34 Hour Reset & time spent PC?

Pay has nothing to with the consideration of duty status. Going home is PC, however, having knowledge of or the expectation of the next dispatch from the terminal would not qualify for PC. Also, be mindful of the State requirements for PC, i.e., WA does not allow for PC other than bobtail. WA considers the trailer as "part of a load" so they do not go along with the federal definition of "unladen".
Always check the State requirements before assuming a situation!

 

Well about that rule thing, there are no rules being made about this. You guys don't want them to make the rules on pc because they means they will come up with all kinds of bs qualifiers so you would have to jump through to use it.

By the way otter, if you are on "compensated time" - meaning clocked in - you are on duty or on duty/driving and pc can not be used. This is in most of the states, if not all of them. The same thing applies to working another job, that counts against your clock as on duty time.

 

Nope. FMCSA specifically does not care if one is compensated (unless one is working for a non motor carrier.)

Question 3: A driver has been given written permission by his/her employer to record meal and other routine stops made during a tour of duty as off-duty time. Is the driver required to record such time as off-duty, or is it the driver’s decision whether such time is recorded as off-duty?

Guidance: It is the employer’s choice whether the driver shall record stops made during a tour of duty as off-duty time. However, employers may permit drivers to make the decision as to how the time will be recorded.


Question 10: How does compensation relate to on-duty time?

Guidance: The fact that a driver is paid for a period of time does not always establish that the driver was on-duty for the purposes of part 395 during that period of time. A driver may be relieved of duty under certain conditions and still be paid.

 

When I refer to pay, I am talking about the miles to/from home or lodging. In principle, if you are pulling a trailer, you are generally considered laden and should be on line 3...but, if he is bobtailing home and back, the regulations are VERY clear..."any time traveling to/from a drivers residence or to/from lodging and their NORMAL location where they report for duty MAY be logged as PC". The only time traveling from home that isn't, is in certain circumstances where they aren't returning to the same location they normally are from AND they are operating under the guidance of the carrier. As in, he heads home(PC), while home, dispatch calls(or sends instructions) that directs him after hometime to an alternate location (drop yard, customer, repower a load from a broken down co-worker, etc), then travel time leaving home isn't PC. Or, if the company includes those miles back to the normal location on the trip. And use of PC is "at the carrier's discretion". Even if the driver is dispatched on a load from their normal location where they report to duty, they do not have to log travel time as drive time until they are back at the normal location where the report for duty. Until then, and are there, they aren't responsible for the load. And per regulations, off duty time is legal any time the carrier has relieved the driver from responsibility of the load. I know this is true because I got stopped by an Olathe, KS DOT cop yesterday. I was at our Spring Hill, KS yard, the company sent me my next load info at 830 am, but it didn't load until 1400, so at 0900 I was PC'g to Walmart, and he pulled me over (bobtailing) for an inspection. While I was digging out my DL and my registration, he asked if I was under a load, I said I was dispatched on one, but it picks up in the afternoon, so I am running to Wally for groceries. He ask if I was on PC, I said yes and he took my docs and headed for his patrol car. He returned, said since you're on PC, we'll forget the inspection today, have a good day...and I left. Only time required to log on duty was the time we were parked on the side of the road.

 

Agree completely...as I said, be careful of different States because they have already made their specifications to qualify for use of PC.

"clocked in" would be a term used for local/hourly drivers, however line drivers or long-haul are generally paid by mile not off a clock. But I see your point. My counter example would be for the LH or mileage drivers...the driver has been "paid" layover pay for the time between last and next dispatch. Tht driver would be being "compensated" for the time and still OFF DUTY and good to use PC for moving around to store or some other general mayhem.

 

How many "mileage drivers" get paid the miles to go home/lodging and/or return from home/lodging? That is OFF DUTY time,...never found one myself!

I'm sorry, but an "MT" trailer is UNLADEN. If I am pulling an MT trailer except in WA and I have heard of one other (thinking it was TN) the State DOT does not accept the FMCSA definition of "unladen" and consider the trailer as "PART OF A LOAD" and have been very specific about PC only when bobtail.

The conflict was from several years back regarding when did the "work clock" for a log begin...think Wal Mart and New Jersey, beginning his "drive to work" from Georgia was an extreme example. However, the similar argument was raised with regard to "local/regional" drivers at first FMCSA wanted to try and have their "time at the wheel" begin when they left home for their commute to the terminal..squashed very quickly with a law suit from Teamsters out of Chicago.
This is more specifically aimed at LTL and local/regional use. It came to be an issue when many smaller outfits allowed their drivers to take their tractors home, mainly due to yard space was very limited for trailers and parking of personal vehicles was at best "risky" due to "not so high class neighborhoods" where the terminal was located. Swift had a very good example back in the 90's at Gary, IN before they invested in security fencing and armed guards.

There is and never was any guidance regarding "same location". This was an assumption broadcast by, as I call them, "the coffee counter clutch thinkers" . It all began when there was no guidance from FMCSA regarding PC but was at first allowed to be completely at the carriers discretion. The FMCSA along with OOIDA and many State Trucking Associations and Unions...yeah scary thought when all these opposing groups found something to agree on...started screeming bloody murder when DOT LEO's from various states started making their own rules and guidelines regarding this "new rule of PC". Two separate officers from the same field office couldn't agree on how it was designed to be used,let alone have any uniformity statewide, let alone nation wide.

The only part of this you have correct is the beginning "he heads home"... once under direction, (dispatched) driver has NO OPTION except to be Line 3 DRIVING and the 14 hour clock begins when he begins his pre-trip before leaving....yes his home!

WOW....LET ME HAVE WHAT YOU'RE SMOKING...MUST BE GREAT STUFF!
Whoever gave you this information needs a Louisville Slugger up alongside the cranium...with force! Spreading it a bit deep there driver...even "back in the day" using paper logs this was only done on the QT and drivers just crossed their fingers the log department wouldn't catch it....most times it did just slide by, but many things managed to "just slide by" back in the day. Which is why we are now being forced to use these ELD's!

"Responsible for the load"... OK, now you're combing some Hazmat regulations with general safety/responsibility parts of 395. And none of this has anything to do with PC....you're reaching for something but only grabbing air.

1. You shouldn't have told Mr.LEO that you were dispatched.
2. You shouldn't have said anything about the load or that you had knowledge of your next load.
3. When he approached, the only thing you should have said was "howdy officer, how's your day going?"
You volunteered information that:
1. Admitted to being under dispatch.
2. Admitted you had knowledge of the load, time and location.
In so doing you gave him all the information he needed to not allow your use of PC...bobtail or not...you were under dispatch, therefore, NO PERSONAL COVEYANCE EVEN TO GO SHOPPING.
Some good news...this is supposedly going to drastically change. There is an attempt to allow PC even under a load, as long as the travel is not toward the destination. In other words, you want to get some shopping done with your load, but the store is a few miles in a different direction, you can go to PC from the time you alter course. But once the shopping is done, you are not on PC getting back to where you changed course, you are again traveling towards the assigned destination in going back to your point of deviation.
Myself, I live 30 miles East of Sacramento off HWY 50. I could (if this change happens) save 30 minutes of my clock by changing to PC as I get off I-5/99 and head up 50. But getting back to I-5/99, would be back on active log.

 

Wrong...wrong....wrong....wrong. what you're saying is, when I am sitting at home, and my terminal is 45 miles away and dispatch sends me the load info on Friday, but it doesn't have to leave the terminal until Monday, I must then log all time going back to the terminal...WRONG!!!!! When I said responsible for the load...it doesn't matter what freight it is...you are responsible for the securement, ensuring the safe condition of the equipment, it's safe transport and it's safety while in your posession be it hazmat or scrap paper. If it is at a company terminal, and I am at home, having never touched the load, having never seen the load, having never inspected the trailer...I cannot be responsible for it...and it is not mine until I either have the bills in my posession, ready to connect and pretrip the trailer, or am being directed by the carrier to do something else, and until any of the above happen, I am not on the load, and therefore not on duty when bobtailing from home to the yard(or from the yard to food/wally and back)


When I said "guidance of the company", I used the wrong word...the way the DOT/FMCSA words it is "at the direction of the company", meaning the company is sending you somewhere for something.

 

I do it all the time pc home off duty and the 34 hr is still counting