateur behind the wheel.
Yes , newbies ARE most of the turnover . Haven't you read the posts here by members saying how many in their CDL mill classes or company training didn't make it ?

 

1.) The numbers I have seen via the department of labor (2005 study, most studies are from prior to economic problems) indicated that 60% of commercial drivers are (were) over 55 when the study was completed; true, study is over 6 years old, but I would believe the average age has not changed much. Keep in mind that the average age of a person who enters the trucking industry is around 40 years old. Baby boomers are anyone born in 1964 or before(1945-1964 - depending on source you read); that is 47 or older. Now obviously most 47-60 year olds are not retiring any time soon. However, drivers in the higher age groups have a harder time qualifying medically as well as the normal retirement cycle. I did not mean to suggest that the bulk of turnover is baby boomers. I merely was stating that most people talk about turnover as being comprised of newbies when in fact it is ALL drivers leaving the industry for whatever reason, wash out or retirement, as compared to those entering. Still 100%+ turnover is an insane amount no matter the cause.

2.) Experienced drivers out of work. I receive a dozen offers to apply for driving jobs a week from OTR and regional outfits; true, many are not companies you or I would jump at the chance to drive for, but if I were in need of an income to pay some bills or feed the kids I would do what I had to do and work where I could till something better presented itself.

I filled out an online "teaser app" (Short form) via a blind ad two weeks ago that advertised for a local driving opportunity. Since then I have received 44 emails, 17 phone calls and 3 letters in the mail. I have interviewed with 2 companies from them and will hear Tuesday if I have been selected for one of the jobs. YES, there were a lot of applicants, many drivers with more experience than myself. I talked with four of them that were waiting to be interviewed the same time I was; I find it scary that 3 of them even have a license due to the things they admitted to doing behind the wheel... As I'm sure you have witnessed over the many decades you have been driving, some people's experience, may not be good experience. Gheez, and yet they sat in the waiting room of an interviewers office talking about running cars off the road, running with no lights sneaking past scale houses, using a razor knife to cut tread in a trailer tire to have it appear a legal depth in order to clear through a scale house; I'm sure most drivers would not see that as quality experience. They are crazy to do it and even crazier to talk about it at an interview. Wonder why they are unemployed...

I AM NOT SAYING THAT THOSE 3 YAHOOS REPRESENT ALL DRIVERS THAT ARE OUT OF WORK. They do represent a certain segment that are though. I believe the vast majority of CDL holders are in fact PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS; unfortunately those three dipsticks are the ones the public sees and will remember.

The fourth driver was pretty quiet as was I, though he had 2 million mile patches on his jacket from a "big 5" carrier - maybe he is tired of OTR and wants a local gig; maybe he had an incident; he looked to be in his late 50's.

3.) Any idea what companies do to recruit specialty drivers? What are most experience requirements? Do those companies usually train drivers from scratch? I have not knowledge of specialty hauling as I have not been involved in that area; are there a lot of drivers in that area out of work currently? What is the normal compensation package for the various specialty haulers? From what I have seen O/Os seem to make up a large percentage of specialty haulers.

4.) Yes indeed, there is a good size percentage of newbies that wash out in school; which is where it should happen, rather than behind the wheel a thousand miles from home. It is unfortunate that they have spent, or committed to spend, several thousands of dollars on the schooling prior to finding out they do not have the skills needed to drive the truck in a safe legal manner. I think everyone will agree that some people make good professional drivers just as some people make good athletes, singers, actors, or teachers and some people just do not have those abilities. However, people have no idea what they can do till they try it. I'm too small for football, too short for basketball, and don't ask me to sing... I tried it, that's why I am a truck driver.

I agree that there should be some kind of safety net for those that go to a school after a recruiter tells them they can learn to drive truck only to find out it is not for them. Would definitely help reduce financial harm to the washed out student.

This is one of the reasons I attended a college for training; a community college is affiliated with the state in most cases and as such have a timeline window that allows students to withdraw and receive a refund, in whole or part, from a class reducing or eliminating the financial loss. For example, most are set up so that if a student withdraws before the second week of classes they receive all or most of their money back; if they stay but drop before the half way point they receive approximately half their money.

Most of the classes I have taken allow a student to drop the class up to the 10th week if they feel they need to and they will only receive a "W" on their transcript rather than a failing grade; even if they did not perform well in the class. A "W" on a transcript for an academic looks better than a failing grade; crazy academic strategies... scary thing is your doctor may have used that strategy to get through school; that will make you think the next time you go to the doctor. lol

Still, we don't know what we can do or what we will like till we have tried it; though it should not cause the person to file bankruptcy merely for trying it out. At the same time, we are all adults and need to be responsible for our decisions; as painful as the end result may be.