When to sign logbook???

That's a nice company form but not required by law. We had the same book sheet inspection for pre-trip and post-trip. We just went a little more in the beginning of our shift. We could do that since we were local in town deliveries. If we had a problem at the start of the shift we'd just take the truck to the shop before any gasoline was loaded. After 5 years of hard city driving our trucks were in pretty good shape. When they went to sell them at 5 years for the truck and 10 years for the trailers they got top dollar. I saw one truck go for $55.000 but it had a drop axle and it sold fast. Most companies would strip their truck of all the fittings and such but we didn't. When we got a new truck and everything was new. It was very smart to do a good pre-trip to catch the problems before they became major.

 

That's kind of impressive. Since I started working local in NJ, I've only seen a couple trucks that the inside isn't held together by duct tape, while repairs just don't get done until they're at the point of being illegal. Why can't I find a company like yours?

 

Ive seen several posts in this thread that bother me. I am not one to try and pick fights, but I am always concerned that new drivers get good information when it comes to regulations. Several of these posts seem to imply that by not signing your paper log you get some kind of protection against being cited by the states. This is NOT true, never has been, and never will be. If you are an OTR driver you are required by law to have your logs up to date and be on line 3 while driving. If a state DOT officer finds any issue with (todays) log regardless of your signature or not you may be subject to getting a ticket and a possible out of service order. Your signature on the log is an end of driving certification by you that that log is a correct and accurate account of your day. Later if that log is called into question you can be prosecuted if its determined you submitted a false log.

 

I agree with you, however, you should back the requirement by listing the paragraph so they can reference this. The requirement to sign a log is very simple and spelled out. The reference is FMCSR's 395.8 (f) (7) This is where it is. "The driver shall certify to the correctness of all entries by signing the form containing the driver's duty status record with his or her legal name or name on record. The driver's signature certifies that all entries required by this section made by the driver are true and correct". The log needs to be signed at the end of a 24 hour period. That's in section FMCSR's 395 requiring the driver to use a 24 hour period to record his or her duty status. For clarification part 395 section guidance states the following.

" QUESTION 24, when must a driver complete the signature/certification of the driver's record of duty status?

GUIDANCE, in general, the driver must sign the record of duty status immediately after all required entries have been made for the 24 hour period. However, if the driver is driving at the end of the 24 hour period he/she must sign during the next stop".

That's the rules from the FMCSR's boys and girls.
It's simple, you sign at the end of the 24 hour shift the company has determined to certify the entries are up to date and correct. The company can start the 24 hour clock at any time they want to. Ours was 6pm. If you turn in a log that is incorrect the laws state the company is not at fault and you're open to prosecution.

 

At the end of the day, how do you sign saying everything is legal, with out having it completed

 

End of day period. Doing it that way for over 30 yrs.

 

But anyone can flag a wrong town name, or state abbreviation, miss a time zone change (all of these can and sometimes do result in speeding tickets, sometimes breaking the land-speed record in an 18 wheeler)... Signing is admitting that what you put is accurate. Not signing, while they can still ticket you, you do have the defense that mistakes happen and can possibly get any tickets dropped. But if that log is signed, you automatically lose in court, you have no defense at all. You went from Phoenix AZ to Flagstaff AR in 90 minutes. That's by law, admitting to driving almost 900mph, and as ridiculous as it sounds, since you signed that your logs are accurate, a cop on a bad day can give you that ticket, and he WILL win in court.

So stick to the general, never sign anything until it's complete, and you've read it.

 

I'm sorry but the underlined is not correct as a general rule with logbook tickets. I'm with you about mistakes. This is why some companies will let you amend a log later. But as I stated you can be and in some cases will be cited by the states if there is a problem with that log, regardless if its signed or not, and these tickets will hold up if you fight them in court. You brought up the speeding issue. You can get nailed for speeding based on those grid lines and your flags. However it is a simple fact that when you put that truck in gear and start rolling that log must be right and you must be on line 3. If there is a problem and a state officer finds it you will be held responsible.

 

The regulation is the regulation. You may think it's wrong but I can not see anyone getting a ticket when you have the reference right there to show the inspector. The FMCSR's is very specific and leaves no room to misinterpret the way I see it.

 

Most of the state DOT enforcement officers are very versed in the regulations. They also have to take continued training from time to time. Trust me most of these guys can just about quote parts 392 and 395 verbatim. You get into a pissing match with a state officer you are most likely going to lose. This is one reason I have always when mentoring told green drivers to never say to an officer you can't do this. Just eat some crow and ask the officer to show you the right way to do it and some times you won't get a ticket. You tell a state officer they can't cite you because you have not signed that log and they are going to laugh at you as they write the ticket and the inspection form.